Is this treason ?

[ledhed]

The people who keep exposing our anti terrorist progrms to the press .
the " leakers" those who have leaked " top secret" documents ...

should they be Shot or just jailed ?

June 23, 2006
JS-4334

Statement of Under Secretary Stuart Levey on
the
Terrorist Finance Tracking Program

My job, as Under Secretary for the Office of Terrorism and Financial Intelligence, is to track the movement of money of terrorists and other national security threats, and do everything I can to disrupt those money flows. I take this job extremely seriously, as do the hundreds of dedicated people at Treasury and our partner agencies who focus on combating terrorist financing and protecting innocent people around the world from vicious and senseless attack.

"Following the money" is one of the most valuable methods we have to identify and find terrorists. If a terrorist operative that you're watching sends or receives money from another person, you know that there's a link between the two. Money trails don't lie. And, to wire money through a bank, a person needs to provide a name, address, and account number – exactly the kind of concrete leads that that can move an investigation forward and allow us to take action.

As a part of our efforts to track the funds of terrorists, we are confirming that we have subpoenaed records on terrorist-related transactions from SWIFT.

SWIFT is the premier messaging service used by banks around the world to issue international transfers, which makes its data exceptionally valuable. I would note that SWIFT is predominantly used for overseas transfers. It does not contain information on ordinary transactions that would be made by individuals in the United States, such as deposits, withdrawals, checks, or electronic bill payments.

The legal basis for this subpoena is routine and absolutely clear. The International Emergency Economic Powers Act, a statute passed in 1977, allows us to issue administrative subpoenas for financial records. We issue such subpoenas regularly, and our authority to do so has never been called into doubt. The SWIFT subpoena is powerful but narrow, as it allows us to access only that information that is related to terrorism investigations. We are not permitted to browse through the data, nor can we search it for any non-terrorism investigation. In practice, this means that we have accessed only a minute fraction of SWIFT's data.

Multiple layers of strict controls have been put in place to make sure that the information is not misused. Before they can run a search against this data, analysts must first explain how the target of the search is connected to a terrorism investigation. If the link cannot be established, the data cannot be searched. Pursuant to an agreement we reached with the company, SWIFT's auditors are able to monitor those searches in real time and stop any one of them if they have any concerns about the link to terrorism. In addition, a record is kept of every search that is done. These records are all reviewed either by an outside independent auditor, the company's auditors, or both.

The SWIFT data has proven to be one of the most valuable sources of information that we have on terrorist financing. It has enabled us and our colleagues to identify terrorist suspects we didn't know, and to find addresses for those that we did. It has provided key links in our investigations of al Qaida and other deadly terrorist groups.

We have briefed appropriate members of Congress and their staffs on this program. We briefed the central bank governors of all the G-10 countries. We briefed key members of the 9/11 Commission. The reaction from experts -- across the political spectrum -- has been that this is exactly the kind of creative and vigorous approach that is needed to combat the elusive terrorist threat that we face. Indeed, our use of the SWIFT data was one of the principal reasons that the otherwise critical 9/11 Commission Public Discourse Project awarded its only "A-" to our counter-terrorist financing efforts.

Until today, we have not discussed this program in public for an obvious reason: the value of the program came from the fact that terrorists didn't know it existed. They may have heard us talking about "following the money," but they didn't know that we were obtaining terrorist-related data from SWIFT. Many may not have even known what SWIFT was.

With today's revelations, this is unfortunately no longer true. This is a grave loss.

The terrorists we are pursuing are deadly serious and take every precaution to keep their plans and methods to themselves. We cannot expect to continue disrupting their activities if our most valuable programs are exposed on the front page of our newspapers.

I can assure you, however, that we, along with our colleagues in the U.S. Government and abroad, will continue to pursue terrorists aggressively and responsibly, to map their networks and disrupt their lines of support. I believe that this is exactly what the American people expect of us.

Thank you.

This was the latest compromised program .

 

[Swift]

Wilful treason deserves death. Unless you can prove you were blackmailed. In that case, prison.

 

[FoolKiller]

Wilful treason deserves death. Unless you can prove you were blackmailed. In that case, prison.

You appear in that article an awful lot there, Swift. Careful what you wish for.

I think the death penalty is a bit severe unless it directly results in the death of Americans, such as giving away troop positions, selling information, etc.

In the case of these recent events I definitely think jail time is in order. These are cases where the leakers believe they are benefiting the country or at a minimum their own pocketbooks, but are not intending to put others in danger. However, they are going outside the law to do these things.

 

[Swift]

In the case of these recent events I definitely think jail time is in order. These are cases where the leakers believe they are benefiting the country or at a minimum their own pocketbooks, but are not intending to put others in danger. However, they are going outside the law to do these things.

I don't care about intent. I care about did they commit treason or not. I don't care if it was for profit or for their own personal sense of justice. You say death is hard punishment, I say it's easy. How would a treasonist survive in jail?

 

[Tornado]

Treason (intended or not) is a capital crime unless it is proven that extortion was commited. If it was willful, they should be punished the way capital crimes are meant to be.

 

[GT4_Rule]

I think death penalty should be reinstated in other countries. If they take a life, then their life needs to be taken away. Criminals hardly benefit or pay back to the public - all they do is waste taxpayer's money.

If that was the original question....sorry for being OT if it wasn't.

 

[87chevy]

Shot. because most likely leaking those kind of secrets will cost someone their life.

 

[a6m5]

Death sentence sounds harsh, but if you are leaking top secret information that could cost lives(even if indirectly), you probably don't have much of a defense.

 

[YSSMAN]

Well, I voted for termination of these folks from the NYT, but I think that should be done in conjunction with a severe penalty from the federal government.

The NYT can claim all they want that they are a "neutal" publication, but it is blatantly obvious that they are completely against everything that the current administration has worked on, for, etc.

Reporting events such as this puts people at risk, and it is generally irresponsible to report on this such as this. Now that the terrorist know, they are going to be more careful with what they do, and have a lesser chance of getting caught.

 

[ledhed]

The times is not at fault...the person(s) who leaked the info are .
The first ammendment protects the press ABSOLUTELY from the government . But just because you have a right...doesnt mean you have to use it.
In this case they used poor judgement.

I want those that leaked the info to the times hung by their nut sack in public .

 

[Touring Mars]

Reminds me of a part of Robin Williams' routine in his recent 'Live On Broadway' show where he mentions the fact that Congress publicly approved a covert plan to assassinate Saddam Hussein With intelligence like that, who needs leaks?

 

[FoolKiller]

I don't care about intent. I care about did they commit treason or not. I don't care if it was for profit or for their own personal sense of justice. You say death is hard punishment, I say it's easy. How would a treasonist survive in jail?

While I have no problem with capital punishment I think that I just don't see treason of this nature as being severe enough to result in death. That said, I can never see the full extent of their actions and they could cost someone their life.

You are correct that intent has nothing to do with it as many deaths are the results of actions that were not intended to cause death.

I may not have thought this through completely yesterday but I still stand by my stance that I think death may be too harsh of a punishment. Even though I feel that way I would not argue against a death sentence being given for this as I can't see the full extent of their actions. At most I might shrug my shoulders and say, "sucks to be them."


As for how a treasonist would survive in jail: They probably wouldn't or their life would be worth as much as a child molester's. That's part of the jail time and the punishment may be worse than a relatively quick execution. Once again, all I can say is, "suck to be them."

 

[87chevy]

The times is not at fault...the person(s) who leaked the info are .
The first ammendment protects the press ABSOLUTELY from the government . But just because you have a right...doesnt mean you have to use it.
In this case they used poor judgement.

I want those that leaked the info to the times hung by their nut sack in public .

ah... so good to see old timers like Ledhed are still here and unchanged

 

[FoolKiller]

Just thought I would add something I read this morning about this story.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,201255,00.html

NYT Foils Finance Plot

The New York Times has been admonished for undercutting efforts to disrupt international terrorist financing networks by exposing a secret government program to monitor foreign banking, a plan that seems very like what the Times itself called for just after 9/11.

In a September 24, 2001 editorial, the Times warned of Usama bin Laden's vast network of Islamic charities and businesses and wrote that the administration needed to do more to "disable the financial networks used by terrorists" through "stricter regulations, the recruitment of specialized investigators and greater cooperation with foreign banking authorities."

The Times added, "If America is going to wage a new kind of war against terrorism, it must act on all fronts, including the financial one."

So, they demanded this be done and then act like it shouldn't have been when it happens?

EDIT: I think I change my vote to kill them on the grounds of stupidity. We don't need them in the gene pool. (Yes, that was intended as a joke before someone takes me seriously)