Endurance Races

[vaioleto]

We need weather, day/night cycles, different weather on different parts of the track (it is common for tracks like Spa and the Nordschleife to have rain in certain parts of the track only), more than just soft/hard tyre compounds (wet tyres need to be included), and there needs to be a risk of mechanical failure.

NO, thank you.

Why do people want stupid stuff like random malfunctions and stuff in Endurance races? Severe case of masochism?

 

[Hyst]

It's hardly a driving simulator if it's not included, is it. Read the my post after that.

 

[vaioleto]

It's hardly a driving simulator if it's not included, is it. Read the my post after that.

GT5 should also come with a giant pair of mechanical scissors that cut off a body part every time you crash, or a giant spike that shoots out and impales you, after all, it wouldn't be REAL DRIVING SIMULATOR if it didn't...

Oh that's right, it doesn't do that, I guess it's nothing but a game then... oh wait, what do you know...

 

[Hyst]

..a game that calls itself the Real Driving Simulator. Which is an oxymoron in itself, as something cannot be real and a simulation. Therefore, the goal becomes to be as real as it can be, but some people still want to be picky about which parts of realism appeal to them.

 

[vaioleto]

..a game that calls itself the Real Driving Simulator. Which is an oxymoron in itself, as something cannot be real and a simulation. Therefore, the goal becomes to be as real as it can be, but some people still want to be picky about which parts of realism appeal to them.

But a simulator has to simulate everything!! Just being a good driving game isn't enough for some people I see.

"OH! BUT IT CLAIMZ TO BE A REAL DRIVING SIMULATORRRR (tm)"

Pretending to be driving while sitting on couch, serious business.

 

[premhz]

I managed it whilst retaining my life too, thanks to B-spec it can be rattled off in 9 hours or so, I woke up about 8am (early for a weekend for me) decided I would rattle of the 24 endurance race. finished it about half 5 the same day, still had time to go out in the evening.

That said, it would be easier if it you could game saves at certain race intervals, it just makes things that more flexible.

Oh yeah it can be done with the help of DAMMIT(the name of my b-spec driver ) But anyone can set it up for b-spec go out and come back and say i`ve done a 24hr race. The real drivers drive it themselves and not many people have that option.

 

[Hyst]

Did you read my other posts? All of this is optional. Why does everything have to be black and white with this forum?

 

[vaioleto]

Did you read my other posts? All of this is optional. Why does everything have to be black and white with this forum?

Even if it's optional, it's just a dumb idea, I'm sorry. Even if you say people can't be picky with what they want in a driving sim, you are being picky by not driving a real car and experience realism in its full glory by paying gas money and repair costs.

Frankly, if PD could add one more tree in the background to some random track by using the time that would've been wasted to implement this feature, I'd be happy. It's just wasted time, no one will use it except for maybe 5 of the millions of people that'll buy this game, and 4 of them would've had it turned on by accident anyways. Actually no, if I can get this game 1 hour sooner by having PD not include the option, I'd be happy as well.

 

[Stevisiov]

..a game that calls itself the Real Driving Simulator. Which is an oxymoron in itself, as something cannot be real and a simulation. Therefore, the goal becomes to be as real as it can be, but some people still want to be picky about which parts of realism appeal to them.

That's the nail on the head. There is no such thing as a real simulator. Every simulator ever created makes assumptions, assumptions which make simulation easier. You can't account for every variable ever unless you have an exact replica of the entire universe (and more if you consider things to exist outside our universe, which of course they must since our simulator must exist outside our universe. we have ourselves a paradox.)

.....Aaaaaaaanyway. Gran Turismo is no exception to that rule, it assumes things in order to make life easy. For example, where do all these credits come from? they don't, its just an assumption that they exist. How does our car get to the track? its just an code that has been created for our convenience. If it were real, we would have to tow our car to the track. This would be more realistic but less convenient.

In the Gran Turismo world, realism is sacrificed massively to improve convenience, in this respect it will never become real. Mechanical failure is one such inconvenience. Its a huge part of racing, but so is getting sponsorship for your car. Just because it is realistic doesn't mean it should be included. I wouldn't want to play a game where I had to scout round and negotiate with sponsors just so I could race. It wouldn't be fun, its a negative things. Thankfully this so called real driving sim can ignore those annoying issues. I feel this is the exact same case with random mechanical damage, its a negative to your experience and it is something completely out of your control, negatives aren't bad as long as you have some degree of control. Thankfully our real driving simulator can ignore this too and get on with the stuff we enjoy. I would go into an inconsolable rage if my car broke down for no apparent reason in the dying hours of my race at Le Mans. Random mechanical failures are bad, if they could be eliminated from racing they would be. Our simulator can do that thankfully so we don't have to go through the misery of a race driver. Non-random mechanical failures aren't bad, infact I would welcome them. Since you can control them its up to the driver to ensure it doesn't happen. That's another good way to differentiate good drivers from bad ones.

Oh yeah it can be done with the help of DAMMIT(the name of my b-spec driver ) But anyone can set it up for b-spec go out and come back and say i`ve done a 24hr race. The real drivers drive it themselves and not many people have that option.

If its between me having a life, and letting Bob do the work for me, I am willing to let him have his rare race to allow me 100% completion.

If you don't care about 100% completion, then you shouldn't have a problem with not being able to do the race, so you don't need to give up your life to do the 24 hour race.

 

[Ardius]

Just to pipe in this debate - I think its meant to be taken as The Simulator of Real Driving not the The Driving Simulator that is Real. There is a difference
You could technically have a simulator of Fantasy Driving - which GT is of course not.

 

[Northstar]

For me, endurance races will be better already, the addition of an extra 10 opponents should really make a difference, lapping people will be more frequent which is definetly needed on the big tracks, which incidentally is where the longer endurance races are held. For me chasing down that car on the horizon is key to motivation and quick lap times.

Pivotal for many are mid race game saves. How many? I reckon for a save point every 5 or 6 hours would ideal. Leaving the console on overnight is a real pain.

More importantly for me, I would like to see day/night transition, 24 hours of daylight is silly, I really hope we don't see it again. Perhaps more of an ask would be in race changeable, for me that would greatly enhance endurance races, bringing an element of unknown and strategy, ultimately making the races more varied and interesting.

They could just add an option to the pit menu to save the race, this would help to in case there is a power failure or something.

 

[premhz]

That's the nail on the head. There is no such thing as a real simulator. Every simulator ever created makes assumptions, assumptions which make simulation easier. You can't account for every variable ever unless you have an exact replica of the entire universe (and more if you consider things to exist outside our universe, which of course they must since our simulator must exist outside our universe. we have ourselves a paradox.)

.....Aaaaaaaanyway. Gran Turismo is no exception to that rule, it assumes things in order to make life easy. For example, where do all these credits come from? they don't, its just an assumption that they exist. How does our car get to the track? its just an code that has been created for our convenience. If it were real, we would have to tow our car to the track. This would be more realistic but less convenient.

In the Gran Turismo world, realism is sacrificed massively to improve convenience, in this respect it will never become real. Mechanical failure is one such inconvenience. Its a huge part of racing, but so is getting sponsorship for your car. Just because it is realistic doesn't mean it should be included. I wouldn't want to play a game where I had to scout round and negotiate with sponsors just so I could race. It wouldn't be fun, its a negative things. Thankfully this so called real driving sim can ignore those annoying issues. I feel this is the exact same case with random mechanical damage, its a negative to your experience and it is something completely out of your control, negatives aren't bad as long as you have some degree of control. Thankfully our real driving simulator can ignore this too and get on with the stuff we enjoy. I would go into an inconsolable rage if my car broke down for no apparent reason in the dying hours of my race at Le Mans. Random mechanical failures are bad, if they could be eliminated from racing they would be. Our simulator can do that thankfully so we don't have to go through the misery of a race driver. Non-random mechanical failures aren't bad, infact I would welcome them. Since you can control them its up to the driver to ensure it doesn't happen. That's another good way to differentiate good drivers from bad ones.



If its between me having a life, and letting Bob do the work for me, I am willing to let him have his rare race to allow me 100% completion.

If you don't care about 100% completion, then you shouldn't have a problem with not being able to do the race, so you don't need to give up your life to do the 24 hour race.

I`m just saying that i`d rather do the driving myself and earn my 100% rather than let bob do it. Didn`t we get te game to play rather than let bob do it for you and then run around saying look at me i`m 100% complete,when it`s you and bob 50/50. I`d love to reach 100% but as GT4 progressed it was leaning towards full blown race cars/Le Mans type cars and no longer more tuned production car races and my interest waned so i decided to put GT4 up on blocks at 66%. All that remains is the majority of non production car races and the majority of the enduro`s.

 

[Stevisiov]

I`m just saying that i`d rather do the driving myself and earn my 100% rather than let bob do it. Didn`t we get te game to play rather than let bob do it for you and then run around saying look at me i`m 100% complete,when it`s you and bob 50/50. I`d love to reach 100% but as GT4 progressed it was leaning towards full blown race cars/Le Mans type cars and no longer more tuned production car races and my interest waned so i decided to put GT4 up on blocks at 66%. All that remains is the majority of non production car races and the majority of the enduro`s.

Well that's alright, although why are you worried about such feature though if you only stick to production cars?

The production car endurance races races are significantly smaller so a half way race save wouldn't affect you would it?

 

[88c-v Racer]

The way I see it is this. You, when starting an enduro, have 2 options -

1 - Turn all mechanical DNFs (for you and the AI) off. You can run in the current style if you want.

2 - Have only 'user-controlled' DNFs. That is to say, the only way you could DNF from the race is through your own fault (overrevving the engine, things like that).

if it was like that then i think it should be like in Forza where options like that affect how many credits you can get in the race.

 

[Qronicle]

Another interesting feature for endurance races would be that you could start the race with multiple users (psn IDs) offline or maybe even online (co-op like).
At the end of the race the credits and prize car are automatically given to all participants.

 

[Hyst]

Could be interesting, but I fail to see many people dedicating 4 hours to not racing, waiting their turn.

 

[yeti]

I`m just saying that i`d rather do the driving myself and earn my 100% rather than let bob do it. Didn`t we get te game to play rather than let bob do it for you and then run around saying look at me i`m 100% complete,when it`s you and bob 50/50. I`d love to reach 100% but as GT4 progressed it was leaning towards full blown race cars/Le Mans type cars and no longer more tuned production car races and my interest waned so i decided to put GT4 up on blocks at 66%. All that remains is the majority of non production car races and the majority of the enduro`s.

I found that some cars were physically undriveable with the Dualshock2 at certain speeds - running the Minolta around the test track would be fine until I was very quick - then all of a sudden the car would slew off the track without a chance to save it with the controller - Bob could drive the race faster than I could because he didn't crash at those speeds...

All the 24hour endurance races were done by BOB with a few laps by myself here and there due to my inability to play a game for anywhere close to 8 hours at a time -> 6*4 stints would mean that I would've had to leave the PS2 on for 4 whole days - and 2 of those would've been work days too - just not possible for me.

C.