Industry Buzz about Sony (not good) + Where do we go for the next great driving sim?
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dylansan
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- MINICOOPER120
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* The topic does say "Industry Buzz about Sony".. and this response is to posts made by the OP so this is on topic.. but maybe this thread doesn't belong in this forum.
Here are some of the nails on HD DVD's coffin:
Unlike HD DVD, Blu-ray has exclusive support from Sony, 20th Century Fox, Disney, and Lion's Gate who control the distribution of the films from the following studios:
At CES, the heads of Sony, Fox, Disney, and Lions Gate home entertainment divisions annouced over 150 exclusive titles for Blu-ray... this compared to only about 15 HD DVD titles that are scheduled from Universal.
As for the relevence of the porn industry, just look at their DVD sales. Porn distribution is not anything like it was during the Beta vs VHS days, and more importantly, how many porn films have ever even been shot in HD? VERY FEW! As evidence of that, just look at the list of current porn films on either HD DVD or Blu-ray, and the list of planned titles. You can use one hand BTW.... no... not for that.. for counting the number of titles.
Besides, anyone who actually researches the history of the Beta VS VHS war will know that the porn industry played a very small role in that format war... and will certainly have no impact on this one no matter how much the HD DVD Promotional Group tries to spin sound bites.
If anything HD DVD is playing the role of Beta due to its tremendous lack of manufactuering support, very limited studio support, and lower capacity. However, while Beta at least performed better, HD DVD has no performance advanatge and even lacks the higher data rate that Blu-ray is capable of.
The only two advanatges that HD DVD had was that it came out first, and that it was less expensive. Despite its early arrival, sales of Blu-ray players have already out paced and out numbered HD DVDs.
If any format is on life support its HD DVD. (and unless HD DVD can turn this ship around and somehow convince Blu-ray supporters to switch sides, try not to be shocked if by this time next year the plug is pulled unless HD DVD )
First of all, it's HD DVD that has the nails coming down on its coffin due to almost no manufactuerer support for making HD DVD players compared to Blu-ray which not only has the exclusive support from the largest consumer electronic companies, but already has several different Blu-ray players from different manufactueres. HD DVD is even losing exclusive support from studios.
Here are some of the nails on HD DVD's coffin:
- Paramount was the first to end their exclusive support for HD DVD
- Warner (who also controls HBO & New Line) soon followed Paramount's lead.
- RCA annonuced they will no longer sell HD DVD players which were nothing more than rebadged Toshiba players.
- Prior to CES the HD DVD Promotional Group where spreading rumors about the upcoming defection of at least one studio that was exclusive to Blu-ray... instead, at CES all the Blu-ray studios were there in force making it clear they have absolutely no plans or intentions of supporting HD DVD.
- Universal, the only major studio exclusively supporting HD DVD was a no show at CES (where at least Warner & Paramount were there with some announcments on HD DVD & Blu-ray titles), their support for HD DVD is certainly looking dubious at best.
Unlike HD DVD, Blu-ray has exclusive support from Sony, 20th Century Fox, Disney, and Lion's Gate who control the distribution of the films from the following studios:
- Sony Pictures
- Columbia Pictures
- TriStar Pictures
- 20th Century Fox
- MGM
- United Artists
- Orion Pictures
- Buena Vista Motion Pictures
- Walt Disney Pictures
- Touchstone Pictures
- Hollywood Pictures
- Miramax Films
- Pixar
- Lion's Gate Films
- Artisan Entertainment
- Republic Pictures
- and others
At CES, the heads of Sony, Fox, Disney, and Lions Gate home entertainment divisions annouced over 150 exclusive titles for Blu-ray... this compared to only about 15 HD DVD titles that are scheduled from Universal.
As for the relevence of the porn industry, just look at their DVD sales. Porn distribution is not anything like it was during the Beta vs VHS days, and more importantly, how many porn films have ever even been shot in HD? VERY FEW! As evidence of that, just look at the list of current porn films on either HD DVD or Blu-ray, and the list of planned titles. You can use one hand BTW.... no... not for that.. for counting the number of titles.
Besides, anyone who actually researches the history of the Beta VS VHS war will know that the porn industry played a very small role in that format war... and will certainly have no impact on this one no matter how much the HD DVD Promotional Group tries to spin sound bites.
If anything HD DVD is playing the role of Beta due to its tremendous lack of manufactuering support, very limited studio support, and lower capacity. However, while Beta at least performed better, HD DVD has no performance advanatge and even lacks the higher data rate that Blu-ray is capable of.
The only two advanatges that HD DVD had was that it came out first, and that it was less expensive. Despite its early arrival, sales of Blu-ray players have already out paced and out numbered HD DVDs.
If any format is on life support its HD DVD. (and unless HD DVD can turn this ship around and somehow convince Blu-ray supporters to switch sides, try not to be shocked if by this time next year the plug is pulled unless HD DVD )
- 30,026
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- JDA1982
Porn isn't what it used to be with regards to hard copies thanks to high speed internet. Why do you need to go into a shop and hand the shop assistand a dvd that exposes your unusual fetishes when you can download it anonymously. People are far more comfotable with that and it's also cheaper. So the porn industry imo will not sway which format wins. It will benefit which ever format it uses, but it will be the deciding factor imo.
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- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
Gee whiz. This argument is 11 years old, believe it or not.
It happened with the Playstation.
It happened with the Playstation 2.
Shazam, it's happening with the PS3. Initial sales boom, then sales slack off in the months following Christmas. Developers quietly moan their fears that the system may die in the face of cheaper challengers. Games are slow in coming, or at least it seems that way. The porn angle is just hilarious, the straws naysayers will grab onto!
Some of you guys can't remember history. In fact, history seems to be repeating itself with the 360. It's following the sales track of the XBox almost exactly. And developers seem to be having trouble harnessing that "limitless power" of Xenon and Xenos. Forza 2 will only have eight car races once again. In fact, the 360 games seem to have seen a slew of eight player games lately.
I'm not worried about any console, least of all the Playstation 3.
It happened with the Playstation.
It happened with the Playstation 2.
Shazam, it's happening with the PS3. Initial sales boom, then sales slack off in the months following Christmas. Developers quietly moan their fears that the system may die in the face of cheaper challengers. Games are slow in coming, or at least it seems that way. The porn angle is just hilarious, the straws naysayers will grab onto!
Some of you guys can't remember history. In fact, history seems to be repeating itself with the 360. It's following the sales track of the XBox almost exactly. And developers seem to be having trouble harnessing that "limitless power" of Xenon and Xenos. Forza 2 will only have eight car races once again. In fact, the 360 games seem to have seen a slew of eight player games lately.
I'm not worried about any console, least of all the Playstation 3.
- 6,009
- Austin, Texas
- D-Nitrate / GTP_DNitrate
Excellent points TD.
Another point that can be made regarding the future sucess of the PS3 is that for some time now, game developers have been pushing the envelope of the limited capacity of DVD (max 7GB game data on DVD9) for some titles and due to the non linearity of modern games, using multiple discs would likely be problematic.
Developers for the PS3 are already developing games to take advantage of its greater capacity. Resistence is apparently 16GB, and MGS4 may exceed 25GB. I certainly would not be surprised if GT5 could end up needing a 50GB BD-ROM. If developers ever wanted to create games the same size as these on the XB360, it would take as much as 7 DVD9-ROMs.
The fact that Microsoft has not adressed this issue with its decision not to design and build the XB360 to support games on HD DVD is not only another nail on HD DVD's coffin, but this could seriously end up hurting XB360 with developers demanding more capacity.
Another point that can be made regarding the future sucess of the PS3 is that for some time now, game developers have been pushing the envelope of the limited capacity of DVD (max 7GB game data on DVD9) for some titles and due to the non linearity of modern games, using multiple discs would likely be problematic.
Developers for the PS3 are already developing games to take advantage of its greater capacity. Resistence is apparently 16GB, and MGS4 may exceed 25GB. I certainly would not be surprised if GT5 could end up needing a 50GB BD-ROM. If developers ever wanted to create games the same size as these on the XB360, it would take as much as 7 DVD9-ROMs.
The fact that Microsoft has not adressed this issue with its decision not to design and build the XB360 to support games on HD DVD is not only another nail on HD DVD's coffin, but this could seriously end up hurting XB360 with developers demanding more capacity.
- 7,830
- U S A
- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
Much obliged.
In the case of the 360, some of that space issue can be alleviated by making games installable. I'd think that if Forza 3 needed two DVDs, that would be a pain if in the course of the game, you needed to swap discs. Installing some of that content on the HD would be a solution. Of course that would eat up disc space rather quickly if you had just five or so games, each needing a bit of HD space to do an install of universal content. Of course that assumes you have a 360 with a hard drive.
Thank heaven it's optional with the PS3. Blu-ray is a blessing indeed.
In the case of the 360, some of that space issue can be alleviated by making games installable. I'd think that if Forza 3 needed two DVDs, that would be a pain if in the course of the game, you needed to swap discs. Installing some of that content on the HD would be a solution. Of course that would eat up disc space rather quickly if you had just five or so games, each needing a bit of HD space to do an install of universal content. Of course that assumes you have a 360 with a hard drive.
Thank heaven it's optional with the PS3. Blu-ray is a blessing indeed.
V1P3R
(Banned)
- 6,310
Umm... yeah. The xBox had just came out and I laughed at it while hugging my PS2 along with GT3 so don't give me that ****. I still laugh at the xbox although it's amazing how much better the 360 is.
- 1,029
- Uruguay
Hey, let's not turn this completely into a discussion of the PS3! I really meant that part of the post as a introduction as to why I'm worried about the future of the PS3 (and thus of GT5), and to suggest that we put some effort into figuring out where to go if the PS3 really does fail (as seems possible, IMHO! I hope it doesn't happen, but it might.) Or, alternately, even if the PS3 does take off by the time GT5 is released, where are we to go if the FF isn't fixed?
I looks into several of the suggestions posted here, but so far what I've actually done is come to the conclusion that GT4 / GT5 are completely unique in the racing sim world, with Forza trying to start competing with the release of Forza II. I haven't yet found anything else with real cars, real tracks, and real physics...
I'm kind of hoping Live for Speed will become so popular they will start licensing real cars...
I looks into several of the suggestions posted here, but so far what I've actually done is come to the conclusion that GT4 / GT5 are completely unique in the racing sim world, with Forza trying to start competing with the release of Forza II. I haven't yet found anything else with real cars, real tracks, and real physics...
I'm kind of hoping Live for Speed will become so popular they will start licensing real cars...
- 1,029
- Uruguay
Well, the good news I've been seeing recently is that blu-ray is actually outselling HD-DVD about 2 to 1. That's generally great news for the the PS3. It is interesting, because those persons I know who are working in the technology industry have stayed away from blu-ray (even more so since the big "adult content" issue hit the fan), but it is obviously selling well overall.
Now let us hope they get the FF fixed!
Now let us hope they get the FF fixed!
- 6,009
- Austin, Texas
- D-Nitrate / GTP_DNitrate
2 to 1 is a very conservative estimate, but yes, support for HD DVD continues to diminish both from the electronic industry and from consumers. Despite the normal slow sales period following Christmas, and despite having very few games designed specifically for the PS3, Sony has sold close to 2 million PS3’s, and that’s just Japanese and North American sales. Once it is available world wide, and more brand name games designed for the PS3 are released, expect these numbers to rise significantly over time.
As for Sony and any so-called negative buzz... clearly the market disagrees. Over the last two months, Sony's stock has risen now by more than 30%, increasing their market capital by $13 billion dollars.
I think it is time for you to change your thread title, as your unnamed "technology sources" have been, and continue to be inaccurate in regards to "industry buzz not being good about Sony"... I suspect the only industry sources that continue to spread this misinformation are affiliated with a company that backs HD DVD.
BTW: There was no "big adult content issue" to begin with. The only issue is the one fabricated by either misinformed, or misleading media types... and this was brought to your attention already.
In brief summation though:
a) The porn industry had very little impact on the VHS vs Beta war and anyone that actually researches the history of that format war would know that. This is an urban myth that the porn industry has enjoyed spreading over the years.
b) Adult content can be released on Blu-ray, only Sony's pressing plants prohibit certain forms of hardcore adult content.
c) Some porn titles have already been announced for Blu-ray.
d) All of this is irrelevant as the porn industry will have no impact on this format war as there is very little porn that is even shot in HD, and even standard def porn isn't selling much via DVD anymore thanks to the success of the internet and video downloading.
- 2,077
- Toronto, Ontario, Canada
- MastrGT
Even today at least one stock market analyst got on the SONY bandwagon and is predicting a turnaround for the company. The analyst is late, though, since the stock has been on the rise since before Dec 1/06. 
With the PS3 likely to gain momentum for quite a while (and with all that entails with associated products), and with the company's desire and plan to raise profitability, the company will get back in shape.
The only "real" problem that gamers have with the console (besides its cost), especially GT5, is what will happen with force feedback. It is no small matter, for a lot of players, but it is solvable. First, the court case is in appeal. There are 3 ways the decision can go, but it is unlikely SONY can win. SONY has the court awards placed in escrow, so it's not as if there isn't money to pay to Immersion. Once the appeal is decided, SONY will either be free to do what they were doing, have to go back to court again, or they have to pay up. Even if they lose, SONY will go to Immersion, cap in hand, and get licenced. They can't afford to completely be left out in the haptic cold.
So, before you write off the new console, if you have any concerns, wait til after the appeal is known. Then you can worry, if you need be, but I doubt I am going to lose sleep over the PS3. If you like GT, then I am pretty sure we will all be able to carry on with the series, as we always have. The only thing I am waiting on is the FFb decision. If SONY says the PS3 will never, ever have it, then all bets are off.
Cheers,
MasterGT
With the PS3 likely to gain momentum for quite a while (and with all that entails with associated products), and with the company's desire and plan to raise profitability, the company will get back in shape.
The only "real" problem that gamers have with the console (besides its cost), especially GT5, is what will happen with force feedback. It is no small matter, for a lot of players, but it is solvable. First, the court case is in appeal. There are 3 ways the decision can go, but it is unlikely SONY can win. SONY has the court awards placed in escrow, so it's not as if there isn't money to pay to Immersion. Once the appeal is decided, SONY will either be free to do what they were doing, have to go back to court again, or they have to pay up. Even if they lose, SONY will go to Immersion, cap in hand, and get licenced. They can't afford to completely be left out in the haptic cold.
So, before you write off the new console, if you have any concerns, wait til after the appeal is known. Then you can worry, if you need be, but I doubt I am going to lose sleep over the PS3. If you like GT, then I am pretty sure we will all be able to carry on with the series, as we always have. The only thing I am waiting on is the FFb decision. If SONY says the PS3 will never, ever have it, then all bets are off.
Cheers,
MasterGT
The "buzz" is nothing more than people flapping their gums about gloom and doom because it excites them. I don't know what it is, but some people just have it in for Sony worse than Microsoft. Is anyone from Sony putting a gun to the heads of people?
Back on topic, PSone was the home to where I got my start in racing games, and GT had me hooked. The following this series alone has is enough to drive the Playstation. Just look at the number of members here (and I'm very new), it's bigger than any other forum I browse.
Sure Sony is, well, "bold", but that's how it got to where it's at today. You watch, the titles will trickle into the PS3 library, the frenzy over the overrated Wii will wane, and you'll see the Playstation in it's classic state: a good gaming platform. I already understand it to be the best value, sporting a Blu-Ray player for less money than dedicated units.
When you put it into perspective, hardcore PC gamers drop PS3-level dollar amounts on a new video card or CPU. Does $600 for a multiple-format media player and a gaming system still sound steep? $400 for an Xbox and $600 for a PS3 isn't a huge gap, it's the difference in getting a good investment.
Back on topic, PSone was the home to where I got my start in racing games, and GT had me hooked. The following this series alone has is enough to drive the Playstation. Just look at the number of members here (and I'm very new), it's bigger than any other forum I browse.
Sure Sony is, well, "bold", but that's how it got to where it's at today. You watch, the titles will trickle into the PS3 library, the frenzy over the overrated Wii will wane, and you'll see the Playstation in it's classic state: a good gaming platform. I already understand it to be the best value, sporting a Blu-Ray player for less money than dedicated units.
When you put it into perspective, hardcore PC gamers drop PS3-level dollar amounts on a new video card or CPU. Does $600 for a multiple-format media player and a gaming system still sound steep? $400 for an Xbox and $600 for a PS3 isn't a huge gap, it's the difference in getting a good investment.
While I have'ny got teh PS3 yet I will for GT5 for sure, so all of its issues should be resolved, like no voice chat in most online games, silly things like that. But I think my PS3 will be a better investment than my 360, especially if Blu-Ray takes the mrket. I'm sure M$ will come out with another system again before Sony, so I will probably get more out of it.
- 5,603
- England, Warwickshire
- GTP_Sigma
This ffb issue is really **** me off now. I have bought a logitech G25 just for the release of the PS3 and GTHD and now I hear it isn't happening. If this is the case I to will be looking for a new driving sim. To be honest I can't be bothered getting a 360 so that rules forza out in fact if nothing decent comes out I dont think I am going to get a PS3 at all, it cost to much to just buy and hope something good will turn up. I think i might just go and take up racing for real because without ffb the driving experience is just boring.
- 583
- compressorsurge
develop your own game and controller system that will use force feedback. Let us know how it goes.
- 20,145
- Australia
- VIPERGTS01
I find it suprising that so many went and bought a G25 for GT5 already considering PD or Sony never said they will support the G25. My guess is by the time GT5 is near release Logitech will produce another Gran Turismo special wheel (Assuming FFB problems are overcome) that will probably be based on the G25 (I will buy one if thats the case).
Although those with G25's I wouldn't give up hope yet for GT5 support.
Although those with G25's I wouldn't give up hope yet for GT5 support.
- 7,830
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- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
Like Sony isn't going to support its most profitable franchise at all cost. I think everyone needs to take a chill on this. If nothing else, remember that the settlement fee Immersion is demanding is already in an account drawing interest, and if Immersion looses (PLEASE God), that money goes back into Sony's budget and they get to use Logitech's force feedback license. If Immersion wins, Sony simply releases the funds and they get their force feedback anyway.
