Gear numbers/settings change after update?

[f_399]

Is it just me or have some of the numbers such as mph change in the transmission settings?

i also thought some settings looks different, car seems to run the same

but with some cars i thought i maxed out some gears but come back and see there is more room to adjust

 

[dr_slump]

Patch 1.10

Correction of Known Issues

PDI has addressed the issue of the maximum speed set in the transmission settings of the settings menu differing from the actual top speed of the car. This will affect cars equipped with the relevant transmission tuning part, and almost all racing cars. Cars for which each gear ratio was adjusted manually with a full customised transmission in update versions 1.07 and earlier will not be affected.

What does this mean? Do we have to rework all tunes done after 1.07?

 

[dr_slump]

Could it be that the patch changes the maximum of the last gear? Cause I haven't updated it and I heard that my transmission settings for the last gear are wrong/strange.

 

[Basilea]

It's just that the top speed is different in the gear ratio box from the one you choose! e.g. you set top speed to 240 km/h on the top right corner it gives you a top speed of 243 km/h...

 

[dr_slump]

It's just that the top speed is different in the gear ratio box from the one you choose! e.g. you set top speed to 240 km/h on the top right corner it gives you a top speed of 243 km/h...

No, I checked it in the meantime and the range of every single gear ratio has changed.
We have to rework almost every transmission setting now.

 

[articzap]

No, I checked it in the meantime and the range of every single gear ratio has changed.
We have to rework almost every transmission setting now.

I bet the net ratios are the same, just adjusted to show the proper mph.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

I bet the net ratios are the same, just adjusted to show the proper mph.

I'm assuming what they've done is changed both the autoset speed shown at a given setting and the numbers spit out in the top right.

So 261mph may now be 255, 360km/h now 350, etc.

 

[dr_slump]

I'm assuming what they've done is changed both the autoset speed shown at a given setting and the numbers spit out in the top right.

So 261mph may now be 255, 360km/h now 350, etc.

RJ, who has a working PS3? You or me?
They changed the range of the single gear ratios. It's subtracred by ca. 0.02-0.1 (depends on the car). That's why the 5./6. gear often can't be set, cause the maximum is lower now. It gives you ca. 5-10km/h more topspeed (shown in the top right).

Example:
Mercedes 300SL 6th gear

patch 1.09 - 1.248
patch 1.10 - changed to 1.223 (max. possible)

 

[Rotary Junkie]

RJ, who has a working PS3? You or me?

...


.....


.......................

They changed the range of the single gear ratios. It's subtracred by ca. 0.02-0.1 (depends on the car). That's why the 5./6. gear often can't be set, cause the maximum is lower now. It gives you ca. 5-10km/h more topspeed (shown in the top right).

Example:
Mercedes 300SL 6th gear

patch 1.09 - 1.248
patch 1.10 - changed to 1.223 (max. possible)

Move autoset down one click and I bet it's fixed.

 

[dr_slump]

...

Move autoset down one click and I bet it's fixed.

WRONG!
I've already tested it and the range of the gears is never the same.

Autoset +0km/h = 5th/6th gear too long
Autoset -10km/h (one click) = first gear too short

 

[JackWilson]

The gear ratio's have not changed, i know this for 100%

 

[No_OBsT33R]

This is interesting...

Has it changed the min and max FD?

 

[esoxhntr]

i agree with dr slump

 

[No_OBsT33R]

From what I've read it will alter ALL gear settings IF adjusted but only on cars tuned after 1.07. The cars pre-1.08 tuned will hold the same results (on the Track) but have a corrected TS displayed.

Have you seen it change the min and max available settings of the Final Drive gear too?

 

[praiano63]

This is the camaro SS'10 i'e tune 2 days ago before update

Transmission how to process:
1- Select default
2- Select final gear at 2450
3- Select top speed at 360 km/h = 223,7 mph
4- Set each gear at this ratio: considering 10 graduations on setting panel
1: 4423 = 0 grad
2: 3113 = 2 grad
3: 2325 = 4 grad
4: 1860 = 6 grad
5: 1528 = 8 grad
6: 1293 = 10 grad

It 'll give a top speed (above on the right) of 333 km/h = 206,9 mph

Now it give after update.

Transmission how to process:
1- Select default
2- Select final gear at 2450
3- Select top speed at 360 km/h = 223,7 mph
4- Set each gear at this ratio:
1: 4423= 0,5 grad
2: 3113= 1,9 grad
3: 2325= 3,25 grad
4: 1860= 6 grad
5: 1528= 8,75 grad
6: 1293= 10 grad

It 'll give a top speed (above on the right) of 340 km/h = 211,3 mph

Who have an idea ??
I will do all again the way i done before, visualy , just considering the new max speed more accurate, but still wrong.

 

[Basilea]

Why is it still wrong? Because the car doesn't make that speeds? Isn't that normal? Limited to the engines power, resp. what the topspeed is on the engine directly without drivetrain ect.?

 

[twohoos]

Here's what I'm seeing:

1) Actual top speed on track (shown on speedo) is always a few mph lower than the top speed shown in the trans settings. That is, the car bounces off the rev-limiter before it reaches the top speed shown in the settings area. This is true for all types of transmissions (standard, aftermarket fixed, fully adjustable) and in every game patch so far, including 1.10.

2) Starting in 1.10, for adjustable transmissions, the top speed setting shown in the slider/adjustment box is a few mph different from the one shown in the graphic at top right. Both numbers, however, are always higher than the actual top speed on track -- see #1.

Never been sure of the reason for #1. Certainly, tire deformation under load decreases the effective radius (circumference) by a few %, but this is a well-known effect and you'd think they'd just account for it in the settings box.

#2 is even stranger. Are they now trying to account for loaded-radius in the settings box (while still showing the theoretical top speed in the graphic)? Surely that can't be, since it still doesn't match actual top speed -- and you have to assume they know what speed their own physics model will produce!

Very weird. After reading the description of patch 1.10, I thought I'd finally be able to just set the actual top speed that I wanted. Instead, I now have TWO incorrect numbers in the settings screen!

[Edit: Of course I'm talking about cases where the top speed is limited by gearing, not by engine power.]

 

[praiano63]

Why is it still wrong? Because the car doesn't make that speeds? Isn't that normal? Limited to the engines power, resp. what the topspeed is on the engine directly without drivetrain ect.?

Yes ok, but it's WRONG..!!! Why ? Because when they say top speed 340 km/h the red zone full speed begin at 308 km/h and you can't reach more than 320 km/h ,it's cutted by the limiter.
So for me ,this kind of informations are still wrongs, it make me say that if the new Forza that i never play, do a game for ps3 i'll buy it and play it if it's better. Because enough is enough, i pay for this s'''t. and if they think they are alone in the world and can do what they want, it's just for now. I'll remember every details when the concurence will appear on the market.All this years waiting for this real super trash???
They treat us like stupids fans???? Really?????
Wait and see !!!

 

[Basilea]

Yes ok, but it's WRONG..!!! Why ? Because when they say top speed 340 km/h the red zone full speed begin at 308 km/h and you can't reach more than 320 km/h ,it's cutted by the limiter.
So for me ,this kind of informations are still wrongs, it make me say that if the new Forza that i never play, do a game for ps3 i'll buy it and play it if it's better. Because enough is enough, i pay for this s'''t. and if they think they are alone in the world and can do what they want, it's just for now. I'll remember every details when the concurence will appear on the market.All this years waiting for this real super trash???
They treat us like stupids fans???? Really?????
Wait and see !!!

Calm down my friend! I haven't played any Forza, as I don't have a XBOX 360 and I'm not intending buying one... but just from what I saw, on demos I just don't get warm with it, not looking like a sim a lot, it looks *arcadish"... the new trailers released for E3, I mean the colours, the movement of cars and suroundings etc. But who cares, it might be a good/great game and I'll find out sooner or later, when trying at a friends home. I won't judge something I don't know! It will might be even better than GT5, but it's not out yet and till then GT5 is by all means a good game!
It has some flaws, sure, but nontheless it is a good racing game (sim) with a very good phyics... Kaz wanted 2 more year, ok, I'm happy he didn't get it and we can play now and they can set the focus on GT6! Still they work on GT5 and give us updates continously (whether that's good or not is an other discussion, but it is where the gaming future is going, the possibility of online updates isn't just a blessing), with all updates being necessary and adding something valuable (for some)...
A lot of complaints are very ambivalent! Some examples:

• premium and standard cars, as they could have released the game with only the premiums... then people would moan about not having enough cars, but now we have standard (which in my opinion aren't looking that bad and I drive with bumper view anyways, so I barely see my car) and the trolling goes agains that...
• Seasonals is an other big issue, either they are too difficult and people complain or it is too easy and they complain or the actually try to improve seasonals and change them to make them better, but people still complain because some though they were good...
• Not enough tracks? There is a track editor! Not the best but you will never drive on the same track!

Ok I have to stop now as it goes far off topic...

To end with, Praiano63 you release around 100 tunes within 6 weeks and you play only GT5 for more than 10 hours a day, you said once... so the game can't be that bad or you just have done something wrong

 

[praiano63]

Calm down my friend! I haven't played any Forza, as I don't have a XBOX 360 and I'm not intending buying one... but just from what I saw, on demos I just don't get warm with it, not looking like a sim a lot, it looks *arcadish"... the new trailers released for E3, I mean the colours, the movement of cars and suroundings etc. But who cares, it might be a good/great game and I'll find out sooner or later, when trying at a friends home. I won't judge something I don't know! It will might be even better than GT5, but it's not out yet and till then GT5 is by all means a good game!
It has some flaws, sure, but nontheless it is a good racing game (sim) with a very good phyics... Kaz wanted 2 more year, ok, I'm happy he didn't get it and we can play now and they can set the focus on GT6! Still they work on GT5 and give us updates continously (whether that's good or not is an other discussion, but it is where the gaming future is going, the possibility of online updates isn't just a blessing), with all updates being necessary and adding something valuable (for some)...
A lot of complaints are very ambivalent! Some examples:

• premium and standard cars, as they could have released the game with only the premiums... then people would moan about not having enough cars, but now we have standard (which in my opinion aren't looking that bad and I drive with bumper view anyways, so I barely see my car) and the trolling goes agains that...
• Seasonals is an other big issue, either they are too difficult and people complain or it is too easy and they complain or the actually try to improve seasonals and change them to make them better, but people still complain because some though they were good...
• Not enough tracks? There is a track editor! Not the best but you will never drive on the same track!

Ok I have to stop now as it goes far off topic...

To end with, Praiano63 you release around 100 tunes within 6 weeks and you play only GT5 for more than 10 hours a day, you said once... so the game can't be that bad or you just have done something wrong

You're right, i'm totally addicted to this game, i love to spend hours and hours on it, i don't do this when i'm in Brasil, the beaches are too cool to stay playing all day.
But to end this , i don't understand how a big society like this who produce a game that millions people play, can release updates like this and make so much wrong things like ride height bug .... Any small business, so small it is, have a quality control that don't let pass this kind of error. Why not them??? Ok that's over. Let's drive.

 

[Adrenaline]

Has anyone mentioned wind resistance yet?
Theoretical top speed vs obtainable top speed.
Dyno vs a track.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Has anyone mentioned wind resistance yet?
Theoretical top speed vs obtainable top speed.
Dyno vs a track.

Still doesn't explain it; the speed that the car hits the limiter at is consistently lower than the speed specified.

And weirdly, pre-1.10 it was in 90% of cases exactly 6.2mph/10km/h off. I think the premium VGTS is off by quite a lot more than that for whatever reason.

 

[Adrenaline]

Still doesn't explain it; the speed that the car hits the limiter at is consistently lower than the speed specified.

Maybe it's because it's 4:30am and I just got home from a party... but I don't see how this statement disagrees with mine?
Wind resistance, would mean that the car should consistently limit as a lower speed than the speed specified.

 

[praiano63]

Maybe it's because it's 4:30am and I just got home from a party... but I don't see how this statement disagrees with mine?
Wind resistance, would mean that the car should consistently limit as a lower speed than the speed specified.

Hello my friend. No diference ,not because of the wind dif. Take any car, set with a short box to reach easy the top speed.
Impreza sedan RA '05:
top speed 210 kmh
final: 3900
6th gear: 1451
top speed above: 201 kmh


But the rpm limiter just allow you : 195 kmh
This diference is proportionaly bigger with higher speeds.

 

[Adrenaline]

Maybe I'm missing what you're comparing.
Are you guys talking about the "210" vs the "201" in your settings screen
or
The 210 vs the 195
or the 201 vs the 195?

If it's the 201 vs the 195, then I stand behind my statement (which is still just a guess)
If you guys are referring to the 210 vs the 201, then... I really don't see a point, as it's meaningless, but at least I'll shut up and move on

 

[praiano63]

Maybe I'm missing what you're comparing.
Are you guys talking about the "210" vs the "201" in your settings screen
or
The 210 vs the 195
or the 201 vs the 195?

If it's the 201 vs the 195, then I stand behind my statement (which is still just a guess)
If you guys are referring to the 210 vs the 201, then... I really don't see a point, as it's meaningless, but at least I'll shut up and move on

201 vs the 195, it's a bigger dif whith higher speed.

 

[Adrenaline]

A 6mph drop, seems extremely realistic for wind resistance.
Also, ass 'top speed' increases, so do the acting force of wind against the car, therefor explaining why the difference increases as top speed does.

A test, off the top of my (unstable at this time) head, would be to take that same car, that says 201, but only hits 195, take it to Daytona, and draft another car. If your top speed increases to 201, then I would have to assume that I'm at least partially right.
But I can't claim to be thinking clearly right now. So I might take all of this back tomorrow. /shrug

 

[praiano63]

A 6mph drop, seems extremely realistic for wind resistance.
Also, ass 'top speed' increases, so do the acting force of wind against the car, therefor explaining why the difference increases as top speed does.

A test, off the top of my (unstable at this time) head, would be to take that same car, that says 201, but only hits 195, take it to Daytona, and draft another car. If your top speed increases to 201, then I would have to assume that I'm at least partially right.
But I can't claim to be thinking clearly right now. So I might take all of this back tomorrow. /shrug

Nonono , 195 you have the limiter rpm that don't let your speed increase. No wind resistance. But anyway, it's just one more thing to know and to deal with.
Resolved. Let's tune this dead fish now.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

A 6mph drop, seems extremely realistic for wind resistance.
Also, ass 'top speed' increases, so do the acting force of wind against the car, therefor explaining why the difference increases as top speed does.

A test, off the top of my (unstable at this time) head, would be to take that same car, that says 201, but only hits 195, take it to Daytona, and draft another car. If your top speed increases to 201, then I would have to assume that I'm at least partially right.
But I can't claim to be thinking clearly right now. So I might take all of this back tomorrow. /shrug

If you take it to Daytona it'll still only hit 195 because it's hitting the rev limiter, not running out of power.

Also, these figures are in km/h rather than MPH so the speeds are only about 120mph.

Before 1.09 I was doing some testing with my Atenza at Tsukuba; "124mph" ratios smacked the rev limiter at 118, "130" at 124, etc. It's not a wind drag thing (wind drag is why my Xanavi NISMO Z doesn't do 562mph or whatever 6th gear is set for or my Hawkeye Impreza not doing 261mph for obvious reasons though ), it's a "these gear ratios are too short to hit this speed" thing.

 

[Adrenaline]

If you take it to Daytona it'll still only hit 195 because it's hitting the rev limiter, not running out of power.

Also, these figures are in km/h rather than MPH so the speeds are only about 120mph.

Okay, I'm not entirely coherent right now, because I had to be up at 10, so feel free to brush me off for whatever reason.
A: kh/h is correct, sorry I just default to mph when speaking in speeds, you know us damn arrogant Americans... But yea, I understood we were talking about km/h.

B: I guessknow I'm stubborn, but I don't believe the speeds are the same with or without draft, regardless of the limiter. But I could very well be wrong, so
I'll have to test it when this weekend's events are over.