CORE Nurburgring 24 Hours 2016Open
- Thread starter ItzRacing
- 220 comments
- 17,852 views
- 557
- Gilleleje
- GTP_Big-Dane
Where do i uploade stint photo?
- 1,133
- Murray Bridge
- ItzRacing
I have invited you to your teams conversation, this is where the stint photos need to be uploaded to.
- 557
- Gilleleje
- GTP_Big-Dane
- 935
- Coventry
- jonnyb1990
Today I placed the car where I wanted in my hotlaps. Only minor mistakes here and there.
- 2,563
- Adelaide
- Heathenpride
Last year our victory was a team effort but we all know that @MINT_GTR had a lot to do with it, as did @TDZdave who's effort was no less herculean.
So this year Mint "screwed us" by winning GT Academy and we were down a driver, how do you replace Mint?? You replace him with @beau231 because that man is one of the few people in the world who can fill those huge shoes left by Mint.
Welcome to the race Beau, welcome to GHH and welcome to the green hell.
GHH are here to defend our crown and we are ready for it, the standard of driving will be huge and we can't wait to battle it out with old rivals and friends.
Let's do this
So this year Mint "screwed us" by winning GT Academy and we were down a driver, how do you replace Mint?? You replace him with @beau231 because that man is one of the few people in the world who can fill those huge shoes left by Mint.
Welcome to the race Beau, welcome to GHH and welcome to the green hell.
GHH are here to defend our crown and we are ready for it, the standard of driving will be huge and we can't wait to battle it out with old rivals and friends.
Let's do this
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- 398
- Maitland, NSW
- TRL_beau
Thank you very much HPLast year our victory was a team effort but we all know that @MINT_GTR had a lot to do with it, as did @TDZdave who's effort was no less herculean.
So this year Mint "screwed us" by winning GT Academy and we were down a driver, how do you replace Mint?? You replace him with @beau231 because that man is one of the few people in the world who can fill those huge shoes left by Mint.
Welcome to the race Beau, welcome to GHH and welcome to the green hell.
GHH are here to defend our crown and we are ready for it, the standard of driving will be huge and we can't wait to battle it out with old rivals and friends.
Let's do this
I'm looking forward to the race and can't wait to see everyone on the race track
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- 1,339
- denmark
- MrRacingline
A little help regarding the PP (first I changed the oil on the cars I allready had and after I went and bought brand new cars so I could be sure that they hadnt had an oil change)
OIL CHANGE
Audi R8 ..............604-605pp
BMW..................597pp
CHEVROLET.........582pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 633pp
turbo 3 - 627pp
MERCEDES..........612pp
NO OIL CHANGE
AUDI R8..............603pp
BMW..................595pp
CHEVROLET.........581pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 631pp
turbo 3 - 626pp
MERCEDES..........609pp
AUDI R8 dont need engine upgrade too have 540bhp and iff it hasnt the engine upgrade it cant get 540bhp without the oil change , just info
OIL CHANGE
Audi R8 ..............604-605pp
BMW..................597pp
CHEVROLET.........582pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 633pp
turbo 3 - 627pp
MERCEDES..........612pp
NO OIL CHANGE
AUDI R8..............603pp
BMW..................595pp
CHEVROLET.........581pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 631pp
turbo 3 - 626pp
MERCEDES..........609pp
AUDI R8 dont need engine upgrade too have 540bhp and iff it hasnt the engine upgrade it cant get 540bhp without the oil change , just info
- 8,168
- Hindmarsh Island
- TDZ-4-12-14-88
- XBOX_is_GAY!!!!
A little help regarding the PP (first I changed the oil on the cars I allready had and after I went and bought brand new cars so I could be sure that they hadnt had an oil change)
OIL CHANGE
Audi R8 ..............604-605pp
BMW..................597pp
CHEVROLET.........582pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 633pp
turbo 3 - 627pp
MERCEDES..........612pp
NO OIL CHANGE
AUDI R8..............603pp
BMW..................595pp
CHEVROLET.........581pp
GTR......turbo 2 - 631pp
turbo 3 - 626pp
MERCEDES..........609pp
AUDI R8 dont need engine upgrade too have 540bhp and iff it hasnt the engine upgrade it cant get 540bhp without the oil change , just info
All the spec's were created with an oil change, all cars bar the SLS can achieve the required BoP parameters without an oil change, that is correct, but the oil change option is an option and left to the teams own discretion, 5bhp isn't a huge loss compared to what happens with an oil change, we will be running our SLS without it,
- 1,339
- denmark
- MrRacingline
All the spec's were created with an oil change, all cars bar the SLS can achieve the required BoP parameters without an oil change, that is correct, but the oil change option is an option and left to the teams own discretion, 5bhp isn't a huge loss compared to what happens with an oil change, we will be running our SLS without it,
Thats not what ITZ wrote in the DART thread and its not only 5 bhp you lose by not changing the oil , you also lose torgue , so I still say that it isnt fair iff not all shall do an oilchange , the specs on page 1 I do hope count
- 590
- Australia
- StigsTC
The cars were BoP'd to do the same laptime such that racing is fair.
During the race, after 200km, this BoP changes.
Non-SLS teams have the choice to take less max torque without oil, but still maintain rather large flat power curves.*
The exception to this is the Z4, which has a rather narrow flat power band at the top of the rev range. The Z4 is also sensitive to oil change regulations and needs investigation also.**
SLS teams either run at correct BoP, and then lose 27hp as the race progresses, or they start 5hp AND 31.4Nm of torque down. (The Z4 can still start at max power, just for much less rpm)
We are asking that the BoP that was designed to keep cars equal over 1 lap keeps them equal over 10 laps.
To do this we need to re-test the SLS with NA Stage 3 instead of Oil change, and come up with a new hp that still fits.
I did some quick tests of my own to see what kind of max hp decrease is required to match the slight increase in torque and increased time at max power.
(Tests conducted with tyre wear off for consistency)
Oil change @ 575hp 612pp - 7:49.523
NA Stage3 @ 574hp 612pp - 7:48.912
NA Stage3 @ 570hp 611pp - 7:49.787
No mods @ 570hp 609pp - 7:54.105
Worn oil @ 548hp 604pp - 7:55.919
575hp Oil change - base laptime
574hp Stage 3 - half a second faster than current baseline - too fast
570hp Stage 3 - Effectively the same - Maybe a tad slower due to better driving but it beats the alternative.
570hp no oil - 4.5 seconds per lap slower
548hp Oil worn - Not much slower than 570hp. Seems to only just cut the tip of the power curve off costing minimal 'area under the curve' and seems to have less impact than expected.
Essentially it boils down to not wanting to start the race 5 seconds a lap off pace.
*Please refer to attached image explaining the power bands of each car on no oil.
**Investigating the Z4 could be as simple as raising the power limiter to give the car access to hp above 545 to allow greater max acceleration to compensate for lost torque and a narrower power band.
During the race, after 200km, this BoP changes.
Non-SLS teams have the choice to take less max torque without oil, but still maintain rather large flat power curves.*
The exception to this is the Z4, which has a rather narrow flat power band at the top of the rev range. The Z4 is also sensitive to oil change regulations and needs investigation also.**
SLS teams either run at correct BoP, and then lose 27hp as the race progresses, or they start 5hp AND 31.4Nm of torque down. (The Z4 can still start at max power, just for much less rpm)
We are asking that the BoP that was designed to keep cars equal over 1 lap keeps them equal over 10 laps.
To do this we need to re-test the SLS with NA Stage 3 instead of Oil change, and come up with a new hp that still fits.
I did some quick tests of my own to see what kind of max hp decrease is required to match the slight increase in torque and increased time at max power.
(Tests conducted with tyre wear off for consistency)
Oil change @ 575hp 612pp - 7:49.523
NA Stage3 @ 574hp 612pp - 7:48.912
NA Stage3 @ 570hp 611pp - 7:49.787
No mods @ 570hp 609pp - 7:54.105
Worn oil @ 548hp 604pp - 7:55.919
575hp Oil change - base laptime
574hp Stage 3 - half a second faster than current baseline - too fast
570hp Stage 3 - Effectively the same - Maybe a tad slower due to better driving but it beats the alternative.
570hp no oil - 4.5 seconds per lap slower
548hp Oil worn - Not much slower than 570hp. Seems to only just cut the tip of the power curve off costing minimal 'area under the curve' and seems to have less impact than expected.
Essentially it boils down to not wanting to start the race 5 seconds a lap off pace.
*Please refer to attached image explaining the power bands of each car on no oil.
**Investigating the Z4 could be as simple as raising the power limiter to give the car access to hp above 545 to allow greater max acceleration to compensate for lost torque and a narrower power band.
Attachments
- 1,442
- Scotland
- Glen-Alz-81
2 days till race day, re-speccing this close to the event is not an option given the time required to do so, car choice was free and this is the 3rd year? with these specs, i think??
I agree that this may need looked at but to meet specs (PP wise) all cars must be oil changed, ie everyone in the same boat with regards to degradation.
All the cars were tested/spec'd with oil change, any additional parts were listed along with a PP range to conform to.
I can happily say that every endurance event i have entered i have done so with an oil changed car (teamates also), GTPscs technical info sheet has oil change ticked, to me that says the vehicle must be oil changed so any time i see a car down on spec pp i dont agree with it.
Not trying to stir anything up, just my opinion.
I agree that this may need looked at but to meet specs (PP wise) all cars must be oil changed, ie everyone in the same boat with regards to degradation.
All the cars were tested/spec'd with oil change, any additional parts were listed along with a PP range to conform to.
I can happily say that every endurance event i have entered i have done so with an oil changed car (teamates also), GTPscs technical info sheet has oil change ticked, to me that says the vehicle must be oil changed so any time i see a car down on spec pp i dont agree with it.
Not trying to stir anything up, just my opinion.
- 1,339
- denmark
- MrRacingline
Iff all cars does the oil change it would be fair in my opinion and thats why i made the test on what PP they would have , as the chevrolet's PP on page 1 needs too be altered or else you can run the car with and with out oil as it is now
- 590
- Australia
- StigsTC
We started the discussion last week before qually then nothing happened, didn't know I needed to go data mining to make the point.
The regulations may be 3 years old, but my team joined super late, and I didn't get around to looking at specs until that week before qualifying, at which point I brought it up and said "that's not right".
If we aren't willing to re-spec cars, then we need to be enforcing BoP WITH an oil change. Such that a lower PP for same HP is unacceptable and requires changing. This requires its own investigation to see if cars are the same PP with OR without PP. If this cannot be established on some cars, then enforcing oil change by checking PP is impossible and all teams are again not in the same boat in regards to oil deg. brb on that one I guess.
This means local teams spend about 23 hours at lower power and network teams get fresh cars every new driver for about 8 laps, returning them 50 of the seconds they lose in the driver swap process.
Also Glen, you definitely didn't do Daytona with an oil change - it was prohibited on the Mazda
(Picture of PP before and after oil at hp cap goes here)
The regulations may be 3 years old, but my team joined super late, and I didn't get around to looking at specs until that week before qualifying, at which point I brought it up and said "that's not right".
If we aren't willing to re-spec cars, then we need to be enforcing BoP WITH an oil change. Such that a lower PP for same HP is unacceptable and requires changing. This requires its own investigation to see if cars are the same PP with OR without PP. If this cannot be established on some cars, then enforcing oil change by checking PP is impossible and all teams are again not in the same boat in regards to oil deg. brb on that one I guess.
This means local teams spend about 23 hours at lower power and network teams get fresh cars every new driver for about 8 laps, returning them 50 of the seconds they lose in the driver swap process.
Also Glen, you definitely didn't do Daytona with an oil change - it was prohibited on the Mazda
(Picture of PP before and after oil at hp cap goes here)
- 1,133
- Murray Bridge
- ItzRacing
Okay, here is what will be allowed and not allowed. The decisions made will be final and there is not going to be any changes to them from now until the race is finished:
- The SLS teams will not be granted permission to run with Stage 3 tuning and must run standard tuning.
- All teams are permitted to run with or without the oil change in the car if they choose to.
- All teams can have spare cars and have the option to change cars at pit stops if they wish to, as an effort to change oil.
-As with the network driver changes, teams which do car changes do so at their own expense and there will be no efforts compensate time. (This will be a straight race and teams are encouraged to find the fastest way to the finish line.)
Finally I want to add a few other points.
The Mercs were 1-2-3 in qualifying, I don't think we need to make them any faster, and how the bop is currently setup, I truly believe the car is capable of winning the race as much as any other car is.
I know the bop was down over a full stint. This caused some issues and complaints in Global GT as some cars were faster over a single lap and took the fastest lap and pole position points, but other cars caught back up over a full stint. Everyone will have the opportunity to swap cars as well if they want to. So the playing field should be even now. It's up to the teams to decide which is the best way to be in the best position to win after 24 hours.
That is all that I have to say on the matter. I look forward to seeing everyone Saturday afternoon/Sunday Morning for what should be an enjoyable and memorable race.
- The SLS teams will not be granted permission to run with Stage 3 tuning and must run standard tuning.
- All teams are permitted to run with or without the oil change in the car if they choose to.
- All teams can have spare cars and have the option to change cars at pit stops if they wish to, as an effort to change oil.
-As with the network driver changes, teams which do car changes do so at their own expense and there will be no efforts compensate time. (This will be a straight race and teams are encouraged to find the fastest way to the finish line.)
Finally I want to add a few other points.
The Mercs were 1-2-3 in qualifying, I don't think we need to make them any faster, and how the bop is currently setup, I truly believe the car is capable of winning the race as much as any other car is.
I know the bop was down over a full stint. This caused some issues and complaints in Global GT as some cars were faster over a single lap and took the fastest lap and pole position points, but other cars caught back up over a full stint. Everyone will have the opportunity to swap cars as well if they want to. So the playing field should be even now. It's up to the teams to decide which is the best way to be in the best position to win after 24 hours.
That is all that I have to say on the matter. I look forward to seeing everyone Saturday afternoon/Sunday Morning for what should be an enjoyable and memorable race.
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