How much setup copying is allowed?

[Prince.M5]

I use some aids in some set-ups. But only because I'm fed up of the Goddamn wheelspin.

Do not use AIDS as if someone drive the car with no AIDS, then the balance and the setup will be ruined which I believe. Try to play a lot with the LSD. That's the key to avoid the wheelspin. Same goes to my 330i but with the LSD, I can reduce them.

 

[Parnelli Bone]

He uses driving Aids in his tunes, PJ.

Edit: Tree'd by Irons. D'oh.


Cheers
Jetboy

AIDS, as in driving AIDS. It's a bit of a pun.

OH! Duh...

 

[Seismica]

A Couple of those are slight copies...

It would be nice if people accredited your work if they based the setup on yours.

But at the same time, people will probably have spent a while fine tuning, and saying 'based on' usually makes it seem like they didn't do much work when they probably did.

I am with you, people shouldn't really copy. But if they do, theres no real harm in it. I'd just send a pm to the people copying and ask them to give you credit where its due.

 

[Watchman]

 

 

[Greycap]

For the record, the poll situation was 10-4-0 before Nenad's post above. Interesting to see how it changes after that as we're not talking cold emotionless numbers anymore.

As I've stated in MFT's thread before, my driving style is similar to Greycap's.

This sentence gives a very interesting aspect to the situation. If you aim to a similar handling as I do, why was your GT-R almost the same as Leo's Grim R34per which doesn't suit my style at all? Just a thought. Had you been going for a "Greycap style" R34 from scratch you would have ended up with a car strongly resembling my R-Tune which differs from the Grim R34per as night differs from day. Just a thought.

I never wanted to copy or steal any of your setups Greycap and on the one hand, I haven't done so. The setups aren't completely 1:1, but at the other hand, they're similar. The point is that I tried to tune the cars to "perfection" and ended up with similar setups to yours. I also want to say that I'm sure I came to similar settings to yours, because I used your cars to tune them.

It's not only me in question here, Leonidae too. He was pretty much climbing onto the walls seeing his highly (for a reason) praised crown jewel having been released with 1mm ride height changes, the exact same damper rebounds and cambers, not to mention the rest of the suspension which only differs noticably in the rear bound and the toe angles. Pair II in the opening post for those who don't know. Which is also why I'm replying to you here instead of him, I'm the cool headed guy of us two.

I just always thought they would be stock or untouched. That's the mistake I made and which I feel sorry for. It was never meant to be intentional copying!

The bell should have been very loud and clear when the dampers weren't 8 all round, camber angles weren't 2.0 / 1.0, toe angles weren't 0 / 0, stabilizers weren't a similar figure at both ends... all certain clues of a custom setup since GT4 was released and ones that every tuner should be familiar with.

But that's all no problem in my eyes, as noone has tested / reviewed those three cars. I'll be happy to remove them from AMMT's thread and re-do them with new, stock cars in future. 👍

EDIT: So, that going to be only the McLaren, GT-R & RGT. No problem, I'll remove them if you feel better then. 👍

EDIT 2: All similar setups deleted:

Actually I would have liked you to keep those setups. Now it looks like you're deleting the problem so that it never happened and I'm pulling the setup sheets out of thin air which most certainly isn't the truth. It happened, let's deal with it. We can do it and I hope you can too.

If you're wondering why I act like I do, imagine spending several weeks making a setup you feel to be as good as you can make it. Then a couple of months later you see me releasing the same model with a setup that only differs in small details and is claimed to have been tuned to its finest by me. You probably wouldn't be too overjoyed. Not that I'd ever do that, I can make my tunes from scratch perfectly well, but it's a good what-if scenario.

 

[Watchman]

 

 

[mafia_boy]

Blah blah blah.....you're all still slower than GME.

/thread.

*hides in bomb shelter*

 

[Leonidae]

It's Christmas and all, and I really hate getting mixed up into crap like this, but since my dear teammate requested me to say something, I shall do so.. *sigh*

Does this ring a bell?

It's something Greycap found and pointed out.. I have no personal opinion of this unfortunate event ( well, not one that could be expressed without severely mutilating, violating and abusing the AUP), I just want to avoid things like this in the future and get over with it.

edit: Mafs.. shut up. If you start stirring up more crap than what is going on already, and especially if it isn't even related to this thread , I'm going to be VERY upset..

 

[mafia_boy]

I'm trying to be light hearted Leo, relax. Read my first reply as to what I felt about it, I am so on your side it's not funny and if it was GME's tunes that were copied I would've been a lot harsher than you guys are being. 👍

Actually, I'm going to re-quote it just to re-iterate my opinion.

Yeah, I'm right against it myself. I couldn't bear to see my (or anyone else's from the Big 5) work being copied by someone and then have them claim it's their own setup and find it wrong that this person is doing so.

You have full right to be pissed Greycap and honestly, you're taking a much calmer line than I would....personally, I'd probably break AUP in my response if it ever did happen to me.

 

[mazdaman]

I'm trying to be light hearted Leo, relax. Read my first reply as to what I felt about it, I am so on your side it's not funny and if it was GME's tunes that were copied I would've been a lot harsher than you guys are being. 👍

Actually, I'm going to re-quote it just to re-iterate my opinion.

Ok, i think everyone put their point out the true question is what your gonna do.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Ok, i think everyone put thier point out the true question is what your gonna do.

Kick you in the head until your posts start making sense perhaps?

 

[mazdaman]

Kick you in the head until your posts start making sense perhaps?

Why must you be so negative?

 

[Rotary Junkie]

I'm not being negative, it's just that the post I quoted was worded very poorly and seemed like you were going off at Mafs about something.

 

[mazdaman]

I'm not being negative, it's just that the post I quoted was worded very poorly and seemed like you were going off at Mafs about something.

Wrong my point is what are they gonna do with the situation i mean everyone is giving good points of veiw.But yet has M.F.T said what they are going to do as in reporting the person or pm them.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

The person already presented their case... Or are you that blind?

 

[mazdaman]

The person already presented their case... Or are you that blind?

No what im not gonna argue wit you on the web imma just be the bigger person.

 

[mafia_boy]

*sigh* Read the whole thread and when your brain actually comprehends what's gone on, then you can reply again mazdaman.

I actually would like a mod to come in and hear their P.O.V regarding this whole plagarism issue and hear their thoughts about it. Is it against AUP to do such a thing and if it's not, why not?

*added bit* After looking at AUP, would plagarism be in the bounds of this AUP rule??

You will respect other people’s right to personal privacy and will not post any other person’s identifying information (including their names, contact information, and any other relevant information) within the forum but your own.

All the setup's are information which gives MFT its identity....so would the plagarism make this a breach??

 

[PF]

Nah mafs, that's stretching it a bit. Anyway, I notice Jordan is in the thread right now, so they must be considering the question.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Let me start off by saying I have never played or tuned for GT4, but I have been reading this thread with interest, and given the fact that I did a lot of tuning for GT5P and my setups were quite popular, I thought my opinion may (or may not ) be of use here.

In my opinion: copying a setup, modifying one or two minor things and then passing it off as your own is lame, regardless of whether it's against any AUP.

Personally, I post my tunes for people to use in any way they see fit, meaning: use it, adapt it, tweak it, combine it with a tune from another garage, whatever you want to do with it, go ahead be my guest. As a matter of fact, I encourage that. I also encourage that you share the result of your work if you do, even if you only changed one minor thing. But it's an unwritten law that you mention credits where credits are due. And most people usually adhere to this 'law'. Of course, there's always the occasional exception to the rule.

My advice: do not worry about it. You can't stop plagiarism, since you're posting your setups in a public forum (and even if you were not, there's no way to know what happens with your setups after you have given them to someone). Just bring it out in the open and let the community do its work. Most people here don't like cheats/ripoffs, they know where the real deal came from. It will sort itself out, especially if you help a bit by bringing it to peoples attention.

As for someone creating a setup that is almost exactly the same as yours all by himself: I don't buy that. I've seen enough tuning challenges and setups by several tuners to know that you NEVER get the exact same settings, even if driving styles are similar. Because even when driving styles are similar, they will not be 100% equal. And I'm not even mentioning that, depending on the goal you are trying to achieve, a tune will be radically different if you have a different one, despite driving styles being similar.

 

[Watchman]

 

 

[Leonidae]

As far as I'm concerned, this matter is solved. I don't know if Greycap agrees. On my behalf, apology is accepted and error has been corrected.

 

[Watchman]

 

 

[Paulie]

Let me start off by saying I have never played or tuned for GT4, but I have been reading this thread with interest, and given the fact that I did a lot of tuning for GT5P and my setups were quite popular, I thought my opinion may (or may not ) be of use here.

In my opinion: copying a setup, modifying one or two minor things and then passing it off as your own is lame, regardless of whether it's against any AUP.

Personally, I post my tunes for people to use in any way they see fit, meaning: use it, adapt it, tweak it, combine it with a tune from another garage, whatever you want to do with it, go ahead be my guest. As a matter of fact, I encourage that. I also encourage that you share the result of your work if you do, even if you only changed one minor thing. But it's an unwritten law that you mention credits where credits are due. And most people usually adhere to this 'law'. Of course, there's always the occasional exception to the rule.

Sounds like my opinion also, you must have plagiarised it!

 

[fogbound]

I am just some guy who enjoys playing, though not that well. I am also an inventor. It would be very uplifting to think that people actually respected original concepts as much as this thread would lead one to think.

Next time you consider a purchase ask yourself if you are buying an original and supporting those who made the investment or a cheaper reproduction.

BTW, I love MFT tunes and thanks for making the investment.

 

[Lucas]

Funny. The first thing I did was to read the poll options. After reading the first post, I proceeded to vote. When I finally voted, the thought crossed my mind:

"Wait... if I end up being the guy that did this, won't this (I voted second option) make me look like I'm the "thief"?"

After reading the rest of the thread, I'm glad it wasn't me. However, reading the rest of the thread I came with the post that said the three setups were found in the same garage, on the respective cars they were designed for. I would have voted the third option, obviously. However... if Nenad says he doesn't copied them, then I believe him.

I never copied a setup before, never will, because it's pointless. At the end of the day, I make setups for myself and only for myself. If I like them so much I believe someone will find they useful, I post them without a doubt. Do I like criticism? Yes. If the criticism is negative, am I sad by it? Not at all. If I post the car, it is because it works wonders for me. I can't be sad by that. That's one of the reasons I don't care if some steals my "work" (if you can call that, in my case). I do put effort into the setups I upload, that doesn't mean they are the best out there, it also depends on who's driving them. Saying all of this makes it seem that I'm acknowledging Nenad stole those setups. I repeat myself again: If Nenad says he doesn't copied them, then I believe him.

To anyone reading this informed on the subject: Any news on Leo's banning? PM or profile message, please.

 

[senamic]

He has returned to our realm, as the good Finn he is!