Laguna Seca really needs an update

[CSLACR]

Sure, if you're on the east coast.

We're talking about Monterey, California.

We're talking about PD, whose grassy textures have remained overused and boring for quite some time.

Please, think BIG. Laguna Seca = dry lake. Tendency toward lovely grassy fields or gritty, dry and brown dirt? Since it's a GT4 track, I cannot totally blame PD, but I imagine it'll look different in time.

I'm well aware that even southern California becomes very green during the winter months, and that's exactly what my point is, as that's clearly what time of year it was when PD did their work at Laguna Seca.

I very much prefer the desert look as well, it is what's commonly seen, but to disregard it's beautiful stage is somewhat offensive also.
Depending on how you view it.

 

[Tornado]

You honestly think that looked real......The last corner on the Forza track looks to me like the track is made of polished glass and they got Michael Bay in to do the lighting. GT looks far more life like.

People say Forza sounds better? "Hollywood sound effects."
People say Forza has better physics? "Hollywood physics."
People say Forza has better lighting? "Hollywood lighting."


Never ceases to entertain.

 

[katnlz]

that's probably one of my dissatisfactions with GT5. the sterile environments. while PD is top notch at car physics, they're WAY behind in other aspects namely environment and animations. Robot Jeff Gordon comes to mind (would it have been so hard to just use an actual video of the guy?). a distant wish, but why not outsource?

 

[lebes14]

People say Forza sounds better? "Hollywood sound effects."
People say Forza has better physics? "Hollywood physics."
People say Forza has better lighting? "Hollywood lighting."

Never ceases to entertain.

I agree with all but the first, if forza is Hollywood sounds, then gt5 is basement Bmovie sounds

 

[Zer0]

Watch from 0:20-0:45.

Look to the left and middle in the background. Try not to laugh at how PD makes Laguna Seca, which means "Dry lake", so green.

Forza and iRacing modeled it perfectly. It's dry, brownish dirt, and has paths up and down the ridge.

-10, PD. Anyways, it's been noted that this is likely a "standard" track.

http://www.tamsoldracecarsite.net/ppq0043LagunaSecaGreen1.html

 

[CorvetteConquer]

Modeling Laguna Seca in the "winter" would be like modeling Autumn Ring in the winter! Haha. Doesn't make sense.

But it's a good find. The ground's much greener in the colder months, though it's NEVER really BITTER cold in Monterey.

But again, and I think many would agree, that Laguna Seca is better represented in its most primal state: in the intense California summer heat when the track and surrounding environment is most "seca" and warm.

 

[Zer0]

Makes sense if you are PD and not a copy-paste developer.

"The thing about reality is that the criteria for looking ‘real’ are actually a lot stricter and volatile than you’d expect. The way the sun shines, reflects off something, the way it lights scenery – we seldom have the opportunity to see what we consider ‘reality’ under the best and most aesthetically pleasing conditions."

“Every time we go out to the circuit and take photos of cars, we get that same impression again. When you see a race on television, compared to a race in a game, you realise that the reality isn’t as shiny or pleasant as the game. However, these ‘best conditions’ do indeed exist. They happen every once in a while. Maybe, once a year, you’ll be watching a race on TV, or you’ll be outside, and a cloud will move in an ideal direction, and the sun will shine down at a perfect angle, and maybe just for a moment you’ll have this beautiful scene right in front of you.”

http://www.play-mag.co.uk/latest-playstation-news/polyphony-gran-turismo-5-better-than-reality/

 

[Tornado]

Makes sense if you are PD and not a copy-paste developer.

Oh please. It's been a year and a half now. You can drop the act.

 

[TheeFrogmanlego]

No. The track profile in GT5 dates back at least to GT4, if not even earlier (probably hasn't been touched since GT3). There was a massive discussion about this in the GT vs. Forza thread where it was proven (regardless of what the person arguing that the track's problems in GT5 were "imaginary" thought), but the long and short of it is that even if the track was accurate in GT4 (which someone who has driven on it in that thread was of the opinion that it likely wasn't), it isn't accurate anymore and hasn't been since before the PS3 even came out, let alone GT5.

The Rahal Straight on the entrance to the corkscrew is completely different now than how it is in GT5, as the video Zer0 provided helpfully shows (iRacing got it right. Forza and GT5 did not). Most of the track landmarks also aren't in anywhere near the right location. A lot of the turn profiles are wrong. Many of the track runoffs (like on the start/finish straight) are wildly incorrect. Off the top of my head.




The long and short of it is, neither GT or Forza do it completely right, but Forza is much closer.

Is that why the track is super wider in forza.. ive been to laguna seca in real life. The track is not sand , during the spring its green as depicted in GT5, now as it being inaccurate at the cork screw , ITS VERY and its also pre 2005 , but saying forza's version is better is just plain dumb, the tracks wide at parts were its narrow, ive walked on it the track various times, in Forza its WAY to wide a round 3-4 feet to wide:tdown:

 

[Tornado]

The track is not sand , during the spring its green as depicted in GT5

Awesome. I said otherwise... when?

but saying forza's version is better is just plain dumb, the tracks wide at parts were its narrow, ive walked on it the track various times, in Forza its WAY to wide a round 3-4 feet to wide:tdown:

Examples plzthxbai.

 

[Zer0]

Oh please. It's been a year and a half now. You can drop the act.

Love the last line of your signature, since when? 2004?

======

Another vid:

 

[Cote Dazur]

I don't think so.

Thank you for the video. Great to see what the differences are ( or lack of) .

 

[zuperkiwi]

seeing gt5 next to forza makes me think fm4 laguna looks even better than when I saw it next to the real-track.

That's because GT really oversaturated the colors ingame, unlike Forza.
Also, Forza is closer to the real thing with all that desert instead of grass.
I think GT5 will look much better when a little less saturated.
Trackwise they look the same to me.

 

[Dr_Watson]

That's because GT really oversaturated the colors ingame, unlike Forza.
Also, Forza is closer to the real thing with all that desert instead of grass.
I think GT5 will look much better when a little less saturated.
Trackwise they look the same to me.

The lighting in forza is pretty **** though. It's way overdone.
Ideally we want the track map from iRacing with GT's lighting and forza's textures.

 

[skazz]

I'm willing to bet that most of these "lighting looks more realistic in Forza/GT5" never ending discussions are actually based on default TV colour saturation settings.

On my PAL EU TV GT5 is far closer in colour to what I see on Motors TV and Eurosport (except American broadcasts) with my TV set to standard colour settings on the PS3 HDMI input. In order to get Forza looking ok on my European TV I had to do some pretty dramatic things to the brightness, contrast and colour settings of the HDMI input from Xbox.

So to all guys moaning about relative colour of the two games, I challenge you to play with brightness, contrast and particularly colour saturation to get a good result for each. To give you an idea, I had to up the colour saturation a lot for Forza and lower the brightness a lot compared to my normal digital HDTV input and the PS3 input.

Clearly differing TV characteristics between the PAL and NTSC zones?

 

[TheeFrogmanlego]

Awesome. I said otherwise... when?


Examples plzthxbai.

Examples, go race it on forza , its a known fact that tracks on forza are wider, Ive played laguna seca on forza 4 it looks amazing but the tracks way to wide!

 

[Tornado]

Examples, go race it on forza , its a known fact that tracks on forza are wider,

It's a known fact that the Nurburgring is wider (and longer and smoother and etc.). You can't blanket that to every track in the game just because of that.

Ive played laguna seca on forza 4 it looks amazing but the tracks way to wide!

Interesting that the video doesn't show it, then.

 

[Forgetful]

Is there any evidence to suggest PD cannot update real-world tracks, or just a random guess?

Spa is brand new, and the Ring and Sarthe were just remodeled, Suzuka was only remodeled half-assed.
So no, unless I see evidence that suggest PD has a license for outdated tracks and cannot get newer versions due to being locked out, this sounds like a typical excuse to me.

It's a theory, as stated. Why else would we have so many out of date tracks?

It's not an excuse, it seems like a smart way to work around restrictive licenses for courses that are locked up in official NASCAR, F1 and other racing games.

None of us will ever really know a great deal about PD's business deals, so for you to declare that it's not the case is about as accurate as if I were to say that it is for sure the case.

We don't know, but a theory that makes sense to me. It's a better explanation that the usual "PD's lazy and sux at modeling" that fills this thread.

 

[Samus]

It's a theory, as stated. Why else would we have so many out of date tracks?

It's not an excuse, it seems like a smart way to work around restrictive licenses for courses that are locked up in official NASCAR, F1 and other racing games.

None of us will ever really know a great deal about PD's business deals, so for you to declare that it's not the case is about as accurate as if I were to say that it is for sure the case.

We don't know, but a theory that makes sense to me. It's a better explanation that the usual "PD's lazy and sux at modeling" that fills this thread.

Doesn't really make much sense though, lots of smaller companies can get licenses for these tracks so it doesn't seem to make any sense that PD can't get updated licenses.

 

[Dr_Watson]

who said you need a license to scan a track?

 

[CSLACR]

Good question doc. I really don't know.

It's a theory, as stated. Why else would we have so many out of date tracks?

It's not an excuse, it seems like a smart way to work around restrictive licenses for courses that are locked up in official NASCAR, F1 and other racing games.

None of us will ever really know a great deal about PD's business deals, so for you to declare that it's not the case is about as accurate as if I were to say that it is for sure the case.

We don't know, but a theory that makes sense to me. It's a better explanation that the usual "PD's lazy and sux at modeling" that fills this thread.

But if there ever are licensing issues, it would make sense for Infineon's disappearing act. Of course I would not at all expect it to be a case where having an old version was ok, but not being allowed to update the scenery? Really?
I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it sounds highly improbable. So improbable that without some form of proof(or a little evidence would help, anything) I totally dismiss it.

 

[Samus]

who said you need a license to scan a track?

You can model a track without a license but to put it into a product requires a license, just like a car does. You also can't just model the track and give it a different name for obvious reasons just like you can't model some Porsches and call them Porshas.

The only exception to this is public and semi public roads, which is how Monaco appears in GT unlicensed and the Montreal circuit appears in Supercar Challenge under another name.

 

[Dr_Watson]

Grand Theft Auto never paid a licensing feel for the Porka turbo...