GTP Cool Wall: Ultima GTR. Voting Closed

[Northstar]

If other people think you are uncool for driving the car then the car is uncool.

Once again we aren't voting on whether or not the car is good, fast, or whatever, we are voting on whether or not it's cool.

So your car is uncool because I think it is uncool?(I think Mini's are rather lame)

I have my own definition of cool and performance is part of the equation. You may not like it but that is how I determine what is/isn't cool. You are basically telling people what they should base the car on which isn't the right way to run this type of thing.

 

[Joey D]

So your car is uncool because I think is is uncool?

I have my own definition of cool and performance is part of the equation. You may not like it but that is how I determine what is/isn't cool. You are basically telling people what they should base the car on which isn't the right way to run this type of thing.

Well if you thought my car was uncool, then I would suspect you'd vote that way if the Cooper ever came up for voting. I'd even vote the Cooper uncool (actually seriously uncool because I own one).

Performance can be part of the equation yes, but it's not the sole deciding factor that so many people think it is. I think the meaning of the cool wall is getting lost. We are out to determine whether or not a car is cool, not whether or not a car has good performance. I'm not telling people how to vote, I'm merely telling them to at least put some thought into it other then looking at performance figures.

You said in your post you don't care if the person next to you at a light thought you were uncool. Well if others think your car is uncool then it probably is. Like I said in my initial post, if you pulled up in Monte Carlo with a Ultima people would probably laugh at you since your car has no style and only cares about lap times and speed runs, not to mention isn't exactly graceful. That right there makes the car uncool...it does not however make it a bad car. I do like the Ultima and I fully respect what it does, I mean it's a huge engineering feat to get performance out of a vehicle like that...but in the end it will never be a cool car. There is a difference.

Watch Top Gear to see how they do there cool wall or even just look online at various cool car surveys...you'll see it's not all about how fast the car is.

 

[High-Test]

^ Indeed. If May owns one, it's seriously uncool.

 

[Lucas]

Sub-Zero. I don't care if this is not a Lamborghini or Ferrari, I like it that way. Even if it's not as good looking as one of those, it still owns them in performance, and that's what I consider cool. Honestly, if a car wins over another car judging only looks, that doesn't tell me anything good about it...

 

[Eric Demory]

Uncool, 40%

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Uncool. Not a particular fan of the looks, it's impossibly impractical (Not much less practical than an Exige?! You can't get much less practical than that to begin with!), and despite it being 5-odd seconds faster than any of them I'd much rather have the Ascari A10, Koenigsegg CCX or hell even the Gumpert Apollo Race despite its questionable looks.

 

[Irons]

Uncool. because it's basicly a track-day car due to it's lack of practicality and unlike other supercars it doesn't have that WOW factor or popularity like say a lamborghini or a ferrari would have (which are also usually impractical but not completely track orientated). Sure it'll smoke any ferrari at the lights (or at anything else performance-wise) but unfortunatly most people won't even know what it is, so it really can't be classified as cool.

A toy for playing with on a track, do doubt fun, but in no way cool

Seriously uncool in fact.

Eh, this is like a nerdy Lotus. As someone else said, if you pulled up in this next to Lamborghini's etc, ok you would have the fastest car, but is it as cool?

If it looked like a Countach but had the same performance and price, maybe it would be cool.

The Lotus 7 is cool because it has history, its become somewhat of an icon and basically its popular.
Its also quite easy to spawn numbers of imitators when the initial design is 40 years old. Therefore, the Ultima may be cool in 40 years time (though unfortunately Patrick McGoohan isn't around to make it cool).

I love it when people say what I would say.

UNCOOL

 

[Jim Prower]

The only things it offers over a SCCA GT1/Trans Am car is a modicum of comfort, Mid engine, and road legality. and I think there's more Trans Am cars floating around.

On the other hand, when the Seven came out, there was nothing like it. The Ulitma will simply become a footnote on the pages of time....

IF THEY QUIT RUBBING IT IN OUR FACES. X<

 

[Boffin]

Its....too hardcore for the street. This thing would be amazingly difficult in the wet, plus I don't especially like the way it looks. Whenever I think of how to vote for this, I always think would I bring it up in endless conversations because my friend has one? With this, sadly no, I wouldn't.

Uncool.

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Uncool. Not a particular fan of the looks, it's impossibly impractical (Not much less practical than an Exige?! You can't get much less practical than that to begin with!)

There's plenty of room for shopping.....for a single male anyway

 

[Northstar]

The only things it offers over a SCCA GT1/Trans Am car is a modicum of comfort, Mid engine, and road legality. and I think there's more Trans Am cars floating around.

On the other hand, when the Seven came out, there was nothing like it. The Ulitma will simply become a footnote on the pages of time....

IF THEY QUIT RUBBING IT IN OUR FACES. X<

I love how you act like Ultima is the only company to ever brag about what their car is capable of. Every company does it because it shows that they have made a good product. I would be more worried if they didn't show off.

 

[Jim Prower]

But they...well, not they, but people who like the car...act as if it shouldn't. Tube frame cars have been fast for many years. We know this.

It's almost a letdown when they break a record. "Oh, great, the Ultima showed up. There goes the "Production" record."

It's a ringer. It's not really that big a deal.

Furthermore, it uses decades-old chassis technology that debuted in Trans-Am cars years ago, and open-wheelers had abondoned it and went to monocoques long before. You could replace Ultima's fiberglass body with anything, really. I could put a fiberglass Camaro body on it. Yes, Tube-frame is very effective, but It's done to death.

 

[LSX]

Sub Zero. If you can't sit in this car start it up then drive off without a smile, your probably dead. I would be more than happy with this car, I think it's cool, who cares what the next person at the light has to say about it. Might not want to drive it every day, but would be pure excitement whenever you do.

 

[YSSMAN]

Despite it's performance credentials, and the use of an American small block, it gets a distinctive "meh" from me.

Uncool.

 

[CarBastard]

It can smash a Veyron, nothing more said, SUB-ZERO .

 

[Murcie_LP640]

There's plenty of room for shopping.....for a single male anyway

What I mean by horribly impractical is that thing looks INCREDIBLY awkward to get in an out of. Like an Exige is. And also like the Exige, the way it stands looks like it will smash your spine to pieces along the way.

 

[Eric Demory]

It looks like a car from the Burnout series.

 

[Tornado]

What I mean by horribly impractical is that thing looks INCREDIBLY awkward to get in an out of.

That's a problem with practically all supercars.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Yes but what I'm comparing it to is the Exige which is very infamous for being more awkward to get in and out of than other supercars. And also saying that the Ultima is less practical than an Exige is doing it absolutely no favours.

 

[Philly]

An ugly car that can outrun the ugly. Sub-Zero.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

I want to go for neutral, but if I saw this car at a track or parking lot I would think that it's pretty damn awesome.

 

[slidesquad#1]

You said in your post you don't care if the person next to you at a light thought you were uncool. Well if others think your car is uncool then it probably is. Like I said in my initial post, if you pulled up in Monte Carlo with a Ultima people would probably laugh at you since your car has no style and only cares about lap times and speed runs, not to mention isn't exactly graceful. That right there makes the car uncool...it does not however make it a bad car. I do like the Ultima and I fully respect what it does, I mean it's a huge engineering feat to get performance out of a vehicle like that...but in the end it will never be a cool car. There is a difference.

Watch Top Gear to see how they do there cool wall or even just look online at various cool car surveys...you'll see it's not all about how fast the car is.

Except cool is inherently subjective, and there cannot be a set way of deciding what is, and what isn't.

I, and obviously others, rank performance higher than other parameters, such as what anyone else thinks. You say that if others think a car is uncool, it probably is. To them. To me, and my perception of coolness, style/gracefulness/looks* etc. are all on a level considerably below performance/handling/the way it actually drives. The engineering associated with the car makes it much cooler to me than whether some rich old guy nods in an appreciative manner as I drive past.

Which is why I reckon it's sub-zero. It's uncompromising in accomplishing what it's built for, which makes it utterly awesome in my book.

*the Weber supercar is an exception. That can't outrun the ugly.

 

[TheCracker]

Like I said in my initial post, if you pulled up in Monte Carlo with a Ultima people would probably laugh at you since your car has no style and only cares about lap times and speed runs, not to mention isn't exactly graceful.

Yeah, because people who live/spend time in Monte Carlo are the epitome of cool and what's tasteful

Turn up in an F430 and they'll laugh you out of the Principality for having last year's Ferrari.


The Ultima can't be a 'trackday car' for the simple reasoning that it was originally developed from a car that was designed in 1983, well before trackdays became popular (or even existed?). The original brochure even described it as 'The ultimate mid-engined road going sports car'. Since when has using race car technology for a road car been a bad idea. Ferrari and Lamborghini have built a whole industry from it.

Furthermore, it uses decades-old chassis technology that debuted in Trans-Am cars years ago, and open-wheelers had abondoned it and went to monocoques long before.

I don't think tube-frame chassis 'debuted' in 70's Trans-Am cars. It's been a race-car staple since the 1950's. Every Ferrari made up until the late 90's had a tube frame chassis. It makes for a strong yet light chassis. Why fix what isn't broken?

What I mean by horribly impractical is that thing looks INCREDIBLY awkward to get in an out of. Like an Exige is. And also like the Exige, the way it stands looks like it will smash your spine to pieces along the way.

An Exige isn't hard to get in and out of. It's not elegant, it just requires a different method. An Exige, even a hard-core one track orientated one, is very softly sprung and certainly won't 'smash your spine'. You don't need stiff suspension if your car is light. Suspension is made stiff to keep the chassis in control. If that chassis/car is light and has a low centre of gravity you inherently have less roll so don't need an overly stiff set-up, which comes with it's own set of issues.

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

What I mean by horribly impractical is that thing looks INCREDIBLY awkward to get in an out of. Like an Exige is. And also like the Exige, the way it stands looks like it will smash your spine to pieces along the way.

It's actually not hard to get in to and out of at all at all due to how much the doors open and the angle they open and the fact you can sit on the sidepods, Alot easier than getting into and exige thats for sure.

 

[Stotty]

All sports cars are hard to get in and out of... particularly if you're tall!

I'm 6'3", and so I have my seat as low as it goes in the 911... the 911's not particularly low, and it's probably fine if you're 25, but it's still a long way up when you're bones are getting older

 

[Sharky.]

Cool. Looks great, goes great, and has the element of anonymity about it. That anonymity stops it from being sub-zero however, as you'll have to explain to your mates what it is.

But come on, a CanAm lookalike that goes like the clappers and you can drive it on the road... how is that not cool? Plus imagine the look on the guy driving that Lambo, Porsche or Ferrari when you smoke him at the lights.

Who cares if it's impractical? It's not designed for the run to the shops.

 

[Joey D]

An ugly car that can outrun the ugly. Sub-Zero.

Nothing can outrun ugly since it's 299,792,458m/s

Except cool is inherently subjective, and there cannot be a set way of deciding what is, and what isn't.

I, and obviously others, rank performance higher than other parameters, such as what anyone else thinks. You say that if others think a car is uncool, it probably is. To them. To me, and my perception of coolness, style/gracefulness/looks* etc. are all on a level considerably below performance/handling/the way it actually drives. The engineering associated with the car makes it much cooler to me than whether some rich old guy nods in an appreciative manner as I drive past.

*sigh* Go watch Top Gear, which is obviously what this cool wall thing is a copy off of.

 

[Jim Prower]

I don't think tube-frame chassis 'debuted' in 70's Trans-Am cars. It's been a race-car staple since the 1950's. Every Ferrari made up until the late 90's had a tube frame chassis. It makes for a strong yet light chassis. Why fix what isn't broken?

Perhaps the wording was a bit odd, but I did acknowledge that open-wheel cars (F1, Indy) used them before.

I really just don't see the big deal with the car. Yeah, it's fast. We know it's fast just by looking at it and the technology it uses. So why is it this big surprise or deal when it breaks a record? again, it's almost to be expected.

Dominance is uncool. Ask anyone other than Scuderia Ferrari during the Shumacher Era.

 

[slidesquad#1]

*sigh* Go watch Top Gear, which is obviously what this cool wall thing is a copy off of.

So we have our opinions but they're overruled by the tall fat guy who does what he wants anyways?

I know what the concept of the cool wall is, but I can't see why we have to follow their rationale for it. My point is that cool is inherently subjective, and if some people choose to base their personal opinions on certain aspects more than others, I can't see how it can be 'wrong'. But that's besides the point here, people will vote how they want to anyways. I was just trying to provide a counterpoint to explain my position.

 

[Joey D]

So we have our opinions but they're overruled by the tall fat guy who does what he wants anyways?

I know what the concept of the cool wall is, but I can't see why we have to follow their rationale for it. My point is that cool is inherently subjective, and if some people choose to base their personal opinions on certain aspects more than others, I can't see how it can be 'wrong'. But that's besides the point here, people will vote how they want to anyways. I was just trying to provide a counterpoint to explain my position.

Part of the battle with determining whether or not a car is cool is how others precieve it, then you have the hundreds of other parts to it. That was why I said go watch Top Gear, they base coolness on so many different things that it tends to work decently well. While I might not agree with a lot of their choices, the rationale they use to get to it makes sense.

Simply looking at a performance figures and going "it's fast, therefore it's cool" makes the point of the cool wall moot. This is not the GTP Performance Wall for the last time.

And with that I'm done, if you guys want to ruin the cool wall by voting based on one aspect of the car go for it. I'll just continue posting threads.