GTP Cool Wall: 2011 Scuderia Cameron Glickenhaus P4/5 Competizione

[McLaren]

Sub Zero.

Jim built this idea from the ground up, & poured his heart into doing it right. More impressive that Montezemolo liked it so much, it was his desire to want Ferrari's name attached to the cars, not Jim.

 

[Heldenzeit]

Wut.

Oops! I meant the race car is based on the 430. There's a pretty epic build thread on Ferrarichat.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Correct. The street car is Enzo based while the road race car uses an F430 Scuderia base and is street legal even in the US.

The base is of course street legal. This car though was built to GT2 standards which means it isn't.

 

[McLaren]

The base is of course street legal. This car though was built to GT2 standards which means it isn't.

Jim has driven it numerous times in New York. I'm fairly confident he designed it to remain street legal.

 

[GTRacer22]

Awesome. Justifies my SZ vote.

 

[ToyGTone]

Jim has driven it numerous times in New York. I'm fairly confident he designed it to remain street legal.

I guess now that you (everyone) don't have the "race car are not road legal, SU" excuses anymore on this car.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Jim has driven it numerous times in New York. I'm fairly confident he designed it to remain street legal.

Fair enough then, I stand corrected.

 

[Famine]

Set a 'Ring record

No such thing.

The Radical is a joke of a street car, and it can hardly lay claim to its record because it's only barely street legal.

Most street cars are only barely street legal. Manufacturers do the barest minimum to make the cars street legal, because doing any more than that costs them money. Do you actually know what goes into making a car street legal?

What makes that Radical even more barely street legal (as a car sold in showrooms that you can drive away) than the titular car of this thread?

 

[Conza]

Cool for sure, perhaps even prettier than the 430 that it's based on, I like that its faster than anything Ferrari have put on their themselves.

Would be interesting to see, once the FXX has gone around, who's fastest then, but we'll see

 

[Leggy1]

The Radical is a joke of a street car, and it can hardly lay claim to its record because it's only barely street legal.

It can legally be driven on the road. Radical apparently drove the car to the 'Ring before setting the record. But it's probably quite awful on the road too.

 

[JMoney]

What makes that Radical even more barely street legal (as a car sold in showrooms that you can drive away) than the titular car of this thread?

It's completely useless other than being a track day car. You pretty much have to wear a helmet to drive it because it doesn't have a windshield. It's far closer to an LM prototype than your average supercar. Yes, it is street legal, but it's so close to a race car it barely has the right to be called a road car. So much so, in fact, that Porsche can have a legit claim on the road car record, because the 918 is usable.

No such thing.

I understand if you think the records don't matter, but I'm pretty sure there is indeed such a thing.

https://nurburgringlaptimes.com/lap-times-top-100/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nürburgring_Nordschleife_lap_times

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...type-r-destroys-fwd-nurburgring-world-record/

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html

http://motorburn.com/2014/04/the-10-fastest-production-cars-ever-to-lap-the-nurburgring/

http://www.digitaltrends.com/cars/scuderia-cameron-glickenhaus-nurburgring-pics-news-specs/

http://blog.caranddriver.com/keep-c...-production-car-lap-record-in-its-crosshairs/

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/2011-subaru-impreza-wrx-sti-sets-nurburgring-lap-record

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/best-cars/86123/fastest-nurburgring-lap-times

http://www.autoblog.com/2014/12/06/koenigsegg-agera-nurburgring-lap-record-claim-report/


Oh, and look what I found! It's a series of quotes by Famine himself regarding the Lexus LF-A Nurburgring Edition, in which he addresses Lexus' invalid claim on the production car lap record, thus acknowledging that a Nurburgring lap record does exist!

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...g-and-winding-road.85149/page-20#post-5869627

The Radical SR8, the Radical SR8 LM and the Gumpert Apollo Sport - two of which also claim to be fastest production car around the 'Ring, all of which are in production at present and can be bought, all of which set their laptimes unmodified from the factory specification (the LF-A Nürburgring had a roll cage added for its laps).

Of the the four, the Lexus is the only one to have done a full closed-circuit 20,832m lap - the others did an industry Supertest 20,600m lap (skipping T13, which must not be taken at full speed due to the entrance/exit there) which is supposed to be around 7s shorter. That means the Lexus's time of 7'14.64 can be compared ahead of the Gumpert's time of 7'11.57. The two Radicals both beat 7 minutes though, at 6'55 and 6'48 and are both production, road legal vehicles. In fact here's the SR8 LM that set the 6'48 driving from Radical Sportscars in Peterborough to the Nürburgring on public roads. It also drove back again afterwards...

So, Famine, do you care to back up your claim that there is "no such thing" as a 'Ring record? Considering you clearly did believe there was such a thing four years ago, it seems very strange to me that you would change your mind about the existence of such a dominant part of supercar culture that very well-respected car news sites regularly report on.

 

[mustafur]

I don't understand the race car logic, something isn't uncool if you can't drive it.

Because that implies you are somehow cool.

 

[Famine]

It's completely useless other than being a track day car.

What does this have to do with how street legal it is?

You pretty much have to wear a helmet to drive it because it doesn't have a windshield.

What does this have to do with how street legal it is?

It's far closer to an LM prototype than your average supercar.

What does this have to do with how street legal it is?

Yes, it is street legal, but it's so close to a race car it barely has the right to be called a road car.

What does this have to do with how street legal it is?

So much so, in fact, that Porsche can have a legit claim on the road car record, because the 918 is usable.

What does this have to do with how street legal it is?

You've answered why you don't like it being classed as a road car. You haven't answered the questions I asked, which were why it is more "barely street legal" than any other car and if you know what goes into making a car "street legal".

This is a car you can go and buy and then drive home. It is exactly as "street legal" as any other car you can do this with, because what goes into making a car "street legal" is a very small list of things indeed. Having a windscreen isn't one of them. Nor is having a roof - in fact not having a roof is a specific body style of car, known as "speedster". Nor is how much use you'd get out of one - I know many people who own a speedster and get plenty of use out of them. My brother commutes in his, for reference. And doesn't wear a helmet to do so, whether you think he "pretty much has to" or not.

So I reiterate. What makes the car more "barely street legal" than Jim's P4/5?

I understand if you think the records don't matter, but I'm pretty sure there is indeed such a thing.

You can be as pretty sure as you like, but you're not right. Your Wikipedia link explains why this is (and disagrees with you about Radical, but let's gloss over that) several times, but just to help you along, it's because there is no official single body that tracks the laptimes. There's a few good reasons for this - the laps are not always the same length (20.8km full circuit, 20.6km minus T13, 19.1km bridge-to-gantry) and there's no official timing body (Porsche, for instance, tells us what the 918's lap time is) so times are not strictly comparable.

The 'Ring record is, and always has been, unofficial. Other than those set during race events.

Oh, and look what I found! It's a series of quotes by Famine himself regarding the Lexus LF-A Nurburgring Edition, in which he addresses Lexus' invalid claim on the production car lap record, thus acknowledging that a Nurburgring lap record does exist!

Found, but didn't read. Let's look at that again:

Oh, and look what I found! It's a series of quotes by Famine himself regarding the Lexus LF-A Nurburgring Edition, in which he addresses Lexus' invalid claim on the production car lap record, thus acknowledging that a Nurburgring lap record does exist!

The Radical SR8, the Radical SR8 LM and the Gumpert Apollo Sport - two of which also claim to be fastest production car around the 'Ring, all of which are in production at present and can be bought, all of which set their laptimes unmodified from the factory specification (the LF-A Nürburgring had a roll cage added for its laps).

Oddly, while not-reading that post you also didn't read one of the posts to which it was responding and quoted:

Aside from the fact that there are no official lap records anyway

Indeed not.

And if you read subsequent posts in that thread you will see I state several times that there is no production car lap record. So this statement:

So, Famine, do you care to back up your claim that there is "no such thing" as a 'Ring record? Considering you clearly did believe there was such a thing four years ago

Is utter tripe.


So, can I assume we're done here?