Gran Turismo HD officially canned - Next stop is GT5

[Gabkicks]

if they a very solid physics engine. then they would be able to do everything very well... i dont know if pd +sony has the talent. we'll see. when gt5 comes out. no more excuses for PD about lack of power...

 

[GTXLR]

Well we all need to get used to the long wait for GT5! according to an interview in the new Official Playstation3 uk magazine with kaz about GT5 its not expected to be ready till around xmas 2008!!!(and we now how those kinda dates can slip in PDs world) he states right now that its only about 30% complete. He's not happy with the game at all yet, even the eiger track with one car doesnt run at 60fps, and it doesnt have the lightning effects, or enviromental effects that he wants. If there that far off with a one car track, one wonders how bad it is with a multi car field and the new physics and AI system they are working on. No doubt this is a contributing factor to why he isnt planning on releasing HD!

 

[Polyphony001]

So everyone, does my release date seem more likely? Given that news I'm thinking more Xmas 2009 / Spring 2010 now. I think we an forget about Gran Turismo in high def for a long long time...

 

[a6m5]

I don't think it will be that long. IMO, Playstation 3 will need a Gran Turismo game in the lineup to sell the system. Even if P.D. is not ready with the new GT, I think they will be pressured into a earlier release by Sony. Both the Nintendo's and Microsoft's lineups are stronger in this round, Sony will need all the help it can get.

 

[DuckRacer]

So everyone, does my release date seem more likely? Given that news I'm thinking more Xmas 2009 / Spring 2010 now. I think we an forget about Gran Turismo in high def for a long long time...

I'm thinking early 2009. Though if it comes out in 2010, I'm just going to laugh my butt off like a drunk spider monkey.

 

[red7]

I'm happy to hear all this, let pd give us free demos while they toil away on gt5. Meanwhile I'll be enjoying live for speed with my dfp.👍

 

[godzilla_GTR]

well i'll be enjoying it and GTR1/2 with my G25 lol

 

[Wolfe]

according to an interview in the new Official Playstation3 uk magazine with kaz about GT5 its not expected to be ready till around xmas 2008!!!(and we now how those kinda dates can slip in PDs world) he states right now that its only about 30% complete. He's not happy with the game at all yet, even the eiger track with one car doesnt run at 60fps, and it doesnt have the lightning effects, or enviromental effects that he wants.

Reminds me of the constantly <20fps, slow-paced Motorstorm demo I've played at several PS3 kiosks. Every single one was sluggish, and the graphics and physics were no better than what the XB360 could pump out.

It'll be cruelly funny if PD is forced release something like GT Vision as GT5. GT4 graphics, GT4 physics, GT4 sounds, but with the framerate, content, and features that KY wants.

 

[JohnBM01]

This isn't my only game I'd want for the PS3. Believe it or not, I'd likely go with Ridge Racer 7 for one of my first PS3 games. I don't know whatever else I'd like to pick up for the system. Just because this game isn't going to be a full-fledged title doesn't mean it's completely disappointing. There will still likely be some other titles to pick up in the short term or long term. Just don't get completely upset because GTHD isn't going to be a full-fledged game. At least there's GT5 to look to a year or so from now (let's be realistic and not overexaggerate). There will still be other games to play... including PS1 and PS2 titles on the PS3. Don't wimp out because this title isn't coming to a store near you. Just like with GT4- have some optomism.

Fear not.

 

[Cobra_UK]

Well we all need to get used to the long wait for GT5! According to an interview in the new Official Playstation3 UK magazine with Kaz about GT5 its not expected to be ready till around Xmas 2008!!!(and we now how those kind of dates can slip in PD's world) he states right now that its only about 30% complete. He's not happy with the game at all yet, even the Eiger track with one car doesn't run at 60fps, and it doesn't have the lightning effects, or environmental effects that he wants. If there that far off with a one car track, one wonders how bad it is with a multi car field and the new physics and AI system they are working on. No doubt this is a contributing factor to why he isn't planning on releasing HD!

Would it be possible to give me a link to the interview? Or perhaps post a scan of it if you have the issue in question.

This is terrible news. Not only is it rumoured that the PS3 is not even as powerful as the XBOX360 but this bad I didn't expect. PGR3 with all those cars and incredible detail and 3D crowds, now we have FM2 looking like it's going to add great tuning and physics and more cars. Can it get any worse for GT? What on earth is happening with Sony? How did PD, the first to bring TV quality visuals in racing games and fantastic content ended, up with constant delays, cancellations, false and failed promises? How did the GT franchise end up here? Xmas 2008? That's shameful! That's 2 years after the release of the PS3. FM2 is 2 years in the making and if they stick to their release date it's a show of force to the PD studios. The genius of PD will take from Xmas 2004 to Xmas 2008 to make the next GT? That's crazy!

 

[bodger]

1: PS3 is still the cheapest way to a Blueray player (with a Games machine and webbrowser/media player chucked in).
2. The GTHD demo/sampler is being released as an online download this month in Japan.

What the big deal?

 

[Polyphony001]

I think it's more the PS3 is powerful enough, but the games aren't written well enough yet. There's ample power there to at least match the 360. I think that's one of the reasons why PD are holding back with GT5, they want to make a game that works. Even with online updates, for those who don't use the net, you only get one chance to get the game right.

 

[RedOak]

how about trashing this section and putting up a GT5 section?

 

[red7]

Excuse me if it has been mentioned; just read on ign site that the concept coming to the japanese online store this month will show off mostly visuals with later on a secondary concept that will include new "driving physics" , interesting....

Anyone know anything else about this?

 

[DuckRacer]

I think it's more the PS3 is powerful enough, but the games aren't written well enough yet. There's ample power there to at least match the 360. I think that's one of the reasons why PD are holding back with GT5, they want to make a game that works. Even with online updates, for those who don't use the net, you only get one chance to get the game right.

Well, I think the problem is that the PS3 is very hard to develop for, plus the dev kits aren't the greatest.

 

[land sea air]

i have mixed feelings on this, on one hand i think polyphony is hurting themselves and all the fans including myself, that wanted something a little bigger than download able demos to hold us over until gt5 comes out who knows when, its understandable why many people would be very frustrated about sonys lack of planning and updates on this... however, i wasn't 100% sure if i was going to spend the money buying HD or even if it would be available here in the states, but i do think its kinda silly to buy a console because of one game, i will most definitely buy a ps3 when they become readily available even if there is no hope of any gran turismo of any sort. as far as ps3 goes, sony is not stupid, if they thought blu ray was going to tank they would not have spent millions of dollars developing a new console around it... i think the ps3 will do just fine even if it was a horrible launch (not necessarily all sonys fault). there may be a good side for HDs cancel, perhaps (big perhaps) we will see gt5 before some of us were expecting it but it would be nice to hear something other than speculation on the matter, i also think its a sign that PD is reconsidering some things and will make this the one we are really waiting for, plus if some of the articles im reading are correct, we will hopefully seeing the development of the game via the FREE demos online... perhaps a name change for this forum is in order...

 

[Bruce Spec]

All I wanted to do was to play online. GT4 was going to have online capabilities and it was delayed a year. Then we were going to see a later release or an online module or something. Then there was GT Vision. Then there was GT HD. Then GT HD Classic and GT HD Premium. And, that's what I thought GT HD Classic was. An online version of GT4. All I wanted to do was play online. I didn't need damage or car painting or team building or whatever … I just wanted to play online. All they had to do was take GT4 and turn it into Gran Turismo 4 ONLINE. That's it. That's all I wanted. I wanted to play online. I didn't need 750 cars or even 50 tracks. Something … something to keep me happy until Grand Turismo 5 came out. Something with some sort of substance.

Well, I can't wait 2 years to race online. PD and Sony. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

 

[harrytuttle]

What on earth is happening with Sony? How did PD, the first to bring TV quality visuals in racing games and fantastic content ended, up with constant delays, cancellations, false and failed promises? How did the GT franchise end up here? Xmas 2008? That's shameful! That's 2 years after the release of the PS3. FM2 is 2 years in the making and if they stick to their release date it's a show of force to the PD studios. The genius of PD will take from Xmas 2004 to Xmas 2008 to make the next GT? That's crazy!

PD became so full of themselves that they totally lost track of what really got them to their position in the first place. It's like the Wachowski brothers: when the made The Matrix, it was highly regarded and was, in some ways, groundbreaking. It had great action, a great story, strong undertones of mysticism, and a subtle underlying philosophy to it. Reloaded was where they lost track; it wasn't much more than a kung-fu-fest, with some semblance of whatever they drunkenly thought the plot was from the previous movie. By the time they got to Revolutions, it was a fest-fest: gun fest, CGI-fest, robot-fest, and a little bit of kung-fu-fest.

The problem was that the Wachowski's thought the success of the first movie was due to the fantastic action & camera work. That's an idiotic viewpoint. The success was the complete package: action, story, characters, etc..

This is how PD has failed. They had a great package in GT1: graphics, huge variety of cars (for the time), strong physics (again, for the time), and good racing. GT2 was more cars, but pretty much the same; it didn't move the plot forward. By the time GT3 came out, since the gameplay was exactly the same, it was pretty clear that PD thought the success of GT1 & GT2 was due to the huge number of cars and graphical detail. Yamauchi is so lost in his own success and fame (and money), so surrounded by Yes Men, that he has completely lost touch with the fanbase and with what it means to create a solid game.

I will still buy GT5, but only because it means it will continue Yamauchi's secondary goal of creating a museum of cars, something I actually enjoy. I have no illusions of it being a great driving/racing game.


It should also be noted that this is pretty much where Microsoft comes in. Their history has been to hang around in a given market, doing some R&D, waiting for someone to screw up. And someone always does -- badly. It has happened in every single market they dominate, and Sony (but not Nintendo) is leaving the door wide open for them. I do not look forward to what happens if Microsoft takes that step forward.

 

[sheruken]

Okay, so let me get this straight. I have been out of news for a week or so. Just been reading headlines as far as the GT world goes. With all that I have gathered. GT:HD Classic is scrapped and GT:HD Premium is now going to be released as a Free Demo, late this december? (with a few minor updates , like driving physics and damage and stuff, once every 3 months)?

Clear me, if I am wrong!
Thanks..

 

[Wolfe]

Close. From what I understand, the demo will include fewer cars and tracks than what GTHD Premium was planned to have.

 

[sheruken]

Thanks Wolfe!

 

[amar212]

All I wanted to do was to play online. GT4 was going to have online capabilities and it was delayed a year. Then we were going to see a later release or an online module or something. Then there was GT Vision. Then there was GT HD. Then GT HD Classic and GT HD Premium. And, that's what I thought GT HD Classic was. An online version of GT4. All I wanted to do was play online. I didn't need damage or car painting or team building or whatever … I just wanted to play online. All they had to do was take GT4 and turn it into Gran Turismo 4 ONLINE. That's it. That's all I wanted. I wanted to play online. I didn't need 750 cars or even 50 tracks. Something … something to keep me happy until Grand Turismo 5 came out. Something with some sort of substance.

Bruce, I have only 4 thumbs for upping - so all 4 are up. 👍 👍 👍 👍

Mine words exactly.

 

[Bruce Spec]

Thanks Amar212.

I really think gamers understand that titles that are released when a new console roles out aren't up to perfection. Developers have a limited amount of time to produce something. GT3 was release with the PS2. The graphics and playability of GT4 shows that with more time a better game can be produced. I just hate being promised something and now it's not even pushed back — it's scrapped and I have to wait two years. Two more years for something I was promised back in March of 2005. That's just insane.

Will I buy a PS3 — yes. But not until the release of GT5. I'm not going to spend $600 for a free download of 10 cars and one track. In the mean time … I even hate to say … I guess I'll look into getting a xbox and Forza so I can race online.

 

[Earth]

GT HD was canned because that pay per download thing had way too much backlash.

I'm kind of happy it was, now they can focus on GT5.

 

[Cobra_UK]

Well GTHD playable demo had only one car on a pretty boring track with no dynamic lighting effects, no tyre marks, no environmental mapping, no damage and had shown no improvement in physics. And they can't even get that to run at 60FPS.

GT5 is going to be a long, long, long way away. If it can ever happen. To go to 1080p GT5 running at the promised 180FPS sounds impossible. I think they'll struggle to do GT5 at 720p at 60FPS. And even if they do I don't believe the promises of damage, online and realistic physics.

Perhaps the PS3 is that hard to develop for, perhaps to reach the same performance as the XBOX360 for a similar game on the PS3 requires a lot more effort in development. Well than silly Sony for making it's second console that's a pain to develop for and silly developers making games for the PS3.

I wish that PD was an independent developer that could release GT5 on the XBOX360 or the PC. You'd have it released a lot sooner, easier to patch it and online would be very easy to achieve. I can only imagine A Logitech G25 with GT5 on my 32" ViewSonic LCD 2ms PC display with my high end PC that would wipe the floor with the PS3. One really needs to look at how many polygons the latest PC graphics cards can throw around. Imagine a quad core Intel CPU, 4Gb DD3 Corsair memory, 2 10,000RPM WD Raptor HD RAID 160Gb for storage, an Nvidia 8 series Geforce 512Mb graphics card, a high end AGEIA physics card and 7.1 DSS Soundblaster Audigy sound card and you might get an idea of just how pathetic the PS3 would look in comparison. Of course the above would cost about &#163;1500 to build, but a PC is so much more, plus it already comes with all the peripherals you need. And just imagine how much more powerful the PC will be in 2 years.

 

[Earth]

Well GTHD playable demo had only one car on a pretty boring track with no dynamic lighting effects, no tyre marks, no environmental mapping, no damage and had shown no improvement in physics. And they can't even get that to run at 60FPS.

GT5 is going to be a long, long, long way away. If it can ever happen. To go to 1080p GT5 running at the promised 180FPS sounds impossible. I think they'll struggle to do GT5 at 720p at 60FPS. And even if they do I don't believe the promises of damage, online and realistic physics.

Perhaps the PS3 is that hard to develop for, perhaps to reach the same performance as the XBOX360 for a similar game on the PS3 requires a lot more effort in development. Well than silly Sony for making it's second console that's a pain to develop for and silly developers making games for the PS3.

I wish that PD was an independent developer that could release GT5 on the XBOX360 or the PC. You'd have it released a lot sooner, easier to patch it and online would be very easy to achieve. I can only imagine A Logitech G25 with GT5 on my 32" ViewSonic LCD 2ms PC display with my high end PC that would wipe the floor with the PS3. One really needs to look at how many polygons the latest PC graphics cards can throw around. Imagine a quad core Intel CPU, 4Gb DD3 Corsair memory, 2 10,000RPM WD Raptor HD RAID 160Gb for storage, an Nvidia 8 series Geforce 512Mb graphics card, a high end AGEIA physics card and 7.1 DSS Soundblaster Audigy sound card and you might get an idea of just how pathetic the PS3 would look in comparison. Of course the above would cost about £1500 to build, but a PC is so much more, plus it already comes with all the peripherals you need. And just imagine how much more powerful the PC will be in 2 years.

Who promised 180fps? Better yet, who believed that? Better yet, why? The human eye can't even tell the difference of anything 60+ fps.

GT5 not possible? Just because a developer may be struggling 20% into a project doesnt mean the project is done

Nice to judge a system over 1 game. If you think what we've seen of GT5 is all the PS3 can do you are sadly mistaken. Gaming magazines have admitted that the PS3 already, even though it has just been released, has games with better graphics then anything on Xbox 360, yet you say it is hard for developers to make games with graphcis even 'equal' to Xbox 360. The following article shows you are wrong

http://gamepro.com/gamepro/domestic/games/features/82228.shtml

Release GT5 on PC? The PC you described is worth $2,500+. If it takes all that to run GT5 what a pity

Sad to see so called 'fans' like yourself jump ship after some bad news.

 

[Cobra_UK]

KY, PD and Sony stated that all games will run in 1080p and at 180FPS to make it sound like the PS3 would be the second coming. Of course I knew it was bull crap but that doesn't change the fact that it was again one of many, many times the above have been blowing smoke up consumer behinds. There was a big announcement thing at a Sony press conference. There is even a thread on this particular forum I read that stated that Sony announces that all it's games will be in 1080 HD and run at 180FPS, because only the PS3 will be the true next-gen HD console and it's phenomenal processing power will introduce a new FPS standard of 180FPS. May have been 120FPS but I'm sure it was over a hundred. Point is it sounded stupid and unbelivable then and it does more so now.

PD is struggling 20% in the development of GT5? Or is it GTHD, or GT4 online, maybe it's GT on the PSP you were referring to? It's hard to keep up with all the GT games promised and cancelled. I hate to break it to you Earth but GT5 was in the making since GT4 was completed. Xmas 2004! in the last 2 years they've developed your assumed 20% and can't even get that to work.That's not a struggle, that's an ongoing comedy fair. No joke, if the big heads at Sony and PD are worried and have expressed this in interviews, allow me, the consumer, to be worried. This is one of many bad news to come from the GT camp and it saddens and upsets me.

&#163;1500 is actually more than $2500 so you're actually saying the PC I was using as an example would be cheaper than I originally believed. Sounds good to me. Thinking about upgrading my PC next year.

There are also magazines that have "admitted", how you put it, that PS3 visuals and games in general fall far short of expectations and also a number have also said XBOX360 has the edge in those aspects. Different opinions by different sources, one is allowed to believe one or the other.

Last but not least don't call me a "fan" and don't say I'm jumping ship you assuming turd. More importantly don't start to accuse me of things just because my opinion differs from yours. I actually said I will buy a PS3 when GT5 is released, and if it's good enough. And I've never said I was a fan, I wouldn't be stupid enough to put myself in a "fan of anything" category. I'll leave fanboism in your boat, thank you! Why couldn't you just post your opinions about the topic, rather than your opinions on me? That's in my book is when the debate turned personal.

 

[Earth]

You spend x amount of hours surfing a GT5 message board yet you are not a fan of GT5?

What are you? A casual observer?

fan = a devotee, follower, or admirer

You dont follow under that?

That's what I thought

Turd? What is this grade school?

 

[Famine]

you assuming turd.

Can it.

If you feel the need to insult someone in a post, do it somewhere else.

 

[Cobra_UK]

I used turd because I didn't want to lower the tone to something more appropriate to your assumptions and accusations. I never accused you of anything, labelled you or made any assumptions about you personally. The last bit was to let you know to back off any attacks against me personally and discuss things as an adult. Apparently that's not within your powers.

No, i'm not a fan, nor a devotee or an admirer. You mentioned, observer, I'm also a casual poster. As in I don't post that often. I mostly go on forums at times, to sometimes kill time at work or check out the news.

At school I use to make an example out of people that gave me grief and it's been like that all my life. I have children of my own now by the way. If I was you I'd just let it go and put it down to experience.

EDIT: Perhaps it would be best to return to topic.

EDIT2: Famine you may want to look at his attitude towards me, for example his accustaions and assumptions. He is also the one who started the personal attacks. Go on, look at the posts, then you can be a good moderator.