Physics Changes - total garbage!

[Johnnypenso]

I have no idea to what level the game is involved in following realistic trends concerning grip from track conditions involving temperatures but the races do occur at different times of the day with variable levels of cloud cover which could very well affect the traction levels from one scenario to the other they are representing.
Same as a part of the track that is getting direct sunlight the grip could very well be much different than in a shaded area of the track. Again not knowing to what extent PD has these variables plugged into the physics it is just possible speculation but could explain why you feel like it is not the same.

Seeing as how PD has never once even hinted at dynamic track conditions, this is pretty much just shooting arrows in the dark and hoping they hit a target.

 

[Rinsky]

I have no idea to what level the game is involved in following realistic trends concerning grip from track conditions involving temperatures but the races do occur at different times of the day with variable levels of cloud cover which could very well affect the traction levels from one scenario to the other they are representing.
Same as a part of the track that is getting direct sunlight the grip could very well be much different than in a shaded area of the track. Again not knowing to what extent PD has these variables plugged into the physics it is just possible speculation but could explain why you feel like it is not the same.

To me the changes in grip are quite noticeable at different times of the day in GT6 and some tracks more than others.
Nürburgring Nordschleife being the most noticeable of them all. One would think it carried over into GTS but no proof of this.

 

[Dan Vincent]

As long as it’s the same for everyone best drivers still win

 

[ASH32]

As long as it’s the same for everyone best drivers still win

This is the debate though, does something else, say lag, cause grip loss for some and not others. It's not just that there is less grip than qualifying, which everyone does have to manage, some races there seems to be less grip than normal race grip (even in tyre/fuel off races) and this affects braking more than anything, sometimes the car just does not want to stop even in no traffic and braking where you normally do so, even before in some cases. In some cars they also becomes really unstable with the rear under brakes when it normally isn't like that.

It's not a new thing either, before the traction improvements that was where strange grip loss seemed to happen, since then it's braking instead.

 

[GTFraker]

Gotta be much more conservative in the opening laps; find the limits within the race conditions before you go pushing.

 

[CliveH]

Why would you put 100 litres in the tank for a 3 lap race? That's not simulating real world. We should be able to select our fuel level at the start and then play around with mixture. Should do this without guidance so it takes experience to know what to carry per track for the right number of laps. Now that would be fun!

 

[meck_rb7]

This is the debate though, does something else, say lag, cause grip loss for some and not others. It's not just that there is less grip than qualifying, which everyone does have to manage, some races there seems to be less grip than normal race grip (even in tyre/fuel off races) and this affects braking more than anything, sometimes the car just does not want to stop even in no traffic and braking where you normally do so, even before in some cases. In some cars they also becomes really unstable with the rear under brakes when it normally isn't like that.

It's not a new thing either, before the traction improvements that was where strange grip loss seemed to happen, since then it's braking instead.

Brake feeling is gone for me since 1.06...

 

[VFOURMAX1]

Seeing as how PD has never once even hinted at dynamic track conditions, this is pretty much just shooting arrows in the dark and hoping they hit a target.

I have noticed a very easily to follow trend which would seem to support the theory of tire temps having an effect on grip levels. Pre race warm up the first few curves on many tracks at maximum acceleration is like driving on an ice skating rink and after a few corners drastically improves.

Lap 1 of the actual race grip is better at the start than at the startup of the warm up lap but still improves after the first few corners after running them on lap 1 of the race.

I many times turn my best lap times in races with fuel consumption on between lap 5 and lap 8 and at times all the way to lap 10 and for that to be consistent as tire wear should be decreasing grip levels at the halfway point over fully warmed fresh tires then lessened fuel load would be a LOGICAL explanation. There have been post by other drivers that have also stated better lap times as it appears fuel load lessens.

I think those arrows are dead in the bullseye. PD is not well known for explaining the intricate details of how their systems work or what it attempts to mimic accounting for. If temps are not part of the equation then just being sunny or cloudy would be all needed for any scenario.

 

[advent]

I think the physics are messed up since 1.06. Check the video below and watch how the front wheels don't move in time with the cars movements.

 

[cleanLX]

I'm not the most skilled driver, so, to be somewhat competitive I pay attention to all these things too.
Note the time of day for the race, morning races are plain slippery... fog/mist/dew... noon seems to be the most grippy, anything outside that seems grip again falls off... times of day, sunny/overcast... track temp.
I have no data, but I sure have noticed this to be consistent.
First several corners are always slippery... cold tires. If you are up front and running hard the tires come in quicker than if you are further back and running in the pack (slower, less tire stress/heat)... factor that in for race starts.
Car at the beginning of the race handles different(cold tires/full fuel) than in middle(warm tires/medium fuel) or the end(wearing tires/low fuel).
Know when to conserve and when to push.
I often will yield a spot early on the first lap to keep from running so hard as to chance a over-driving situation. As a result I also often pick up a spot or more, not due to skill, but due to others going off track. Mid race I set my best times, but, I do not push the car, I just stay in check with those ahead (if my skills allow, sometimes I just get dropped). Late in the race I'll put the hammer down having conserved tires and now light on fuel, and as a result often grab a spot late in the race because others have worn their tires to a point they are no longer competitive with "ok" tires (be it me making a real pass, or, again faster drivers seeing pressure, but on less than ideal tires... now go off track).
Like I say, I'm far from fast, but... steady pace wins the race... well... I don't win but I most often I place higher than I started. Good enough for me.

I think the physics are messed up since 1.06. Check the video below and watch how the front wheels don't move in time with the cars movements.

I would rely less on what the replay captures and more on what the car acted like during the event. Look at in car steering wheel/hands movements for example... yikees!
I've also caught several slides with a little "opposite lock", then gone back to the replay thinking it would make a great photo... only for the replay to show no "opposite lock" at all... simply showing the fronts pointed straight ahead... yet the slide was recovered with definite opposite steering angle... I watch and try to learn from my replays, but I do not take graphical representation of any steering inputs with any weight. I think breaking, throttle and car attitude are well represented... steering... nope.

 

[Baconink]

When you are in an online race and no other car is anywhere nearby to interrupt your aero, don't you think your car should handle the same as it does on a qualifying run?

I just rage quit a sport mode race for the very first time. The physics were total crap during the race, and there was no other car anywhere too be seen, so the aero explanation is non-existent here. It was the first lap and I had already screwed up, so most cars went by and I was all alone on my section of the track. I was driving exactly as I did during the qualifying run and my car was sliding off the track everywhere. There was hardly any grip, like my tires were already worn out. Ya I know I need to drive more carefully around other cars, that's not what is happening here. The physics changed radically between the qualifying run and the race.

This is BS!

Chill out lol

 

[Johnnypenso]

I'm not the most skilled driver, so, to be somewhat competitive I pay attention to all these things too.
Note the time of day for the race, morning races are plain slippery... fog/mist/dew... noon seems to be the most grippy, anything outside that seems grip again falls off... times of day, sunny/overcast... track temp.
I have no data, but I sure have noticed this to be consistent.
First several corners are always slippery... cold tires. If you are up front and running hard the tires come in quicker than if you are further back and running in the pack (slower, less tire stress/heat)... factor that in for race starts.
Car at the beginning of the race handles different(cold tires/full fuel) than in middle(warm tires/medium fuel) or the end(wearing tires/low fuel).
Know when to conserve and when to push.
I often will yield a spot early on the first lap to keep from running so hard as to chance a over-driving situation. As a result I also often pick up a spot or more, not due to skill, but due to others going off track. Mid race I set my best times, but, I do not push the car, I just stay in check with those ahead (if my skills allow, sometimes I just get dropped). Late in the race I'll put the hammer down having conserved tires and now light on fuel, and as a result often grab a spot late in the race because others have worn their tires to a point they are no longer competitive with "ok" tires (be it me making a real pass, or, again faster drivers seeing pressure, but on less than ideal tires... now go off track).
Like I say, I'm far from fast, but... steady pace wins the race... well... I don't win but I most often I place higher than I started. Good enough for me.

Are you talking about Arcade Mode or Sport Mode?

 

[Corsa]

I think PD employees and Kaz are crying because they don't know how to make the physics it better for the players anymore.

It must be a very frustrating position to be in.
On one side are guys like me that really wish they'd bring the physics and tire model closer to the competition.
On the other side are those that want the pick up and go fast anyone can edge the car physics.

They can't make everyone happy so they dig in middle ground.
Rightfully so in the interest of sales as I feel the majority of Gran Turismo racers do not care about things like tire deformation, proper standing starts or trail-braking (understeer correction through oversteer introduction)

I absolutely think they could be on par (or better) than the competitions physics if they wanted.
They have the time, resources and manpower.

 

[cleanLX]

Are you talking about Arcade Mode or Sport Mode?

Sport

 

[Knukel]

I think one could do a lap time/driving feel comparison at Suzuka East both in drift lobby (or cruise room that has been up for several hours with short track) and in Arcade mode/Private room... To see if it's connection related.
P.S. In GT6 i found normal circuit driving in drift rooms more difficult than in 'fresh good quality' rooms on CH tyres.

 

[OdeFinn]

Higher your tire wear rate (i.e. x3) reduces also grip.
Higher rate = less grip

 

[Johnnypenso]

Sport

So you experience differences in handling due to tire wear and fuel usage in a 4 lap sprint?

 

[cleanLX]

hmm, good question... I've not run a "sprint" race since they had the one make Cayman's on NurbGP... so I honestly don't recall.

 

[Amaru]

I think the physics are taking into account the extra weight of the fuel load which a car would carry at race start that they would not put in the car for qualifying. Also Tires would not be optimum temperature for grip at race start which again could affect handling on the first lap.

Warm up lap grip at the beginning is even worse which would add some reasoning to the tire temps being a factor and although better at race start over the beginning of warm up still not at optimum grip level for at least half of a lap on the first lap.

I usually turn my fastest laps between lap 5 and 8 of a 10 lap race which again could be related to fuel load decreasing in a race that has fuel consumption enabled.

I usually laugh at the number of drivers that go full tilt like they are trying to win the race on the last lap and then go sliding and barrelling off the track due to limited grip at the start of the warm up lap. Even on the warm up lap if you run 85% through the first half of the lap then you can push it if you want for the last half of the lap.

I usually stay at the 85-90% pace as in a race with tire wear the warm up lap should be affecting your tires through the life of the tire so I do not want to push the tires hard before the actual start of the race. Whether in game it works the same who knows.

This is exactly what should be happening, but what is not happening in daily races. It's a bug which is causing this "change" in grip.

99% of the time when i start from pole i set the fastest lap of the race in the 2nd lap -matching my qualifying time- and then I aim for pure consistency rather that trying to go even faster.

The amount of grip I feel going into T1 at the start of lap 1 doesn't feel less grippy than it does halfway through the race.

It's a bug. I reckon it's the same bug -not properly fixed- which caused setups not to work on cars in daily races if a player did not take part in the pre-race warm-up back at the end of October before PD decided to ruin daily racing by introducing fixed setups.

No, when you're having the feeling you lack grip during a daily race as soon as the race has started, you're driving a bugged car & aren't experiencing cold tyres.

I'm 100% convinced of this, I can feel it on both my G29 & my T500RS the moment this 'bug' kicks in, day & night difference in car handling and it lasts the entire race.