Help with NSX'S

[Rotary Junkie]

Hmm... Ever hear of the term "Lemon"?

Methinks you've been around some gerry-rigged examples.

 

[Spec M]

You can replace an entire rotary engine for about $1500-$2000 (including the TT). They are also really simple and the way they function is the coolest. Those are the reasons I like them.



Edit: Just like I told Perfect Balance, the FC and FD share the same engine in some models. Neither car is really more dependable than the other its the engine you have to take note of. N/A rotaries tend to last forever while 13BTT's can be babied and well maintained and still pop before 50k miles.

 

[shoman]

Hmm... Ever hear of the term "Lemon"?

Methinks you've been around some gerry-rigged examples.

OH NO this is just what I've seen in high boosted TT's well taken care of. You just have to keep up on them. And as stated they love to pop motors.

 

[shoman]

You can replace an entire rotary engine for about $1500-$2000 (including the TT). They are also really simple and the way they function is the coolest. Those are the reasons I like them.



Edit: Just like I told Perfect Balance, the FC and FD share the same engine in some models. Neither car is really more dependable than the other its the engine you have to take note of. N/A rotaries tend to last forever while 13BTT's can be babied and well maintained and still pop before 50k miles.

The price is bad. The new motors in the RX8 seem to do better with the heat.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

OH NO this is just what I've seen in high boosted TT's well taken care of. You just have to keep up on them. And as stated they love to pop motors.

Hmmm... What's the leading cause of death for a turbo rotary?

Apex seals.

What does extra boost stress? The apex seals. 💡

Also creates more heat unless someone decides to dump a ton of fuel in (or run alky... There's an idea) to cool combustion. Rich mix = lost power.

Best idea is to invest in a good cooling system. That big front-mount intercooler? Yeah, that's preheating the air that's going to be used to chill the coolant. Why do we have that front-mount? We want to run more boost without excessive intake-charge temps. Even if the charge temps drop, there's more heat from combustion, which puts stress on the cooling system.

Vicious cycle. RX-7s don't have a lot of frontal area for a giant radiator.

So something else has to be found. How about going NA? Instead of running so much boost, we can run smaller dishes on the rotors, raising compression. No need for that FMIC anymore. Could run alky. But that would double fuel consumption (cut economy in half).

Renesis + mild port & more compression = heaven.

 

[Spec M]

Very true RJ. Thats why a well maintaned N/A rotary can last forever. If I get a TT the turbines and boost pressure will remain factory and if I did any mods it would be intake, exhaust, fuel delivery, EMU etc. Especially since its a car built for the track it wasnt built to have massive loads of hp. 350ps at the most is more than enough for me and you can achieve this without touching the turbo. But some people just want to bolt on turbos and turn up the boost and they ended needing a whole new car.

However the renesis is excelent for those who want the bolt on power of a turbo. Im not sure how much pressure it can take, but im pretty sure its the most reliable rotary to come about.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

If I get a TT, I'll part out the drivetrain and save up a bit of $$ for the RX-8's Renesis and six-speed.

Then again... There's a 13BT and trans combo on Ebay right now that will probably go for 1500 bucks or so... Find me a B-series.

 

[shoman]

Hmmm... What's the leading cause of death for a turbo rotary?

Apex seals.

What does extra boost stress? The apex seals. 💡

Also creates more heat unless someone decides to dump a ton of fuel in (or run alky... There's an idea) to cool combustion. Rich mix = lost power.

Best idea is to invest in a good cooling system. That big front-mount intercooler? Yeah, that's preheating the air that's going to be used to chill the coolant. Why do we have that front-mount? We want to run more boost without excessive intake-charge temps. Even if the charge temps drop, there's more heat from combustion, which puts stress on the cooling system.

Vicious cycle. RX-7s don't have a lot of frontal area for a giant radiator.

So something else has to be found. How about going NA? Instead of running so much boost, we can run smaller dishes on the rotors, raising compression. No need for that FMIC anymore. Could run alky. But that would double fuel consumption (cut economy in half).

Renesis + mild port & more compression = heaven.

A lot of tunershop are making a V set up. With the rad on the bottom, and the IC on the top. I hear it's be good set up. Yes if your going to run boost better have a lot of fuel.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Yes if your going to run boost better have a lot of fuel.

Never said that.

Forced induction simply shoves more air into the engine. You WILL need more fuel to get the A:F ratio back down to sane levels. But you shouldn't need to dump gigantic amounts of EXTRA fuel in to drop EGT down.

 

[shoman]

Now that I read that. I don't know what the heck I was saying. It was one of those wake up posts. (Mine) yes if you can get to a happy level you should be fine and not go boom. I'm more of a N/A guy I shouldn't be talking about boost. Carry on guy's

 

[mafia_boy]

Damn I've read some horse manure in this thread. Let me state this clear right now:

THERE IS NO FACTORY 20B RX7 FOR THE PUBLIC!! The only car the 20B came in factory from Mazda was the JC Cosmo. Every 20B powered car otherwise has been a conversion job usually in RX7's over in Japan (and an AE86), but here in Australia it's been done in everything from a Mazda 1300 wagon to a big Ford Cortina!!

Secondly, you CAN build reliable rotors on boost!! The stock apex seals are garbage, that's why nowadays a few rotor shops have their own composites for their own apex seals that hold up to boost so much better than 20 years ago. Different materials and different technologies have made this possible. It's not unheard of here to have a 400hp@wheels rotor running for well over 100,000kms nowadays, whereas 10 years ago this wasn't possible. Cooling is still the #1 thing for it, but then all you have to ask is "how big of a fridge (I/C) do you want on the front?" And how good your radiator is.

 

[wrcsti]

Damn I've read some horse manure in this thread. Let me state this clear right now:

THERE IS NO FACTORY 20B RX7 FOR THE PUBLIC!! The only car the 20B came in factory from Mazda was the JC Cosmo. Every 20B powered car otherwise has been a conversion job usually in RX7's over in Japan (and an AE86), but here in Australia it's been done in everything from a Mazda 1300 wagon to a big Ford Cortina!!

Secondly, you CAN build reliable rotors on boost!! The stock apex seals are garbage, that's why nowadays a few rotor shops have their own composites for their own apex seals that hold up to boost so much better than 20 years ago. Different materials and different technologies have made this possible. It's not unheard of here to have a 400hp@wheels rotor running for well over 100,000kms nowadays, whereas 10 years ago this wasn't possible. Cooling is still the #1 thing for it, but then all you have to ask is "how big of a fridge (I/C) do you want on the front?" And how good your radiator is.

you do have quite some good logic there. Being from Puerto Rico I have seen with my very eyes what they do to those cars to take GINORMOUS(sp?) ammounts of boost and not break an apex seal. One of the best rotaries in PR nicknamed la atrevida has been run with the same motor for 3 years straight and has not missed a single 1/4 mile run twice a week.

 

[Megasoft Office]

The biggest problem with rotary engines is cooling. The block develops hotspots that would be almost impossible to cool, even if you wanted to fabricate some ridiculous ducting for an NSX to accept a transversally-mounted 20B. The 787B is an exception since the engine was mounted longitudinally with ample space and cooling in the engine bay.

 

[mafia_boy]

you do have quite some good logic there. Being from Puerto Rico I have seen with my very eyes what they do to those cars to take GINORMOUS(sp?) ammounts of boost and not break an apex seal. One of the best rotaries in PR nicknamed la atrevida has been run with the same motor for 3 years straight and has not missed a single 1/4 mile run twice a week.

PR, 2nd home of the rotor. You guys do things to them over there that make us Aussies go WTF!! ESPECIALLY with the good old 13B.

However, they're coming from a road use point of view which makes the 1/4 mile argument irrelevant. Which is why I was talking more about the 400hp@wheel 10sec street cars that usually have a mild port and small boost increases but rebuilt internally. Here it's a drive-in/drive-out experience with your stock car. Even over 10 years ago, people were getting 350hp@fly with the stock 6 port motor with just a TO3/4 hybrid turbo on mild boost.

 

[Spec M]

PR, 2nd home of the rotor. You guys do things to them over there that make us Aussies go WTF!! ESPECIALLY with the good old 13B.

However, they're coming from a road use point of view which makes the 1/4 mile argument irrelevant. Which is why I was talking more about the 400hp@wheel 10sec street cars that usually have a mild port and small boost increases but rebuilt internally. Here it's a drive-in/drive-out experience with your stock car. Even over 10 years ago, people were getting 350hp@fly with the stock 6 port motor with just a TO3/4 hybrid turbo on mild boost.

What usually disgust me is seeing a LS1 in an FD.., (smh)