High HP Drifting-or-Low HP Drifting?

[japanese_freak5]

High HP drifting (HP 350+) has advantages but some downs too. High HP drifting can give maximum control of the car but the drifts are very short if you gas it all the way around the corner.
Low HP Drifting (HP 350 or lower) is my personal favorite. You can control the car a much better than high HP with a lot of practice. You can drift much longer than high HP but...there is a higher possibility that you will spinout (an uncontrolled one) i am a amateur but i can nail a couple of good drifts after a warm-up lap but i still go off the road a lot!!! and i cant nail a 360, a 180, or any of that stuff.

 

[Delphic Reason]

Actually, the only difference is the speed you take into the corner, and how fast you can accelerate. This of course is if you have matched the tires with the power to weight ratio... A 450hp S13 on sports should act very similar to a 240hp S13 on sims. The only difference being that the higher HP car will be able to get to the corner faster (less time on the straights)... How are you setting up your higher HP cars?... usually, and this also depends greatly on the weight, 400 to 600hp vehicles should be on sports, and anything above that should be on various racing slicks (the higher the HP/weight, the stickier the tire)...

 

[BlakNite]

None of the drift cars I have now exceed 400 HP. I beleive that some of the cars I have need more horsepower to cause the cars to induce more oversteer, specifically my MR's. Yet, most of my tuned FR's drift perfectly, atleast to me. I usually use the power over drift or braking drift to induce oversteer. I'm still an ammature, maybe intermediate

 

[rsmithdrift]

I always use MAX HP possible and sim tires and I can link Complex String from start line to finish line. High Horsepower will always win because if you want to have less horsepower all you have to do is learn some throttle control and feather it. 600bhp at half throttle is now only 300bhp, get it? So the real question you asked is: How much control do you have as a driver?

My answer: MORE THAN ENOUGH. I have a 600bhp Mustang that I can do it with as well as a 445bhp 240sx. I can do it with any car over 350bhp. Any car under 300bhp doesn't have the grunt to hold the LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG drifts though the carousel turns or to keep it going through some of the long links required to make the whole track. (ie, turn 1 to the S turns in one long drift, after the 90* turns to the decreasing radius in three long drifts, etc.)

YES I SAID 600bhp AND SIM TIRES. It's pretty easy once you learn to modulate the throttle and have lightning quick reflexes with the wheel.

 

[japanese_freak5]

ok this is pretty much a thread i did to some ideas either to get high HP or low HP keep the posts coming because i still need to choose thanx!!!

 

[japanese_freak5]

to use high HP or low HP****my bad

 

[Delphic Reason]

to use high HP or low HP****my bad

You know, you can use the edit button... Please refrain from double posting...

Why do you need to choose between them?... I drift high and low, and everything in between... Just go drift... It doesn't matter...

Any car under 300bhp doesn't have the grunt to hold the LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG drifts though the carousel turns or to keep it going through some of the long links required to make the whole track. (ie, turn 1 to the S turns in one long drift, after the 90* turns to the decreasing radius in three long drifts, etc.)

100% false... Myself, and many others, have drifted every possible link/corner in GT3 with stock power to 300hp vehicles... I can link all of the CS loops, and beyond, with my 230hp S14 K's...

 

[nigs]

a 600hp car @ half throttle produces 300hp
hahaha.
cute.

If you can't hold a long drift with a car with under 300hp then u may wanna look at your entry speed, angle and suspension settings.
Or maybe you just lack the skills.

As Delphic Reason pointed out, it's all possible with many cars under 300hp.

 

[rsmithdrift]

a 600hp car @ half throttle produces 300hp
hahaha.
cute.

If you can't hold a long drift with a car with under 300hp then u may wanna look at your entry speed, angle and suspension settings.
Or maybe you just lack the skills.

As Delphic Reason pointed out, it's all possible with many cars under 300hp.

It's just different driving styles I suppose. I like to balance my car between rear tire grip and countersteer and to be able to do that properly you have to have enough power to be able to get wheelspin at any speed and modulate it to use changes in rear tire grip to steer the car around the turn. The steering wheel is just there to keep the angle constant and smooth, I steer with the rear while drifting.
Some people like to have oversteer and high entry speed and use momentum, in which case they wouldn't need high power. They also will have to fish-tail (manji) alot more down the straights to keep the drift going instead of just increasing the wheelspin and driving in a straight line at a 45* angle like I commonly do.

I can hold a long drift with a car as low as 160bhp, but I can't do it at the same speed, or with the same angle as I could with 350bhp in that same car. Also once your over 100mph any chance of wheelspin is lost if you don't have the power. I like drifting at 80+mph, even in real life, and you need high power (or rain) to do so. Yes I get sidways in my 300zx in the rain at 80mph all the time, it's fun. I got sideways at 110mph in the dry once and it broke my front sway bar.

edit: AN EXAMPLE: I can link 4 laps of continuous drift at CS easily with my 240sx. (that means 4 laps w/o ever straightening out at all) But if I drop the power below 300, I can still link the individual sections fine, but I can no longer get an entire lap. It just plain runs out of torque and straightens out.

 

[Delphic Reason]

It's just different driving styles I suppose. I like to balance my car between rear tire grip and countersteer and to be able to do that properly you have to have enough power to be able to get wheelspin at any speed and modulate it to use changes in rear tire grip to steer the car around the turn. The steering wheel is just there to keep the angle constant and smooth, I steer with the rear while drifting.

Drifting IS about controlling the balance between the grip of the front tires (should always be gripping in a RWD) and the traction curve of the rear tires... It has nothing to do with style... There is only one way to drift properly, and that's to use the steering to control the line the car takes through the turn, and the
throttle to control the angle and to adjust speed... Everything else is up to "style"... However, in GT4, momentun is incredibly important, much more so than in GT3, with any HP tire combo...

Some people like to have oversteer and high entry speed and use momentum, in which case they wouldn't need high power. They also will have to fish-tail (manji) alot more down the straights to keep the drift going instead of just increasing the wheelspin and driving in a straight line at a 45* angle like I commonly do.

Wrong... There is absolutely no reason to manji down the straights, to keep a drift going... I can easily use power over, lift off, feint, dynamic, and anything else you can think of with a low powerd car... Manji is mainly just used to please the audience... It's definitely not necesary...

I can hold a long drift with a car as low as 160bhp, but I can't do it at the same speed, or with the same angle as I could with 350bhp in that same car. Also once your over 100mph any chance of wheelspin is lost if you don't have the power. I like drifting at 80+mph, even in real life, and you need high power (or rain) to do so.

As nigs said, it sounds like you just don't have the experience (and thus skill) to do it... A lot of people here can drift high speed high angle with low powered cars... You don't need a lot of power to do what you are describing... I have said it so many times, but no one ever seems to listen... It's all about the relationship of the weight of the vehicle, power, and tire choice... If you match up the tires well with the power to weight ratio, every RWD vehicle will have the same capabilities, regardless of high or low power... The problem is, most people don't know how to match these things, and thus rely on power alone...

edit: AN EXAMPLE: I can link 4 laps of continuous drift at CS easily with my 240sx. (that means 4 laps w/o ever straightening out at all) But if I drop the power below 300, I can still link the individual sections fine, but I can no longer get an entire lap. It just plain runs out of torque and straightens out.

As previously stated, you just need to work on keeping your momentum up, and it sounds like the car just isn't set up well for the track/HP/tire combo, etc... If you spent a good long while with only stock to low power vehicles, you would learn a lot and possibly increase you capabilites with low and high power... If you need any help with matching the tires/hp/weight, let me know... I have devoted a lot of time to the subject, so I can surely be of assistance...

 

[rsmithdrift]

I have devoted a lot of time to the subject, so I can surely be of assistance...

Hmmm.... I have always drifted (before I even knew what it was) with the most power possible for as far back as I can remember (around 1996). And I guess Taka Aono was right when he said "Power is a handicap" at the Infenion Formula D event.

I just realized that I have NEVER touched the e-brake in GT3 I actually had to find it just to make sure there was one last night. I spent several hours last night trying to drift my 160hp AE86 SS, it's fully modded, minus engine upgrades, with sim tires, around complex string and I just cant keep it going down the straights or at over 100mph. It just bogs out and quits wheelspinning and consequently straightens out. I tried everything I could think of and nothing besides driving slower than usual can keep that thing sideways. I just ended up modding out the motor to 350bhp and then I got it on the first try.

I never see a car with less than 280-ish bhp doing large, long, smokey, high angle drifts in real life (Taka doesn't either) and it doesn't seem to happen in the game either. Low powered cars like to do low angle drifts in order to hold them around a long turn. If you get high angle they just bog out and slow to a crawl then drive off straight. I see Taka and my car and my buddies '87 N/A second gen (rx-7) and another friends '88 Supra do it all the time. All of our car have between 145-200bhp and they all bog out at high angle. It's either short and high angle, or long and low angle as long as you have under 280-ish bhp, from what we can tell.

I drift my 160bhp 300zx in real life all the time, usually just a quick link through a set of S turns on a mountain road, or any turn I can find in the rain, or just a good set of links in a wet parking lot. I know all the techniques and how to use them. I own a copy of the Drift Bible and I drift every chance I get (video game or real)

QUESTION: You can get a low powered car to hold a high speed drift down a straight w/o manji??!! How do you do that?? Every time I try I just bog out and go straight. And I worked on the cars suspension/LSD set up for hours untill it is now perfect. Also do you have a different def. for manji than I do? Because I call any fish-tailing down a straightaway Manji, and there is absolutely no way to link from the last turn to the first hairpin down the 1 mile long straight w/o doing it. I don't care what your driving or who you are, it can't be done.

Edit: Man do I lack skill!! I just went to Mid Field with my 445bhp 240sx and did 5 laps of non stop drift and didn't straighten out once for the whole run on my first try at it w/o any warm up laps. NEVER DENY MY ABILITY TO CONTROL A CAR!!!!!

 

[Delphic Reason]

Actually, Taka, can do long high angle drifts... I have seen him do it on quite a few occasions... I drift my 160HP S13 all the time, and I am able to keep the revs in the powerband without it bogging down... Sure, I'm not drifting at 100mph, but I have drifted my car at speeds up to 75mph, without any problem... Definitely not low angle either...

I'm not really sure what you are doing wrong... Your problem may be with the transmission/LSD settings... I'm not sure... PM me the settings and I'll see what's up...

I never see a car with less than 280-ish bhp doing large, long, smokey, high angle drifts in real life

You're not looking very hard... My friend Scott drifts a 220hp RPS13, and he drifts at high speed, at angles I wouldn't even try with my current suspension setup... Some of his drifts make the Formula D stuff look like garbage... He is currently working towards Formula D, nonetheless...

In real life, the tire compound plays a much bigger role in the amount of smoke you see, than in GT games... Still, the tire compound in real life needs to be matched well to the power/weight ratio, just like in GT3/GT4...

 

[rsmithdrift]

Actually, Taka, can do long high angle drifts... I have seen him do it on quite a few occasions... I drift my 160HP S13 all the time, and I am able to keep the revs in the powerband without it bogging down... Sure, I'm not drifting at 100mph, but I have drifted my car at speeds up to 75mph, without any problem... Definitely not low angle either...

I'm not really sure what you are doing wrong... Your problem may be with the transmission/LSD settings... I'm not sure... PM me the settings and I'll see what's up...



You're not looking very hard... My friend Scott drifts a 220hp RPS13, and he drifts at high speed, at angles I wouldn't even try with my current suspension setup... Some of his drifts make the Formula D stuff look like garbage... He is currently working towards Formula D, nonetheless...

In real life, the tire compound plays a much bigger role in the amount of smoke you see, than in GT games... Still, the tire compound in real life needs to be matched well to the power/weight ratio, just like in GT3/GT4...

Yeah, any car can hold high angle, but low powered cars can only do it at low speed. Like I said, Low speed and high angle, or high speed and low angle. Unless you have alot of power you generally can't have both. Taka does it once in a great while at the Horseshoe in Road Atlanta (I was there) and at the tightest point of the Infenion drift course, but in the 2nd and 3rd gear areas he generally won't go above 15-25* of angle.
All of me and my buddies cars have under 200 horsepower and they all have the same characteristics, they will run out of gear in 1st, drift good in 2nd, and wont do **** in 3rd or higher unless it is raining. I drift on the interstate at 70+mph in the rain all the time. I drift my touge runs in the rain at 30-50mph, and in the dry only the tigher turns can be drifted in 2nd at 35-40mph. I braking drifted in the dry at 110mph once and broke my front sway bar in the process, but to hold it sideways at that speed you have to have power, LOTS OF IT.

 

[Delphic Reason]

Yeah, any car can hold high angle, but low powered cars can only do it at low speed. Like I said, Low speed and high angle, or high speed and low angle. Unless you have alot of power you generally can't have both. Taka does it once in a great while at the Horseshoe in Road Atlanta (I was there) and at the tightest point of the Infenion drift course, but in the 2nd and 3rd gear areas he generally won't go above 15-25* of angle.
All of me and my buddies cars have under 200 horsepower and they all have the same characteristics, they will run out of gear in 1st, drift good in 2nd, and wont do **** in 3rd or higher unless it is raining. I drift on the interstate at 70+mph in the rain all the time. I drift my touge runs in the rain at 30-50mph, and in the dry only the tigher turns can be drifted in 2nd at 35-40mph. I braking drifted in the dry at 110mph once and broke my front sway bar in the process, but to hold it sideways at that speed you have to have power, LOTS OF IT.

Actually, you need torque... I'm tellin' you bud... I have seen it done plenty, in real life and in GT3/GT4... Hell, I can do it in GT3/GT4... There were a number of stock power vehciles in "Positive Lock", and they were easy to keep sideways at whatever speed I was able to take into the turn... You obviously can't take a car into a turn at 140mph with 160hp... The car wouldn't have time to get up to that speed before a given turn... However, given the same entry speeds, a low power car will have no problem keeping that momentum going with proper throttle and steering inputs, just as good as a higher powered car.... Power is a handicap in a lot of ways...

Don't get me wrong... I drift everything from stock to 1000hp... In all my practice time, I have learned how to control low powered cars at the limit as if they were high power... It's really not that hard... It just takes more thought to the line (because of course, it's a bit different), and the type of throttle inputs needed... The LSD settings are different, the suspension settings are different, etc... You have to setup the low power and high power cars differently, depending on so many different variables... People try to simplify drift settings/techniques too much, in my opinion... With enough research into tuning/technique, a lot can be accomplished that you wouldn't think possible (especially in GT3/GT4)...

 

[twinturboengine]

I use both high and low HP cars

 

[Joshua Wilcox]

I have a question though fellas I have a 2000 Nissan Silvia Spec-R RWD with 748 HP and 565 ft lb of torque I'm thinking on going into the 1000s range and keeping it a track car car only weights about 2500 lb