NASCAR Thread.

[YSSMAN]

How long till Montoya runs in the Nextel Cup series?

He already does. He'll be racing this Sunday in Las Vegas. He has been a mid-pack finisher for the most part, usually hovering in the 20's... Although I'm not certain if he has ever finished on the lead-lap... Remember, they've only gone to Daytona and California thus far...

 

[musclecarlover]

Me, im a fan of Richard Petty and my favorite Track is the Daytona 500, where all begun.

 

[JohnBM01]

Like I said, he didn't mean to tag Pruett. I've seen it as incidental contact. I don't see it so much as "wanting all the glory." He's no Tony Stewart. He's no "if I have to spin you out to win, I will," kind of guy. Maybe I don't watch too much Formula One to know what Juan Pablo is capable of outside of talent, but I do know that Juan Pablo Montoya comes to play every day. He'll fight hard unless his car is crap (remember the 2000 Champ Car season?). These are reasons why I respect Montoya for what he does. I think he's going to win perhaps many more races this season, if not next. This also means that I have two favorites to win races in Nextel Cup- Jeff Gordon and Juan Pablo Montoya. I wonder if the two still have respect for each other considering that one-off stock car to F1 car and F1 car to stock car deal...

 

[m.piedgros]

John, I respect your opinion a ton! Unfortunately I disagree with you on this one. Montoya's contact was certainly avoidable and the fact that it was on a teammate really burns me. I think we can all agree he had the better car all day, and was on fresher tires to getting by was inevitable, I think part of the reason for the contact was he was getting a little to itchy on the trigger finger and we could call that (failed) pass an accidental discharge or what have you but I think it was inexcusable. Like Scott said in his post race interview that is what the team harps on - not taking out teammates that it - and that is precisely what Montoya did when a 1-2 finish looked inevitable. I think Montoya is better off in NASCAR with his driving style than an open-wheeler because in NASCAR there is a lot less danger involved with the bumping and contact is what Touring Car racing all over the globe seems to promote, its part of what makes it so exciting. However, this was unacceptable and I expect he has received an earful from Chip and Felix, heck probably Brad Parrot as well and he'll learn from this and most likely develop into a NASCAR Cup champion. We saw good runs from him in the end of '06 and this win will only make him even more dangerous. He has now won in stock cars, so he knows he can do it. He can take it in strides, start with a couple wins at Pocono (Denny Hamlin-esc, especially with the first win coming at Mexico) and then get more comfortable with the bumping and grinding of short tracks, and tracks like Texas, Charlotte, California and Michigan will come to him. Not to mention he will always be a threat at Sonoma and Watkins every year. As his stock car IQ grows the top tens, fives, and wins will start to show up and consistent performances and finishes will follow. He just needs to remember to screw his head on tight. Kind of like Stewart had to and now Tony is quite possibly the best driver in Cup. Not to leave out Gordon(s) (both Robby and Jeff) as well as JPM... but Stewart seems to play the role of the wiley veteran almost Intimidator like in his policing of all drivers and even NASCAR itself. But now I'm getting WAY off topic.

m.piedgros

 

[Jim Prower]

I said it earlier: some of the roughest drivers in NASCAR's "Golden '80s" are now legends. (one of them, arguably, the biggest of all, Mr. Earndhardt.) A lot of people don't like Montoya because he's not American, and this is just more reason for them to hate him. I'm willing to give him a chance.

If he sticks with it, could he be a legend 20 years from now?

 

[m.piedgros]

I think the only people who don't like him are Chevy, Ford, and Toyota fans who hate that he's driving a Ganassi Dodge. That or someone who hated him from his Formula 1 career. Then there is me, I loathed Montoya in F1 but since coming to NASCAR I respect him a lot more and I am pulling for him to do well.

m.piedgros

 

[JohnBM01]

If this all this hate of him comes down to the fact he's not American, then that's just sad. Ron Fellows is Canadian, and he's loved by American and Candian race fans (I respect the guy myself). But is this another double standard? Talent comes from a number of places. I think it does boil down to talent coming from all sorts of places as opposed to just American talent. The one I think I hated was people thinking there was going to be some "Latin Invasion" when Juan Pablo Montoya wanted to come to NASCAR. Do stock car drivers HAVE to be from America to be loved by the general public? Isn't there a guy named Marcus Ambrose doing NASCAR Trucks? Where's he from? What if Sebastien Bourdais (a Frenchman to you haters) came to NASCAR? Maybe I'd be an anti-Christ of American racing by respecting a highly-talented non-American racer

You know what? This is sort of a "live by the sword, die by the sword" deal. NASCAR wants to diversify, and what they are getting is some international support. They race on a nice Mexican course and will head to Canada in August. Diversity is what they wanted. Diversity is what they are getting. Welcome to the rest of the world.

 

[m.piedgros]

The all mighty Marcos has moved up to the Busch series. In fact there is a rather comical ad he is in I enjoy. I doubt the people who don't like him, or certainly not the majority by any means, dislike him because he is Latin. A huge segment of the American population (legal and illegal ;-) haha) are Latins. Is that to say NO ONE dislikes him because he is Latin, fella, if you believe there are no bigots left in the world you are in for a rude awakening when there is another celebrity off to rehab after making off color remarks. And I personally can't respect Bourdais because he is a poor sport who thinks he is the greatest thing since sliced bread, as a karter myself, there is a difference between confidence and cockiness. Confidence=good, cockiness=bad.

m.piedgros

 

[JohnBM01]

Mentioned on "WindTunnel with Dave Despain," NASCAR drivers were asked what is the most boring race track in the series. Pocono is the most boring race track as said by some of the NASCAR racing personalities. Do you agree?

 

[mwoodski]

Definitely, it is utterly, and completely, BORING.

 

[Pupik]

...Pocono is the most boring race track as said by some of the NASCAR racing personalities. Do you agree?

Not really, it has that super-long front straight, and a tight first turn. I've always liked it, for some reason; tires played a big part there in many races since it's a tough track on those Goodyears. Maybe the throng that arrives with the NASCAR circus doesn't like the surrounding area of Pocono, which is mostly rural and mountainous.

Loudon ranks as one of the most boring race tracks for NASCAR; it least, I can't recall watching an exciting race there, since it's too short and too narrow for Nextel Cup cars.

For all the hype, the 400-mile races at the Brickyard have rarely been exciting. Again, the track has one line, and one line only, for the width of a Nextel Cup car.

 

[JohnBM01]

If you're going to hate on Pocono because of "no passing," then don't wet your diapers. Pocono is probably the world's fastest road course. At least Pocono is a unique challenge compared to ovals that seem to look like one another. There may be a few oval courses that look like California Superspeedway, but how many look like Pocono? Pocono also takes place in a beautiful setting. My parents actually been to the Pocono mountains. I even tell my mom about when NASCAR races at Pocono. It is a great challenge. One could probably say that Loudon is pretty boring. It's not seriously an exciting track having raced it before in countless NASCAR sim games. The road course configuration sort of goes outside of the oval. I don't really know what track I'd consider the most boring. It certainly ISN'T Pocono, I can tell you that.

I'm going to surprise some of you. I kind of think Watkins Glen gets boring, and I'll tell you why. First of all, I'm not saying it's boring because it's a road course, so you can forget that. I just don't really like Watkins Glen as much as, say, Sears Point. It doesn't really stick out at me as much despite that wicked finish last year or so in the Busch series. There are some better alternatives for an East Coast or somewhat-east course. These include:

* Virginia International Raceway
* Barber Motorsports Park

Or how about these:
* Sebring
* Road Atlanta

But that's just me. Have you any votes for "most boring NASCAR course?"

 

[m.piedgros]

Perhaps the car of tomorrow will be excellent on road courses and NASCAR would consider using the full Watkins Glen circuit. I think that would help fix the racing. I love Watkins Glen and IMO the Long Course, or the old GP course is the only way to go. The deformed oval that NASCAR run just isn't a great road course. Didn't NASCAR originally run the long course? If so, why did they change to the short course? Timing and distance issues? Safety issues? The cynic in me believes NASCAR love to throw the full course caution, know they get plenty in their road course races and felt that the shorter course would aid in getting them over with quicker? Why not run the long course and when under full course caution use the short course? Does that make sense? I digress...

m.piedgros

 

[Jim Prower]

* Virginia International Raceway
* Barber Motorsports Park

Not well known...and VIR's more of an amateur course anyway, from what I've seen. I mean, Motorweek tests there.

* Sebring
* Road Atlanta

Road Atlanta would be fantastic, but might be too close to Atlanta Motor Speedway for that track's comfort. Sebring....is pancake flat, with super rough surfaces. It should have more use out of it, though.

I'd like to see Mt. Panorama on the schedule...that'll never happen.

 

[m.piedgros]

Aside from other issues that may arise with VIR (which is easily one of America's best road courses) is the fact that it is on a big plot of what I assume would otherwise be farm land or something. Though it is serviceable, NASCAR prefer sticking people into grandstands the same way I try to get every Cola into that little row on the fridge that can, with a ton of room hold eleven but the twelfth seems to want to break out... so NASCAR would want to see Grand Stands, and a lot of them, before they race there. Heck, a lot of NASCAR teams test at VIR (along with Road Atlanta fyi) so clearly the track is seemingly usable by NASCAR teams. Forty three NASCAR teams? That still has to be answered. Otherwise the only real issue is the lack of Grand Stands. But please, don't discount VIR, it is a terrific track.

m.piedgros

I'd also like to note that VIR handled 100+ cars or something crazy like that for the Grand-Am Cup finale there last October and the Grand-Am series bring forty, fifty and sixty cars there regularly if my memory serves me.

P.S. Mount Panorama probably won't ever happen, but NASCAR did race at Suzuka didn't they (an exhibition race in the ninties or something.) So perhaps a race at a more NASCAR friendly circuit in Oz wouldn't be out of the cards. Who knows, maybe with Marcos Ambrose coming to America the interest could grow enough to bring at least an exhibition or Busch race to the land down under.

 

[mwoodski]

BRing em down under, and to Calder, like they did before, on the Thunderdome.

 

[dougiemeats]

So, apparently Jeff Gordon's tribute after his victory managed to create quite an uproar amongst a few fans. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Personally, I didn't see anything disrespectful in Jeff Gordon's actions. Is it really that hard to believe in the possibility that the man genuinely wanted to honor the late Dale Earnhardt?

 

[thebtspecial]

There wasn't anything wrong with what he did. People have a hard time believing that those two actually liked each other. They were rivals on the track and friends off it. I thought it was a very classy act on his part that he carried the flag for so long because of what tying Earnhardt meant to him. Unfortunatley it seems that sometimes people just want to hate Gordon.

 

[JohnBM01]

I've been meaning to come in here and bring up Jeff Gordon's win. Most of you know that I love Jeff Gordon. He is one of the finest in the game, and I congratulate him on being tied for sixth all-time in NASCAR wins with Dale Earnhardt Sr. I thought his tribute was great no matter what anyone says. Maybe some of those fans having an uproar were the same fans that soiled him in food and empty beer cans when Jeff Gordon clearly beat Dale Earnhardt Jr. (of course, people usually treat it like a crime against humanity if Tony Stewart or Dale Earnhardt Jr. doesn't win the race). I think J. Gordon is going to pass Dale Earnhardt for victories before this season is done. But for him to take down some of the other greats, he's going to have to dominate for a long time to catch up to and even pass Richard Petty. I'm not saying he will get 200+ wins, but he's going to be one of the all-time greats once he hangs it up. Jeff Gordon is 35, but I still think of him as the young cat that can still win races and perform at his absolute best- even in losing efforts. I got into racing around 1998 or 1999. I still see him as that already-great talent that will be even greater. I mean, he's got to be among some of the all-time greats in not only NASCAR, but in American motorsports period. He's done more before age 30 than almost anyone else in NASCAR.

People hate him, but I love and respect his racing ability. He's not the teenybopper favorite or the "all eyes on me" kind of guy. He's just out there to get it done on the track and make others follow his lead. Congratulations to Jeff Gordon. And as a segway into Talladega, that's the next track. This won't be the Car of Tomorrow race, but it will be... Talladega. Meaning that the probability of "The Big One" comes into play. Suffice to say, I actually like Daytona and Talladega. Question is, will the fans be nicer if Jeff Gordon wins at Talladega this coming weekend and not dump crap all over his car? Just a thought.

 

[Solid Fro]

I didn't think nothing of Gordon when he did that and I'm a big Earnhardt fan. Jr. went over after the race and congratulated Gordon, he didn't seem to have a problem with it. I even feel bad for hating on Gordon so much since his win.

How do you guys feel about the Car of Tomorrow? Hate it or love it?

 

[GilesGuthrie]

How do you guys feel about the Car of Tomorrow? Hate it or love it?

Is it a love/hate thing? I'm not convinced by it stylistically, but then outside of the US we're very much spoiled for pretty saloon racing cars. I think that NASCAR had a very difficult job on their hands to update the Cup car in terms of its safety and general construction, and whilst I thought that the gradual introduction was madness at first, now I can see the benefits of it.

Towards the end of the Phoenix race, one of the commentators remarked that the top drivers are still top drivers, and the top teams are still top teams, so I think that as a Cup car, CoT is meeting its goals. Sure, it's not perfect yet, but then the CoY was never exactly bulletproof, was it?

 

[thebtspecial]

I don't really hate the car, nor do I love it. Lookswise I really like the front and the dimensions. I still can't get around the wing. I kinda wish they would throw the lip spoiler back on, or at least let the teams paint the wing to match. Performance wise, its produced some very nice racing. Drivers can now bump and bang into each other and still be competitive. I'm still anxious to see how it will do at Talladega or Daytona. So far I'd give the car a B+.

 

[Jim Prower]

I don't really hate the car, nor do I love it. Lookswise I really like the front and the dimensions. I still can't get around the wing. I kinda wish they would throw the lip spoiler back on, or at least let the teams paint the wing to match. Performance wise, its produced some very nice racing. Drivers can now bump and bang into each other and still be competitive. I'm still anxious to see how it will do at Talladega or Daytona. So far I'd give the car a B+.

I agree on everything except the wing, and I tend to disagree with the drivers who complain that it doesn't have enough grip and is "Too hard to drive." I mean, come on, view it as a challenge!

As I see it, this car performs like I'd think one of the old late '70s/Early '80s cars would on modern tires, and with more downforce. I'd love to see a full-width wing, might help the grip issue some, but I doubt NASCAR would be willing to do that.

 

[GilesGuthrie]

Drivers will say one of two things about a car:
- It doesn't have enough grip
- It doesn't have enough power

Sometimes they will say both of these things, but since the driving experience is derived from the gripower ratio, you want them to be complaining of insufficient grip, because that means they have too much power.

 

[ND4SPD]

Anyone remember when Nascar went to Suzuka? Well I was thinking about it today and I remember during one of the races it started pour and the teams were forced to use the goodyear rain tires for the first time. Well, does anyone have a clip of this race at all? I've been wanting to see this footage for ages. I do remember seeing a clip of it once on Speedvision(SPEED channel before the switchover) it was a 10 second clip or so of the Winston cup cars coming down the front stretch of Suzuka in the pouring rain with their wipers flapping around. The last time I saw that clip would probably be atleast 9 years ago. If anyone knows or has any video of this I'd love to see it again. Also, I know that Nascar brings the rain tires to Watkins Glen in the event of rain and they also have windshield wiper motors installed in their cars, but has it ever rained during a watkins glen race, forcing them to race in the rain?!

 

[JohnBM01]

My favorite driver is Jeff Gordon. In sort of a freaky setting, one car gets spun out. Tony Stewart gets tagged a bit and spins out into a non-SAFER barrier wall. The green-white checkered deal means that Jeff Gordon now holds 6th all-time in wins. On Dale Earnhardt Sr.'s would-be birthday. What happened after J. Gordon's win has me wanting to sound off. Get ready because this may be a lot to read.

--- John's Sounds Off! Throwing Stuff on the Track and of Jeff Gordon ---

* WARNING: This may be very long! *

Think back to about 2004 or 2005 when Jeff Gordon clearly passed Dale Earnhardt Jr. for the win. What happened? People threw crap on Jeff Gordon's car. Let's look two years ago in football (as in soccer to us Americans) in Europe. Jeff Gordon wins on Dale Earnhardt Day at Talladega... and the fans throw more stuff at Jeff Gordon. Obviously proud of Jeff Gordon for passing Dale Earnhardt Sr. for sixth all-time in wins, this is really disgusting. This was a classless act committed by the people who thought it was a great idea to throw stuff at Jeff Gordon even as the authority at Talladega admonished fans about littering the race track by throwing stuff at people. This is one of the other reasons why I am not a full-fledged NASCAR fan- classless acts by some race fans, even to the point of stuff like what just happened at Talladega. It would have been a great story for Dale Earnhardt Jr. to win for his late father. Just don't make this into some sort of "if Dale Jr. loses, we will riot." So Dale Jr. or DEI didn't win. Tough break. I'm sorry. I didn't know that there was a rule in NASCAR that someone other than Jeff Gordon has to win every race on the NASCAR schedule.

This is very sad for a number of reasons. The first is simple- a complete lack of sportmanship. I know Jeff Gordon isn't as favored as "Smoke" or Dale Jr. But come on now. He's one of the best racers (much less NASCAR racers) still racing today. I always say that he's done more before age 30 in NASCAR than almost anyone else. He's won four championships and may damn well get #5 if he keeps up the good work this season. Just because he isn't a media darling or a particularly well-liked person doesn't mean you have to get on him like white on rice. Like Tony Stewart's complaints or Kyle Busch's wreck sprees are nothing compared to Jeff Gordon. Give me a break. It's okay not to like a driver, but it's not okay to do what some fans decided to do against Jeff Gordon at Talladega not just this year, but also a few years back. This brings me to my second reason why this is sad- fans' impact on the series. I know we have Freedom of Expression and Freedom of Speech and all, and I know that Jeff Gordon said that he's respectful of fan comments against Jeff Gordon after his Talladega win; but I'd be mad as Hell if I did abosultely nothing to hurt anyone as people soil me in crap if I won a race as big as this one in Talladega. Think about the message you're sending to race fans in America and even around the world about NASCAR. Most NASCAR fans don't care about the rest of the world (much less the rest of the world of racing), but think about this. What if a fan from America or another nation gets to see his/her first NASCAR Nextel Cup race for the first time either in person or on TV and something like this happens? Most people are going to be thinking, "what did he do to deserve this?" He won the race, didn't deny a fan favorite the win by slamming him into the wall, all for what? Soiling him? Like I said- screw the fact that this is Jeff Gordon winning on Dale Earnhardt Sr. Day and passing Dale Earnhardt Sr. for sixth all-time in wins. Think of the message you're sending to people who know very little about NASCAR and see something like this blatant show of disrespect towards one of the sport's finest. Would American and Canadian race fans throw crap at Audis in the ALMS for winning all the time? Would fans soil Kimi Raikkonen or Lewis Hamilton for winning a race? Has Jacky Ickx or Tom Kristensen had crap thrown at them for winning Le Mans outright? Do people throw crap at Sebastien Bourdais for winning Champ Car races? No, and you know why? Because most other race fans have class. While the fans had their favorites, they aren't threatening to kill themselves because their favorite driver didn't win the race. What if Jeff Gordon was still in his car and someone threw something at his right-side tires to make him spin out and hit something or someone? Then NASCAR and local law enforcement need to step up on-track security to seek out and arrest ANYONE who intentionally litters the race track or throws something at a certain driver. You wouldn't throw crap at someone if your favorite driver didn't win, so why Jeff Gordon and why now?

I'm mad as hell about this and can't believe some race fans stooped to this low. Not once, but twice at the same race track at around the same time of year. Get over it if your favorite driver didn't win and if your least favorite driver did win. Have some class and sportsmanship. Even ESPNEWS commentator, Kirk Gimenez, said, "how about some respect?" The beautiful thing about racing is that it's never about one party vs. another. It's usually about many people all battling among themselves. There are still teams, but it's still every one for themselves. Let's face facts. Jeff Gordon loved and respected Dale Earnhardt Sr. despite their racing rivalry. He knows what it means to knock off #3 when it was #24 vs. #3. It's nothing but respect for Jeff Gordon regardless of people who think this is a terrible lack of classlessness (like littering a race track and throwing stuff at a driver IS classy). It is a terrible shame to have to watch this happen to Jeff Gordon. And... hey, you know what? I'd hate to see this happen to ANY driver in ANY racing series. Even to drivers I don't necessarily like. There's better ways of dealing with drivers you don't like, and what was shown at Talladega was NOT one of them. People who decided to do what they just did not only disgraced NASCAR, but also disgraced American racing in general. We are much better than what was shown the past few years at Talladega when Jeff Gordon won. Reconsider your actions and think before you throw. You have a test coming up next race weekend. Study hard. Class is dismissed.


I'm also going to post this commentary on my Myspace page < http://www.myspace.com/22957000 >. What do you think about what I posted? Regardless, congratulations once again to Jeff Gordon and on his accomplishments he got with this race win.

 

[Solid Fro]

NASCAR blasphemy:

• Jeff Gordon wins
• Under caution
• At Talladega
• On Dale Earnhardt's Birthday
• Over taking Earnhardt's all-time wins.

Gordon would had to taken out Tony Stewart on the last lap to make it any worse and then he would need a helicopter to get out of Alabama alive.

In my opinion, the race should have kept going after David Reutimann's Camry blew up with four laps remaining. Waiting for fifteen minutes for the track to get cleaned up only for another caution and the end of the race really rubs me the wrong way.

 

[mwoodski]

The first time they threw stuff, was because NASCAR put the race under yellow with about 8 to go, had the track cleaned up with 4 to go, and held them under yellow for the last four laps.

 

[JohnBM01]

Brief NASCAR note: as many as 14 fans were banned for life from attending Talladega for a NASCAR race.

 

[thebtspecial]

Brief NASCAR note: as many as 14 fans were banned for life from attending Talladega for a NASCAR race.

Sounds good to me, I hope they can identify and ban more of those so called "fans".