Idiot gets tasered at John Kerry forum

[Azuremen]

Somewhat unbiased report here...
http://www.miamiherald.com/466/story/241219.html

Basically, from what I see, attention causing prankster gets up, interupts things, then complains when he can't ask all his questions. Gets prompted to leave, goes on about secret society, resists police, gets warned, and gets tasered.

Awesome clip of him getting owned here... following him saying the dean had 45 minutes or something, so he should have 2 minutes.


I think it was all just him trying to get attention, but of course the student body is protesting his arrest. And others claim he got tasered for his question; I think it was the smart thing to do.

So, taser too much? Cops restricting free speech? Or people just bashing cops cause they can? Discuss! I personally think that guy fails at life, but thats just me.

 

[Vasco]

I thought the whole point of the taser was to allow the police to subdue people they had not yet arrested but were acting violently or people who were really resisting arrest. This guy deserved to be taken out of there (obviously attention seeking), but really when you have the guy on the ground and a couple of cops already having control over him the use of the taser is pointless.

And I seem to recall reading an article somewhere (can't remember exactly where) reporting on police abuse of tasers and the that they are not as safe as claimed. This seems to makes the abuse even more dangerous.

 

[Kylehnat]

Police use tasers when they want the person to stop spewing ridiculous bullcrap from their mouth. Taser = STFU.

 

[Touring Mars]

This seems to be a case of both parties being in the wrong - you've got a chap on the one side who doesn't know when to belt up (he'd exceeded his allocated time to ask questions at the mic) and then you've got a stupidly heavy-handed 'arrest'. Sure, the guy makes a total meal of it, and if he hadn't over-reacted so ridiculously, arguably he wouldn't have been treated the way that he was. But that's no excuse for the police to have used a taser in this instance. D t V is dead right, the guy deserved to be removed, but there's no way the taser should have been used - surely a piece of gaffer tape over the gob would have sufficed? I'm not saying that that would be 'fair' either, but surely if you want to shut someone up, you don't zap them with a megavolt of electricity!

Hopefully this will serve as a lesson to those who disrespect everyone else in the room by not knowing when to shut the hell up, and hopefully the cops will get censured for using a weapon that is intended as a last-ditch alternative to lethal force on a someone who really wasn't posing any physical threat to anyone (except himself!)...

 

[Omnis]

Getting arrested for free speech now? This is disgusting. Kerry was ready to answer his questions and everything. It's one thing for the police to escort him out if he's not going to leave, but to put him under arrest, dogpile him, and then taser him is RIDICULOUS. The woman cop even pulled a [taser] gun on him while he was still at the microphone.

I hope he sues the **** out of campus police. Campus police departments are always the worst.

 

[FoolKiller]

They were discussing this on the radio last night and apparently this guy has a history of doing crazy stuff and having a friend video tape him so he can put it up on YouTube. I think this is just more of that. You can even see him keep looking over at the camera, as if he is making sure it is all being caught.

That said, he seemed somewhat subdued when he got tasered, but too many people were in the way to tell for sure. From this I would say it was uncalled for, but I can't be 100% sure. He was still putting up a struggle/show and refusing to let them cuff him. Part of me wants to say he deserved it because he obviously had warning that he would be tasered as he managed to say, "Don't taser me, bro," multiple times before it happened. That tells me he was either given warning or the officer that did it took his sweet time getting to it, allowing the kid to see it and know it was coming. If he didn't want to be tasered perhaps he should have quit trying to resist.

Anyone else notice that you could hear the kid loud and clear but John Kerry over the microphone was hard to make out and the cops yelling at him were barely audible? I wonder if he mic'd himself up beforehand.

EDIT:

Getting arrested for free speech now? This is disgusting. Kerry was ready to answer his questions and everything.

I thought I could make out Kerry say, "Because that question was inappropriate," but I am at work and can't turn it up to be sure.

It's one thing for the police to escort him out if he's not going to leave, but to put him under arrest, dogpile him, and then taser him is RIDICULOUS. The woman cop even pulled a [taser] gun on him while he was still at the microphone.

I think the arrest was for refusing to leave and resisting the escort. While I am unsure of the taser, the arrest became wholly deserved when he started trying to get away from security.

I hope he sues the **** out of campus police. Campus police departments are always the worst.

From what I understand the lawsuit has already been filed and the officers in question are under review.

 

[Kent]

Well, we all know this same sort of trouble goes on all the time with events hosted by conservatives (and yet we rarely, if ever, see this sort of result).

Further...

Just replace "Kerry" with "Bush" and I'm sure the opinions of many would instantly change.

It's just sad to me when I see this sort of thing go uncensured. 👎
Everyone should consider this unacceptable and everyone should consider this a violation of the most basic rights we have as Americans.

Bottom line:
Partisan politics will rule the opinions of this event and if the political parties involved were reversed this would end up being incredibly important.
However, as is, this is going to be overlooked by the mass media and by some crazy means, justified by liberals everywhere.

I just hope there are atleast a few libs with the guts and ethical conviction to condemn this tasering (as I know they would if it had been Bush getting those questions and a liberal on the hot end of the taser).

 

[Swift]

He resisted being escorted out. That alone is grounds for arrest. As far as the tazer thing goes, it's easy to play armchair coach on this one.

The guy got to say his thing and that should've been it. As much as I think Kerry is a useless senator, he IS a US senator. So you really can't take change with stupid people. If it was the president I can guarantee they would've done worse, sooner.

It was not a violation of his 1st amendment rights. He got to say something, then HE caused a disturbance. You can't cause a disturbance at a function for a member of the US congress and expect that it will be "cool".

 

[Kent]

He resisted being escorted out. That alone is grounds for arrest. As far as the tazer thing goes, it's easy to play armchair coach on this one.

The guy got to say his thing and that should've been it. As much as I think Kerry is a useless senator, he IS a US senator. So you really can't take change with stupid people. If it was the president I can guarantee they would've done worse, sooner.

It was not a violation of his 1st amendment rights. He got to say something, then HE caused a disturbance. You can't cause a disturbance at a function for a member of the US congress and expect that it will be "cool".

I'd agree with you but I've seen too many war protestors get carried out of the building by police without tasers.
All they had to do was muscle up on the kid and carry him out (like so many liberals have experienced in the halls of Senate and Congress throughout the first few years of protesting the war in Iraq).

Further...
Four cops had him pinned to the ground and were in the process of cuffing him when they tased him... I mean come on man! This was incompetetant (sp?) police work and totally uncalled for... They had the kid subdued long before the taser was used!!!

The more I watch the video the more it becomes apparent that there was no excuse for this action.
The police should have picked him up by the arms and carried him out like every war protestor we've seen in the last 6 years. To even try justifying this is rediculus in my opinion.

 

[Swift]

I'd agree with you but I've seen too many war protestors get carried out of the building by police without tasers.
All they had to do was muscle up on the kid and carry him out (like so many liberals have experienced in the halls of Senate and Congress throughout the first few years of protesting the war in Iraq).

Further...
Four cops had him pinned to the ground and were in the process of cuffing him when they tased him... I mean come on man! This was incompetetant (sp?) police work and totally uncalled for... They had the kid subdued long before the taser was used!!!

The more I watch the video the more it becomes apparent that there was no excuse for this action.
The police should have picked him up by the arms and carried him out like every war protestor we've seen in the last 6 years. To even try justifying this is rediculus in my opinion.

You realize he was a big liberal, right?

 

[Kent]

You realize he was a big liberal, right?

It's not like I'm going to go back on everything I've said (and believe) simply because the victim was a lib.
For that matter, I don't see how the victim being a lib. or con. has any bearing on the events that took place.

Whether this kid was a republican or democrate doesn't change my opinion that the tasering was unacceptable.

I point back to my last post to re-emphasize my opinion. 👍

 

[Danoff]

The bill of rights does not guarantee you a podium from which to spout your message. It says you're free to speak, it doesn't say you won't be arrested for creating a nuisance of yourself and running someone's event. "Disturbing the peace" comes to mind. "Resisting Arrest" comes to mind. "Trespassing" comes to mind once he's been asked by campus authorities to leave and refuses to.

When you're told multiple times "roll over on your stomach or I will use the tazer" you roll over.

Reminds me a great deal of this video:



Not included in that clip is the part where he puts her in the car and she keeps whining and eventually he says "Stop whining, it doesn't hurt that bad. I've done it myself."

 

[Kent]

I suppose we disagree, it's that simple.
I believe the Police were in the wrong to taser him (being that four police were already holding him down) and some of you believe it was perfectly acceptable.

However, I would (if this was another thread at another time) argue that this individual's rights to peaceful assembly and freedom of speech were violated when he was treated in the manner that we have seen on this video.

Putting that aside, I still believe that the police were in the wrong.

 

[Danoff]

However, I would (if this was another thread at another time) argue that this individual's rights to peaceful assembly and freedom of speech were violated when he was treated in the manner that we have seen on this video.

What's peaceful about barging into someone else's peaceful assembly and trying to take over the podium? Is it cool if he walks up on stage, shoves Kerry out of the way and uses his mic? That's effectively what he did.

When you go to something like this, you're invited as long as you play by the civilized rules of the session. As soon as you violate those rules, you're not longer invited. You don't have a right to join any assembly you're not invited to.

This case isn't even close. It's not a grey area. He was asked to leave by the hosting party and refused - at that point they're free to call police in and move him out. I suppose if you walked across the street to your neighbor's house and sat in their living room and refused to leave, that if they called the cops you'd think they violated your right to peaceful assembly? And once the cops are authorized to arrest you (which they were in this case) and you resist that arrest, they're authorized to use non-deadly force to get you to comply. Again, it's not even close.

I think we should feel free to have this debate in this thread, it's at the very center of discussing this particular video.

 

[wfooshee]

We don't see anything that happened more than a few seconds prior to the police moving in on him. How long had he been a jerk, how long had he been spouting conspiracy theory secret society nonsense, rather than asking legitimate questions about legitimate issues? The video obviously was presented only to show the police action, not the cause.

I agree with the earlier post about sound pickup. He was wearing a wireless mike, and although the camera mike picks up room sound, including the PA system, almost nothing else even approaches the sound level of this "victim's" own whining.

IMO, he wasn't asking questions, he was trying to debate, and the material he was trying to debate was paranoid conspiracy theory crap. The fact that there was applause at the start of the arrest indicates what a nuisance he was to the proceedings.

 

[Kent]

Even if all of the above is true, I believe using a taser was going too far (especially considering the number of police and the location of the incident... Many people have made similar actions without police/security using tasers to subdue the individual who's at the bottom of the dog-pile).

 

[DustDriver]

In my opinion the teaser is used way to much.
What if you have a pacemaker or something else that's prone to be damage by a high electric current?
It's strange that nobody has made teaser-resistant clothing.
(complete rubber outfit anyone? )

 

[Swift]

I just hope there are atleast a few libs with the guts and ethical conviction to condemn this tasering (as I know they would if it had been Bush getting those questions and a liberal on the hot end of the taser).

This statement lead me to believe you thought the protector was a conservative. My bad, but do you see how I could get that?

It's not like I'm going to go back on everything I've said (and believe) simply because the victim was a lib.
For that matter, I don't see how the victim being a lib. or con. has any bearing on the events that took place.

It doesn't, that's why I brought it up because I thought you may be insinuating it did in a prior post. Again, my misunderstanding.

Whether this kid was a republican or democrate doesn't change my opinion that the tasering was unacceptable.

I point back to my last post to re-emphasize my opinion. 👍

I think it's perfectly acceptable. At the point when he tried to burst through the police to get back towards Kerry, I can understand how the police thought he could be a significant threat. That's a very aggressive action for someone that is already being escorted by police.

However, I would (if this was another thread at another time) argue that this individual's rights to peaceful assembly and freedom of speech were violated when he was treated in the manner that we have seen on this video.

Putting that aside, I still believe that the police were in the wrong.

Did he look peaceful at all to you at the time when the cops came out?

As Danoff said, let's have that debate. I don't think his rights were violated because he was resisting arrest. Now, if they would've just walked up to him and Tazed him then yeah. But they tried to be "nice" and that didn't work.

 

[Kent]

I did originally assume he was a con. so you did no wrong. However... I don't see how the victim being a lib. or con. has any bearing on the events that took place.

In the end we just disagree. I feel the tassing was unnecessary and some of you disagree. 👍

btw, putting aside all the issues of rights... I've seen people do similar actions and tassers were never needed, I don't see why it was absolutely necessary in this case compared to any of the other events along these lines over the past 6 or 7 years.

 

[FoolKiller]

btw, putting aside all the issues of rights... I've seen people do similar actions and tassers were never needed, I don't see why it was absolutely necessary in this case compared to any of the other events along these lines over the past 6 or 7 years.

I agree the taser may have been a bt much after he was subdued, so either the cops are inept and that is the only way they are able to subdue him or he really did put up a heck of a fight. It is hard to tell.

As for everything else, he needed to be asked to leave. He was obviously being inappropriate.

I found the full video with his questions. Warning: Reference to Bill Clinton's extracurricular activities.

 

[Swift]

I did originally assume he was a con. so you did no wrong. However... I don't see how the victim being a lib. or con. has any bearing on the events that took place.

In the end we just disagree. I feel the tassing was unnecessary and some of you disagree. 👍

btw, putting aside all the issues of rights... I've seen people do similar actions and tassers were never needed, I don't see why it was absolutely necessary in this case compared to any of the other events along these lines over the past 6 or 7 years.

OK!

But, how can we judge whether it was "absolutely" necessary? We weren't there. We watching an amateur video. I think if the officers felt they or senator Kerry were in danger then they did the right thing.

Sorry, I side with law enforcement until proven guilty. Not the other way around, like the media tends to do.

 

[Danoff]

OK!

But, how can we judge whether it was "absolutely" necessary? We weren't there. We watching an amateur video. I think if the officers felt they or senator Kerry were in danger then they did the right thing.

Sorry, I side with law enforcement until proven guilty. Not the other way around, like the media tends to do.

Even if they're not in danger, as in the case of the girl in the car resisting arrest - they're authorized to use non-lethal force to make the arrest.

 

[///M-Spec]

I'm no existentialist, but this all this attention whoring reminds me of a Kierkegaard quote: "People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use."


M

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

From my observations, they tasered him on account of acting like a douche.

 

[Azuremen]

Quick info on what happened before that clip starts. He charged in basically, then told John Kerry he should have contested the election, ranted about a book, and proceded to ask his ridiculous question.

I do not know how many of you have tried to subdue a somewhat crazed (or at least acting crazed) person, but it is hard to do with out some serious damage generally. The taser pretty much put an end to that without gagging him or breaking bones, etc. I fully agree with the taser, given the nature of the scenario. He had SEVERAL warnings beforehand.

And Omnis, I am sad to see you jump on the "Ask a question get tasered" bandwagon =/

I'll post more once I return from an exam.

 

[FoolKiller]

From my observations, they tasered him on account of acting like a douche.

If that is the charge it was fully acceptable.

Quick info on what happened before that clip starts. He charged in basically, then told John Kerry he should have contested the election, ranted about a book, and proceded to ask his ridiculous question.

The clip I posted shows the whole thing and he was obviously being inappropriate and needed to be removed.

 

[Omnis]

And Omnis, I am sad to see you jump on the "Ask a question get tasered" bandwagon =/

Gotta stand up for the dissenters, even if they are a bit loony. They could've just dragged him away. The dog-piling and tasering was unnecessary.

 

[Azuremen]

Gotta stand up for the dissenters, even if they are a bit loony. They could've just dragged him away. The dog-piling and tasering was unnecessary.

Have you ever tried to drag off a crazed person? Its really a lot harder than it looks, and thats what they tried to do at first anyhow.

And about the freedom of speech bit... Danoff is completely correct on it. It is the right to speak your mind, not to have a podium and mic whenever you want, wherever you want.

What happened here would be like a guy walking into a club, walking on stage and taking the mic. Then ranting like a crazed person and when asked to leave, refuses and then gets into a fight with the bouncer. Now just change club to forum, stage to podium, and bouncer to cop and you have this situation. It wasn't a full blown public event, and the organizers have all the rights in the world to tell the guy to leave.

The police acted by the book and gave him plenty of warning; which is a whole lot better than the old days where they would have smacked him with a billy stick. Then dragged him outside while he was out cold. The taser just hurts like a mother and causes one to spasm. The number of officers is good, as it reduces the likely hood of serious injury to BOTH parties.

I agree with the actions of the officiers. Yes, campus cops can be jerks, but they generally are just doing everything best they can by the book. And its not like they knew if he was gonna try anything else. I've had to restrain people, and some times they bite, etc.

 

[Sureboss]

In my opinion the teaser is used way to much.
What if you have a pacemaker or something else that's prone to be damage by a high electric current?
It's strange that nobody has made teaser-resistant clothing.
(complete rubber outfit anyone? )

Teaser?

Greatest spelling mistake ever

The use of a taser does seem very extreme in this case, if 4 people can't hold one person down/get them out of a room then they don't know what to do? They never heard of body pressure points? (I don't mean the crotch).

 

[Wolfe]

When you're told multiple times "roll over on your stomach or I will use the tazer" you roll over.

</thread>

I'm laughing my ass off at this attention-hungry idiot. This clip made my day.