- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
That's true. I remember the bloodbaths that occurred every weekend at D'n'D meetups*.
*Obviously I don't.
Mass shooting at Madden tournament in Jacksonville
- Thread starter PzR Slim
- 371 comments
- 16,680 views
That's true. I remember the bloodbaths that occurred every weekend at D'n'D meetups*.
*Obviously I don't.
- 20,970
- NJ/USA
- Blitzbay
- Blitzbay
- 11,270
- Sweden
- eran0004
No, because it makes people afraid of seeking help for any mental illness they may suffer from. It's much better to have them undergo treatment and that their employer/friends/family is aware of any special requirements they may have, than to have them fly under the radar without any treatment.
- 17,257
- United Kingdom
I take the fact that you state you wouldn't trust anyone with depression, with a gun, to mean that you assume the worst case with all depression sufferers - and would therefore be accepting that discrimination against them is justified. One practical example I've seen of that, is being declined for a mortgage (I appreciate that seems a little disconnected from this conversation but it's much more relevant to the average person here (geographically) than gun violence).
It set a suitable scene. Your post highlighted a ridiculous situation; Pro-gun types want to focus the attention on mental health, yet the NRA appeared to have hobbled attempts to do that in a meaningful fashion. Pro-gun types are keen to point out the intricacies around guns, gun ownership and gun violence, yet their lobbying body is happy to repress an opportunity to do the same for the supposed cause of the issue... just thought I'd poke fun at a scenario that might therefore arise.
Joey D
Premium
- 47,462
- Lakes of the North, MI
- GTP_Joey
- GTP Joey
I'm still of the mindset it's more mental illness than access to guns. But I don't have a good answer how to solve the mental health issue. Between the rising cost of healthcare and with insurance companies covering less, it's difficult and expensive to treat. Also, state budgets often slash mental health programs, leaving fewer people with access to the services they need.
I get healthcare is a tricky subject to deal with in a practical way, but something needs to be done. Getting the cost of insurance and care in general would go a long way. It's probably a lack of actual competition that leads to the price gouging, and I'm not sure what the barrier is for innovation.
I get healthcare is a tricky subject to deal with in a practical way, but something needs to be done. Getting the cost of insurance and care in general would go a long way. It's probably a lack of actual competition that leads to the price gouging, and I'm not sure what the barrier is for innovation.
- 29,971
- a baby, candy, it's like taking.
- TexRex72
Whelp, I didn't interpret that...at all.
Even looking back at the remark, armed with the explanation, I wasn't able to draw that conclusion...so I'm that much more appreciative of your willingness to clarify further.
Disagree. That said, I don't believe it's more access to guns than it is mental illness. The two issues are simultaneously independent of one another and thoroughly intertwined.
The way mental illness is addressed in this country is appalling and the ease with which firearms change hands and the lack of accountability in the process is just primed for abuse.
But hey, I'm not so unreasonable that I can't appreciate the difficulty in addressing either issue. Of course I'm also not oblivious to the fact that there are countless instances where an individual suffering mental illness slips through the cracks or an individual easily acquires a firearm courtesy of lax regulations and neither result in tragedy...but those instances don't make the news (which isn't cause to put the blame on news outlets as some are so inclined--not bringing attention to an incident doesn't retroactively prevent its occurrence).
I couldn't agree more, and I suspect existing providers are in no small part to blame for a lack of competition by making it more difficult for competition to establish itself. This belief is both cynical and logical, because a not insignificant part of me thinks these companies would want to act offensively (in both uses and of the word) to maximize profits and...well...why wouldn't they?
I suspect the barrier is two-fold. On one hand you've got that monopoly that keeps those with an inclination and an ability to innovate from entering the industry, and on the other, innovation itself is incredibly difficult and costly because of all of the hurdles that have to be cleared to get something into widespread use. The latter is likely se--*
Edit: Good grief...
*--lf-inflicted through a history of skirting regulations and taking advantage of loopholes that resulted in great harm to individuals and groups.
- 1,971
- Seattle, WA
Ok disclaimer, I've literally been out of touch with the News in general, so I don't really know the details on this, but an avid gamer that I work with (who's big into E-sports) told me a 24 year old male shot up a Madden tournament and killed some people. I asked if there was a motive and he said, rather flatly, "it's because he lost".
Well I got to thinking about it an it seems to me if he was armed at a tournament then it's likely it was premeditated. Without knowing anything more, I would say he went there intending to do what he did and that it wasn't some emotional last minute decision.
Well I got to thinking about it an it seems to me if he was armed at a tournament then it's likely it was premeditated. Without knowing anything more, I would say he went there intending to do what he did and that it wasn't some emotional last minute decision.
SestoScudo
(Banned)
- 3,000
- Australia
- Decepticon 47
Rest in peace to all the victims.
The private health system in America is a failure and common place procedures are more expensive than anywhere else in the developed world, so you need more private health care systems. Sounds a lot like the solution to gun violence, is more guns.
I guess at least there is solid evidence that backs up the fact that as more guns are sold and owned in America, the number of mass shootings has decreased substantially.
Danoff
Premium
- 34,014
- Mile High City
Oh I see the connection now. I was having trouble following the chain.
You're blaming failures of the American healthcare "system" to address mental health (especially in a cost effect manner) on the fact that you think it is private. So your presumed solution to @Joey D's posed problem is further socialization of the US healthcare system. That seems like a pretty big leap - especially given that all our government has ever managed to do is increase costs.
McLaren
Premium
- 45,568
- Texas
From what I've read, this wasn't exactly a high security event. I would wager he was likely a concealed carry user and his emotions got the better of him. If this was premeditated, he certainly picked the most opportune moment to attack.
Danoff
Premium
- 34,014
- Mile High City
You didn't ask me to clarify my post, you asked a very confused question. I was left with two choices, either you were intentionally misunderstanding and were being flippant, or you genuinely misunderstood. Given that the two definitions of socialize are pretty basic in the English language, I thought it would be prudent to ask you if you speak English (not everyone on this board has English as a first language). This seemed like a good solution to my conundrum (wondering whether you were being a jerk or genuinely misunderstand) since I don't have to convey tone over the message board. If you were being flippant, my question retroactively comes off as flippant. If you were being genuine, my question retroactively comes off as genuine. And I fully intended that double meaning.
Apparently you're claiming that you did not understand that socialize has (at least) two definitions. So I'm forced to conclude that you're either a non-native English speaker, or maybe you're just very young.
Joey D
Premium
- 47,462
- Lakes of the North, MI
- GTP_Joey
- GTP Joey
The system isn't a failure, it could be fixed to make costs more reasonable. America has one of the highest administrative costs when it comes to healthcare. For example, if a hospital has say 500 beds, it could easily have 1,500 people working in the billing office alone. To bill out procedures is insanely complex and takes a ton of time, this is largely due to how asinine Medicare and Medicaid (our government healthcare) are.
Both Medicare and Medicaid also require a ton of tests, doctor's visits, and procedures that are meaningless. For example, I had to jump through all sorts of hoops after I hurt my knee. I'm still waiting on an MRI and I hurt it back in June. It's stupid.
There are other factors too, but I only work on the IT side of things so I don't know all the ins and outs. But given how many of us there are to just make changes based on government regulations year after year, I'm guessing even my department is way to big and costly.
American health care and by extension it's mental health support has failed it's population for many years (from what I can tell as an outsider). The USA has the one of, if not the most expensive health care in the world (I found links saying it was the highest but I don't know how reliable they are) and the average life expectancy is below 80 years old.
I don't know why more competition, would help, or even functionally work. Wouldn't that just drive up costs as the doctors (who are in fairly limited supply) could just demand higher salaries and/or less working hours?
Meaning the most vulnerable just continue to get ignored. Wouldn't a better funded and free social system for helping those in need serve everyone in the nation better?
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Joey D
Premium
- 47,462
- Lakes of the North, MI
- GTP_Joey
- GTP Joey
Yes, the US is the most expensive when it comes to healthcare. The reason is largely the result of government intervention. Like I said, our social medicine system is awful and requires patients to do all sorts of unneeded treatments. That inflates the cost pretty quick. Also with many insurance plans you need to see 1 or 2 other doctors prior to seeing a specialist, which once again raises the prices.
The way you buy insurance is strange too, I really can't shop around for the best plan. I need to either take what my employer gives me (which is typically expensive) or pay several hundred or thousand a month for insurance. I believe I have to buy insurance from the state I reside in too, so I can't go to say Colorado and pick up insurance even if it was cheaper. Finally, I can't buy drugs outside the country. If I could, I'd import my medication from Canada for a fraction of what it costs in the US. Most of this is the result of government regulation.
If we actually had competition, prices would go lower as a result. It's just the way economics work. If you have a monopoly on something, you can charge whatever you want and people will pay it because they need it to live. Look up the case against Valient Pharmaceuticals. They acted really shady and gamed the system, but never did anything illegal. People died as a result or went broke.
Finally, the FDA has a ton of red tape with getting new treatments approved. Companies pay millions to go through that process. Really it should be up to the patient if they want to risk an experimental treatment or not. Plus, there could easily be a third party who certifies drugs for use, much like we have a third party accredited hospitals.
As for a social healthcare system, did you see who's in charge of the US government? Trump and the asshats in Congress are not who I want running a healthcare system, nor making "business" decision regarding it. Let people who know healthcare run healthcare.
- 5,051
- Netherlands
It is very telling how much less exposure this story is getting, because it doenst involve:
A. an immigrant
B. a violent shooting game
C. young attractive girl
And I am calling out both left and right media. There is no common sense in hanging on to gun laws in their current state. More weapons will not prevent mass shootings!
edit: corrected spelling
A. an immigrant
B. a violent shooting game
C. young attractive girl
And I am calling out both left and right media. There is no common sense in hanging on to gun laws in their current state. More weapons will not prevent mass shootings!
edit: corrected spelling
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
The reason it's not multi-day news is twofold:
1. 24 hour news cycle
2. Not enough victims. Harsh but true, only 2 or 3 victims only gets you a day near the top before you are replaced by Russian collusion, a Trump tweet, someone using the wrong word 3 decades ago and they and maybe their son losing their entire careers over it or a Kardashian saying something tittilating. If it weren't for the videogame angle and the live Twitter feed I doubt this would even have made national news to begin with.
Last edited:
- 5,051
- Netherlands
I understand fully, but I made my comment compared to the Mollie Tibbet's murder which got significant more exposure.
edit: changed grammar
Similar threads
