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GTP Cool Wall: 2015+ Mazda MX-5 (ND)
- Thread starter Wiegert
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- 4,231
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I actually prefer that to the ND.
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- GTP_Frenzyhero
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- 4,231
- UK
To be honest, i think i just prefer the looks of the NC to the ND anyway. That concept just looks exceptionally nicer than any ND iv'e seen so far.
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- GTP_Frenzyhero
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- 1,656
- With Kim Jong Un
Best looking Miata in ages. Also, any Mazda sports car is either a cool or a sub zero from me, bonus points if it's a rotary.
- 3,202
- Murcie LP710
So it has very average performance besides really good handling and feel. A Cavalier sports car, if you will.
Cheap, dependable, fun, and best of all, you don't have to worry about speeding when you romp on it.
A performance car is different to a sports car. Besides the fact that as already stated the 2.0 has fairly brisk performance because of its low weight, a sports car is not supposed to be about its objective performance anyway.
Do you feel the same way about the BRZ/86?
- 10,456
- United States
- WrecklessAbandon
In America, (I know I can hear people grumbling already) sports car means fast. Just to over 90% of people. The remaining few are disregarded because nobody cares.
A 350Z is a sports car, but not a 350Z, which is quite illogical for the most part.
Technical classifications of "sports car" like you're using aren't really used.
Regardless of what you think of Miatas, I think they're bloody pointless.
Why would I want my "sports car" to be slower than my common car? I wouldn't, because it feels awful getting into a slower car than you're used to, let alone for a supposed "sports drive" (to which speed or performance has no relation, even though that's the sport part) BRZ's and the like are even worse.
The sole reason I enjoy either car existing is to taunt them at redlights with childish antics.
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So it has very average performance besides really good handling and feel. A Cavalier sports car, if you will.
Cheap, dependable, fun, and best of all, you don't have to worry about speeding when you romp on it.
It's much quicker to 100 kmh than an 86, similar to a turbo Genesis or Mustang (though slower to 200, natch) and corners better than any of them.
Your "average" motorist is driving a 1.6 (non-turbo) Fiesta, a Corolla, or a 2.4 liter Camry. None of which are nearly as quick in terms of acceleration or racetrack performance.
A Camry is just as quick with a V6 and a stick, but that's not an average car... Not by any means, and good luck finding one with a stick
The only issue with the MX5's performance envelope is top speed, limited to around 215 kmh due to the roadster body... Give it an aerodynamic top, and it should hit about 230+ kmh.
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
Time out.It's much quicker to 100 kmh than an 86, similar to a turbo Genesis or Mustang (though slower to 200, natch) and corners better than any of them.
Your "average" motorist is driving a 1.6 (non-turbo) Fiesta, a Corolla, or a 2.4 liter Camry. None of which are nearly as quick in terms of acceleration or racetrack performance.
A Camry is just as quick with a V6 and a stick, but that's not an average car... Not by any means, and good luck finding one with a stick
The only issue with the MX5's performance envelope is top speed, limited to around 215 kmh due to the roadster body... Give it an aerodynamic top, and it should hit about 230+ kmh.
You compared the best engined Miata to low engine other cars.
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Where in the United States can you buy a 1.5 liter ND Miata?
*They don't sell them here, either. The only MX-5 variant on offer here since the release of the NC has been the 2.0.
Out where you can actually buy the 1.5 liter MX-5... namely, Europe... people are buying 1.6 liter Mazda6s and 1.0 liter Ford Mondeos. Over there, the 1.5 liter MX-5 is still decently quick compared to the common car. In fact, its 0-100 time of around 8.0 seconds is about the same as the automatic-transmission Toyota 86. A car with seventy horsepower and 0.5 liters of engine more.
In the USA, 8.0 is middling (it's equivalent to around 7.6 seconds to 60 mph)... when compared to bigger, more powerful and more expensive motors... but it's still faster than the common car.
Whereas the 2.0, which you can buy in America, is downright quick.
- 40,855
It also again needs to be pointed out that it transcends logic just how actually fast the V6 Camcords are now, especially the latter. They are not that much lighter than the current Ecoboost Mustang and V6 Camaro and are way down on horsepower to both (plus are, you know, FWD midsized family sedans), but both of them are perfectly capable of embarrassing the hell out of the guy who got his brand new pony car and took it right to the drag strip to show off after signing the lease (nevermind the outgoing Camaro or the Challenger).
That doesn't make the ND Miata any slower itself.
That doesn't make the ND Miata any slower itself.
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- 3,202
- Murcie LP710
Let's talk more understandable terms then. What is one of, if not the most popular vehicle for Autocrossing in America?
Regardless of what you think about MX-5s, the general public disagrees considering the MX-5 is by far and away the best selling sports car and convertible.
Clearly you've never heard of the phrase "The answer is always Miata."
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
Rather than speculate, I'll ask you.
What percentage of NEW Miatas sold, do you think are used for autocross in the States?
Regarding it being the best selling sports car, I'd like to hear what comparative sports cars it outsold in the states. To be fair, BRZ, FRS, and GT86 sales are one car divided three ways.
Now don't go naming cars that cost substantially more.
- 4,763
- Houston, TX
If you don't understand the Miata (or any lightweight, low power sports car), you haven't actually driven one.
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
Ah, the proverbial "if you don't like it, you haven't tried it" argument. Cool.
What's cooler is this started by me simply stating the car doesn't make sense to me. God forbid rabid Miata fans hear something not positive about their precious.
- 4,763
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But have you driven it? I wasn't a believer until I drove it.Ah, the proverbial "if you don't like it, you haven't tried it" argument. Cool.
What's cooler is this started by me simply stating the car doesn't make sense to me. God forbid rabid Miata fans hear something not positive about their precious.
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- WrecklessAbandon
I rode in one once, it was hardly impressive. Granted it was a few years old, and heavier than the new model.
I completely understand the joy of throwing light cars around, but I think what makes the Miata "special" is that nobody makes cars similar to it. The BRZ has been brought to my attention 5 times in this thread, but they weigh hundreds of killograms more.
Toyota MR-S was kinda fun but suffered Miata problems of not being quick enough. (yes, for me)
Elise's are awesome, by the way. Small car done right.
- 4,763
- Houston, TX
If you have access, it's worth driving a 94-97, or 99-05 car. The early 1.6L cars are gutless for sure, but a stock 1.8L car is truly an enjoyable experience, and the new ND feels similar but with more creature comforts. Hell, I sold my 93 Corvette cause I rarely drove it compared to my Miata.
Small cars are the best!
Small cars are the best!
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
I have a big "hope to drive" list, occasional test drives help in that department.
Finding an older one shouldn't be too hard.
- 3,202
- Murcie LP710
There was also the MazdaSpeed for those who didn't quite find it quick enough.
Considering that you claim you don't understand the MX-5 in general, and this car has only been out for 6 months, that's irrelevant. However a few reviewers in the US have taken their loaners to autocross (one even managed to match a record set by a 2015 Corvette Z06).
Take your pick, since I was referring to the entire name, not a specific generation.
In its first 6 months the FRS and BRZ did sell significantly more than this car, but the 2-seater Roadster is even more of a niche market than the 2+2 coupe.
Considering that you claim you don't understand the MX-5 in general, and this car has only been out for 6 months, that's irrelevant. However a few reviewers in the US have taken their loaners to autocross (one even managed to match a record set by a 2015 Corvette Z06).
Take your pick, since I was referring to the entire name, not a specific generation.
In its first 6 months the FRS and BRZ did sell significantly more than this car, but the 2-seater Roadster is even more of a niche market than the 2+2 coupe.
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
Oh, so you were counting 27 years of Miata sales together?
Lol. Just lol.
- 3,202
- Murcie LP710
- 10,456
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- WrecklessAbandon
The only interesting thing about this post is why you picked those particular years to quote, instead of more relevant years.
Shall I quote the sales of a car in 1997 next?
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- GTP_Frenzyhero
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- 23,800
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True, but they're fascinating discussion.
They're relevant years because they're first year runs for both the NC and the BRZFRS96, which were released within just a few years of each other... and thus released into the same sort of market (though both being on opposite sides of the 2008 crash skews that a bit). Still, given the huge, pent-up demand, and the fact that the 86 was supposed to offer everything that customers felt the MX-5 lacked (extra space, extra power, a permanent roof), more was expected.
To put into perspective how bad that was, the Solstice/Sky twins sold nearly 20k in their first full year of production.
But then the duo got axed pretty quickly... so you really can't make any inferences from single year sales.
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In the end, it's probably more of a reflection of how soft the market is nowadays. We'll see how good or bad the ND MX-5 does in its first full year on the market (this year)... sales of the ND last year, even considering sales started only mid-year, were rather tepid. Then again, there is supposedly a supply issue, and customers here have a long wait-list for LHD units.
It's actually pretty amazing that these things get greenlit at all in this sales environment... considering the cost of investment versus sales... even more amazing when you consider Toyota is actually considering the S-FR, which has even less power and weight than the MX-5... That one is on my "Drive" list the moment it comes out.
You're not going to learn much from a passenger ride. The thrill of an MX-5 isn't in the high G-Forces it generates (it doesn't). It's in how well it engages your senses while you drive.
That said, again, the ND's helm is very light and not quite as satisfying as the one in the NC, which wasn't all that satisfying compared to the one in the NA/NB. But it's quite a gas, simply because it has a good amount of power in something that's not much heavier (and quite a bit cheaper) than an Elise*
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*which, yes, is fantastic to drive (and the unassisted steering is much better than the Miata), but costs a hellishly large amount for something with the interior quality of a Chinese car.
It's also stupidly difficult to climb into and out of one with the hard top on.
They're relevant years because they're first year runs for both the NC and the BRZFRS96, which were released within just a few years of each other... and thus released into the same sort of market (though both being on opposite sides of the 2008 crash skews that a bit). Still, given the huge, pent-up demand, and the fact that the 86 was supposed to offer everything that customers felt the MX-5 lacked (extra space, extra power, a permanent roof), more was expected.
To put into perspective how bad that was, the Solstice/Sky twins sold nearly 20k in their first full year of production.
But then the duo got axed pretty quickly... so you really can't make any inferences from single year sales.
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In the end, it's probably more of a reflection of how soft the market is nowadays. We'll see how good or bad the ND MX-5 does in its first full year on the market (this year)... sales of the ND last year, even considering sales started only mid-year, were rather tepid. Then again, there is supposedly a supply issue, and customers here have a long wait-list for LHD units.
It's actually pretty amazing that these things get greenlit at all in this sales environment... considering the cost of investment versus sales... even more amazing when you consider Toyota is actually considering the S-FR, which has even less power and weight than the MX-5... That one is on my "Drive" list the moment it comes out.
You're not going to learn much from a passenger ride. The thrill of an MX-5 isn't in the high G-Forces it generates (it doesn't). It's in how well it engages your senses while you drive.
That said, again, the ND's helm is very light and not quite as satisfying as the one in the NC, which wasn't all that satisfying compared to the one in the NA/NB. But it's quite a gas, simply because it has a good amount of power in something that's not much heavier (and quite a bit cheaper) than an Elise*
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*which, yes, is fantastic to drive (and the unassisted steering is much better than the Miata), but costs a hellishly large amount for something with the interior quality of a Chinese car.
It's also stupidly difficult to climb into and out of one with the hard top on.
- 27,387
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- NewAesthetic
- SlipZtrEm
Yeah, I was a huge fan of the Elise. Right up until I had to sit in one. I'm sure it's a delightful steer, but I'd really like a hyper-accurate teleportation device if I ever planned on driving it regularly. Other than both being two seater, relatively lightweight cars, I really don't see much point in comparing the two, though.
Unsure on this one. Could go either way.
Unsure on this one. Could go either way.
