NA Inline 4 - 16 Valvers

  • Thread starter a112
  • 27 comments
  • 1,260 views
a112

a112

Auto Partes Restorations
Premium
1,166
Croatia
Zagreb,Croatia
I will keep it short and simple.

As I'm daily driving the UK Spec SR20DE P10 Primera rated at 150bhp but most people dyoned 160-170bhp on standard engines, I was wondering what cars should I consider next. I liked most of the Hondas, but gave up on them due to several reasons. I would prefer The DC2 Integra, but that's out of the price range.

I'm mostly interested in a car that has around 2000cc and good torque and midrange power figures.

Problem number one: Drove a K20 EG, H22A Prelude, 2ZZGE Corolla - not impresed with variable cam engines. All these cars I drove didn't have low and midrange power/torque - my P10 pulls really really strong in comparison to these cars.

Only other engine that behaves like the SR20DE I know and really like is the GM C20XE, but I hate every possible production car that was equipped with it, and block is all steel.


Question: What are other engines that have simmilar/better specs and in what chassis?

Possible solutions:

PSA XU10RS - Xsara VTS or Peugeot 306 swapped
Renault F7R - Clio Williams
Lampredi DOHC 16V - Tipo Sedicivalvole

In other words, I'm in pursuit of some other oldschool 2 litre 16v lump if there is one.

PS: If your only experience of comparison comes from straight line pulls, don't bother. All those variable cam engines with right transmission eat my SR20DE P10 in said conditions, but it's a whole another story in real life conditions where I live (mountain passes and winding roads)

Thank You all in advance!
 
A/S/L?

Seriously, a clue to where you live might be a help. I'm assuming Somewhere in Europe? Your budget too would be useful.

How about an Alfa with the twin spark?
 
If you are after a Seidicivalvole, then I hear the 5-door is the torquier model than the 3. Good luck finding either though if you're UK based.
 
I'm not currently in the market, This was more of a theoretical question, but I'm interested in some opinions. I'm located in Eastern Europe, that's an important factor as most of the japanese cars aren't top of the line JDM version but EUDM counterparts. Due to economy crisis, some of the popular hot hatches and performance cars are affordable and cheap.

My main part of the question is, what is the bang for the buck in comparison to my current car. I found K20 EG to be better for spirited driving, but not enough to justify the price of the swap/car. DC2 would be the ultimate weapon despite the smaller engine and lack of torque, but it's very high priced. BB Prelude didn't impress me with the engine nor the chassis. 2ZZGE Corolla has some serious power also, but the car isn't that good, and the VVT is harsh in the upper part of the power curve.

I also had a chance to test the E30 320is that has destroked M3 engine called S14B20 rated @ 192BHP. I couldn't feel the power to be honest, I also found the SR20DE stronger for the most of the power curve as the S14 is really really linear in the delivery, therefore the engine wasn't as great as the SR20 for that kind of driving style.

It's important to know that I find all of these cars really good, but I had somewhat bigger expectations from them.

On the subject of Alfa TS. Not impressed. I drove some most of the cars with 1.6/1.8 engines, haven't had a chance to try the 145 QV but I will soon.
 
MK3 Golf GTI 16V is not an option due to bad suspension design and ABF in stock form isn't that impressive, there are plenty more reasons why Golf isn't good for this application, but not that relevant.

All of the 405 Mi16/309 GTI16 are ruined or scraped. 306 I believe is a better car, and so is the Clio Williams, but maintenance and repairs are the worst. Transmission/Clutch/Driveshaft problems, electrical stuff, torsion bars etc. Good race cars though, all of them.

Primera has multilink suspension standard, braking is not that bad, overall balance is really good. You feel really safe pushing the car. Although I do have stiffer suspension and close ratio diff fitted to the car. Steering is not great, initial turn in is slow, but cornering is good. I wouldn't like to go beneath that level with the next car. It would be good for the car to be 1100kg or less if possible (1200kg current) with simmilar engine/chassis peformance.

There is an SR20DE equipped Sunny GTi local car that I'm interested in, but it's not available for sale at the moment.
Although the chassis/suspension isn't as good as P10's, it's lighter and there is a room for improvement. I wanted a car with a different but simmilar engine (Nissan excluded) and keep the P10 so I could enjoy some other engine, but it seems to me that I'm going for the SR20 again.
 
Why have you limited your search to such a specific engine requirement? It sounds like you really love your Nissan for what it is, so it seems odd that you're looking for a car that's so similar. You've mentioned that you aren't a fan of engines with variable valve timing because of their lack of driveability at low revs, so my opinion is that you'd enjoy a larger displacement 6 cylinder engine. It might not be quite as cheap to run but as a car specifically bought for fun I suspect it will offer a more potent and more focused driving experience.

I have no idea what your budget is, nor do I know what the market is like where you live. But here are some suggestions I have based simply on a search of Autotrader UK. I haven't driven any of these cars and you've listed very few concrete, quantitative requirements, so they will likely not appeal to you at all, but it's a start and should give you some cars you can go out and test drive just to see how they feel.
Alfa Romeo GTV 3.0 V6
BMW E36, E46 with any straight 6
Nissan 350Z
Toyota Celica 2.0

It's an odd list but they all seem to fit, to an extent, with what you're looking for.
 
The E36 would be cheap enough and the 325i or 328i are torquey for the type. They handle well, but aren't the most forgiving when you get it wrong. The E46 with the 3.0 is another fine choice and the car itself is nicer than the cheap-feeling 36.
 
I'm looking to get a lighter car if possible. I don't like the feeling of driving a heavier car. Had a chance to drive a lot of cars that wasn't that great in reality but they were great on paper. E36 is not an option if it's not the M3 that is expensive and even more expensive to maintan. Had a M50B25 in the E30, couldn't feel the power, to be honest.

Focus is a good example. Does anyone have some experience with Zetec engined cars? Also there is a 4G63 Galant for sale nearby, but it's AWD and heavy. The suspension is good, brakes are OK even on the basic models.

Why I4-16V - Cheap to maintan, best bang for the buck. Light engines (SR20DE all Aluminium is around 100kg dry - good weight balance) etc.

6 cylinder cars are all heavy and more robust.
 
Unless it was engine swapped, it's not an M50 in the E30.

The Zetec Focus won't feel that quick. The ST170 was noted to be a bit slow.
 
Swapped M50B25 yeah. Friend has an M20B25 with fast road cam, real stainless header and some headwork and it's better allround than the M50.

Too bad about the Focus as there are some ex circuit racing cars for sale around registered for road use relatively cheap.
 
Rover K series? They only go to 1.8 but its a cracking platform, light, compact and with a whole bunch of tuning options
 
There are some SW20s in the price range, even one Yamaha 3SGE. I had an idea of buying a Miata and build a stroker but It has to be a reliable daily. What kind of car is the SW20 vs the AW11 or a Miata if anyone knows first hand?
 
Miata is slow, and AW11 is even slower. The chassis makes up for the power however. 99-05 Miata's are the best years chassis wise and have a good, simple VVT system when equipped.
 
DolHaus
Rover K series? They only go to 1.8 but its a cracking platform, light, compact and with a whole bunch of tuning options
Click to expand...
I'd second this. They have their issues, but if looked after and with the weaker points eliminated (and it is possible), they can make great power. They used to put them in Lotus and Caterhams at all sorts of power outputs - several making over 100hp/litre.
 
a112
There are some SW20s in the price range, even one Yamaha 3SGE. I had an idea of buying a Miata and build a stroker but It has to be a reliable daily. What kind of car is the SW20 vs the AW11 or a Miata if anyone knows first hand?
Click to expand...

The AW11 is about as quick in a straight line as the MX5 in NA guise but the MR2 had the option of the supercharged 4AGZE which pepped it up quite a bit.

However in terms of its handling the AW11 does like some lift-off oversteer in the wet whereas the SW20 is more forgiving in this respect, but both deliver predictable mid-engined handling (understeer near the limit progressing to oversteer).

Not an inline 4 but interesting all the same: what about Mazda's K-series all-alloy V6?
 
a112
I had an idea of buying a Miata and build a stroker but It has to be a reliable daily.
Click to expand...
The two aren't mutually exclusive. An 89mm crank in an 1839 shouldn't require clearancing and my own 1.8 was punched out to 85.5mm making it a 1.9--the combination should bring you to over 2 liters. As @Eunos_Cosmo stated, though, the MZR in the NC is a spectacular motor--but it's not an NA. :P

Bear in mind stroking is pricey even without machine work to the case. That's why I opted for the larger bore.
 
I eventually decided to build my P10, even though a near 2 liter NA Miata is the thing I woud like to do in near future.
 

Similar threads

a112
My Centos and street/track engine build
Replies
7
Views
8K
ZGBox
ZGBox
AfraidRacer
GT Sport Track Tests - Mazda RX-7 vs Honda NSX
Replies
4
Views
2K
AfraidRacer
AfraidRacer
VBR
The GTS Force Feedback Problems Thread
2
Replies
43
Views
17K
VBR
VBR
Cristobal1234
Ferrari Purosangue Prototype 2022
Replies
0
Views
1K
Cristobal1234
Cristobal1234
TayeezSA
Opel Kadett (E) GSi SUPERBOSS 1990
Replies
10
Views
17K
Dennis-GT
Dennis-GT

Latest Posts

Back