Harsh Realization: Mexico Has the Cars That American Enthusiasts Want

[YSSMAN]

While tinkering in the FIAT 500 thread over in the Auto News section, for some reason it finally clicked that a lot of the cars that so many people say they want in America are actually sold just south of the border.

Some of the big names that aren't sold here include:

- Renault: Clio, Megane, etc
- Peugeot: 206, 407, etc
- FIAT: Panda, Bravo, Grande Punto... Maybe the 500 (eventually), etc
- Suzuki: Yes, we have Suzuki in America... But we don't have the SWIFT...

So, the question is: Would you go to Mexico to buy one? If you could, what would you get?

...And then I guess the biggest question is, is it legal, and can it be done to get a car there and drive it legally in the US?

 

[Metar]

Whoa, and I thought we had it bad in Israel, not getting the hot/warmy stuff from them... But not getting those at all?

Doesn't the US have import-laws that state minimum emissions, safety and/or age (of the car) in order to sort out the import? Israel is quite harsh, as the age of the car must be less than a year (current-gen imports) or more than thirty years (Antiques), and withstand the ages-long beaurocracy here. I reckon the US might be easier, though... More advanced country, automotively

 

[1X83Z]

Every single time this comes up, someone mentions the turbocharged Dodge Avenger. I might as well.

I see Mexican cars with regularity in Denver. I have a shot of a Volkswagen Sharan from here in Atlanta and I've seen a Seat Cordoba and Volkswagen Pointer as well. Some interesting cars run across the border. If you have the time, Google around a bit and try to find a shot of the current Dodge Ramcharger - three quarters Durango and one quarter Caravan, with two doors. It's very interesting.

 

[YSSMAN]

After some more stumbling around on the Mexican websites, there are even more cars that are "on the list" that are available south of the border...

- Ford: Ka, Fiesta, MKII Focus (includes the 'true' ST)
- Chevrolet: Corsa, Astra, Zafira, and something called the Tornado... A more car-like Colorado?

---

And I clicked through the hoops on the US Customs, EPA, DOT, etc and they make it nearly impossible to get some of these cars in America. I'd have to talk to someone with experience with getting these cars to the US...

...Although I did just find an importer a few miles from my house, one of which is looking to become some kind of Skyline importer or something (apparently they have an R33)...

 

[Duke]

Back in the day (1996-7), all the modern Mopar heads wanted a Mexico-only Stratus R/T, which was a Stratus (duh) with the turbocharged 2.4l 4 and 5-speed manual that eventually found their way into the GT Cruiser and thence into the Neon SRT.

Importing them is nearly always illegal due to (mostly) smog and emissions requirements and some safety issues.

 

[1X83Z]

Back in the day (1996-7), all the modern Mopar heads wanted a Mexico-only Stratus R/T, which was a Stratus (duh) with the turbocharged 2.4l 4 and 5-speed manual that eventually found their way into the GT Cruiser and thence into the Neon SRT.

Importing them is nearly always illegal due to (mostly) smog and emissions requirements and some safety issues.

Oh, I thought it was the Avenger. I knew someone would mention it.

 

[Tornado]

Every single time this comes up, someone mentions the turbocharged Dodge Avenger. I might as well.

What, the Stealth?

If you have the time, Google around a bit and try to find a shot of the current Dodge Ramcharger - three quarters Durango and one quarter Caravan, with two doors. It's very interesting.

Wikipedia has a picture of the old one. Looks like somone rear-ended a Dodge Ram with a Chevy Tahoe.

 

[1X83Z]

Indeed - it's actually the most recent one, even though it's based on the old Ram. According to Wikipedia it was sold through 2004. I've seen a few of these and I can tell you that there's Ram architecture up front, Durango pillars and lights in the back, and the entire tailgate assembly is off the 96-00 Chrysler minivans.

 

[Pupik]

Sometimes they stop in New Orleans:

I saw a tiny, yellow, 5-door, Kei-looking Hyundai on Monday afternoon. It was three lanes over, and no camera. Mexican plates, though.

Edit: It was an Atos.

 

[Joey D]

Indeed - it's actually the most recent one, even though it's based on the old Ram. According to Wikipedia it was sold through 2004. I've seen a few of these and I can tell you that there's Ram architecture up front, Durango pillars and lights in the back, and the entire tailgate assembly is off the 96-00 Chrysler minivans.

That's one of the oddest looking vehicles I've ever seen, my eyes and my mind won't let me focus on what it is.

 

[YSSMAN]

I think the thing that pisses me off most is that the car that could literally save Ford is lingering just across the border. The sheer stupidity of the guys in Detroit for not selling the MKII Focus in America is just becoming astounding, and when I later found out that the Fiesta and Ka are down there too, its enough to take a gun to the backside of my neighbor's Contour...

It all raises an interesing question for me: Why, exactly, isn't there an international safety and emissions standard worldwide for automobiles? If I'm not mistaken, are most American market cars (on average) safer than that of the Asian and European market cars? The same can be said of the air-quality issue, where our EPA has put a strangle-hold on our vehicles... Despite the fact that we're the cause of global warming... (?)

...The only countries I know of that come anywhere close to our standards for new automobiles is Canada and Australia, otherwise everyone else has pretty much got their own rules for whats out there...

Meh. I'm frustrated...

 

[Joey D]

The new Focus that debuted at the NAIAS is supposed to be better, but since no one has gotten a chance to test the thing yet that is still up in the air. I think Ford should bring the Ka here though, at least to compete against the Yaris, Aveo, and other little things.

 

[YSSMAN]

New Focus = sux. Its still the same car we saw debut in 1999 underneath, as the only major refresh has been the exterior and the better (but still awkward) interior. IMO, the only redeeming quality about the 'new' Focus is the FordSync deal they have with Microsoft where a bunch of stuff talks to the car, but IMO, that isn't an excuse for continuing and out-of-date car for this long...

As for the Ka, I'd love to have it, but the Fiesta would probably fare better in terms of size. The Ka is a bit smaller, and certainly would make it one of the smallest, if not the smallest new-car offered in the US. I'd take a Fiesta ST any-day if they would sell them in the US, but Ford has to get-off their ass and realize that people are willing to buy them, and then give the public what they want...

Good, decently-priced, fun-to-drive, economic cars that are better than the competition. Come to think of it, the last time they did that was with the MKI Focus... Hmmm. So they know they can do it, so why haven't they done it?

...Oh yeah. Billy Ford had the collective thinking capacity of a Canadian Goose suffering from SARS. Thus far, Mullaly has promised a lot, but I haven't seen the delivery yet...

 

[Joey D]

Hmmm for some reason I thought it was a big step up, guess I was wrong. That's ashame though. I rather like the Focus hatchback and if I was looking at getting a used economy car I might look into one, considering they are a dime a dozen around here. I think the Ford dealer down the street has 10 used on the lot.

I thought Ford would do great things, I really did, but they are just kind of there, taking up space in the car world. I don't think the Fusion is anything to get excited about, sure it's an ok car but I don't think I would want one.

Ford really, really, really needs to redesign and update their Ranger, it's been the same for ages.

 

[3-Wheel Drive]

I think the thing that pisses me off most is that the car that could literally save Ford is lingering just across the border. The sheer stupidity of the guys in Detroit for not selling the MKII Focus in America is just becoming astounding, and when I later found out that the Fiesta and Ka are down there too, its enough to take a gun to the backside of my neighbor's Contour...

They won't change. Not unless all those dinosaurs at the top of the company finally go extinct. If they could get fresh blood to their company, and enough of it to overrule any decisions made by those currently in charge, some progress could be made. It's just the old farts have grown fat and lazy with American car buyers eating from their hands for so many years that now that simply don't know how to adapt to this new market. And considering the MASSIVE losses apparently aren't even enough to change them, it may take nothing less than the complete demise of 1 of the Big Three to finally wake the other 2 up.

 

[YSSMAN]

...And the funny thing is that a relative 'old man' has literally turned GM around, that being Bob Lutz. Hell, GM turned a profit in Q4 2006, and its losses were certainly less than the other two in the American market. And why is that? Oh my, GM actually builds cars and trucks that people would care to buy!

...Don't get me wrong, Ford has some good stuff, the Fusion and Edge in particular. But when the idiots (like you said) are pounding the table for profits over innovation and thereby a clear-cut possibility of later profits due to good sales of a truly good car, you have to wonder how they have managed to place the horse on-top of the cart, after shooting it square between the eyes.

Sure, they've all done some stupid stuff, but Ford and Chrysler never seem to stop amazing me with their 'good ideas.' Its like they actually want to drive themselves into the ground...

 

[Tornado]

Ford needs a new Iaccoca. Or even the actual Iaccoca.

 

[YSSMAN]

I don't even know if Iacocca is the man for the job anymore. Ford, or even Chrysler, needs their own Bob Lutz... Hell, maybe we should clone him and sell him to the other two...

The fact of the matter is that they are reluctant to do anything 'dangerous' and instead produce mediocre cars and trucks that never do anything to move the market forward. I wouldn't say that GM's products push the envelope, but under Lutz, they have certainly become more competitive, and it has scared a few of the others out there...

I'd be willing to bet that if Ford and Chrysler let a few 30 or 40-something car enthusiasts run the company, we could see a dramatic shift in the performance of the companies in less than five years. The lack of 'balls' at both companies is so astounding, given that they are the homes of the Mustang and the Viper, and yet the continue to churn-out models like the crap-tastic Focus 2.0 and older-than-Jesus Crown Vic, as well as the crushingly disappointing Caliber and waste-of-time Avenger/Sebring.

...For God's sakes you two! Build the Interceptor and Demon, now!

 

[Race Idiot]

 

[Tornado]

I don't even know if Iacocca is the man for the job anymore. Ford, or even Chrysler, needs their own Bob Lutz...

I dunno. I'd argue that Chrylser needs more how Iacocca saved Chrysler than they need how Lutz saved Chrysler. They already have the pieces to produce great cars, they just need to get the spending down and the quality up. Lutz is good with the second, but not so much with the first. Iacocca is more evenly spread.

 

[YSSMAN]

You arent missing anything there, I would say the same about most base spec Renaults as well. There only saving graces are the renaultsport line and even some of those aren't that great anymore.

Also if you get excited over Corsas, Astras and Zafiras there is something very very very wrong with you. Although the new Astra is allright, it's still not as good as it's compettion. Also ford ka's hahahahahhahahahhahahahahaahahahahahahahaahhaahahahhahahahhahahhaha.

Yeah yeah, laugh it up... But until you see how bad the small-car market is in the US, its hard to understand how desperate we are for good alternatives. BTW, I'm a big fan of 'basic' rides, so if they're moderately good and comparable to the MKV Golf, then they will be quite good in America. A good sense of what we got here is that the MKV is by-far the supreme compact in our country, the only reasonably-price car coming close is the Mazda3.

...But from what I understand, the new Corsa is surprisingly good, and the same can be said of the newer Astra (which we are getting this fall, BTW). The Zafira is one of those things I would want more on a personal note, as I like the idea of the quasi-minivan, but don't call me a van, deal.

I'm not sure if we have a market that most Europeans would lust for in America, but on the flip-side, there are a lot of us who would die to get some of your small-car market...

 

[Race Idiot]

 

[Dave A]

Yes, I agree with that. SEAT's are good. Peugeot haven't been making good cars since the 306 was scrapped and Renalut, though they do absolutely fantastic spot models just can't seem get the base models right either. Citoren I do thnk are the most up and coming French brand of thoes three, but they still arn't at a point where I'd buy one. the MKII Focus on the other hand is a car that I am thinking of buying, they're decent cars. The Ford Ka is too small for me, they're great cars to drive, and I mean almost original Mini good. They zip round corners like a go-kart, but they're getting on a bit now and probably will go out of production soon. The Ford Puma should have been updated imo.

 

[TheCracker]

You arent missing anything there, I would say the same about most base spec Renaults as well. There only saving graces are the renaultsport line and even some of those aren't that great anymore.

Also if you get excited over Corsas, Astras and Zafiras there is something very very very wrong with you. Although the new Astra is allright, it's still not as good as it's compettion. Also ford ka's hahahahahhahahahhahahahahaahahahahahahahaahhaahahahhahahahhahahhaha.

Yes i totally agree, it's a very 'the grass is greener over there' opinion if you think that half the Vauxhalls, Renaults, Citroens mentioned are worth importing - they're not. Even the Renaultsport Megane they sell in Mexico is very average for a hot hatch - it's only really the 225 F1 version that gets the praise. If our US friends really want a good Euro hatch they should stick with the Golf they already have - it's probably the best alrounder available in that market segment.

 

[Duke]

I don't even know if Iacocca is the man for the job anymore. Ford, or even Chrysler, needs their own Bob Lutz... Hell, maybe we should clone him and sell him to the other two...

Let us not forget that Lutz came from Chrysler, and he was Da Man behind the Viper and the Prowler. He left when the pillaging began. Before he Chrysler he was at Ford...

 

[Race Idiot]

 

[1X83Z]

I'd be willing to bet that if Ford and Chrysler let a few 30 or 40-something car enthusiasts run the company, we could see a dramatic shift in the performance of the companies in less than five years. The lack of 'balls' at both companies is so astounding

Spoken like a true car guy with no knowledge of the business world.

 

[Jay]

As for us getting american cars, well I see a fair few 300C's never any hemi ones but all diesel.

Pretty much opposite here, nearly all 300C's getting around (selling fairly well) are Hemi's.

 

[TopHat]

I've noticed that the new F-series is called the Lobo in MX, and the new Silverado is called the Cheyenne, like the concepts!

Also, they couldn't even bother changing the badging on the Hyundais for Dodge....

 

[YSSMAN]

Spoken like a true car guy with no knowledge of the business world.

Well, I know what you mean, but yeah... kinda. I was thinking more along the lines of some hot-shot doing new-car development (ala Bob Lutz) while a level-headed but enthusiastic CEO and CCO run the company...

Until the boards of the respective governments either A) die or B) are replaced, we aren't likely to see what is happening at GM between Wagoner and Lutz replicated at Ford and Chrysler.

...Although, with the sale of Chrysler reportedly going to the Canuks, things could change quickly...