Gripes

  • Thread starter ChaosMonk
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Gran Turismo is definitely an excellent game.  I have never seen graphics like these before.  I couldn't believe the first time I saw the sunlight... that's the only game I know of where it's done properly.  Complete with glare on the pavement and everything. (obnoxious while in a real car, though)  The rendering is photorealistic down to real reflections of passing objects on the car windows and surfaces.  And the lighting is also perfectly done.  GT3 was nearly everything I'd hoped it to be, which made the following things that much more of a letdown:

1)  Perhaps the biggest gripe I have with the realism is that there are no backup lights.  They put in an extra button JUST for reverse gear...why not do a little bit of extra coding and put in real backup lights? That was just silly of them.  I know that the previous Gran Turismo games didn't have them either, but with all the fuss about realism, it's a real oversight to not have included them.

2)  The cars in this game, while great, are lacking.  150 cars? On a DVD?  True, it took something like 2 weeks to encode every car on GT3 as opposed to like 2-4 days for GT2.    And 150 cars is way more than a hell of a lot of other racing games out there anyway. But why are so many of them just remakes of the same damn car?  It looks to me like the people were getting sloppy with modeling and just chose a bunch of extremely similar cars so they wouldn't need to do a lot of work and a lot of models.  And I KNOW that more than 150 cars could've fit on that DVD.

3)  The cars are incredibly detailed, down to realistic-looking spinning wheels during a race. But that was one thing that bugged me... the 2D wheels.  It wouldn't have required that many extra polygons to render actual rims, or even transparent ones.  And even if the performance took a hit, so what? We lose out on FPS? I heard somewhere that the framerate in GT3 is something on the order of a constant 60FPS.  Let's assume that this small rendering issue knocks it down by a whopping 20 fps.  Big whoop...it's still faster than the eye can see.

4)  No cross-country races.  Yeah, I know, GT has always been a lap-based racer at heart, but it would still have been nice to see maybe one or two in there.

5)  I would've liked an option to alter the weather.  This of course isn't a terribly necessary thing, based mostly on opinion than anything else, but it would've been fun to be able to do a free race around the Super Speedway in an overpowered car in the rain.

6)  The game, at least to me, seems extremely slow in the beginning.  I started with a Trueno and had to spend a long time running the races just to upgrade it a bit.  In my opinion, it would've been a little better to make it a small amount more gripping at the beginning. It takes a real commitment to this game to get going where you want.

Keep in mind these are all opinion-based (and I didn't even mention the giant oversight of volume controls, which everyone seems to hate), so if you decide to flame me, I won't be offended.  After all, I'm entitled to my viewpoints the same as you. But I thought it'd be interesting to see who out there agrees with me.
 
Hey, good post! I agree with most of your points (although I feel like a whining jackass complaining about ANYTHING in GT3 - oh well, maybe I am...) and I also noticed a few things that caught my attention:

Missing totem pole view - I know this has been beaten to death, but it would've been nice to have the choice. Removed for technical reasons? Too much draw-in/pop-up? I got used to in-car view real quick though. I like the inside engine noise too.

Back-up lights - I also wondered why these weren't there. I try not to do much backing-up anyway.

Driver AI - This one bugs me the most. I heard a bunch of stuff about 'emotional drivers' in previews, but they all seem to follow the same line as previous games and ignore me when I pull past them, even if I'm gonna screw up their next corner >: )

But this game is so far beyond any other console racer that my complaints are pretty pathetic. Favorite section so far? Smokey Mtn, dirt uphill in Tommi's Evo, sun shining thru trees, dust cloud out behind. It's a beautiful thing. I'm going to play now...




 
Backup lights !@#$%? Some people!... we don't need no stickin backup lights!!! If you have to back up then you screwed up.
 
The only thing that bothers me about GT3 is the absense of the racing modification. Also there are currently 185 known cars in the US version. Even though there are about 15 cars which are almost the same with minor details changed. This game is hands down the best racing sim on ANY platform.

(Edited by Link0064 at 11:49 pm on July 18, 2001)
 
I didn't even mention the lack of car damage (which is the thing I disliked the most in the Gran Turismo games) or the 2-dimensional crowd.  As far as that goes, it looks like they were just thrown in at the last minute when someone realized, ten days before the release of the game, that there would be spectators at these races.
 
The reason there hasnt been any car damage in this and the past Gran Turismos is beacuse the car companys wouldn't let Polyphony put car damage on thier cars. They did this because they were affraid if people saw just how fragile thier cars were they wouldnt buy them.
 
The wheels are 3D, yes. The rims themselves are not.  Look closely...it's just a skin.

As for the damage thing...regardless of the reason, it's still something that's always bothered me, and for that reason, GT won't ever be my favorite racing game, although it is up there in the top few.

I miss the old original Nascar game where you could drive backwards around the track and slam head-on into a line of about 25 cars.  Tires, parts, and scraps of metal flew far, let me tell ya.  Those were a blast.
 
I remember those kinda games, perticulary Destruction Derby 2 where you could destroy EVERy bit of the car down to the last wheel. BUT this has nothing to do with GT3. GT3 is FAR better then those games, in my opinion, and more fun. Also the replay value is amazing.
 
As for the damage thing...regardless of the reason, it's still something that's always bothered me, and for that reason, GT won't ever be my favorite racing game, although it is up there in the top few.
What is your favorite racing game?
 
STOP!

I wish everyone would stop complaining about the greatest driving simulator do date.

If you don't like the game, don't play it!!!!!

P.S. Be lucky you own a PS2 - Say ha to all the other different console owners who don't have the chance of playing GT3!!!!!
 
Great post!

Just to clear this 'rim' thing up...

The tire/rim is a 3D model.  The actual outside surface of the rim where the lug bolts and 'spokes' are is NOT 3D.  It's a 'quasi-3D' effect using a flat polygon (that's the key, one polygon) with a transparency-enabled texture.

They have also (somehow) placed a strange 'bending' effect on the texture so that when it is viewed at an angle, it appears to have a curve to it. Which it does not.
 
Horrorman, you've neglected to realize one thing...people went out and bought this game right away expecting it to be the best.  I was one of 'em, of course.  And you know how tight a lot of places have gotten with returned software policies.

So here I am, I've paid $42 on this game that isn't what I expected it to be.  Should I write my $42 off as a total waste and not play the game because of the problems with it? I don't think so.  But the fact that I spent money on it allows me to gripe about what I want.  So stop grouping me with the people that can't do anything but complain about this game--you'll notice I said a lot of good things about it too.
 
You know, the people that wrote GT3 read fan sites.  They listen to what people are saying and file it away as ideas for GT4.  Griping is VERY useful.  The developers need feedback.  Ignoring the problems with the game won't do anybody any good.

Anyhow, griping is what message boards are for, so just ignore the posts you dont want to read.  
 
As far as the lack of car damage goes, I was never bothered by it. Can you imagine smashing the crap out of a car you won in a 3 hour endurance race and then never being able to race it again? Although, I guess they could have done it race by race . . . either way, I still don't have  a problem with it. If there was damage, we wouldn't be able to do the slam-into-the-side-of-a-pack-going-around-turns-so-you-can-pass-them-faster maneuver.

My only gripe about the game is this: I had to order it online for $49.99US, but it just got in at my local Wal-Mart for $67CAN, making it a hell of a lot cheaper than I paid for it (it's actually the cheapest game they have). D**n my impatience!
 
Heres the thing - they made GT3 to be a Race Sim not a destruction Derby game.  They dedicated the memory that could have been used for damage and used it for the awesome effects of sunlight or 3D wheels.  

I was a bit upset about the volume controls also until I figured out the solution.  Turn the music volume on the game off and put a CD in your stereo, that way you can listen to anything.

 
The beginning can be quite slow if you pick a mediocre car... as I did... the Beetle. The Miata is my pick for the best starting car.
 
This is all very true. GT3 is not a destruction derby game.  But for those out there who are crazed about Gran Turismo's realism...how realistic is it to ride the walls like crazy, or to bump hard into an opponent's car and use the sudden change of control to corner tighter? In REAL racing situations, if you did that, you'd mess up your car.  So Gran Turismo is not as realistic as people think it is. Sure, the physics and everything are great...UNTIL you collide with something. And that's where Gran Turismo always has failed.  If they wanted a truly realistic simulator, they would include damage so that people can't work out strategies for getting ahead that include pinballing off other cars.
 
Oh, in response to a previous question...my favorite racing game is probably Need For Speed: Porsche Unleashed. I've always been a Porsche fan.  Or 1NSANE, an offroad racing game.  That game is wicked fun.
 
    ChaosMonk Are U Out Of Your F%$&ing Mind??? GT3 Is The Greatest Racing Game On Any Platform Ever ~ Hands Down Period...    
        I Myself Have Only Two Somewhat Major Gripes With The Game. Number One - The Inability To Save More Than 1 Game On A Memory Card (Although I Am Sure This Was Done Deliberately To Increase The Games Difficulty). Number Two - The Fact That You Receive ZERO Money On All Your Improvement Mods If You Sell A Car You Soup Up (Once Again Probably Done Deliberately To Add To The Games Difficulty).
       Back Up Lights, Come On Dude If You Were Any Good You Could A) Race In The First Person View!  Which By The Way, Doesn't Show Little Hands On The Steering Wheel Which Drives Me IMMENSELY FRIGGIN INSANE. After Two Weeks Of Not Getting Any Sleep Over It I Was Forced To Stop Playing The Game. Lucky For Me A Local Bum That Lives On My Street Had Stumbled Across A PS2 In The Dumpsters Behind Best Buys & Was In Fact Looking For GT3. I Warned Him Over & Over How The Game Sucks Because It Doesn't Show Any Brake Lights On Cars Nor The Small Hands With A Steering Wheel In First Person View But He Insisted. So Being A Generally Nice Guy I Decided To Give Him My Game. Besides Hank Is Blind So He'll Never Even Notice! Which By The Way, If Anyone On These Boards Has An Official Logitech GT3 Steering Wheel There Are Not Using My Buddy Hank The Bum Is Looking For One. Hank Now Needs Costly $25,000 Corporal Tunnel Surgery In Both Wrists Because Of The Thousand Of Hours He's Played GT3 With The Basic PS2 Controllers.  
     Oh I Almost Forget B) You Would Never Even See Your Taillights Nor Need To Put The Car In Reverse If You Had Any Skills ChaosMonk.


Suck It Up Man ~ GT3 ROCKS...........    
 
 
Now now...let's be civilized people. I haven't been forced to ban anyone...yet.  :)

The reverse lights are a definite oversight on PD's part, but don't really detract from the game.

By the way...for those who don't seem to understand, that's what we call an opinion.

BTW, GoldenEye...isn't it difficult to type while capitalizing each word?
 
I hate the fact that that after you finish a race, it automatically goes into the replay.  Can you disable this so once the race is complete it will allow you to start a new race right away?
 
I hate that too, quick! And I also hate how when you start a race, that menu pops up. Why doesn't it go straight to the race starting, and then if you want to change those things you can pause the game before the Go! command and change them.
 
Although it would have been nice to destroy your car I can understand why the didn't included it.
But a few of the worse things are:-
No second hand cars
THE DAMN 2D CROWD REALLY P*SS ME OFF!

But it is a beaut n rockin game.
 
Maybe if ChaosMonk would keep both hands on the wheel instead of one on the wheel and one on his slim jim he wouldn't be hitting walls and need to put the car in reverse.
 
All in all, I'm startled that people like GoldenEye and PDog (sub-average intelligence, desire to defend their favorite with childish insults rather than facts) took so long to notice my thread and respond.

What I'm saying has nothing to do with my skill at playing the game (I'm not that good, but I'm getting better).  It has to do with common sense.  I think it's silly that they allowed a mapping for reverse gear without putting reverse lights in. That doesn't equate to I'm a bad driver, I NEED to back up.  Despite what shining geniuses like GoldenEye think.

As for PDog...I'm not even sure what point he was trying to make by saying I masturbate on the road.  Speaking from experience about the whole thing, I imagine. Trying to keep me from making the same mistake he made?

Yes, the 2D crowds are extremely silly looking. It wouldn't even be as bad if they had SOME animation, but Polyphony and SCEA really dropped the ball on that one.

As for the idea that they only allowed you to save one game per memory card...I don't think that's something that makes things difficult. It's just a nuisance.  It's not a matter of difficulty if you can just go out and buy another memory card (and I'm sure there are people that will do this).  It's just a lack of insight on how to set up the game.

What I wouldn't mind seeing is an option to rename saved game files in the PS2's browser.  That way you could bypass games like Sky Odyssey and GT3 that only allow you to save a couple of different games on the card.

 
I guess my comment was a little harsh and I am sorry. But let me ask you a simple question. When you are in your car driving to work, do you notice your backup lights coming on? Of course not. The only time you see your backup lights is when you got the cruise control on and the hatch is open and some guy is slammin his salami in you while you are bent over hanging out the hatch. I'd say you must get a clear view of those backup lights then, huh?

PDog
 
The reason they made the croud watching the races 2D is prolly because they made a racing game not a look at the croud game i would much rather have more cars to buy and more tracks to race at then a 3D croud
 
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