I was about to buy Driveclub until...

[unit-one]

When I grinded the drafting accolade (many restarts, of course) a few months ago, I always played on the first A to B track from Scotland (in the VW Golf, so Hot Hatch class), and some AI (which I change to a lower difficulty so it would be easy to stay behind them) always did the same thing in the first hard left turn, that is crash and spun out on to the grass while the first 2-3 cars kept going.

Didn't encounter anything similar in the single player tours, but I don't think the AI is 100% dynamic.

Maybe it's something like MotorStorm AI. In Pacific Rift the AI will cause crashes and sometimes their cars will brake down and the "Lunatics" will get out of them.

 

[chzsln485]

When I grinded the drafting accolade (many restarts, of course) a few months ago, I always played on the first A to B track from Scotland (in the VW Golf, so Hot Hatch class), and some AI (which I change to a lower difficulty so it would be easy to stay behind them) always did the same thing in the first hard left turn, that is crash and spun out on to the grass while the first 2-3 cars kept going.

Didn't encounter anything similar in the single player tours, but I don't think the AI is 100% dynamic.

I'm not sure it is, either. I distinctly remember being taken aback by an extremely daring AI overtake at the start of one of the Tour races, thinking that was quite an incredible spectacle.

However, after a couple of retries, it became apparent that the same AI car would overtake in the same fashion, at the same time, in the same place, which not only lessened the excitement of it, but allowed me to easily set up a defence against it.

Also, are we absolutely sure that the AI doesn't rubberband? Sometimes, the AI (normally the first two or three cars on the grid) will storm off at an alarming pace, to the extent that doesn't seem realistic given the road conditions and performance of the rest of the grid.

These are minor quibbles though, really, and the rest of the time the AI drivers are pretty good. They're fast, persistent, and just about on the clean side of aggressive. They often make for exciting and entertaining races, something which actually makes the single player campaign mode worth doing - unlike a certain other racing game I could mention.

 

[Zonda5]

I think we need a clear cut definition of dynamic AI in this forums in order to decide if DC has it.

 

[MeanElf]

I think we need a clear cut definition of dynamic AI in this forums in order to decide if DC has it.

A good point, as with that made by @chzsln485 - although the term rubber-banding has been denied yet continues to get debate time here, which is all good and healthy - however, I do strongly feel that the AI is dynamic.

True, they do tend to follow the ideal line and there are discernable patterns which if you watch the AI remain consistent (I feel) as something like character traits - so if you see a certain livery, you know what behaviour you can expect (I'm always at loggerheads with that turquoise and orange car!) To be truthful, I haven't checked to actually see if it's the same driver associated with the livery in question - it certainly feels like it though.

My point though, is that outside of those predictable actions and styles of overtaking, they respond to the unexpected actions, such as the ones we make and also errors made by the other AI - now that's what I call dynamic.

 

[Cursed DICE]

Registered just to say, yes they do appear scripted and no, they don't react to the player at all (unless you are completely stationary). Tested it extensively a while ago. Sit stationary on track they'll do everything to get round. Race competitively they'll ram you, always (or at least a lot), even when the entire width of the track is there for overtaking. When I go to take a corner, they hit me, when they go to overtake each other, they hit each other. If you are on racing line they will barge you off it.

As for scripting, I've restarted events several times and noticed they do exactly the same thing pretty much everytime. In one event it got to the point I knew exactly what they'd do so I could overtake almost all of them into turn one

 

[MeanElf]

Registered just to say, yes they do appear scripted and no, they don't react to the player at all (unless you are completely stationary). Tested it extensively a while ago. Sit stationary on track they'll do everything to get round. Race competitively they'll ram you, always (or at least a lot), even when the entire width of the track is there for overtaking. When I go to take a corner, they hit me, when they go to overtake each other, they hit each other. If you are on racing line they will barge you off it.

As for scripting, I've restarted events several times and noticed they do exactly the same thing pretty much everytime. In one event it got to the point I knew exactly what they'd do so I could overtake almost all of them into turn one

Turn one will likely be the same for every race - got to give them a bit more of a chance and space to open out than that.

Still can't agree that they will ram you on purpose, or even blindly and that observation comes from almost a year of playing the game. At first they seemed to do that to me, but it's been a rare occurrence since, so perhaps it's all down to different play-styles.

 

[Cursed DICE]

Turn one will likely be the same for every race - got to give them a bit more of a chance and space to open out than that.

Still can't agree that they will ram you on purpose, or even blindly and that observation comes from almost a year of playing the game. At first they seemed to do that to me, but it's been a rare occurrence since, so perhaps it's all down to different play-styles.

I found they seemed to sometimes know what they're doing, and are pretty competent

As for the rubber banding:
There have been times though where I sit on the start line for half a lap to give them and myself space (for the clean event trophy) and have caught and passed them.

Other times, I'm doing 200 on a straight and leading and then then they pass me like I'm standing still O_o or... even worse, they cruise up to me and rear end me which happens far more than the other one when the entire track is open to them to use to overtake (a lot of the time I'm one side of the track ready for the next corner and this still happens).

When they try to overtake they'll cruise up to you, pull out as you're supposed to, but then it all falls apart. They go to pull out and clip my bumper or want to return to racing line after they think the pass is done and clip my front. I've pulled this off properly online several times, just wonder how Evolution never saw this

EDIT: As a result I long since gave up trying to race the AI cleanly and use them as breaking zones quite a lot, whereas online I will do what I can to avoid collision, unless I'm having a moment

 

[MeanElf]

...EDIT: As a result I long since gave up trying to race the AI cleanly and use them as breaking zones quite a lot, whereas online I will do what I can to avoid collision, unless I'm having a moment

The catch-up effect is a weird one, granted. Another member here found that they will all park up after a couple of corners if you are stationary - he saw this on the mini-map.

I think the passing errors are due to slipstreaming miscalculations - slipstreaming is certainly how they are building up such good passing speeds.

As for your above comment, well that would explain a lot of the AI aggression - they will fight back harder and purposefully go for you if you use them like that. This is why I suggested that the differences in observation could be down to differing playstyles. Try your online approach in SP and I think you'll find it'll work out better for you. A bit of rubbing is fine by the way, they seem to accept that.

Welcome to the forum by the way.

 

[Cursed DICE]

I'm not sure it is, either. I distinctly remember being taken aback by an extremely daring AI overtake at the start of one of the Tour races, thinking that was quite an incredible spectacle.

However, after a couple of retries, it became apparent that the same AI car would overtake in the same fashion, at the same time, in the same place, which not only lessened the excitement of it, but allowed me to easily set up a defence against it.

Also, are we absolutely sure that the AI doesn't rubberband? Sometimes, the AI (normally the first two or three cars on the grid) will storm off at an alarming pace, to the extent that doesn't seem realistic given the road conditions and performance of the rest of the grid.

These are minor quibbles though, really, and the rest of the time the AI drivers are pretty good. They're fast, persistent, and just about on the clean side of aggressive. They often make for exciting and entertaining races, something which actually makes the single player campaign mode worth doing - unlike a certain other racing game I could mention.

With me, I know that the car with a certain livery/name will be really slow or will crash at turn x or on certain track, car x will move to the right off the line, attempt an overtake, get slightly squeezed, brake, they lose time and I can pass on the left even though the car that was attempting to overtaking had room to finish. Or, on another track, the AI will crash on a certain straight in the exact same place and take out 2 to 3 cars and this one does happen a lot

 

[Zonda5]

*Says AI drivers crash too much when on the racing line*
*Uses them to aid driving*

Honestly, I think the AI are only going to crash into you because you yourself are driving erratically. Go on now and try to get a clean race for yourself. Even with online players it's next to impossible because the roads are thin, there's only one racing line for most corners and the cars are high powered.
If the AI were more scared of hitting the player they'd not be competitive; they are also taking risks. These risks don't always pay off and that's what some call "bad AI".

 

[Cursed DICE]

*Says AI drivers crash too much when on the racing line*
*Uses them to aid driving*

Honestly, I think the AI are only going to crash into you because you yourself are driving erratically. Go on now and try to get a clean race for yourself. Even with online players it's next to impossible because the roads are thin, there's only one racing line for most corners and the cars are high powered.
If the AI were more scared of hitting the player they'd not be competitive; they are also taking risks. These risks don't always pay off and that's what some call "bad AI".

I only drive erratically (and I don't do it all the time), because I saw they weren't keeping it clean when I started, so I reasoned why should I bother following racing etiquette when they don't appear to, therefore there are times I just choose to use them as a braking zone. 90% of the time I don't have time for that so I just clear them as fast and as cleanly as possible because I have stars to get

 

[MeanElf]

I just did the 'Dam Buster' event and saved the replay - that's eight laps on a tight track, filthy weather and very, very fast cars - not once did I get bumped from behind...

I'll post the vid tomorrow.

 

[Cursed DICE]

I just did the 'Dam Buster' event and saved the replay - that's eight laps on a tight track, filthy weather and very, very fast cars - not once did I get bumped from behind...

I'll post the vid tomorrow.

Awesome. It is possible to achieve clean race, I've done it before. The AI seem better these days since I came back, or I've adjusted to know what they're going to do. I'm no driving god, but I do my best to keep it clean (recently came back to the game). However I've seen the AI take each other out, clip each other from behind when trying to overtake, fail to give each other enough room into corners and head off into the barriers, cause pile ups and straight up get sections wrong. The rear ending at 200mph happened months ago.

But the turbo chargers from nowhere and the turning in on me at the corner when I am already up the inside still occurs. I'm no driving god, but I do try to not touch them in most cases



That's not my footage, but stuff like this happens. Not as bad as back in the day

 

[Zonda5]

@MeanElf , you should record from an AI's perspective! I know you keep defending the AI with that argument.

 

[MeanElf]

@MeanElf , you should record from an AI's perspective! I know you keep defending the AI with that argument.

I was going to do an edit from various perspectives Though this race there was no contact that I saw or felt.

EDIT: I know what you are saying @Cursed DICE about the past - things are a lot easier now. About the vid though, the driver clearly cut across the path of the car trying to pass him, quite severely too. The rest passed him/her because he/she had lost momentum.

 

[Mike_grpA]

Its not even surprising people said this. The witch-hunt and subsequent attempted burning of Driveclub's reputation post-release is one of the most embarrassing things I've ever seen from racing game fans and gamers alike.

Driveclub is a game you'll have to play to experience. Dont believe the plethora of moaners harking on about what it isn't rather than treating it for what it is.

I've seen so many people bash DC so hard it's almost like they've been paid to do so. The problem is the same as GT fanboys bashing Forza for no reason, and vice versa. Some people just hate on a game because it's not the franchise they favour, or it's an exclusive of a console they don't own. In DC's case, I have no idea why people bash it so hard, I have played a massive variety of racing games, and I think it's one of the best ever made.

Scripted or not, the AI is not clean, they are going to ram you off the road and not leave you space when you are ahead as it should be, so thats another reason why this game is not good.

I've finished the game, and all the DLC tours too, and I have literally never experienced what you're claiming. Perhaps you're just blaming the AI for your own mistakes.

Watch this video to see how good DCs AI is

www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKNHjNDhwIo

That's a very good example of how good their avoidance is, and how quickly they react to changing conditions. The way Evo made them so good at avoidance, and yet race so hard, is really great. Maybe PD should hire the AI guy from Evo!

Registered just to say, yes they do appear scripted and no, they don't react to the player at all (unless you are completely stationary). Tested it extensively a while ago. Sit stationary on track they'll do everything to get round. Race competitively they'll ram you, always (or at least a lot), even when the entire width of the track is there for overtaking. When I go to take a corner, they hit me, when they go to overtake each other, they hit each other. If you are on racing line they will barge you off it.

As for scripting, I've restarted events several times and noticed they do exactly the same thing pretty much everytime. In one event it got to the point I knew exactly what they'd do so I could overtake almost all of them into turn one

I've never seen anything that suggests to me they are scripted, and they absolutely do react to the player. Perhaps you're expecting them to be like GT's AI and slam the brakes on and swerve away from you whenever you get within a metre of their car, I don't know. What I do know is that they will adjust their line for me, and will not barge me off the racing line at all. The only times I've had AI cars run into me is if I divebomb them and generally drive in a dirty way, adjusting my line heaps, aggressively blocking, cutting them off, etc. Drive cleanly, and show them some respect, and the most you'll get is a small amount of trading paint, and some good close racing.

Awesome. It is possible to achieve clean race, I've done it before. The AI seem better these days since I came back, or I've adjusted to know what they're going to do. I'm no driving god, but I do my best to keep it clean (recently came back to the game). However I've seen the AI take each other out, clip each other from behind when trying to overtake, fail to give each other enough room into corners and head off into the barriers, cause pile ups and straight up get sections wrong. The rear ending at 200mph happened months ago.

But the turbo chargers from nowhere and the turning in on me at the corner when I am already up the inside still occurs. I'm no driving god, but I do try to not touch them in most cases



That's not my footage, but stuff like this happens. Not as bad as back in the day

All that video shows is very amateur driving from the player. An AI car coming alongside, on the inside leading up to a chicane, and the player cuts right across them and forces an accident. The AI had nowhere to go being cut up like that, and then the player swerves around trying to block the other AI cars, which are going way faster than him. Poor driving from the player.

Edit: Off topic, but one dynamic thing that blew me away about DC is the weather. I knew the weather was dynamic and would go from sunny and clear all the way to brutal thunderstorms and snow storms and everything in between, but what I didn't notice right away was that the clouds themselves are a very dynamic and important part of the weather system. You can watch them moving over, you can see different clouds of different densities, and when rain clouds start coming over, the rain is actually coming from those clouds. I have had a long race where the rain came in from one side of the track, and for ages there was rain on half the track and none on the other half. As the clouds moved over the track, so did the heaviest rain. It started off near the end of the lap, but slowly moved across the course, and ended up covering about half of the track.

 

[Cursed DICE]

Maybe I'm remembering them more as they were when I started, because they seemed pretty alright last night. Still got hit a couple of times

 

[Mike_grpA]

Maybe I'm remembering them more as they were when I started, because they seemed pretty alright last night. Still got hit a couple of times

I only watched 3 and a half minutes of that video, and I'm not bothering to watch a full 15 minute video as I think I've seen enough.

In the first race, you rear ended the AI twice, and then once you were past, you went very deep in turn one, way off the racing line, and then turned right in on the AI who was passing you on the inside, who was, I might add, giving you tons of room before you turned in on him. You also made a mistake on another corner, and as an AI attempted to get alongside your outside, you turned to block him at the last minute and made contact.

The second race you ran clean into the side of an AI after some very scrappy driving, and this slowed you down on a fast stretch, which resulted in an AI who was right behind you rear ending you.

All of these were your fault IMO. Not gonna bother watching the rest.

If you want to experience AI worthy of complaining about, try Pcars, they are bloody mental.

 

[Cursed DICE]

I only watched 3 and a half minutes of that video, and I'm not bothering to watch a full 15 minute video as I think I've seen enough.

In the first race, you rear ended the AI twice, and then once you were past, you went very deep in turn one, way off the racing line, and then turned right in on the AI who was passing you on the inside, who was, I might add, giving you tons of room before you turned in on him. You also made a mistake on another corner, and as an AI attempted to get alongside your outside, you turned to block him at the last minute and made contact.

The second race you ran clean into the side of an AI after some very scrappy driving, and this slowed you down on a fast stretch, which resulted in an AI who was right behind you rear ending you.

All of these were your fault IMO. Not gonna bother watching the rest.

If you want to experience AI worthy of complaining about, try Pcars, they are bloody mental.

I know my racing isn't perfect, never is in any game. I was going to cut it down, but I'd already started the upload on my PS4 so I just let it finish

 

[MeanElf]

I know my racing isn't perfect, never is in any game. I was going to cut it down, but I'd already started the upload on my PS4 so I just let it finish

I'm guessing from your comments that you have returned to DC after an absence; it is a different situation from back around the launch time and if you keep at it, you will I think see more evidence of this. Give them room and pick your places to overtake and I think you'll find they are more forgiving in return.

 

[Mike_grpA]

Try racing in Pcars against AI (seriously) for a while, and then come back to DC. After learning how to just survive against Pcars' AI, your races against DC's AI will be squeaky clean I promise you! lol.

 

[MeanElf]

Okay, a slightly naughty bump from me on the second corner but overall a clean race. Shown in trackside mode to show how the AI interact.

 

[Cursed DICE]

I'm guessing from your comments that you have returned to DC after an absence; it is a different situation from back around the launch time and if you keep at it, you will I think see more evidence of this. Give them room and pick your places to overtake and I think you'll find they are more forgiving in return.

Yes, I played it back in November when I got a PS4 (Driveclub bundle), then I got other games which I played more and then went back to my gaming PC so Driveclub didn't get much playtime. Came back to it recently

 

[torque99]

I did a few tests on point to point/Circuit tracks on the AI waiting like I thought I saw on the mini map. They don't stop and wait on the point to points they actually go very slow on the map as you can see them move round but not at the pace you would expect when stationery if you move within a minute they will be catchable within a few corners if you wait longer and don't move they will slowly move on and finish the race.

With the tracks/circuits very similar if you sit for not long you will catch them, If not they will just keep lapping you and avoiding you until they finish. I think they have improved the AI slowly on each update as they seem very clever depending what level you choose.

I agree with @Mike_grpA to try PCars as they are not dynamic but mental and just hit you if you are anywhere near their race line!

Either way I really do enjoy this game more with each update and can't wait to see what the big update/Free cars brings soon for their anniversary in October..

 

[Mike_grpA]

Pcars' AI are dynamic, and there's no rubber banding or anything. They are just far too aggressive, and care very little about your presence.

They do react to you, and each other, but their massive aggression means they rarely have a problem with muscling you off the track or at least off the line they want. They react better to the player being aggressive. If I squeeze the AI wide when passing they will react and there'll be no contact, but if I respect their space and try to be careful, they will turn in on me or divebomb like I'm not even there. It's like they mistake your kindness for weakness lol.

 

[glassjaw]

I gotta say Driveclub has become one of those games I can not play for a few weeks or a month or two, go back to and get hooked all over again. I enjoyed it when it first came out, but the weather update, all the DLC, and the addition of Japan has given me reason to check it out every so often, and I love the game now more than I did at launch. It's grown into one of my favorite racers of the past several years, just because it's a simple, amazing looking arcade racer with perfectly tuned physics, a great selection of cars, and some of the best track design in recent memory. It reminds me of the kinds of racing games I grew up with, and that's just about the best thing I can say.

 

[VBR]

@CHEN255 - So now that you have DC, & I'm guessing have resterted at least a few races, do you think DC's AI are scripted or dynamic? I'm interested to hear what you think.

 

[CHEN255]

@CHEN255 - So now that you have DC, & I'm guessing have resterted at least a few races, do you think DC's AI are scripted or dynamic? I'm interested to hear what you think.

Thanks for the follow up TBH I have taken on board what several said earlier in that the races may start in a similar scripted fashion but will play out dynamically as the race progresses. I don't restart races and even though I have reraced many there has been enough other races between them that I don't remember how they played out earlier.
Here's the thing, DC is one of two that are my favourite titles, I am an unapologetic fanboy of it and I am enjoying myself too much each time I play to even want to double check things like scripting.
I committed myself to purchasing DC after a lot of investigation into it and not only bought it, but the season pass too. Everything I discovered before purchase satisfied me that the AI behaves in a dynamic enough fashion for my liking. This is a first class game and I have absolutely no regrets in buying it and is one of the few titles that I would recommend to people I know who may express an interest in it.

 

[techventage]

Tried PS Plus version, I didn't like the AI either at first but couldn't get enough of racing for 2 weeks almost everyday.

Got stuck at Ferrari challenge but then I decided to drive like a maniac just to get through the level. It was really ugly but fun too

After that I decided to buy it second hand just to drive around on every track. Its a beautiful game.

Driving the car with game pad is awesome. Sold my PS3 and so GT6 is gone. Bought Project Cars but left it because of minimum 2 hours endurance racing in career mode.

Really enjoying the game so far. And its much enjoyable when you don't crash and go smoothly on high speed. Also I enjoyed very much the hatchback cars.

 

[torque99]

Glad to see people who came in late to DC are really liking the game- It grows on you and worth getting the full game for not much now for the tour and extra tracks.

@techventage Did you pick up the season pass- that is good value if it is still on offer(even full price) for all the content they gave over the year. Worth it for the extra career tours, rare cars/ Lambos/muscle cars/Nismos alone 👍