Love PC1 should I get PC2 now or wait?

[Harry Freq]

"Jaggies" is reasonably objective - if a line that should be straight or have a smooth curve presents as jagged, there's "jaggies" in play.
"Horrible jaggies" very much enters the realm of subjectivity.

Tell him that he has low standards if you must, but don't tell him that he's lying.

I beileve he was lying to sell his game. If he thinks hes telling the truth pre release regarding the horrible jaggies comment then that suggests he has insanely low standards like lowest of the low standards.

Ian if you stand by that comment even after that screenshot posted then im sorry for calling you a liar you just had extremely low standards for you game. Oddly your team seem to have fixed those jaggies which is strange if an issue didnt seem present to yourself.

 

[Scaff]

I beileve he was lying to sell his game. If he thinks hes telling the truth pre release regarding the horrible jaggies comment then that suggests he has insanely low standards like lowest of the low standards.

Then you best be able to prove that or fall foul of the AUP.

Accusing a member of lying, regardless of who they are is a rather serious charge, one that will need to be either proven or retracted.

 

[diesel97]

No horrible jaggies Ian? Cmon your team seems to have fixed the game judging by the demo but how can you defend that no horrible jaggies comment? No wonder you have no interest in engaging further as all you can see in that screenshot is horrible jaggies.

What am I missing I think it looks good

 

[diesel97]

we need a cancel button

 

[Harry Freq]

Then you best be able to prove that or fall foul of the AUP.

Accusing a member of lying, regardless of who they are is a rather serious charge, one that will need to be either proven or retracted.

I retract what i said.

 

[Ian Bell]

I retract what i said.

And forgiven Harry. Let's get on

 

[Logsi]

What am I missing I think it looks good

Not adding fuel to the fire but purely pointing out aliasing. Click on the image to make it full size. If you look at the hard edges on spoilers, lower valances, windscreen wipers and bonnet line you can see aliasing.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

Not adding fuel to the fire but purely pointing out aliasing. Click on the image to make it full size. If you look at the hard edges on spoilers, lower valances, windscreen wipers and bonnet line you can see aliasing.

I struggle to notice them and certainly don't during actual gameplay. One persons problem is another persons ok and another persons good.

 

[BrandonW77]

I struggle to notice them

Really? They're literally all over the place. Whether they're horrible or not and whether this screenshot was taken from normal gameplay are different matters, but it's pretty hard not to notice the abundance of jaggies. (Note: I've never seen anything nearly this bad on the PC version during normal gameplay)

 

[Sentry87]

They're there. You just have to be close enough to see them. Luckily for me I have about 4 feet between me and the TV and don't notice them 👍

 

[diesel97]

Really? They're literally all over the place. Whether they're horrible or not and whether this screenshot was taken from normal gameplay are different matters, but it's pretty hard not to notice the abundance of jaggies. (Note: I've never seen anything nearly this bad on the PC version during normal gameplay)

View attachment 694920

Sorry I'm too busy looking for the best place to pass

 

[Wolfe]

I see jaggies, and I could not care less. Computer graphics are made of pixels...so what? From my perspective, smudging them a bit or pushing a higher resolution does not make this any less apparent, does not make the game look better, and does not make it look more "real" or "immersive". It's still the same polys, textures, lighting, etc.

I'd play PCARS2 in native 720p if I had that option on PS4 for a more stable framerate (the PCARS engine just downscales if you force 720p in the system options). I'm boggled by the quest for 2K gaming and beyond, because I see no benefit in it aside from, say, four-player splitscreen, which is hardly a thing on the platforms pushing toward 2K gaming.

 

[05XR8]

Jiminey Cricket! I'm too busy trying to keep AI behind and being consistent lap after lap. Glad some players have time for this or I'd not notice I was playing such a horrible looking game.

 

[Cote Dazur]

I did not like PCars very much, but PCars 2 is much better, I enjoy the driving and the VR experience is very nice, so in response to the OP question, I would say yes, now.
I have one reservation and it is about the AI, in PCars they were a “little” wild but I would always get an interesting race without having to play with the AI strength too much. In PCars 2, they drive more realistic but I am not able to get an interesting race going, I usualy end up racing on my own, some time in front, sometime behind, some time in middle field. Starting last allows for a few pass in the first and second lap, but after that, thing settles and I end up alone with big gaps in front and back. So it takes a lot of efforts to set their pace because it varies widely From combo to combo and then when you have a matching pace, you end up somewhere in the train of cars after a lap or two and not much happens. I am now a 80 aggressivity level, but it does not help much when I change the aggressivity level.

 

[Harry Freq]

I see jaggies, and I could not care less. Computer graphics are made of pixels...so what? From my perspective, smudging them a bit or pushing a higher resolution does not make this any less apparent, does not make the game look better, and does not make it look more "real" or "immersive". It's still the same polys, textures, lighting, etc.

I'd play PCARS2 in native 720p if I had that option on PS4 for a more stable framerate (the PCARS engine just downscales if you force 720p in the system options). I'm boggled by the quest for 2K gaming and beyond, because I see no benefit in it aside from, say, four-player splitscreen, which is hardly a thing on the platforms pushing toward 2K gaming.

There is absoluely nothing wrong with wanting a great looking game on PS4 Pro or X. Some of us want great graphics, Others want great sound and others want fantastic framerate especially PC gamers who can easily achieve 120fps in games. People who dont car if the game looks like a Geoff Crammand game seem to have issues with those that spend 500 on a graphics card or upgrade consoles for better graphics which is weird.

Dont understand ya 2k gaming statement surely you mean 4k gaming as the quest for 2k has been here for a year on consoles and years on pc. People want or get close to 4k so they can play natively which of course looks better on the brilliant oled tv or qled tv they just bought?

Playing Horizon Zero Dawn or AC Origin on a 4k tv oled would maybe open your eyes on how great gaming can look.

 

[Mr Tree]

There is absoluely nothing wrong with wanting a great looking game on PS4 Pro or X. Some of us want great graphics, Others want great sound and others want fantastic framerate especially PC gamers who can easily achieve 120fps in games. People who dont car if the game looks like a Geoff Crammand game seem to have issues with those that spend 500 on a graphics card or upgrade consoles for better graphics which is weird.

Dont understand ya 2k gaming statement surely you mean 4k gaming as the quest for 2k has been here for a year on consoles and years on pc. People want or get close to 4k so they can play natively which of course looks better on the brilliant oled tv or qled tv they just bought?

Playing Horizon Zero Dawn or AC Origin on a 4k tv oled would maybe open your eyes on how great gaming can look.

I think their (at least my issue) with it is that this game was advertised to have certain features which all together require some computing power. If this is the case you should expect less stunning graphics.

My number 2 issue, 'the game is the ugliest ever!' 'the game has the worst jaggies ever' and phrases that share a strong resemblance with the are serious hyperboles. There is a diffrence between saying you'd like the graphics to be more beuatifull or whatever but if people use hyperboles like that it's not so wrong to show the jaggies in 15+yr old games.

Again nothing wrong with people wanting to have a beautifull game. But as you pointed out some people care more for features/gameplay, now that we have such a game it's annoying to keep hearing people state the obvious (see issue 1)

I myself like beautifull graphics so I'm glad we're moving to mote pictureperfect games but I wish it wouldn't come at the expense of simulation/gameplay features. Which it hasn't for pCars2, my fear is the whine they got for it will change sms's mind for a possible future successor and think we don't flak about graphics again let's drop some features to make it look pretty.

But yes I agree this is very subjective and so the reasons I give are subjective. They have every right to voice their opinion, this is just why those opinions rub me the wrong way.

I do feel you are not the person I'm describing in this post.

 

[Logsi]

I see jaggies, and I could not care less. Computer graphics are made of pixels...so what? From my perspective, smudging them a bit or pushing a higher resolution does not make this any less apparent, does not make the game look better, and does not make it look more "real" or "immersive". It's still the same polys, textures, lighting, etc.

I'd play PCARS2 in native 720p if I had that option on PS4 for a more stable framerate (the PCARS engine just downscales if you force 720p in the system options). I'm boggled by the quest for 2K gaming and beyond, because I see no benefit in it aside from, say, four-player splitscreen, which is hardly a thing on the platforms pushing toward 2K gaming.

I'm not sure I entirely agree with your opening paragraph and it almost seems to me that you don't really understand what Anti-Aliasing or supersampling and other technologies can achieve. You are being subjective but giving factual anecdotes that are false and I don't want this misinformation to be seen as fact. Raising resolutions does improve on image quality and lowers aliasing, it does look better, and does look more real and is more immersive. The closer we get to virtual reality the more immersive and real a game will be, our reality doesn't have jagged lines.

Speaking of textures, a texture may be the same texture but having different filtering techniques on said texture makes a hell of a difference. Surely you can tell the difference between bilinear/trilinear and anisotropic filtering. This is equally important as Anti-Aliasing.

How do you feel about ambient occlusion?

What about supersampling? 4K downsampled down to 1080p for me vastly improves on image quality and lowers shimmering due to aliasing.

If you take VR for example. The technology can be seen to be in its infancy still due to the low resolution of headsets, a higher resolution will increase view distances.

Racing games are probably one of the best reasons to upgrade your TV. Higher resolutions mean you can sit closer whilst your eyes can resolve more detail due to the higher pixel count. Because of the higher pixel count and detail, you can see further into the distance and horizon. Take a look at this graph below for optimal seating distance for resolution/TV size. You may be using a 20" Monitor at 20' away so you may not see the difference in resolution/aliasing. The further you sit away the lower detail your eye will be resolving and also aliasing is less pronounced.

When you say 2k gaming do you mean 1920x1080p? Or do you mean 4K UHD 3860x2160p? The nomenclature spun by the marketing departments of TVs has done wonders in confusing consumers, switching from vertical to horizontal pixel count. 1080p is a much greater improvement over 720p than 1080p to 4k. There is logarithmic curve of perceived improvement when going from 720p to 1080p to 4K though this much is true.

Fair enough if you don't personally care and you can rise above it but lets not spread subjective views as fact.

 

[Wolfe]

@Harry Freq -- The whole point is I don't think PCARS2's aliasing prevents it from looking great. You're welcome to wish for better anti-aliasing or a higher resolution, especially on more expensive hardware. What we disagree on is whether the visuals are a complete disaster because of the aliasing.

Raising resolutions does improve on image quality and lowers aliasing, it does look better, and does look more real and is more immersive. The closer we get to virtual reality the more immersive and real a game will be, our reality doesn't have jagged lines.

I'm telling you that's not my experience, which is not misinformation. A higher resolution improves clarity and does make aliasing smaller, but that's about it. I can't relate to it making a game look more real or immersive. I only see sharper visuals, which is more than nothing, but not a high priority for me. When I'm immersed in a game I perceive it as a world apart from our own, not like I'm really driving a car or anything.

When I said, "it does not look better," I meant it's still the same graphics, not that there is no change in image quality -- clarity does matter, particularly in a racing game like you said. This relates to @Harry Freq's quip about Geoff Crammond games, which is a false equivalence. You could play some 1990s games like Interstate '76 in 1024x768, but even if you crunch PCARS down to a lower resolution, as I did to the screenshot below, it is still very plainly way more advanced than I76. It does not change the level of detail on the car or environment, lighting, special effects, etc. That's what I see in PCARS2 regardless of the aliasing.

 

[Harry Freq]

If PCars 2 actually looked like that i wouldnt be able to play it the other game on the other hand doesnt hurt my eyes and could play it without wanting to turn it off.

 

[Imari]

If PCars 2 actually looked like that i wouldnt be able to play it the other game on the other hand doesnt hurt my eyes and could play it without wanting to turn it off.

K. Now try the two of them in motion and see what you think. I think you'd be surprised at how well your brain interpolates for the low-res PC2 to see the real assets, whereas I76 is jagged and low res by nature.

Or do you actually think something like GT3 is unplayable now?

 

[superwally]

So I am still wondering if I should get it now or not, this thread is a little off the rails.

I AM USING A NON-PRO PS4. In all caps because I only want to know about the PS4 version and not the PC version.

I like racing online vs other humans. I like GT Sport but if the physics and tire model in PC2 are great I'd like to see what that's all about. I'm not looking to pick one over the other.

If I have time, I like time-trialing and car setup. I don't take photos much. I like good physics and tire modeling. I like good sound.

I like nice graphics but will not notice small jaggies as shown and described in this thread as they do not distract from immersion while I am racing.

I am not that interested in battling with AI now that stable online racing is available, it feels like a waste of time.

Car and track selection is important but not a deal breaker. I can only drive one place in one car at a time, and I like to practice so I can learn how to be fast.

Any thoughts?

 

[Sentry87]

So I am still wondering if I should get it now or not, this thread is a little off the rails.

I AM USING A NON-PRO PS4. In all caps because I only want to know about the PS4 version and not the PC version.

I like racing online vs other humans. I like GT Sport but if the physics and tire model in PC2 are great I'd like to see what that's all about. I'm not looking to pick one over the other.

If I have time, I like time-trialing and car setup. I don't take photos much. I like good physics and tire modeling. I like good sound.

I like nice graphics but will not notice small jaggies as shown and described in this thread as they do not distract from immersion while I am racing.

I am not that interested in battling with AI now that stable online racing is available, it feels like a waste of time.

Car and track selection is important but not a deal breaker. I can only drive one place in one car at a time, and I like to practice so I can learn how to be fast.

Any thoughts?

Physics and tyre model way better than gt sport. If you can call what gts has even a tyre model.

If you like time trialing and dialing in setups pc2 has you covered there. Some default setups are perfect, others/ most need tweaking.

Graphics are decent, sounds sre great. Jaggies aren't nearly as noticeable as a few on this forum would have you think.

A.i. is improving each update but could always use work ( still top notch compared to f7 and GtS).

Car and track selection is best on console, I feel like a kid in a candy store.

HOWEVER, I can't honestly give input on online play. I'm mostly offline. From what I gather when online works, it's fantastic. However some people report disconnect and weather syncing issues. However driver standards seems better in pc2 compared to GTS who seem to have a lot of rammers and unfair players.

 

[superwally]

Great response, thanks.

 

[Gr8_Lakes]

Great response, thanks.

I doubt you'll be disappointed if you buy the game now. Especially if you use a wheel. It's a solid game with a few issues that will be resolved soon.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

Really? They're literally all over the place. Whether they're horrible or not and whether this screenshot was taken from normal gameplay are different matters, but it's pretty hard not to notice the abundance of jaggies. (Note: I've never seen anything nearly this bad on the PC version during normal gameplay)

View attachment 694920

Even with the arrows to mark them, I still don't see what I'm supposed to notice!

 

[IBZ6L20VT]

So I am still wondering if I should get it now or not, this thread is a little off the rails.

I AM USING A NON-PRO PS4. In all caps because I only want to know about the PS4 version and not the PC version.

I like racing online vs other humans. I like GT Sport but if the physics and tire model in PC2 are great I'd like to see what that's all about. I'm not looking to pick one over the other.

If I have time, I like time-trialing and car setup. I don't take photos much. I like good physics and tire modeling. I like good sound.

I like nice graphics but will not notice small jaggies as shown and described in this thread as they do not distract from immersion while I am racing.

I am not that interested in battling with AI now that stable online racing is available, it feels like a waste of time.

Car and track selection is important but not a deal breaker. I can only drive one place in one car at a time, and I like to practice so I can learn how to be fast.

Any thoughts?

@Sentry87 did a great job answering your questions.

I might only add that online is rather good. The rating system is far from perfect but I think it does a decent job.

However most people create lobbies with it off or with the minimum safety level required. Even so, I joined an E rated lobby (medium-low safety degree) and the host waited for me and deliberately rammed me twice after I set the fastest time in qualifying.

With that said, this game online has provided me with some of the most exciting, close and immersive races I ever had outside a real car.

On another note, if you’re after a very good physics/tire model with good FFB, if you love motorsports and want the most realistic recreation of a wide array of disciplines, if you want variety of tracks and in any imanigable time and condition, if you want to spend endless hours looking for the last tenth out of the setup, then PCars 2 will exceed your expectations.

 

[superwally]

Excellent, thanks everyone. It sounds like it's worth exploring and I'll give it a shot.

 

[Morgoth_666]

Slightly different problem for me.

I was late to pCARS 1 so trying to wait until I got at least something accomplished before getting part 2. I gave in because Black Friday discounts and the demo seemed really nice. So now I have it and trying not to play it until Christmasish, I at least want to finish season 3 of the career(no GT4 ride available so I went with Clio Cup which was probably a good choice).

I reckon if I can be super efficient every day about finishing all the races I have left to do including the un-won invitationals, I'll wind up getting to the endurance race overload at the end of the season just about at the holiday break. That should make for a nice finale. Still want to play with new shiny thing, but trying hard to stay focused.


INB4 my wheel finally dies for good just before Christmas

 

[GTsimms]

If PCars 2 actually looked like that i wouldnt be able to play it the other game on the other hand doesnt hurt my eyes and could play it without wanting to turn it off.

Just thinking, I don't know how we made it through the 80's!

 

[ZGreen]

finally have changed the settings so that since of speed is more like how my PC1 was set up. I maxed out the FOV in all views and since of speed is way better. I play on 55 inch tv and set less than 6 feet away. I will most likely reduce the FOV some in some of the views.

Bottom line is use the settings that you like to achieve you own personal enjoyment or comfort level with the game.

Is that action in race graphics on the ps4+ more inline with the replay graphics on the PS4. Regardless still believe that the lighting effects are way better on PC1.