Codemasters to Develop Official WRC Titles from 2023

[Morbid65]

I had the same initial impression of dirt 2 as the career mode sucks and starts you with the worse possible vehicles, did you try the better faster cars out (in a custom rally), its like night and day the difference... or for that matter adjust the settings at all?

Yeah I messed with settings and turned off assists, and my issue didn't seem to matter which car I was driving... Honestly I liked the vintage cars better than the R5s.

My issue was a combination of the "feel" of the physics, and the stage design.

The cars feel like they have a very light touch on the road instead of feeling planted, and like they just sorta rotate on an axis and the ground that is below them has little impact on it. I didn't feel like banked corners had much impact on grip/rotation, and I didn't feel like I really needed to adjust for compressions or the car getting light-ish over a crest. It's not that the game plays awful or I find it unplayable or something (maybe my wording in my first post was harsh?), but it just doesn't capture me at all and feels pretty artificial.

Stage design is also uninteresting. Granted I didn't run every stage in the game, but I tried to jump around and try a lot of different areas, but I don't think I ever found any section of the stages where I went "**** yes" and wanted to re-run it immediately, like I find in many stages in the last 2 WRC games. It's not just the width that people often complain about, but they just feel like generic rally stages made by people who think making squiggle-y roads in the woods is enough to make a "good stage" and they lacked memorable features.

Comparatively, I find WRC8 has a much better sense of connection with the ground, and all the bumps and camber changes are felt more. The better sense of connection to the road also means there is a better sense of not being connected to the road, making bumps, bounces, two-wheel moments, getting light over crests, all that stuff much more exciting.

The stage design in the WRC games feels much more distinct, and nearly every stage I can pick out a sequence of road or a "moment" of the stage that is super exciting, if not several, that make me want to re-run the stage immediately. Part of it is because of the better feel of road connection, so a tiny detail in a single corner like a little off-camber bump near an apex that puts you sideways up on two wheels sliding out of the corner feels thrilling. While that can be just one corner out of a hundred, I find them memorable.

I'm playing on a controller for now though, it might be a very different case with a wheel and I'll probably have to re-evaluate when I get one.

The end result though is that I can fire up WRC8, planning to spend 30mins making a few cracks at a stage and find myself still playing the same stage trying to improve 3 hours later, because when I crash while pushing for a time, restarting is an opportunity to re-run a great stage. I never find myself doing that with DR2.0.

 

[evldave333]

Yeah I messed with settings and turned off assists, and my issue didn't seem to matter which car I was driving... Honestly I liked the vintage cars better than the R5s.

My issue was a combination of the "feel" of the physics, and the stage design.

The cars feel like they have a very light touch on the road instead of feeling planted, and like they just sorta rotate on an axis and the ground that is below them has little impact on it. I didn't feel like banked corners had much impact on grip/rotation, and I didn't feel like I really needed to adjust for compressions or the car getting light-ish over a crest. It's not that the game plays awful or I find it unplayable or something (maybe my wording in my first post was harsh?), but it just doesn't capture me at all and feels pretty artificial.

Stage design is also uninteresting. Granted I didn't run every stage in the game, but I tried to jump around and try a lot of different areas, but I don't think I ever found any section of the stages where I went "**** yes" and wanted to re-run it immediately, like I find in many stages in the last 2 WRC games. It's not just the width that people often complain about, but they just feel like generic rally stages made by people who think making squiggle-y roads in the woods is enough to make a "good stage" and they lacked memorable features.

Comparatively, I find WRC8 has a much better sense of connection with the ground, and all the bumps and camber changes are felt more. The better sense of connection to the road also means there is a better sense of not being connected to the road, making bumps, bounces, two-wheel moments, getting light over crests, all that stuff much more exciting.

The stage design in the WRC games feels much more distinct, and nearly every stage I can pick out a sequence of road or a "moment" of the stage that is super exciting, if not several, that make me want to re-run the stage immediately. Part of it is because of the better feel of road connection, so a tiny detail in a single corner like a little off-camber bump near an apex that puts you sideways up on two wheels sliding out of the corner feels thrilling. While that can be just one corner out of a hundred, I find them memorable.

I'm playing on a controller for now though, it might be a very different case with a wheel and I'll probably have to re-evaluate when I get one.

The end result though is that I can fire up WRC8, planning to spend 30mins making a few cracks at a stage and find myself still playing the same stage trying to improve 3 hours later, because when I crash while pushing for a time, restarting is an opportunity to re-run a great stage. I never find myself doing that with DR2.0.

I like both games myself, but find Ive put more hours in wrc overall as its more forgiving, if you push in dirt 2 you get punished, I end up rage quitting alot. It annoys me you cant customise the gameplay in dirt 2 theres a time for simulation and a time for giving it the beans, but with no damage options you cant let your inner child go for a joyride its all intense focus stuff. Im sure both developers will continue to pump out rally games and simply change the titles and car rosters abit. Neither company is going to shelve their game engines they will just re-skin and re-brand so the licence changing hands isnt that much of a big deal.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

I feel like Codies is just making too many things at once, and none of them are given enough attention. I wonder if the WRC game will be standalone, or will it be incorporated to the Dirt series? Will the Dirt series even still have the Rally/Casual two games approach? So many uncertainties, just when Kylotonn is starting to make good games with WRC7 onwards. Competition is good. Without it, game devs tend to fall back on the yearly sport games approach of just putting out the same thing year after year with minimal innovation.

I dunno why WRC doesn't just sublicense the cars to CM. Kylotonn can keep making the whole game, CM can have the newest WRC cars too. Win-win situation.

 

[Robin]

I suspect the Dirt Series will be canned when the CM WRC series starts. I agree, they have too many things going on at once.

 

[FT-1]

I suspect the Dirt Series will be canned when the CM WRC series starts. I agree, they have too many things going on at once.

Dirt Rally perhaps, but I'm not sure the mainline Dirt series will face the axe too. If the WRC series has a greater emphasis on realism, a more accessible and fun-focused offroad series can co-exist alongside it.

 

[Robin]

Dirt Rally perhaps, but I'm not sure the mainline Dirt series will face the axe too. If the WRC series has a greater emphasis on realism, a more accessible and fun-focused offroad series can co-exist alongside it.

For sure, I think even if both Dirt's were axed 2 similar WRC games could probably coexist, much like back in the day with the Colin McRae games alongside the Evolution Studios WRC games.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Dirt Rally perhaps, but I'm not sure the mainline Dirt series will face the axe too. If the WRC series has a greater emphasis on realism, a more accessible and fun-focused offroad series can co-exist alongside it.

I think this is what will happen, Dirt Rally will just morph into WRC and the Dirt series will carry on from Dirt 5 with the more action, gymkhana, buggy etc style off roading.

I reckon we still have 1 more Dirt Rally to come before the WRC games though.

 

[sirjim73]

I think this is what will happen, Dirt Rally will just morph into WRC and the Dirt series will carry on from Dirt 5 with the more action, gymkhana, buggy etc style off roading.

I reckon we still have 1 more Dirt Rally to come before the WRC games though.

Bearing in mind the timescale and the way CM seem to like to roll out games, with few getting much support beyond a year, I agree.

I can foresee, Dirt 5 2020, Dirt Rally 3 2021, Dirt 6 2022, WRC 2023 as a very tempting timescale for them, with Dirt Rally 3 as a "stepping stone" used to prep certain things behind the scenes for transition to WRC (game engine, physics etc, obviously not vehicles or tracks due to licensing).

KT will want to maximise their licence in the meantime too, so WRC 10 in 2021 and WRC 11 in 2022 from them to go with the above (Plus TDU).

Could be a good 3 years for rally fans, I only hope that KT can establish a commercially successful rally game after 2023 as competition is good for us all 👍

 

[SPhilli911]

I reckon we still have 1 more Dirt Rally to come before the WRC games though.

Hoping so, because I worry if they morph Dirt Rally into WRC games is that it will lose a lot of the cars and locations to focus on official WRC stages. No way a car list like DR 2.0 would be in a WRC game.

I also fear they would lose the "hardcore" difficulty of the DR games going into WRC in favor of a more accessible game.

 

[Scaff]

Hoping so, because I worry if they morph Dirt Rally into WRC games is that it will lose a lot of the cars and locations to focus on official WRC stages. No way a car list like DR 2.0 would be in a WRC game.

I also fear they would lose the "hardcore" difficulty of the DR games going into WRC in favor of a more accessible game.

Hope not given that the WRC titles have out hardcored Dirt Rally of late.

 

[SPhilli911]

Hope not given that the WRC titles have out hardcored Dirt Rally of late.

I haven't played much of WRC 7 or 8, but I wasn't implying that Dirt Rally is more or less hardcore or difficult than current WRC games. Meant that if Codemasters is going to be making the WRC games that they may chose to tweek things a little bit to be more accessible like they did with Dirt 4, that's my worry.

When the "sim" mode in Dirt 4 was announced it was promised to be better than Dirt Rally and it didn't exactly turn out that way. In other words, I hope the WRC games will be not be dumbed down versions of Dirt Rally, is all.

 

[MagpieRacer]

I haven't played much of WRC 7 or 8, but I wasn't implying that Dirt Rally is more or less hardcore or difficult than current WRC games. Meant that if Codemasters is going to be making the WRC games that they may chose to tweek things a little bit to be more accessible like they did with Dirt 4, that's my worry.

When the "sim" mode in Dirt 4 was announced it was promised to be better than Dirt Rally and it didn't exactly turn out that way. In other words, I hope the WRC games will be not be dumbed down versions of Dirt Rally, is all.

Codemasters are sensible enough to know what the fan base wants. So I don’t think they’ll go down the Dirt 4 route with it. That would be absolute suicide.

 

[Scaff]

I haven't played much of WRC 7 or 8, but I wasn't implying that Dirt Rally is more or less hardcore or difficult than current WRC games. Meant that if Codemasters is going to be making the WRC games that they may chose to tweek things a little bit to be more accessible like they did with Dirt 4, that's my worry.

When the "sim" mode in Dirt 4 was announced it was promised to be better than Dirt Rally and it didn't exactly turn out that way. In other words, I hope the WRC games will be not be dumbed down versions of Dirt Rally, is all.

Valid point, personally I hope they offer the same range of accessibility that F1 2020 offers.

 

[er185es]

Tom Henderson said: "I'll have lots of details on WRC later this week though."

 

[er185es]

Codemasters' WRC 23 Lets You Build Your Own Rally Car

Codemasters' WRC 23 Lets You Build Your Own Rally Car

Insider Gaming sources say that Codemasters' WRC 23, the first WRC title in over 18 years will allow you to fully build your own rally car.

insider-gaming.com

 

[T0MMY3688]

Seems like historic cars is still in the game and build your own car sounds interesting but having choices on where the engine is positioned sounds like it is not based on WRC1 cars.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Codemasters' WRC 23 Lets You Build Your Own Rally Car

Codemasters' WRC 23 Lets You Build Your Own Rally Car

Insider Gaming sources say that Codemasters' WRC 23, the first WRC title in over 18 years will allow you to fully build your own rally car.

insider-gaming.com

Sounds excellent. Glad it seems that the car classes from Dirt Rally 2 will carry over, lots of great cars in there. Building a car from the ground up sounds really interesting, perhaps akin to Sega GT but with more depth.

Seems like historic cars is still in the game and build your own car sounds interesting but having choices on where the engine is positioned sounds like it is not based on WRC1 cars.

It didn't explicitly say that building cars is specific to WRC classes. In fact I'd almost expect WRC1 to be the exception because of licensing but we'll wait and see. The engine position choices tell me we will be able to build something for multiple classes, especially as it seems the classes will be based off DR2.0.

 

[FT-1]

I was worried the Codemasters WRC games were going to solely focus on the WRC cars, but now I feel more assured knowing that it is pretty much Dirt Rally 3.0 with the WRC licence attached. 👍

Seems like the logical route to go down knowing that more cars bring more appeal, besides the fact Codemasters love recycling as many assets as they can!

 

[evldave333]

Looks like both rally franchises will carry on despite the licence trade im hopeful we get dirt 3.0 and not some dirt 4/5 aberration. Just a matter of time until v-rally brand resurrects to keep the flame lit at KT.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Well we now know the calendar for the 2023 WRC season and therefore the rallies that Codemasters first WRC game will feature.

Excited at the prospect of the central European rally, a tarmac event involving Germany, Austria and Czech Republic.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Codemasters' WRC 23 could be coming sooner than expected

We could be playing WRC 23 before F1 23 next year.

racinggames.gg

Rumours point to a spring launch for the first codemasters WRC game. The article says it seems early for the next one relative to the launch of Generations but I actually disagree here. Firstly, Generations was delayed several times which shouldn't affect Codemasters, and I much prefer licensed racing games such as F1 to launch during the season not right at the end of it.

Plus when you consider that WRC23 basically took over Dirt Rally 3, it stands to reason that a good portion of development was already done and the new of the WRC license acquisition broke midway through 2020, so there's plenty of development time there as well.

 

[TypeRDC5]

Codemasters' WRC 23 could be coming sooner than expected

We could be playing WRC 23 before F1 23 next year.

racinggames.gg

Plus when you consider that WRC23 basically took over Dirt Rally 3, it stands to reason that a good portion of development was already done and the new of the WRC license acquisition broke midway through 2020, so there's plenty of development time there as wewell.

I didn't know that WRC23 is replacing Dirt Rally 3, that's a shame as I assume the WRC games won't be as hardcore as the Dirt Rally series.

I would've thought the new WRC games would replace the main line Dirt titles instead.

 

[MagpieRacer]

I didn't know that WRC23 is replacing Dirt Rally 3, that's a shame as I assume the WRC games won't be as hardcore as the Dirt Rally series.

I would've thought the new WRC games would replace the main line Dirt titles instead.

It makes sense that it would replace the rally series. I see no reason why they'd dial down the sim nature of the rally games for the WRC title. KT Racings WRC games weren't exactly dialled back at all.

 

[FrankieStail]

I assume the WRC games won't be as hardcore as the Dirt Rally series.

Don’t think this should be the case, if anything I’d say the new wrc generations is a more realistic sim than dirt rally, apart from the usual kyloton bugs, generations is a really solid feeling title that codemasters will have their work cut out to top.
And I say this as a big dirt rally fan!

 

[Smokinrothman]

Codemasters are owned by EA now. if you look at psn profiles average trophy completion is 5% from 116k players. That says to me the average gamer thinks dirt 2.0 is too difficult. EA likes money. I’m worried

 

[TypeRDC5]

Don’t think this should be the case, if anything I’d say the new wrc generations is a more realistic sim than dirt rally, apart from the usual kyloton bugs, generations is a really solid feeling title that codemasters will have their work cut out to top.
And I say this as a big dirt rally fan!

Haven't played any of the Kyloton WRC games myself so hard to judge for me. Maybe I should give it a go to see what it is like.

Codemasters are owned by EA now. if you look at psn profiles average trophy completion is 5% from 116k players. That says to me the average gamer thinks dirt 2.0 is too difficult. EA likes money. I’m worried

This was my thinking too with it being EA now but if it is indeed taking over Dirt Rally then hopefully it will be more hardcore, im sure additional liveries can be obtain through a season pass I'm sure though 😅

 

[The Stig Farmer]

man I just hope that the rallycross stuff sticks around, especially now that WRC promotes World RX and all the tracks they added to DR2 are back on the calendar from this season

Watch them sell it back to us as a DLC expansion

 

[Smokinrothman]

Haven't played any of the Kyloton WRC games myself so hard to judge for me. Maybe I should give it a go to see what it is like.

This was my thinking too with it being EA now but if it is indeed taking over Dirt Rally then hopefully it will be more hardcore, im sure additional liveries can be obtain through a season pass I'm sure though 😅

The wrc games have there problems but in the newest one, there’s loads of courses and after a bit of fiddling with the settings it handles really well

 

[FrankieStail]

if you look at psn profiles average trophy completion is 5% from 116k players. That says to me the average gamer thinks dirt 2.0 is too difficult. EA likes money. I’m worried

It would be unwise to come to this conclusion regarding trophies as it’s more likely that the competitive sim player foregoes the career path and heads straight to dailies, weeklies and clubs.

In the case of both dirt rally and the wrc games I’ve never even looked at career modes and have no interest in trophies or game completion.

 

[Northstar]

It would be unwise to come to this conclusion regarding trophies as it’s more likely that the competitive sim player foregoes the career path and heads straight to dailies, weeklies and clubs.

In the case of both dirt rally and the wrc games I’ve never even looked at career modes and have no interest in trophies or game completion.

To further this point, DR2 still manages around 1,000 players on Steam. Granted that's only a third of the equation since we don't know what the console numbers are, but even if they are a fraction of it that is still a great number for a rally racing game that hasn't been updated since April, 2021 and IIRC no new content since September, 2020.

EA likes money. I’m worried

The fact EA likes money is exactly why I'm not worried. Sim racing is a very small market sure, but at the same time it can also be a very loyal market that isn't afraid to open their wallets if they feel it's worth it (while complaining about it, of course). There's also the fact that DR2 still has a healthy userbase while the casual focused Dirt 5 never even came close to the numbers the more serious title managed.