Journalist Allegedly Killed In Saudi Embassy in Turkey

baldgye
You mean the selling of arms?

Reading and listening to FT reports on the matter, prior to this the business world basically overlooked SA's human rights violations, as doing or not doing business on those grounds can be a treacherous and lead to uncomfortable situations. However, in-spite of the huge revenue on the table and the ability to be on the ground floor on an economy that's been totally restructured (to be weaned off oil revenue), businesses are taking a stand. Regardless of what actually happened, this has been monumentally costly to the Kingdom and takes away any and all momentum from Mohammed Bin Salman
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Which businesses are taking a stand and what is the monetary impact of those stands?
 
Johnnypenso
Personally I find it disgusting. To me it's like taking a mic and standing on a pile of dead bodies to do your comedy act.
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Sanji Himura
No offense, I personally think that he is an idiot too, but I won't go and jump off the deep end in proving that idiocity. I would rather not watch.
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Why should humorous angle be a problem? In the name of what is pointing the ridicule of behaviors an insult to anyone? You are assuming that John Oliver and his audience are unable to distinguish between being serious and taking themselves seriously. I acknowledge that some people are culturally/mentally unable to operate that way. But, i'm making an analogy here: it is documented that some very uneducated people are intellectually unable to conduct a thinking based on hypothesis ; what legitimacy do they have to be upset by those formulating hypothesis?

We could also consider this scale:
- Good news
- I don't care news
- Depressing news
- So depressing news that i'd better laugh than hang myself.

Oliver operates on that last level, not at the previous ones.

That being said, having seen a large number of his shows, there's way more seriousness and pertinence in John Oliver segments that you may think, and despite that at first glimpse, he could look like a clown. He's not. He's making points, and good ones. Hence the hate from the opposite camp, i guess...

Regarding the region lock of the video, i guess his show is broadcasted in other ways in your country and that HBO won't undermine their deal with local broadcasters.
 
This whole case seems to be coming together in an odd way so I suspect there is much we've not heard yet. My guess is the Crown Prince is going to blame Khashoggi's murder on some traitorous forces working against him or within his own regime or simply call it a botched interrogation and blame it on those directly involved. I wouldn't be surprised if the Turks have some information implicating the Crown Prince via having bugged the consulate and are leveraging that information to their advantage politically. I doubt the whole truth will ever be known and the Crown Prince will likely come out unscathed and it'll all be forgotten soon enough.
 
The killing took 7 minutes, according to sources speaking to Middle East Eye. The consul was removed and the killing was performed like an autopsy. Not going to link you the article due to its rather graphic nature.
 
Liquid
The rumour I heard was that he was killed inside the embassy, dismembered there and then his corpse was taken away
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Posted Monday.

I honestly don't remember where I heard this rumour but I've seen it repeated a lot in the past 36 hours or so.
 
Liquid
Posted Monday.

I honestly don't remember where I heard this rumour but I've seen it repeated a lot in the past 36 hours or so.
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The Guardian reported on it.
They’ve also reported on the story that the audio recording picks up the ‘interrogators’ chopping off his fingers during the tourture (sorry I’ve a mental block and can’t spell that work haha, even iOS won’t help!)

Edit: link to article
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...eet-erdogan-as-gory-reports-of-killing-emerge


What’s ****ed up, is that if true, these people brutally murdered this person in the worst possible way, just for the sadistic enjoyment of it. No one was supposed to know, he just had to disappear... it’s bewildering
 
baldgye
The Guardian reported on it.
They’ve also reported on the story that the audio recording picks up the ‘interrogators’ chopping off his fingers during the tourture (sorry I’ve a mental block and can’t spell that work haha, even iOS won’t help!)

Edit: link to article
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...eet-erdogan-as-gory-reports-of-killing-emerge


What’s ****ed up, is that if true, these people brutally murdered this person in the worst possible way, just for the sadistic enjoyment of it. No one was supposed to know, he just had to disappear... it’s bewildering
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Alternatively they could have, well, given him the proof of divorce he wanted. In public. In front of media cameras. Smilling a lot. And showing how tolerant they are and how they are not terribly unpleasant people after all. Honest.

They could then not have the world's media talking about them....
 
Subtlety in the exercise of sovereign authority over exiles is clearly a mixed bag. North Korea will send a woman to throw acid on you. Russia will send a couple of thugs to botch the job and poison bystanders instead. Britain will send James Bond with his .25 Beretta to put a bullet in your ear. The US will send a drone to get you, your son and anyone else nearby. But these Arabs take the prize for clarity of purpose and dramatic effect upon those who would defy the authority of the Kingdom.
 
Sanji Himura
7 of the 15 man team is allegedly close to the crown prince, Middle East Eye reporting:

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/...lled-istanbul-were-close-mbs-report-149446239
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I can't see any way the Crown Prince is going to go down for this one. The only way that would happen would be if enough of the world decided to boycott Saudi Oil and effectively choke them out economically, which would trigger an internal revolt and have the CP ousted by his own family. This would require some of the big importers of Saudi Oil to step up, mainly China, Japan, South Korea, the U.S. and India. I doubt this is even possible without torpedoing their own economies unless they can secure an alternate source in a hurry.
 
Johnnypenso
I can't see any way the Crown Prince is going to go down for this one. The only way that would happen would be if enough of the world decided to boycott Saudi Oil and effectively choke them out economically, which would trigger an internal revolt and have the CP ousted by his own family. This would require some of the big importers of Saudi Oil to step up, mainly China, Japan, South Korea, the U.S. and India. I doubt this is even possible without torpedoing their own economies unless they can secure an alternate source in a hurry.
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US doesn't depend on Saudi oil, it's Canadian oil they depend on most
 
TenEightyOne
That was taken off him in the 50s, he used a Walther PPK mostly... although that was semi-retired after the Princess Anne incident.
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On a more serious note, I think you can confirm MI6 could and did, at least in the past, exercise a license to torture and kill. Even British subjects.
 
The purge might be starting:
One of the 15 Saudis who arrived in Turkey the same day Jamal Khashoggi disappeared has died in a “suspicious traffic accident” and the Saudi consul in Istanbul could be the “next execution,” according to Turkish media reports.

Mashal Saad al-Bostani, 31, a lieutenant in the Saudi Royal Air Forces, was among the 15-member “hit team” that landed in Istanbul in two private jets from Riyadh on Oct. 2 and headed to the Saudi consulate.

He died in a car crash in Riyadh, but few details have emerged, the newspaper Yeni Safak reported, adding that his role in the “murder” was not clear.

Sure are a lot of quote signs used.
 
So brutal if this is true. Killing opposition from other parts of the world is nothing new.

Stalin even sent a assassin to kill trotsky with a ice pick.

Saudi Arabia basically sending a message to its opposition go against us or your end will be like this.
 
SestoScudo
So brutal if this is true. Killing opposition from other parts of the world is nothing new.

Stalin even sent a assassin to kill trotsky with a ice pick.

Saudi Arabia basically sending a message to its opposition go against us or your end will be like this.
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They weren’t sending any message because no one was supposed to have found out...
 
I find it interesting that all the stuff I've read and seen and learned over the years as far as global politics go, that I still get highly disturbed at some of the actions of governments and how they treat those who dare to personally level reality at them. A reality where they are corrupt, they are unbalanced and unfair. And rather than either change, ignore, or other methods that aren't this, they almost always come to this at some point in their history. I have to wonder why, but the why is typically so irrational that I never get a realistic answer when I seek one out.
 
Johnnypenso
The purge might be starting:
One of the 15 Saudis who arrived in Turkey the same day Jamal Khashoggi disappeared has died in a “suspicious traffic accident” and the Saudi consul in Istanbul could be the “next execution,” according to Turkish media reports.

Mashal Saad al-Bostani, 31, a lieutenant in the Saudi Royal Air Forces, was among the 15-member “hit team” that landed in Istanbul in two private jets from Riyadh on Oct. 2 and headed to the Saudi consulate.

He died in a car crash in Riyadh, but few details have emerged, the newspaper Yeni Safak reported, adding that his role in the “murder” was not clear.

Sure are a lot of quote signs used.
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There might be a few two-bullet suicides in Saudi Arabia soon.
 
baldgye
They weren’t sending any message because no one was supposed to have found out...
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I'd say it was a pretty poor plan then. High profile Saudi journalist and critic of the Saudi government, now living in the U.S. and writing for an American paper, goes to Saudi consulate and is never seen again. Even without the alleged recordings this one is a no-brainer and the suspicion would have fallen on the Saudis no matter how this played out. Virtually impossible to keep this a secret.
 
Johnnypenso
I'd say it was a pretty poor plan then. High profile Saudi journalist and critic of the Saudi government, now living in the U.S. and writing for an American paper, goes to Saudi consulate and is never seen again. Even without the alleged recordings this one is a no-brainer and the suspicion would have fallen on the Saudis no matter how this played out. Virtually impossible to keep this a secret.
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Indeed. I suppose one has to start wondering that if they always knew the truth would out then who the real actors were and if they had a wider game plan.
 
TenEightyOne
Indeed. I suppose one has to start wondering that if they always knew the truth would out then who the real actors were and if they had a wider game plan.
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Indeed. The most obvious conclusion is that the Crown Prince ordered the killing. To me that seems a little too pat of a solution. One could assume he's so arrogant he thought no one would care and he's untouchable. But it's also possible there is a plot within a plot here. I mean, why not snatch him off the street or murder him at his hotel or poison his food or something a little less obvious than having him walk into your very own consulate and never coming out? Other than murdering him in a camera shop while holding signs saying, "I'm doing this for the Crown Prince", I can't think of anything more blatantly obvious. Even the biggest moron in the world would have to know that at least a few people around him would know where he was going that morning. It all seems a little too convenient of a solution.
 
Dotini
Whomever was behind the murder, the Crown Prince will pay dearly, and rightly so. Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...udi-prince-is-shunned-by-investors-he-courted
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Here's one for you to ponder? What if the Islamic hardliner deep state in Saudi Arabia arranged for this to happen as a way of discrediting the reform-minded Crown Prince? Perhaps some nefarious elements weree watching the Kavanaugh hearings and said to themselves," hold on a second, half of these people don't believe in innocent until proven guilty."
 
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Johnnypenso
Here's one for you to ponder? What if the Islamic hardliner deep state in Saudi Arabia arranged for this to happen as a way of discrediting the reform-minded Crown Prince? Perhaps some nefarious elements weree watching the Kavanaugh hearings and said to themselves," hold on a second, half of these people don't believe in innocent until proven guilty."
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I acknowledge what you suggest is a possibility, maybe even a strong one. But even so, the Crown Prince will still pay a steep price. After all, he is the author of the climate of fear and retribution now permeating the Kingdom, the Prince's liberal blandishments towards female driving, etc. notwithstanding.
 
The whole situation does seem like the plot of a James Bond movie. I normally dont believe in conspiracy theories, but it just seems too obvious to kill someone in an embassy. There are much smarter and less obvious ways to abduct someone. Wouldnt it be better to get him in his own house or at least transport him to a safe location? It is almost setup to point the finger at the saudi Prince.


Or the plan just sucked.
 
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