Forza Motorsports 4 review by insidesimracing.tv

[Scaff]

Physics 12.5 - 11.5. Both games get things right and wrong. Why GT5 wins out is unfortunately FM4 does dumb things down too much. Its way too easy to correct hiccups. Sorry but it really is

Its slightly easier to correct that it should be, but certainly not way too easy at all and lift off oversteer is not severe enough (but FM4 still does make a better fist of that that GT5 does), that said its certainly not dumbed down to the degree you are suggesting. Get to cocky with a car and it will bite back.



GT5 on the other hand misses out significant chunks of how cars react as a result of issues with its physics engine.

Ever wondered why GT5 doesn't have standing starts? Give a full throttle launch in any powerful RWD car a go and let me know just how much the car tried to step out of line, or how realistically the tyres hook up. That's all without raising the thorny issue of if they are talking about on or off line physics in GT, because you can see some differences between those.

Overall the biggest problem for me with GT's physics is how it manifests itself in tuning and the effects of changes in comparison to the real world. In GT5 we have this utterly bizarre situation that FWD cars need to be tuned the total opposite of how real world cars would be tuned, what scares me the most is some of the nonsense that gets posted on GTP attempting to justify this issues, the real world gets thrown right out of the window then.


Scaff

 

[Speed-Fox]

I thought it was a pretty good review.

The slow AI took the score down a little too much. But other than that I think they were spot-on.

 

[I'm Motarded]

Tracks 9 - 8.75. FM4 gets too higher score for me here. Graphics aside, GT5's original tracks blow FM4's away. Also, apart from LS, FM4's RL tracks just have way too many issue's. Majority is because they were deliberately made easier

Sorry, don't mean to jump on you here, but which tracks were made easier? we all know people "claim" the nordschleife was made to make online racing more accessible (I'm yet to see factual evidence of turn 10 saying this after all this time) but aside from that what else?

When you say majority surely you can't mean one?

I'd say it was a fair score when you take into account all of GT5's 2D copy/paste trees and 2D people, although really on afterthought 50% of that should be bundled under graphics. How accurate can a row of identical trees in size width and height be?

At the end of the day all reviews are opinions, peoples opinions vary, very few are definitive, if any.

 

[yakapo]

Forza 4 should have double whatever GT5 scored in multiplayer and sound. Who cares about AI? I've said this before but playing online against other people is 10x as fun as playing the AI. They weighed AI much too heavily.

 

[imported_Chad Esposito]

IF ISR gave 9 out of 10 to Forza 4 in sound, please somebody tell me which game deserves a 10 out of 10 then. I would LOVE to give it a try just to listen to it.

 

[somebodysb2]

Sorry, don't mean to jump on you here, but which tracks were made easier? we all know people "claim" the nordschleife was made to make online racing more accessible (I'm yet to see factual evidence of turn 10 saying this after all this time) but aside from that what else?

When you say majority surely you can't mean one?

I'd say it was a fair score when you take into account all of GT5's 2D copy/paste trees and 2D people, although really on afterthought 50% of that should be bundled under graphics. How accurate can a row of identical trees in size width and height be?

At the end of the day all reviews are opinions, peoples opinions vary, very few are definitive, if any.

2d copypasta trees and people aren't exclusive to GT..Forza has its fair share of cutting corners.

 

[imported_JJ72]

This is EXACTLY how I feel about the review now.

It is to an extent.

And don't forget that when they review GT5 most of its shortcomings in terms of physics were not totally exposed yet.

I wouldn't say being level 50 "only" is too short for a comprehensive review, in terms of difficulty and driving feel they have plenty of experience to conclude it in a relatively short period of time.

 

[imported_JJ72]

IF ISR gave 9 out of 10 to Forza 4 in sound, please somebody tell me which game deserves a 10 out of 10 then. I would LOVE to give it a try just to listen to it.

perfect score shouldn't be given out lightly.

 

[UKMikey]

How about 9 and a half for audio then?

I think the audio should maybe have been rated a fraction higher. Perhaps ISR felt more could've been done with directional sound ie making a far away car sound more echoey with DSP. I dunno.

I'm more inclined to believe the conspiracy theory that Signor Rossi and his hapless AI cohorts have been made the whipping boys for the game so that Shaun and Darin could reduce enough categories to give the game a closer score to GT5.

Oh well, their definitive comparison of the two games (er, I mean the game and the dead serious console sim ) is coming soon to pour more gasoline on the fire of this minor frontline of the console war.

 

[imported_JJ72]

9 and half would be for Shift 2 or GTR2 I think.

 

[cuco33]

Didn't they also say something about the ai shouldn't be looked at as a huge factor in the last review yet here we have this one and they even admitted they brought down the score a lot due specifically the ai?? So which is it? Ai is not as important or so important it drives scores down so much??

 

[imported_Chad Esposito]

Didn't they also say something about the ai shouldn't be looked at as a huge factor in the last review yet here we have this one and they even admitted they brought down the score a lot due specifically the ai?? So which is it? Ai is not as important or so important it drives scores down so much??

Those guys are full of contradictions, they act much more like fans of a hobby, rather than journalists or experts.

 

[Terronium-12]

9 and half would be for Shift 2 or GTR2 I think.

PGR4.

It still has the best audio samples for cars, ranging from accurate to incredibly accurate.

 

[UKMikey]

PGR4.

It still has the best audio samples for cars, ranging from accurate to incredibly accurate.

That's exactly the title I'm thinking of. Hearing the cars roaring down the track sounds even better than Forza.

 

[I'm Motarded]

2d copypasta trees and people aren't exclusive to GT..Forza has its fair share of cutting corners.

I can honestly say I didn't notice any of that (2D objects) in Forza, Not close to trackside, not that I've bothered delving any further afield to look as that's where my FOV is mostly.

Anyone have any pics?

PGR4.

It still has the best audio samples for cars, ranging from accurate to incredibly accurate.

I think FM4 is up there with PGR4 and in a lot of cases better (The fm3 DLC and new to fm4 cars).
The Ford RS500 sounds directly lifted from PGR4 for example but with better clarity IIRC, this could be down to the fact the Audio Lead Nick Wiswell was also the Audio Lead for PGR4.
I think the current FM audio mainly falls on the older cars that are less likely to have been updated and the lack of overall lack of "over-run" sound effects.

Surprisingly to me, pretty much every sim audio currently out there is using "F-mod" with plug-ins
Random fm4 audio article feat. Mr Wiswell

 

[BarronGeddon]

[DELETED]

 

[shawtyoner]

Are physics a subjective topic as well? I thought FM4 would have gotten a higher physics score than it did...

 

[tomcat66]

I think they should use CSR Elite to review forza 4,not CSR!
I have CSR Elite,forza 4 is amazing!FFB is very strong!I adjust FFB to 20%,100% is too strong.But they say FFB is week after patch.So i disagree FFB score!FFB should score at least 9,because i feel FFB as good as GT5 using CSR Elite,even better,having more FFB detail when car drives to grass or sand.

I was also shocked by their FFB-rating. I use the CSR Elite too (for Forza 4 and GT5). And Forza 4 is so much better than GT5 in the FFB department that I have stopped playing GT5 completely. With the CSR E you dive into another world of FFB-information. You can feel every little thing your tires are doing on the road. It is simply amazing.

 

[HBK]

I'm actually amazed people can find GT5's AI superior to FM4's AI.

FM4's AI is far from being perfect. It's way too slow in World Tour mode (World Tour mode desperately lack a difficulty slider), but it's just an issue in this mode. Go play events using "professional" difficulty AI and unless you're a really good driver, you'll have to drive fast to defeat them. And yes, it has some dumb moments (I'm not talking about the scripted loss of control). It can bump into the player in some situations where they should be able to avoid him. But having played FM4 quite a lot now, I can say it's AI is pretty much the same as the previous games, which is a good thing. They may be a bit on the "aggressive" side, but given the fact that "simulation" damage is still pretty forgiving, it's not that big of a deal (unless you really don't want to scratch your car). And it's way more pleasant to compete with FM4's AI than GT5's AI, even GT5's AI is way less dumb now than at release.

Oh and regarding ISR, I kinda like 'em, but I must admit I often disagree with them (and they sometimes get some of their facts wrong, like when they say photomode appeared in Forza 3).

 

[GT6mebe]

I can honestly say I didn't notice any of that (2D objects) in Forza, Not close to trackside, not that I've bothered delving any further afield to look as that's where my FOV is mostly.

Anyone have any pics?



I think FM4 is up there with PGR4 and in a lot of cases better (The fm3 DLC and new to fm4 cars).
The Ford RS500 sounds directly lifted from PGR4 for example but with better clarity IIRC, this could be down to the fact the Audio Lead Nick Wiswell was also the Audio Lead for PGR4.
I think the current FM audio mainly falls on the older cars that are less likely to have been updated and the lack of overall lack of "over-run" sound effects.

Surprisingly to me, pretty much every sim audio currently out there is using "F-mod" with plug-ins
Random fm4 audio article feat. Mr Wiswell

Here you go

 

[imported_JJ72]

ummm dunno what we should be looking at?

 

[Northstar]

ummm dunno what we should be looking at?

The 2D fans I'm guessing, which GT5 also has so not sure what he is on about exactly.

 

[shawtyoner]

Both games use 2D objects to some degree so its a moot point. Which for one I could personally care less about so long as it doesn't ruin the driving experience. Does anybody really care about 3D fans in the stands? So long as the tracks are accurate, that's all I really care about, and for real world track accuracy, I feel GT wins that one. Both games have good fantasy tracks, but I think most would prefer real world tracks instead.

 

[Scaff]

The 2D fans I'm guessing, which GT5 also has so not sure what he is on about exactly.

The question was asked and all he did was answer it, no problem with that.

Nor do I have a problem with either title having 2d crowds, not exactly a high priority to change in either for me.


Scaff

 

[Wiggs]

To me, Forza 4 is the superior game until you factor in the network connectivity problems it has. I was absolutely loving Forza until the network problems went from a minor annoyance to a major problem. I've never had such problems with trying to play a game online. The fact that Xbox Live is a service that I pay for makes it worse.

 

[I'm Motarded]

Here you go

Yeah, but those are not exactly trackside, they're way out of the way, probably why I didn't notice them.

There's something about driving past spectators on the other side of a pit wall or safety fence and noticing they're wafer thin that ruins the immersion for me. When you race at tracks like maple valley, and fm3's New York the track feels more alive, partly because the people are moving (and 3D), partly because it doesn't catch my eye and distract me. I have the same problem with the Targa Florio track in rFactor, ruins a great looking track, luckily I can turn the crowd off there.

But hey, that's just me, I guess I'm easily distracted.

 

[GT6mebe]

Yeah, but those are not exactly trackside, they're way out of the way, probably why I didn't notice them.

There's something about driving past spectators on the other side of a pit wall or safety fence and noticing they're wafer thin that ruins the immersion for me. When you race at tracks like maple valley, and fm3's New York the track feels more alive, partly because the people are moving (and 3D), partly because it doesn't catch my eye and distract me. I have the same problem with the Targa Florio track in rFactor, ruins a great looking track, luckily I can turn the crowd off there.

But hey, that's just me, I guess I'm easily distracted.

You sure your not just missing them. Both FM4 and GT5 have 2d crowds that are pretty obvious. Some of GT5 crowds move too like in eiger nordwand so I am not surprised that crowds in FM4 move however the majority of the crowds in both games are just 2d cut outs. Also those moving crowds are not exactly 3D...well technically they are but there extremely poor 3d models almost like a couple of 2d perspectives stuck together.

 

[II-zOoLoGy-II]

Guess I must be too busy looking at the apex to notice the crowds...

 

[imported_JJ72]

I don't remember any game having a full grandstand of 3d crowds and I am pretty sure it ain't what ISR was talking about.

 

[hennessey86]

forgot how good PGR sounded, as for the review it has many short falls. Maybe it wasn't finished because it doesn't seem to be very accurate.