GTP_WRS-Online: Special II - #GT500 Triple Mix Test Bracket

  • Thread starter GTP_Dutchy
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Room is up If you cant join please send me an friend request. Due to testing i'd advise to also join party chat even if you don't have a mic.
 
GTP_Dutchy
Nope you're right i could've mentioned this better. but after the race i had a conversation with some of the stewards about how to move on with the championship. We think it would be best to restart after some issues with and around the championship.

However this test bracket will still have its bracket champion.
Click to expand...

Well, I already mentioned yesterday that I´m sort of confused and disappointed about how things concerning this event and the Ring Rats events (which are practically replaced by the triple mix event) are handled. This just adds to it. There is a couple of people who make the decisions in the WRS. Well, that is ok, some people are in charge, that´s the normal way. But the way decisions are made here has something about it that I´d like to call intransparent, disrespectful, sort of dictatorial. It feels like the "normal" members, the plebs, have nothing to say here, are not seen and decisions are just made above their heads like it pleases the leaders. Like declaring an official race a test the day after. I won two races yesterday and finished 2nd in the last one. The next day I read that I did just a test race? And I´m told, as a comfort, that there will be a "test champion". Man, it´s hard to not react cynical to something like that. It is not like the lobby was really crowded yesterday. And I don´t think that the test season decision will help to fill it. "Issues with and around the championship". What does that even mean? But maybe the plebs are not supposed to know and just accept. It´s also disappointing how the heads of the Ring Rats just let go of it. I was under the impression that it meant something to people. But having a new important function (or assuming to have one) in a new event might make you forget quickly about your old child? Or are the Ring Rats not dead? The leaders have not spoken on it to us. Yes, I know you guys do something for this community. You organize events and leagues. You try to make it attractive for people. And you can´t make it right for everyone. I see that and acknowledge it. But I can´t agree with your ways. I´m out of this.
 
Goldomor
Well, I already mentioned yesterday that I´m sort of confused and disappointed about how things concerning this event and the Ring Rats events (which are practically replaced by the triple mix event) are handled. This just adds to it. There is a couple of people who make the decisions in the WRS. Well, that is ok, some people are in charge, that´s the normal way. But the way decisions are made here has something about it that I´d like to call intransparent, disrespectful, sort of dictatorial. It feels like the "normal" members, the plebs, have nothing to say here, are not seen and decisions are just made above their heads like it pleases the leaders. Like declaring an official race a test the day after. I won two races yesterday and finished 2nd in the last one. The next day I read that I did just a test race? And I´m told, as a comfort, that there will be a "test champion". Man, it´s hard to not react cynical to something like that. It is not like the lobby was really crowded yesterday. And I don´t think that the test season decision will help to fill it. "Issues with and around the championship". What does that even mean? But maybe the plebs are not supposed to know and just accept. It´s also disappointing how the heads of the Ring Rats just let go of it. I was under the impression that it meant something to people. But having a new important function (or assuming to have one) in a new event might make you forget quickly about your old child? Or are the Ring Rats not dead? The leaders have not spoken on it to us. Yes, I know you guys do something for this community. You organize events and leagues. You try to make it attractive for people. And you can´t make it right for everyone. I see that and acknowledge it. But I can´t agree with your ways. I´m out of this.
Click to expand...

Markus, Ring Rats will still be here after this Championship is over. We are trying to find a way to appeal to a broader range of drivers than what we are able to do at RR, and by no means we "Owned" the sunday slot, which has traditionally been used for WRS Special Events since a lot before RR even existed. In fact, Ring Rats came to be after one of those Special Events. We have done a poor job of letting you guys know how we were going to move forward with Ring Rats once the GT500 Championship started, but by no means we are "Letting it go", it was never our intention to have people choose between one or the other, and it still isn't.
I've been there hosting for almost every sunday the last 4 or 5 months and I find it a bit unfair that you might think I'm abandoning RR because of my involvement with WRS. Ring Rats, my friend, would have never started without WRS in the first place. I'll always be happy to accommodate another racing series that's here to add, and certainly not compete, with the variety and fun of online racing.
 
Rikson
I like to join for the next race.
If I understand correctly I use 2 different cars for these 2 races and a third car for race t Suzuka?
Click to expand...
Yes you're free to pick what ever car you want for what ever race but you can use a car only once. i.e.
 
roamer2629
Markus, Ring Rats will still be here after this Championship is over. We are trying to find a way to appeal to a broader range of drivers than what we are able to do at RR, and by no means we "Owned" the sunday slot, which has traditionally been used for WRS Special Events since a lot before RR even existed. In fact, Ring Rats came to be after one of those Special Events. We have done a poor job of letting you guys know how we were going to move forward with Ring Rats once the GT500 Championship started, but by no means we are "Letting it go", it was never our intention to have people choose between one or the other, and it still isn't.
I've been there hosting for almost every sunday the last 4 or 5 months and I find it a bit unfair that you might think I'm abandoning RR because of my involvement with WRS. Ring Rats, my friend, would have never started without WRS in the first place. I'll always be happy to accommodate another racing series that's here to add, and certainly not compete, with the variety and fun of online racing.
Click to expand...
Amen!
 
okay I still think a bit of background info would be in place here before people are making judgements before hearing the full story.

Alright guys the season this championship was organised was because our community told us that the 2.4 hour Nurburgring special was to long a go. Also we've seen a decrease in participation. That's why we thought it would be a good idea to do an championship so the regulars have an fun event based on a long tradition as @hasslemoff already mentioned.

hasslemoff
A bit of nostalgia moment when I seen another triple mix event 👍, may 2014 was the first time we ran a race with the idea https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ecial-ii-moffs-triple-mix-sat-may-3rd.306383/ and I still remember all the testing before hand which started in February.
Its great to see the ideas behind the scenes progress the way they do and it normally produces some great races 👍, have fun.
Click to expand...

But also this one
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...le-mix-part-deux-august-2nd-21-00-gmt.312817/

Which triggered this one
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ship-finale-10-dec-2-4-hour-endurance.342974/

So we thought this proven concept would be the way to go forward. Since we want to add people to the WRS and add this event next to our exisiting event our choice has fallen on Sunday these kinds of events are hard enough too pull of let alone if you'd choose an awkward timeslot.

I'm not going to repeat @roamer2629 about racing on sunday i think he pretty much covered it, if you have questions on that part please feel free to ask. Anyhow this was basically the only time slot for us to be able to pull it off in the way we had intended it to be. We never said anything about killing ring rats. In fact in the very first rough format for this we had stated that we would like to keep you guys up to date straight away. Sadly this didn't happen straightaway for what ever reason. Which caused some confusion. however we did communicate this with the ring rats and agreements were made as @roamer2629 mentioned in the post above. To my knowledge those are still intact despite of what was communicated through the ring rats convo.

The thing is we're working with volunteers who spend a lot of their spare time to make sim racing fun for as many people as possible. If you like the gt500 great sign up if you don't like it great go do regular WRS or go to the ring rats. And if you got the time do all of it. It's up to driver to pick what they want when were and how.

If I recall correctly ring rats was formed after the last 2.4 hour special event on a sunday and the stewards were asked if it was okay to continue a series like that. Not under WRS stewarding but as an own organisation. Great initiative but if that means we lWRS loses that slot for specials that means there is no more room for any specials now and in the future. Race Rat has it's hardcore members but to be honest it's also quite niche. So basically that would rob the WRS of any chance to run like it has always run and get WRS under the attention of new drivers.

On topic of making the #GT500 a test bracket.
Again poor communication on my side and i can really see the anger in not knowing this. However to be honest if we'd continued like yesterday we'd have to kill the championship before the 2nd bracket because of partipation. In which case there would be a bracket champion instead of a test bracket championship but no further championship. As hard as it is to make that call i thought the bracket champion being called the test bracket champion was the lesser evil then the alternative of not having a championship it all. Since we don't want to give up that easy we thought it would be an good idea to use these races to finetune the event. specially in terms of tire choise and fuel and tyre degradation settings these things cost a lot of time to test espacially when you'd go to another tyre in which case everything has to be re done. Last reason is that due to some private circumstances we weren't able to setup the PR for this event as we normally do. we see that has andirect result in participation. So instead of messing about in a championship with it's flaws and a false start. we decided to do the wise thing (in our minds) and go ahead and clean up the mess first and then start off on the right foot.

So yes we've made mistakes
Communication to ring rats could be better
Communication / PR about this championship could be better.
Setup towards the championship could've been better.

But we're trying to fix all those and working hard in our free time to give everyone the best experience. If that means that i have to make the difficult desicion to postpone the championship and fix things first i'll happily do that. If that means organising an championship to boost participation and provide an fun experience to our community

Even when slightly dropping the ball means people call me "intransparent, disrespectful, sort of dictatorial"
Even when they say I look down on dem as "Plebs"
Even when person X thinks I don't care what the community wants and "just want to do as the leaders pleases"
or Even when Person Y tells me my "political and social skills are appaling"

Because I know the majority of the WRS community will handle us with respect. And values what we are doing here week in and week out.
They know if somethings wrong with an event it will get fixed. What if the stewards didn't we wouldn't be around here for more than 15 years.

So if after this anyone is still offended or buthurt in anyway please feel free to not register for this championship. And i'll gladly go ahead and continue with the people who like to have a good race and can handle one another with some respect.

p.s. this is my personal opinion.
 
Last edited:
Now that the thing above is off my chest.

Thanks for helping me with testing today @hirnsauger69 and @roamer2629


Attention!!!​
So Heads up to everyone we might be racing sunday on racing softs. They provide a bit more grip so the car is better managable on the power without it becomming numb. Also note that we do have fuel and tire wear planned for the last race on suzuka.

I'll provide further details in the oncomming days.
 
GTP_Dutchy
okay I still think a bit of background info would be in place here before people are making judgements before hearing the full story.

Alright guys the season this championship was organised was because our community told us that the 2.4 hour Nurburgring special was to long a go. Also we've seen a decrease in participation. That's why we thought it would be a good idea to do an championship so the regulars have an fun event based on a long tradition as @hasslemoff already mentioned.



But also this one
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...le-mix-part-deux-august-2nd-21-00-gmt.312817/

Which triggered this one
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ship-finale-10-dec-2-4-hour-endurance.342974/

So we thought this proven concept would be the way to go forward. Since we want to add people to the WRS and add this event next to our exisiting event our choice has fallen on Sunday these kinds of events are hard enough too pull of let alone if you'd choose an awkward timeslot.

I'm not going to repeat @roamer2629 about racing on sunday i think he pretty much covered it, if you have questions on that part please feel free to ask. Anyhow this was basically the only time slot for us to be able to pull it off in the way we had intended it to be. We never said anything about killing ring rats. In fact in the very first rough format for this we had stated that we would like to keep you guys up to date straight away. Sadly this didn't happen straightaway for what ever reason. Which caused some confusion. however we did communicate this with the ring rats and agreements were made as @roamer2629 mentioned in the post above. To my knowledge those are still intact despite of what was communicated through the ring rats convo.

The thing is we're working with volunteers who spend a lot of their spare time to make sim racing fun for as many people as possible. If you like the gt500 great sign up if you don't like it great go do regular WRS or go to the ring rats. And if you got the time do all of it. It's up to driver to pick what they want when were and how.

If I recall correctly ring rats was formed after the last 2.4 hour special event on a sunday and the stewards were asked if it was okay to continue a series like that. Not under WRS stewarding but as an own organisation. Great initiative but if that means we lWRS loses that slot for specials that means there is no more room for any specials now and in the future. Race Rat has it's hardcore members but to be honest it's also quite niche. So basically that would rob the WRS of any chance to run like it has always run and get WRS under the attention of new drivers.

On topic of making the #GT500 a test bracket.
Again poor communication on my side and i can really see the anger in not knowing this. However to be honest if we'd continued like yesterday we'd have to kill the championship before the 2nd bracket because of partipation. In which case there would be a bracket champion instead of a test bracket championship but no further championship. As hard as it is to make that call i thought the bracket champion being called the test bracket champion was the lesser evil then the alternative of not having a championship it all. Since we don't want to give up that easy we thought it would be an good idea to use these races to finetune the event. specially in terms of tire choise and fuel and tyre degradation settings these things cost a lot of time to test espacially when you'd go to another tyre in which case everything has to be re done. Last reason is that due to some private circumstances we weren't able to setup the PR for this event as we normally do. we see that has andirect result in participation. So instead of messing about in a championship with it's flaws and a false start. we decided to do the wise thing (in our minds) and go ahead and clean up the mess first and then start off on the right foot.

So yes we've made mistakes
Communication to ring rats could be better
Communication / PR about this championship could be better.
Setup towards the championship could've been better.

But we're trying to fix all those and working hard in our free time to give everyone the best experience. If that means that i have to make the difficult desicion to postpone the championship and fix things first i'll happily do that. If that means organising an championship to boost participation and provide an fun experience to our community

Even when slightly dropping the ball means people call me "intransparent, disrespectful, sort of dictatorial"
Even when they say I look down on dem as "Plebs"
Even when person X thinks I don't care what the community wants and "just want to do as the leaders pleases"
or Even when Person Y tells me my "political and social skills are appaling"

Because I know the majority of the WRS community will handle us with respect. And values what we are doing here week in and week out.
They know if somethings wrong with an event it will get fixed. What if the stewards didn't we wouldn't be around here for more than 15 years.

So if after this anyone is still offended or buthurt in anyway please feel free to not register for this championship. And i'll gladly go ahead and continue with the people who like to have a good race and can handle one another with some respect.

p.s. this is my personal opinion.
Click to expand...

The whole RR thing has nothing to do with you. From my perspecitve I was missing some effort to save the RR or clarification if and how the RR would go on. But that has nothing to do with you, Dutchy. And as I know now there was and is an effort to save it. And I´m sorry to have mistrusted people in that matter.

"Because I know the majority of the WRS community will handle us with respect. And values what we are doing here week in and week out."

Which translates into: We are the ones who aren´t valued and respected by people like you. But you´re a minority, a single opinion that doesn´t count, considering all the people who value us. We´re actually victims here and the guy who complaines is the offender who acts disrespectfully towards us.

"So if after this anyone is still offended or buthurt in anyway please feel free to not register for this championship. And i'll gladly go ahead and continue with the people who like to have a good race and can handle one another with some respect."

Which translates into: After all this nobody should be offended anymore. But I also want to mark you as a person who cannot treat others with respect, because I actually want to give the offense I think I took from your side back to you. So I offend you right after my efforts to make it unneccessary to feel offended.

It was not my intention to characterize anyone as anything, especially not a particular person. I don´t even know who all is envolved in the organization of the Triple Mix Event. I explained how things came across, how they seem for people in my position and what attitude it might express. I also think I have never treated anybody in this or any other community in a disrespectful way.

I´d like to say I appreciate your effort to give more transparency and admit mistakes. But how I expected, this also turned into a power struggle by means of coloring me as the bad, disrespectful aggressor even if in an indirect, wrapped fashion.

Well, you´ve swung the hammer of power now. You´ve shown the community your good intentions, brushed the dirt that (you think) was poured on you by me off your shirt and at the same time tried to put the guy who provoked your explanations in a bad spot. Turned things around. That indeed is a social as well as a political skill - if you want to exercise power.

That is MY personal opinion. Good night.
 
Goldomor
The whole RR thing has nothing to do with you. From my perspecitve I was missing some effort to save the RR or clarification if and how the RR would go on. But that has nothing to do with you, Dutchy. And as I know now there was and is an effort to save it. And I´m sorry to have mistrusted people in that matter.

"Because I know the majority of the WRS community will handle us with respect. And values what we are doing here week in and week out."

Which translates into: We are the ones who aren´t valued and respected by people like you. But you´re a minority, a single opinion that doesn´t count, considering all the people who value us. We´re actually victims here and the guy who complaines is the offender who acts disrespectfully towards us.

"So if after this anyone is still offended or buthurt in anyway please feel free to not register for this championship. And i'll gladly go ahead and continue with the people who like to have a good race and can handle one another with some respect."

Which translates into: After all this nobody should be offended anymore. But I also want to mark you as a person who cannot treat others with respect, because I actually want to give the offense I think I took from your side back to you. So I offend you right after my efforts to make it unneccessary to feel offended.

It was not my intention to characterize anyone as anything, especially not a particular person. I don´t even know who all is envolved in the organization of the Triple Mix Event. I explained how things came across, how they seem for people in my position and what attitude it might express. I also think I have never treated anybody in this or any other community in a disrespectful way.

I´d like to say I appreciate your effort to give more transparency and admit mistakes. But how I expected, this also turned into a power struggle by means of coloring me as the bad, disrespectful aggressor even if in an indirect, wrapped fashion.

Well, you´ve swung the hammer of power now. You´ve shown the community your good intentions, brushed the dirt that (you think) was poured on you by me off your shirt and at the same time tried to put the guy who provoked your explanations in a bad spot. Turned things around. That indeed is a social as well as a political skill - if you want to exercise power.

That is MY personal opinion. Good night.
Click to expand...

There's an awul lot of assumptions in there which is not what I actually said. Just like your previous message. Seems you like to fill in the blanks for yourself instead of actually having a solid argumentation.

The thing is i'm tired of being treated like crap by a few people simply because basically I did what the community asked me to do for the WRS. You state "But you´re a minority, a single opinion that doesn´t count, considering all the people who value us." However this is simply not true. We're always open for idea's like this special, for time trials even the Ring Rats for Pete's sake.

Next to that you seem under the impression that i'm swinging the hammer of power here or i'm just wanting to display power. This also couldn't be further from the thruth. I'm not even going to defend my self on that one because its just silly. my previous reaction has to do with the standards of your previous message. I guess in my response you get same amount of respect you're giving in your first message. If you can't handle that that you shouldn't have posted it in the first place. No matter how hard you yell powerplay at me.
 
ERAZER
Been away for a long while, just saw the tag.
Yes I'd like to join next sunday, however im not entirely sure how competetive I'll be( not been driving for a very long time) :)

Will sign up as soon as I can confirm I'm available. Thanks for the tag @GTP_Dutchy :D
Click to expand...
I think you'll do just fine don't worry about it. Good to see you back at it!
 
GTP_Dutchy
Attention!!!​

So Heads up to everyone we might be racing sunday on racing softs. They provide a bit more grip so the car is better managable on the power without it becomming numb. Also note that we do have fuel and tire wear planned for the last race on suzuka.

I'll provide further details in the oncomming days.
Click to expand...

Maybe too much grip?
 
Well..this was not a great succes for me.
Hard work to run these unguided missiles for half an hour.:lol:
I don't get used to the steering input and how these cars react.
I tried the race hard tires allso but doesn't make much difference.
Very little feedback.
I'll do some testing for Suzuka with tire wear later his week.
:cheers:
 
Thanks for hosting last night. First race had 4 massive spins which ruined any chances of a half decent finish - 2 on the first lap didn't help! NSX was a right handful there.

Second race and the Lexus was amazing! Had a great battle with Dutchy for a couple of laps then he made a mistake and I built up a decent gap. But then jfrod started to reel me, bit by bit. Thought I may be able to hold him off but he made it past on with 1 lap to go. Still very happy with a podium considering the quality of drivers in the field. 'Stay safe, don't crash' is very true! Looking forward to Suzuka on Sunday :)
 
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