Fanatec Gran Turismo DD Extreme Wheel

[super_gt]

So, everyone everywhere tells you to use an INT Setting as low as possible to get the most direct, raw and unfiltered FFB Signal.
Agree?
But just for a little moment have you ever asked yourself if it's true? And why, who says that, what is it he aims for. What led him to that statement?
Have you ever questioned this recommendation?

 

[PirovacBoy]

Is that your new Wheel?
Awesome looks like the Bentley.
Mr Richie Rich 😁
Referring to the on screen display message.
Have you read it and comprehend it.
What does it say?
It says High Interpolation settings Can!, reduce the detail.
Think about it... The exact wording and how it can! Not that it does reduce the detail.
Let's take it a step further as I highly appreciate it to engage with a well known member.
Which detail can be less detailed?
All details.?
What are all details?
Or just certain not clearly stated details like,,, what actually?

What I'm trying to explain is, I rather trust my hands.
I'm not saying that it's wrong though, yet in GT7 I personally haven't noticed a loss of Any details in the slightest.

What I actually did notice is that these overly harsh and completely unrelated to what's happening feedback wise from the car/road to the Wheelbase /Wheel and to our hands Signal is being shaped and formed and molded with each step I went higher on the INT. setting.
I would say my hands are very sensible and I can clearly feel even slightest changes.
Hence if I would have noticed that a partly loss of details, let alone complete signal strings, I would have never ever fiddled further as up To the point I noticed the loss.

But that's exactly what didn't happen.
Everything is still there.
Every little detail. Raw visceral and with a brute force which now, with the raised interpolation finally feels so precise, so detailed in a way that with the same car same corner same everything, yet with a low INT Value the FFB signal just punched you but you couldn't precisely say what it actually was.
The Bump, or the kerb, or a car hitting you.
It was always muddy yet harsh and it never felt like anything but the real thing.
I related to a tin filled with some marbles or sand.
It was metallic, robotic not fluid by any. Means. At all.
It felt loud and noisy, but never realistic or precise.
Of course over time our bird brains adapted and we tricked eventually our minds to believe it's the real thing.
But I read comments everywhere like @Nebuc72 on his TGT but DDPro and DD+ users too that the rattle feels horrible.
As if some cogs were running mad inside the base.
And exactly This has vanished completely.
With the Clear and crisp Signals cloaked in a Signal mud prior, now as precise like a Swiss clockwork.

No Detail IS lost, actually it's quite the opposite.
Every signal is now ironed out to a degree that every detail can be pointed to a specific sensation.

To sum it up, I appreciate to clarify and answer one of my many questions.

And I really really hope that you look into the others too.
Because once the magic got you, there is no going back to low INT Values.
Impossible.

I think I remember another very enthusiastic Fanatec DD Pro Tuner... @Abarth_71

I believe he also once suggested a very high INT setting.
Not sure though.
But yeah.
By the way have you tried my recommended. Setting.
I would really like to hear your thoughts.
Because no matter my blabla, the moment u feel what I talk, you'll kiss my heart 😁

 

[super_gt]

I'm not sure about the details, but I definitely feel increased lag with high INT values in an oversteer situation.

 

[FMW]

My INT setting is at 3. For laughs and giggles, I set it to 11. While this setting felt fine, inputs felt delayed. You can get used to it, I suppose, but for me racing in a league makes this setting not ideal.

 

[FMW]

Unfortunately that was announced before, due to the tariffs... Not much they can do about it

Understandable. I don't see how anyone looking to jump into the sim racing hobby in the USA will want to pay that tariff to play with FANATEC gear. It will be interesting to see how it affects other brands that manufacture their bases, wheels, pedals in China.

 

[ANDRITSOULAS]

In every base's manual in the section "TUNING MENUS AND PROFILES'' Fanatec states clearly which setting is a filter.
Interpolaration is a filter :
"FFB Interpolation smooths and interpolates FFB by filtering game output without FFB detail loss. OFF = unfiltered, 01 = lowest filter, and 20 = highest filter.''
(CSL DD page 20.......5.6.8)
So it is really easy to understand what setting has to go to ''OFF'' or ''0'' to have the ''RAW'' ffb signal from every particular sim/game

*Filters are :

• NDP (Natural Damper)
• NFR (Natural Friction)
• NIN (Natural Inertia)
• INT (FFB Interpolation)
• FEI (Force Effect Intensity)

* Assuming FFS (Force Feedback Scaling) is set to ''PEAK", where ever it is applicable.

In every steering wheel that has a ''bigger'' screen (Bentley/DD Extreme/Porsche endurance e.t.c.) pops the same message when you go high with the INT value.
Also in the last 20+ drivers, if not earlier, if you leave the mouse pointer on the particular setting pops up a message that explains how every setting works and has a suggestion above which value there is negative impact at the ffb etc. Only FEI goes in reverse.

One can easily see that above 50% (if not sooner) of the scale value in every ''Filter setting'' ffb signal goes worse.....

In my opinion the best way to start tunning a wheelbase is:

1. Start with filters NDP/NFR/NIN/INT ''OFF'' and FEI 100.
2. Let everything else maxed out.
3. Consideration of the weight and diameter of the steering wheel.
4. Last but not least have in game settings with no signal clipping.

 

[PirovacBoy]

I'm not sure about the details, but I definitely feel increased lag with high INT values in an oversteer situation.

OK I see, very very strange.
So to confirm that I got you right.
You have used the exact same settings which I posted.
All.
And you then felt increased lag.
So lag in terms of the Signal not being synced to what's happening in the game?
OK, that's new.
Never had such behavior.
But thanks for clarification mate.

My INT setting is at 3. For laughs and giggles, I set it to 11. While this setting felt fine, inputs felt delayed. You can get used to it, I suppose, but for me racing in a league makes this setting not ideal.

Just the INT Value or did you copy all and every single bit I mentioned?

Delayed inputs in terms of un synchronized FFB signal related to the on screen action.?

 

[Nathaniel_Wu]

I could be totally wrong, but I think the INT setting most likely controls a smoothing filter instead of a true interpolator, so the more past samples it includes, which is probably what the INT value means, the more phase delay it adds to the output signal.

 

[FMW]

OK I see, very very strange.
So to confirm that I got you right.
You have used the exact same settings which I posted.
All.
And you then felt increased lag.
So lag in terms of the Signal not being synced to what's happening in the game?
OK, that's new.
Never had such behavior.
But thanks for clarification mate.

Just the INT Value or did you copy all and every single bit I mentioned?

Delayed inputs in terms of un synchronized FFB signal related to the on screen action.?

In terms of wheel base settings, yes. I use your exact values from before and I only changed the INT from 3 to 11. To be fair, if you're saying "STEERING TORQUE" and "STEERING SENSITIVITY must also be set to your preference to see the effects of INT 11, then I did not try that. My Steering Torque is set between 3-4 (Car dependent) and steering sensitivity is set between 9-10 (track and tire compound dependent)

Wheelbase Settings :
Sen: Auto
FFB: 100
FUL: OFF ( not used)
NDP: 28
NFR: 5
NIN: OFF
INT: 11
FEI: 100
FOR: 100
SPR: 100 (I have this off as the game does not use it. At 100 same as off from what I see)
DPR: 100 (I have this off as the game does not use it. At 100 same as off from what I see)

GT7 In Game Settings :
Controller Sensitivity : 0
Controller Vibration : OFF
TORQUE : 5 (I use 4)
SENSITIVITY : 1 (I use 9-10)

Anyway, I will try this again to see if Steering Torque and Steering Sensitivity make any difference with INT being set to 11.

 

[PirovacBoy]

In terms of wheel base settings, yes. I use your exact values from before and I only changed the INT from 3 to 11. To be fair, if you're saying "STEERING TORQUE" and "STEERING SENSITIVITY must also be set to your preference to see the effects of INT 11, then I did not try that. My Steering Torque is set between 3-4 (Car dependent) and steering sensitivity is set between 9-10 (track and tire compound dependent)

Wheelbase Settings :
Sen: Auto
FFB: 100
FUL: OFF ( not used)
NDP: 28
NFR: 5
NIN: OFF
INT: 11
FEI: 100
FOR: 100
SPR: 100 (I have this off as the game does not use it. At 100 same as off from what I see)
DPR: 100 (I have this off as the game does not use it. At 100 same as off from what I see)

GT7 In Game Settings :
Controller Sensitivity : 0
Controller Vibration : OFF
TORQUE : 5 (I use 4)
SENSITIVITY : 1 (I use 9-10)

Anyway, I will try this again to see if Steering Torque and Steering Sensitivity make any difference with INT being set to 11.

Yes DEFINITELY, and Sensitivity especially MUST be set to 1.
Torque on 5 isn't an definitive and obligatory must but it shouldn't be neglected.
I'll explain why especially the Sensitivity plays a main role here.
Previously I always used high Sensitivity settings.
I wanted to get fast and firm forces to be felt around the center position of my Wheel rim.
On top of that I also suggested to use NIN at 1.
This added even more firmness and stability to the 0 degree center position of the Rim.
So that as soon as you had to turn the Wheel the FFB Torque was immediately guided by the desired Firmness and the high Sensitivity setting guaranteed me amplified FFB effects which were even further completely masking the weight shifts, or to be more precise, weight transfers became non linear as the high sensitivity setting shiftrd the driving dynamics into a much more narrow operating windows.

@super_gt always said that Sensitivity should be set to 1 to have the highest dynamic range available for the FFB to be felt.

Me on the other hand didn't like the loose Wheel feel on initial turn in.
I always referred to Low Sensitivity setting feels more like a weight transfer driven FFB experience as opposed to a very high sensitivity setting which provides a more Firm and direct FFB with no Wheel play deadzone around the center.

This worked like a charm for me.
The only issue I always had and couldn't get rid of was the horrendous oscillation.
So having a high Sensitivity setting in game and therefore direct and desired amplified FFB effects, the trade off was to deal with these oscillations.

I then out of curiosity and being bored, I switched to the other end of the spectrum.
@super_gt words came to my mind and I set Sensitivity to 1.
Ahaaaa, no more Oscillations.
So now I was finally getting an even more real life Wheel feel experience.
And on top of that I realized that especially the weight transfer feeling which is 1 of the 3 main forces felt in the Wheel made the driving become a much more authentic experience.

But I wasn't truly satisfied with the somewhat slightly loose turn in feel.
That initial turn in, that left right turning.
I was missing the accomodated stability, but the more I got used to the weight transfer FFB I forgot about it.

But, I now also realized way more precise and nuanced how completely wrong and robotic the FFB signal spikes felt.
Especially the road and suspension, but tire FFB as well which were super precise, they all felt off. Unrealistic and hollow, mechanical noise included and I knew I had to get rid off just of This single piece in the FFB chain and my Wheel would finally feel perfectly close if not the closest it can to the real world feel.
Having completely forgotten about INT settings and how they were impacting and addind to the feeling and how they effected the feeling with high Sensitivity settings, I reminded myself that now using low INT, maybe it will have a different outcome playing around with it.

Step by step I started to increase it, have a spin, check the feeling. OK.
1 more click up... UNTIL...


And here is where the circle finally closes.

INTERPOLATION 11

GAME CHANGER

Mechanical Noise, marbles suspension, and almost non existing tire feel, but as well as the still existing but in the meanwhile gotten used too loose Wheel feel around the center which suddenly and immediately noticeable became firm again, yet now, with the still available complete dynamic range Signal despite the low INT Value.

Even the Oscilliations came back... And here is what led me to my conclusion how the INT works and effects the Driving Experience in GT7 combined with the low Sensitivity setting in game.
It doesn't make the signal loose details, not the slightest, it doesn't add or take away FFB effects.
But it simply smoothes out the spikes and seems to fill a very flattering FFB signal curve.
Like some sort of increased Bitrate which adds missing information.

Try to look at it like the Soap Opera effect TVs tend to produce.

At first it looks artificial.

But it actually is realistic.
But because we all got used to the robotic 23,97 fps or 25 fps pictures it takes our brains some time to get used to this new fluidity.
Or Video games.
I would never go back to 25fps gaming.
60fps is the lowest I consider as being playable AND therefore enjoyable.

THIS INTERPOLATION 11 transformed EVERYTHING.

It made everything within the FFB signal feel more filtered and separated from each other, more precise, and took away the mechanical feeling completely.
Driving down the straights, there is no more strange rattle and shaking to be felt.
Just the engine buzz slightly felt in your hands.
As soon as your cars' suspension gets involved it is felt immediately and very brutal and precise, yet without unsettling the Wheel rim.
Understeer is now separated into even more precise steps.
Going from becoming firmer and firmer in the Wheel rim until the point the tires loose grip where the Wheel suddenly becomes very loose before regaining grip and the Wheel becoming firm again.

So yeah, conclusion. High interpolation acts like a signal enhancer it amplifies the details and separates each layer within the signal.


Unbelievable and to me not comprehensible.
Yet it is what it is.

 

[Dep Fishtail]

Where is the controlled vibration setting found which should be “off” ?
In game or under options controller settings?

 

[Oshawa-Joe]

I currently use the Logitech G Pro wheel. Hopefully I can comment here as I also use the Fantec CSL Elite V2s.

Im planning on picking up the Clubsport DD F1 bundle if tariffs, taxes, etc make it possible, and hopefully join all of you with the ridiculous amount of wheel tuning options. For now I'll enjoy my ignorance with the lack of options. It's kinda great.

 

[PirovacBoy]

Where is the controlled vibration setting found which should be “off” ?
In game or under options controller settings?

Both options contain the option to turn Controller Vibration off.

 

[rsspyder21]

Both options contain the option to turn Controller Vibration off.

I must've missed it ... why does this matter if driving with a wheel?

 

[PirovacBoy]

I must've missed it ... why does this matter if driving with a wheel?

Because for some reason, changing both available controller options still have an impact despite using a wheel setup.
It sounds strange but from my personal observations I noticed that changing for example the Controller Sensitivity which ranges from - 2 up to 10, it does make a difference in terms of how quickly the car reacts to my steering wheel inputs.
It works different compared to changing the Wheel SEN degree of rotation though.
It's more subtle where the Wheel Rotation still matches the in game wheel rotation as opposed to changing the SEN where it's clearly visible that Physical Wheel inputs get out of sync to the in game steering wheel animation.
Same goes for the Controller Vibration setting which goes from 0 up to 150.
The default I think is either 80 or 100 not sure which one it is but with Vibration turned on, I noticed that the FFB still had some sort of signal processing going on and intervening with the actual Wheelbase FFB signal.

As soon as I turned it off I noticed the actual FFB became more refined and more precise in terms of being able to distinguish certain elements better from each other.
Especially the Road Surface feel immediately became more distinguishable from the other FFB effects.
It's hard to explain.

For example the Logitech G Pro uses exactly this Controller Vibration Feature to amplify their True Force features.

Hence it became logical to me that this Vibration Feature does have an impact to a Wheel Setup.
Our Fanatec Wheelbase despite not having such a feature available, controller vibration maybe still sends some signal output to the Wheelbase.

I don't know how FullForce was meant to be implemented or if it would have worked similar to how Logitechs G Pro receives its True Force signal.

Yet you can clearly see that both Controller options still seem to have some effect.

I mean I can still remember the discussion where some people swore that they can't feel any difference if using wheel sensitivity either at 1 or 10.
To them both felt the same.

So still, maybe some don't notice the differences but at least from my personal experience it does have an impact.
Hence I advice to turn off Controller Vibration when driving with a wheel.

 

[donkervoort]

Hello Guys and everyone in between 😬
Currently sitting at work doing my duty, I just tuned in to see if any news in regards of FullForce and finally its integration to GT7 might have leaked.

Unfortunately from the looks of it there still seems to be nothing on the radar.

Anyway I just wanted to share my latest Settings for GT7 which to be honest may seem minor at first glance, but let me assure you, they do have a significant impact on the overall perceived driving experience.

So if you are happy and satisfied with your Settings, you may as well skip the following.
Of course You'll definitely miss on a game changing driving experience, but like I mentioned earlier, if you're satisfied why change it.

For everyone else who is still struggling to get an as close as possible to the real world Wheel rim feel, the following Settings do provide the most authentic and immersive driving experience in GT7.

OK so here we go

Wheelbase Settings :
Sen: Auto
FFB: 100
FUL: OFF ( not used)
NDP: 28
NFR: 5
NIN: OFF
INT: 11
FEI: 100
FOR: 100
SPR: 100
DPR: 100

GT7 In Game Settings :
Controller Sensitivity : 0
Controller Vibration : OFF
TORQUE : 5
SENSITIVITY : 1

Just as a reminder. I personally drive only in Cockpit View with the HUD turned off completely.
On top of that in 99% I drive without ABS.
I'm using TCS1.

So this is my setup all of my observations come from.

Assuming that most of you know what every setting does and how it works and impacts the FFB, I'm only going to explain here why I absolutely and highly recommend and advice to use INT 11.

So, everyone everywhere tells you to use an INT Setting as low as possible to get the most direct, raw and unfiltered FFB Signal.
Agree?
But just for a little moment have you ever asked yourself if it's true? And why, who says that, what is it he aims for. What led him to that statement?
Have you ever questioned this recommendation?
Or did you just copy paste it and forgot about it.
Because I was guilty of it.
And Boy was I wrong.
I'll explain why.
So, ask yourself please the following questions.

What is it that makes a perfectly dialed in FFB an enjoyable and believable driving experience?
Think about it...not as easy as you thought.
Because there are a lot of different things which have to come together.
The ingredients need a balanced recipe.
And one more for you, what is it that is essential to feel, or let me put it this way.
What are the main Forces we feel in real world driving which we as well need to feel in our virtual Worlds?
Take a moment and think about it, please.
Well I'm sure you all will agree on the following.
1. It's Weight Shift / Transfer
2. It's Understeer
3. It's Oversteer
The above 3 are the main Forces.
Nothing else. Nothing more.

Now, I want you to ask yourself how do you feel these sensations in real life?
Through our steering wheel, exactly.

And what is it our Steering Wheel is attached to?
Yes exactly it's the steering column... Which receives its Feedback from... Yes, exactly... The Front axle.
The Front axle is where all the magic happens.
It's our direct connection to what the tires are doing.
It's our link to feel the grip.
It let's us know when we are on the edge.
It communicates understeer.
Agreed.
So, let's move on to the next part, the weight transfer.
And you might have already guessed it, this is as well communicated through our steering wheel yes, our wheel getting firmer or loose, depending on tire friction, the steering amount in relation to speed and of course the resulting g forces produced.
And yes of course we also feel weight shift through our body, more or less precise and intense, depending on the stability provided by our seats as well as how tight and firm we are strapped in to our seat belts. Acceleration and braking factored in too.
Agreed.
So we have come to our last main force/sensation we feel in real life and urgently begging to feel somehow in our virtual ride too.
Oversteer.
Only with the exception that this force is not as easy to simulate and implement plausibly and separated from another force which plays a huge role and we have already mentioned before... Exactly you got it... Weight shift.
Because of the simple fact that Oversteer is not a force tied directly to the front axle, our main Signal output as we have concluded previously, it has to be integrated in a more artificial way.
Some games do it better then others, but right here and right now we are strictly talking about GT7.
As every Racing Game uses a different Algorithm and FFB Calculations System it's completely up to the Simulation Team how they wish to implement real world telemetry data. and especially how it will feel through our hands holding to our beloved Wheel rim.
Yet, I hope we all will agree on the fact that at least, same as in real world driving, most of the Oversteer feel and how we perceive it goes through our inner ear and rim wise we just react to the sudden loss of traction.
Of course we also notice and subconsciously feel the angle from our front tires in relation to the direction the car is heading, we visualize and aim to stabilize our imagined line the car should take to not end up in a glorified Donut aka spin our ride.

Yes, to sum it up actually what we feel through our hands is only related to the front axle.
And that's basically what matters.
That is actually what is directly communicated in real world same as in GT7.

Now, and only now at this point, we can move on.
To everything else we do experience and feel, 0driving our cars in real life.

Things like Suspension and Road Surface or Bumps and everything else which is also to a degree communicated by the front axle.

And of course we want to feel these Sensations too in our Simulator of choice, here namely GT7.

But now comes a very very important question I once again want everyone who hasn't left the chat by now 😅 ask oneself.
How much is needed?
How much is enough?
How much is actually effective?

And most of all, is it really necessary to feel every virtual marble and tiniest of effect artificially implemented, also known as canned effects.
Yes they feel nice, they add to the immersion and if implented correctly definitely round up the driving experience and perceived level of authenticity.
Yet, and now please, I want you all to listen up closely.
Isn't it about the balance of these effects in relation to our 3 Main Forces which are tied to the front axle.
Pay attention now please as I'm about to reveal what the hell I'm actually trying to tell you.
Because all of these Signals have to blend in homogeneous.
Nothing should obscure or mask our 3 Main Forces.
These canned effects should act as an immersion amplifier.
And most of all, and most importantly of all, they should feel pleasant and informative.
Because honestly it's not about quantity, but quality.

And this quality I'm talking about is what led me to the Interpolation Setting of 11.
11 is where everything finally makes sense.
It's smooth, it's sleek it's elegant.
And not a single effect, I say it again loud and clear,... NOT A SINGLE EFFECT is missing.
Because it's simply not about how Raw the FFB Signal is filtered or not in order to feel everything in the Signal , but it's about how it feels. In our hands.
A low INT Signal, and I always said that, is not desirable. It's not realistic.
It just plain and outright feels completely unnatural and wrong.
It rumbles and rattles the Wheelbase / Rim mechanically and hollow.
It's absolutely wrong.
This is not what it feels like driving in real life, God beware.
And yes we play a game but FFS, we are using such delicate hardware, with an integrated software which can be dependent on the games FFB Signal dialed in to come as close as possible to its real world counterpart.
Because and this is my final question.
Do you really think, do you honestly believe that this low INT Setting feels close to your real world driving experience?
If you answer that question with yes... Sorry but in that case you have completely lost the point and sense of what it feels like in reality.
A low INT Setting is harsh, it's mechanical and loud.
It's noisy and grainy.
It communicates a completely artificial sensation which is anything but not real.
The DD+ is such a great Package, Hardware and Software wise that if dialed in correctly and having the real world as example, you just can't argue a low INT Setting.

No way, never.
There are no arguments or facts that justify a low INT Setting.
Definitely NOT for GT7.

So do yourself a favor and give my mentioned settings a try.
And compare them to the real thing.
Nothing else.
I have 3 Rims.
No matter which one is in use, the result is ALWAYS the same.

I never ever have to adjust the in game Torque, because GT7 uses a dynamic FFB algorithm to set the Torque Values individually by its internal calculations.
No matter what car type, tire choice or track or conditions.
Every car in GT7 feels how it is supposed to feel.

Have you actually ever asked yourself why all of these false Prophets on YouTube tell you to change the Torque values for individual car types?
Did you?.
Because they use such laughable settings, it's beyond me how one can enjoy driving like that.

Have you guys actually ever watched TRL Superstar Max Verstappen, yes F1 Verstappen playing iRacing?
Do you see how intense and visceral his Wheel behaves.
The brutal Hits and impacts communicated through his Wheelbase.

And now I want you to watch the GT YouTube Experts.
Just pay attention to their hands how they turn the Wheel.
How dead the Wheel behaves.
Absolutely ridiculous compared to the likes of a Max Verstappen playing a racing game with settings which most definitely come as close as possible to his experience.

Listen carefully to what Suellio Almeida tells you.
Pay attention to how Daniel Morard sets up his Wheelbase to simulate his experience.
Watch their hands, watch their Wheel rims, both in real life AND virtually.

You will notice that it looks almost identical.
Why?
Because THAT is how driving feels in both Worlds.
Everything else is just sweatz stuff.

The most pleasant, most precise and most natural and therefore easiest and effective way to be fast and have fun.
It's raw yet it feels impactful and visceral.
And only now with INT 11, the road surface as well as tires come alive.
Actually everything in terms of FFB strength and fidelity gets caught up in this singularity.

PLEASE remember how utterly false it feels going down the final long straight at Interlagos? I mean what the fck is that rattle?
That's not what a bumpy surface feels.
Not the slightest.
Or take Daytona Road Course the final straight before start finish line.
What is that??? What, why does a low INT Setting make sense?
For what?
Honestly if you think carefully about everything I wrote down it should click, yeah and you should clack, do your own math.

I mean to be honest do whatever you want.
But being a FFB Enthusiast, craving for the most authentic replication, wanting you my Fellow Driving enthusiasts to experience what I do, just do it what I described.

And yes I know, many around here don't give a moist fart about reality.

Bumper, chase or whatever nonsense Video game view suits best in terms of lap times, laughable weak FFB my 3year nephew would steer one handed, artificially lowered Wheel Rotation to get quicker response times... O god, although my settings are catered towards everyone I know 99% of you don't care.


You don't care about the stuff I talk about.
But I know exactly that we have a very very small and almost non existent player base here who do care.

This is for you my friends.
I wrote down and explained all of this in a logical and comprehensive manner, so there are no more arguments left on the table.

GT7 is absolutely top notch in terms of FFB.
With our DD+.
With the Settings I just provided to you.
Maybe even @Jordan might like to undust his old and trustworthy DD+ and give these Settings a swing.
Trust me my good fellow Planeteers.
You should definitely enjoy and feel what I feel.
It's magic... True magic 😁

I enjoy my dd+ and the feedback it gives but with ffb at 100 and 5 ingame i can't imagine some cars steering that heavy, sometimes i have to go back to 4. The immersion of feeling everything is awesome though.

 

[RS60NR]

I enjoy my dd+ and the feedback it gives but with ffb at 100 and 5 ingame i can't imagine some cars steering that heavy, sometimes i have to go back to 4. The immersion of feeling everything is awesome though.

I’ve been mostly driving 5/100 w these settings which are really doing it for me BTW. But agree that the heavy hitters can be a bit much.

I set up a duplicate tuning slot and adjusted FFB down to 80-90% for easy switching as 4 felt really different from 5 in-game - not just strength but the overall range of effects - maybe its not completely linear?

 

[PirovacBoy]

I enjoy my dd+ and the feedback it gives but with ffb at 100 and 5 ingame i can't imagine some cars steering that heavy, sometimes i have to go back to 4. The immersion of feeling everything is awesome though.

Are you using my latest settings.?
If so tell us your experience.
Curio to hear.
And yes I drive EVERY Car on any tire track combo and NEVER adjust Torque settings.
For me it's about replicate real world sensations as best as possible.
Everything else is playing games.
I don't play, I drive and race.
👀😎

I’ve been mostly driving 5/100 w these settings which are really doing it for me BTW. But agree that the heavy hitters can be a bit much.

I set up a duplicate tuning slot and adjusted FFB down to 80-90% for easy switching as 4 felt really different from 5 in-game - not just strength but the overall range of effects - maybe its not completely linear?

So Neil, have you tried my final stage of FFB Tweak.
How does it compare to the previous variant?
What is it that you like the most.
I mean honestly, this is just the best I've ever had it.
If I could just lmake Yamauchi San experience what PirovacBoy has created... It's magic 😁😍

 

[timekiller001]

I gave your settings a try but they are not really to my liking, the wheel feels too springy and the effects a bit over-exaggerated.
But it's also because I'm very used to my own settings and grown to them.
My settings are almost identical but with some differences:
FFB 80 (personal preference)
NDP 50 (to reduce the springy feel that PD introduced several patches ago)
INT 0

 

[RS60NR]

So Neil, have you tried my final stage of FFB Tweak.
How does it compare to the previous variant?
What is it that you like the most.
I mean honestly, this is just the best I've ever had it.
If I could just lmake Yamauchi San experience what PirovacBoy has created... It's magic 😁😍

Yes running the latest settings after you changed INT to 11. Was running the previous w INT at 5.

Prior I had my own settings which I thought were pretty good but that was no comparison - yours were much more intense, not just due to the higher strengh, but in the sensations of weight transfer and grip behavior, more imersive and more true (as it can be possible in a sim) to cars I have driven and tracked IRL, road cars only tho no GT3 or better - really blown away!

I compared INT 5 to INT 11 back to back - I also was doubtful about that change, as I had thought like most that 11 was too high and lower was better.

But now INT 5 felt a bit metallic, like speakers where the treble is too high or a photo that has been oversharpened - not terrible - but after some time, INT 11 surprisingly feels so much more natural. And the oscilation is gone - so much nicer now

So yes…Magic

I think people who feel instant reactive responsiveness is better may have other preferences - I’ve moved on from that view and am now doing much better w car control using these settings

I do wonder if the higher grip cars - the Formula and GR1 cars - are a bit too heavy, but that may be issues still w how PD’s tire and supsension modeling are scaled between classes - I was a bit worn down at 100 FFB after a while

But the higher FFB setting does seem better to bring out the more subtle behaviors so running it at 100 is where I’ve mostly been

 

[PirovacBoy]

I gave your settings a try but they are not really to my liking, the wheel feels too springy and the effects a bit over-exaggerated.
But it's also because I'm very used to my own settings and grown to them.
My settings are almost identical but with some differences:
FFB 80 (personal preference)
NDP 50 (to reduce the springy feel that PD introduced several patches ago)
INT 0

Hey Tudsen, Thx for your opinion on the Settings.
My Wheel Settings will be perfect for most probably 95 if not more % of all DD + Users.
Because unlike you and some other highly competitive players who are not into recreating Real World FFB, you will prefer a different Feeling and that's absolutely ok.
What exactly do you mean by springy?
I don't notice anything springy.
Just a firm overall feedback.
And yes you are absolutely right about the FFB effects.
They might seem brutal, but none of them feels wrong.
It's mainly down to the high Torque setting.
So your Wheelbase is set to 80%, and what about your in game setting?
NDP at 50 would be way to muddy and make the Wheel feel artificially heavy, but therefore a low INT doesn't feel that harsh.
Hence I guess your in game settings are Torque 3 / Sensitivity 10.
Am I right.
On. Another note.
Just recently I shared my settings with some online friends which you also know, like David Vörös aka IGTSH David Red and Simek aka ERS GPG18 as well as Parka aka Dstinct Tsunamee.
I also called up Mihael Matika.

Simek was absolutely blown away by the precision and the on point perfect FFB.
He loved the fact that the Wheel finally feels real.
He was also using very low INT 2.
He IMMEDIATELY noticed how smooth and calm the Wheel became after also switching to Sensitivity 1, but INT 11 was THE game changer for him.
David and Parka appreciated the feedback too, yet same as you said they just felt overwhelmed by the precision and brute force of the FFB.

The meant that it slows them down having to put that much physical strength to turn the Wheel.
As well as the appreciated the FFB they also prefer gimmicky FFB as it's easier to them to react accordingly as they are used to the mechanical noise.
To them GT7 isn't a Sim they said it's about gaming the inputs.

Matika on the other hand told me that he couldn't believe how good and precise and yet smooth it felt.
Yet same as the other two, he said the high FFB Torque unnecessary slows him down and it would definitely fatigue him after a while.
He is also a person who doesn't like a realistic feel.
To him it's about reactions and harsh FFB to react the Quickest as possible.

He said he will 100% use my settings for offline stuff and for fun and immersion or showcasing others how good GT7 is.
He was mostly impressed by the high INT setting. Very surprised how it completely calmed down the driving.
But from a competitive point of view he couldn't drive on the level he does.

Not because of the FFB feel, but it would fatigue and slow him down.

So yes it's all about what we want .

Gaming FFB or Immersion Real World FFB wheel feel.

I will leave these 2 clips here.

Give them a watch.
Not just you but ANYONE.

Because these People do it exactly like I do.
My approach.
Seeing real world race drivers actually doing the same I do gives me the good feeling of knowing exactly what I do and that I did it spot on.





And now do me a favor please and try my settings again... 😁

And then tell me that it's not the closest to what it should feel like compared to the real thing

You still won't like it but you should notice that this is very much what these People advise us to do.

See you mate. 👍👽

 

[PirovacBoy]

Yes running the latest settings after you changed INT to 11. Was running the previous w INT at 5.

Prior I had my own settings which I thought were pretty good but that was no comparison - yours were much more intense, not just due to the higher strengh, but in the sensations of weight transfer and grip behavior, more imersive and more true (as it can be possible in a sim) to cars I have driven and tracked IRL, road cars only tho no GT3 or better - really blown away!

I compared INT 5 to INT 11 back to back - I also was doubtful about that change, as I had thought like most that 11 was too high and lower was better.

But now INT 5 felt a bit metallic, like speakers where the treble is too high or a photo that has been oversharpened - not terrible - but after some time, INT 11 surprisingly feels so much more natural. And the oscilation is gone - so much nicer now

So yes…Magic

I think people who feel instant reactive responsiveness is better may have other preferences - I’ve moved on from that view and am now doing much better w car control using these settings

I do wonder if the higher grip cars - the Formula and GR1 cars - are a bit too heavy, but that may be issues still w how PD’s tire and supsension modeling are scaled between classes - I was a bit worn down at 100 FFB after a while

But the higher FFB setting does seem better to bring out the more subtle behaviors so running it at 100 is where I’ve mostly been

Wow that sounds awesome.
I'm so glad that another good person finally gets the possibility to experience GT7 and it's phenomenal FFB.
This Game deserves the slogan The Real Driving Simulator more than ever after these latest tweaks.

I will go so far and put my hand in fire when I say the following.

It's these exact settings the DD+ as well as the DD Pro should came shipped with.
Or at least these should be the Settings which PD should recommend to be used.

Because we still don't know exactly which settings they test their FFB with.

Imagine Yamauchi San would give these a try... I bet he would get hooked.
This is what GT7 is supposed to feel like.
So damn close to real world sensations and immersive as it can be.

@Jordan in case you still haven't tried them settings...
Now is the moment.
Because you too are most probably one of the few ones who will absolutely adore them.

@Kriptical @FMW and many many others out there stil looking for The Settings... 😎😁

 

[Jordan]

@Jordan in case you still haven't tried them settings...
Now is the moment.
Because you too are most probably one of the few ones who will absolutely adore them.

Finally had a chance to give them a go tonight and yep, I do.

You've got another hit on your hands, in my opinion, and I agree it is a very natural sensation in all the cars I've tried. I'm using the settings with the new Porsche Vision GT wheel that I just reviewed and the combination of this configuration with the added fidelity of the aluminum frame is a real treat.

I felt faster straight away. It feels like I can detect the loss of grip and understeer earlier now. It's not that the effects are "stronger", per se — it's that I can feel them when they are even at their most subtle. For me, this seems to translate into improved reactions to oversteer and understeer, as if I can reign it in quicker or catch a slide easier. It's brilliant stuff, and I've been driving great with it.

Well done!

 

[timekiller001]

What exactly do you mean by springy?

It's a bit hard to explain, but that was introduced in one of the patches that updated feedback for the DDX a long time ago. Just that at the end of the corner, the way it pulls back to the center position. It kind of feels like you're pulling on a spring and then releasing it, so it pulls you back to the center quite hard. That's why I increased NDP to 50 to counteract that.

And yes you are absolutely right about the FFB effects.
They might seem brutal, but none of them feels wrong.
It's mainly down to the high Torque setting.

No, no, not wrong Just not what I'm used to. The settings I've had on my DD Pro resulted in a similar feel to what I have now (less force, less detailed of course), but it's what I'm used to now for almost 3 years.
I can see the benefit of your settings, I'll probably give them also more of a try, but I didn't want to test them too much during the GTWS season

So your Wheelbase is set to 80%, and what about your in game setting?
NDP at 50 would be way to muddy and make the Wheel feel artificially heavy, but therefore a low INT doesn't feel that harsh.
Hence I guess your in game settings are Torque 3 / Sensitivity 10.
Am I right.

Nope I'm using 5/1 as well.

 

[FMW]

Yes DEFINITELY, and Sensitivity especially MUST be set to 1.
Torque on 5 isn't an definitive and obligatory must but it shouldn't be neglected.
I'll explain why especially the Sensitivity plays a main role here.
Previously I always used high Sensitivity settings.
I wanted to get fast and firm forces to be felt around the center position of my Wheel rim.
On top of that I also suggested to use NIN at 1.
This added even more firmness and stability to the 0 degree center position of the Rim.
So that as soon as you had to turn the Wheel the FFB Torque was immediately guided by the desired Firmness and the high Sensitivity setting guaranteed me amplified FFB effects which were even further completely masking the weight shifts, or to be more precise, weight transfers became non linear as the high sensitivity setting shiftrd the driving dynamics into a much more narrow operating windows.

@super_gt always said that Sensitivity should be set to 1 to have the highest dynamic range available for the FFB to be felt.

Me on the other hand didn't like the loose Wheel feel on initial turn in.
I always referred to Low Sensitivity setting feels more like a weight transfer driven FFB experience as opposed to a very high sensitivity setting which provides a more Firm and direct FFB with no Wheel play deadzone around the center.

This worked like a charm for me.
The only issue I always had and couldn't get rid of was the horrendous oscillation.
So having a high Sensitivity setting in game and therefore direct and desired amplified FFB effects, the trade off was to deal with these oscillations.

I then out of curiosity and being bored, I switched to the other end of the spectrum.
@super_gt words came to my mind and I set Sensitivity to 1.
Ahaaaa, no more Oscillations.
So now I was finally getting an even more real life Wheel feel experience.
And on top of that I realized that especially the weight transfer feeling which is 1 of the 3 main forces felt in the Wheel made the driving become a much more authentic experience.

But I wasn't truly satisfied with the somewhat slightly loose turn in feel.
That initial turn in, that left right turning.
I was missing the accomodated stability, but the more I got used to the weight transfer FFB I forgot about it.

But, I now also realized way more precise and nuanced how completely wrong and robotic the FFB signal spikes felt.
Especially the road and suspension, but tire FFB as well which were super precise, they all felt off. Unrealistic and hollow, mechanical noise included and I knew I had to get rid off just of This single piece in the FFB chain and my Wheel would finally feel perfectly close if not the closest it can to the real world feel.
Having completely forgotten about INT settings and how they were impacting and addind to the feeling and how they effected the feeling with high Sensitivity settings, I reminded myself that now using low INT, maybe it will have a different outcome playing around with it.

Step by step I started to increase it, have a spin, check the feeling. OK.
1 more click up... UNTIL...


And here is where the circle finally closes.

INTERPOLATION 11

GAME CHANGER

Mechanical Noise, marbles suspension, and almost non existing tire feel, but as well as the still existing but in the meanwhile gotten used too loose Wheel feel around the center which suddenly and immediately noticeable became firm again, yet now, with the still available complete dynamic range Signal despite the low INT Value.

Even the Oscilliations came back... And here is what led me to my conclusion how the INT works and effects the Driving Experience in GT7 combined with the low Sensitivity setting in game.
It doesn't make the signal loose details, not the slightest, it doesn't add or take away FFB effects.
But it simply smoothes out the spikes and seems to fill a very flattering FFB signal curve.
Like some sort of increased Bitrate which adds missing information.

Try to look at it like the Soap Opera effect TVs tend to produce.

At first it looks artificial.

But it actually is realistic.
But because we all got used to the robotic 23,97 fps or 25 fps pictures it takes our brains some time to get used to this new fluidity.
Or Video games.
I would never go back to 25fps gaming.
60fps is the lowest I consider as being playable AND therefore enjoyable.

THIS INTERPOLATION 11 transformed EVERYTHING.

It made everything within the FFB signal feel more filtered and separated from each other, more precise, and took away the mechanical feeling completely.
Driving down the straights, there is no more strange rattle and shaking to be felt.
Just the engine buzz slightly felt in your hands.
As soon as your cars' suspension gets involved it is felt immediately and very brutal and precise, yet without unsettling the Wheel rim.
Understeer is now separated into even more precise steps.
Going from becoming firmer and firmer in the Wheel rim until the point the tires loose grip where the Wheel suddenly becomes very loose before regaining grip and the Wheel becoming firm again.

So yeah, conclusion. High interpolation acts like a signal enhancer it amplifies the details and separates each layer within the signal.


Unbelievable and to me not comprehensible.
Yet it is what it is.

I tried your settings again today with the only 2 settings being different than what I already run. As mentioned before, they are INT at 3 and in game sensitivity between 8-10 (car dependent).

Anyway, I wanted to approach trying INT 11 and SENSITIVITY 1 differently today. I league race on Saturdays. For me I look for three things in by base settings: Realism, lap time, and consistency. Today, I discovered your settings gave me 2 out of 3! So, today we are racing GR3 (All members racing the Renault-NO TUNING) at MONZA. Simple track, but tricky to extract fast and consistent lap time, at least it has been for me. Anyway, ran my tried-and-true settings. Fun, but I struggled in LESMO 1 and LESMO 2. The car always feels like it’s in a narrow window before it feels “snappy” and has a weird behavior of twitchiness on the front end. Anyway, I made the two changes. To my surprise, the lap times went down and my consistency noticeably improved. Not by a little, but by a lot. Now, the car’s tires with this setting feel like absolute deadness. You can’t feel them at all, but to be fair, GT7 has always not been the best at tire feel. (Hopefully “FULL FORCE” fixes that someday…) With SENSITIVITY at 1, however it appears like weight transfer seems more like a thing. The wheel does feel dead at center, but my head quickly got over it because the lap times came down and each corner felt more consistent and more fun to take to be perfectly honest. More natural in a way. That narrow window I mentioned earlier through LESMO 1 and 2 for sure broadened. I made up a lot of lap time through there and the consistency through there was much better. And again, FUN.

The input lag, I mentioned before was wrong. What I was feeling was the wheels dead feeling at center, but I can’t deny, that once you get used to it, the cars I’ve driven so far do feel a bit more natural.

I’m going to leave these revised settings in my base and game for a while. You’ve discovered something cool. I’m willing to bet it will be broken at some point if PD updates the game with some new FFB tweak. LOL Hopefully not. Hopefully Full force comes out and we get better tire feel with these revised tweaks.


Thanks for all the testing and observations. Fun stuff and a fun part of the hobby to discover new things.

 

[crackhaed]

Gave Int 11 a shot and I really like it. Feels very real and less uhh… crunchy?

 

[donkervoort]

Are you using my latest settings.?
If so tell us your experience.
Curio to hear.
And yes I drive EVERY Car on any tire track combo and NEVER adjust Torque settings.
For me it's about replicate real world sensations as best as possible.
Everything else is playing games.
I don't play, I drive and race.
👀😎

So Neil, have you tried my final stage of FFB Tweak.
How does it compare to the previous variant?
What is it that you like the most.
I mean honestly, this is just the best I've ever had it.
If I could just lmake Yamauchi San experience what PirovacBoy has created... It's magic 😁😍

I'm not on your settings yet, need to try that....

 

[harnas8]

Hello
what are the best settings for clubsport dd+ base in gt7?

 

[RS60NR]

Hello
what are the best settings for clubsport dd+ base in gt7?

These:

@pirovac_boy’s lastest

Set both wheel and in-game as described

 

[Andy Lapi]

For me unplayable..(steering..) I use
FFB 100
NDP 25
NFR 10
NIN 5
INT OFF
FEI 100
FOR 120
Note FUL SPR DPR note used in GT7

In game
FFB Torque 2
FFB sensitivity 10