Polyphony Digital Has Been Working on GT Sport's HDR Feature for Three Years

[JTB10000]

Well, look at the crash damage. Obviously very little to no work has been done on it over the past 5 or so years. PD working on AI for 3 years isnt a given considering there is supposedly just one guy working on it based on the end credits in GT6. If they made no progress on damage (it actually looks like they've regressed in terms of damage based on how its completely lacking in GTS), how can we be sure they made progress on AI?

Kaz has made it abundantly clear if he doesnt care for a feature, like damage, he will ignore it. With his focus on e-sports and online with GTS to me its more clear then ever he doesnt really care about his team producing quality AI. Kaz has a very narrow vision and anything outside that gets ignored.

According to this, Kaz actually does care about damage. Chill, they're probably still working on it, bringing it to acceptable standards to show to the public.

Who knows, maybe the A.I. are still a work in progress too.

Since we have no idea how far off GTS is (it could be December 2017 for all we know), we can't assume its completion.

 

[Johnnypenso]

According to this, Kaz actually does care about damage. Chill, they're probably still working on it, bringing it to acceptable standards to show to the public.

Who knows, maybe the A.I. are still a work in progress too.

Since we have no idea how far off GTS is (it could be December 2017 for all we know), we can't assume its completion.

I think you're right. When Kaz promises something he delivers!!

“Finally, when asked about the alleged arrival of Gran Turismo 7 in 2017, as initially feared by some sources, it came a blunt denial: “People will never wait so much.”

Oops

 

[John_Marsten]

According to this, Kaz actually does care about damage. Chill, they're probably still working on it, bringing it to acceptable standards to show to the public.

Yep, he cares so much about damage that he has been working on it for nearly 20 years.

And if we apply the same logic to A.I!!! Damn!! it must be the single most important element of the entire GT series, cause he's been 'working' on that since day dot.

 

[JTB10000]

Yep, he cares so much about damage that he has been working on it for nearly 20 years.

Damage was obviously never a priority to his team all those years. That interview just comes across as Kaz's acknowledgement that damage simulation would get the attention it needed from then on.

Same goes for the sounds: they obviously weren't a priority before, he was aware they were really lacking, and now they've been improved a considerable amount (imo).

Just remaining optimistic in the sea of all the things to be pessimistic about in GTS.

 

[John_Marsten]

Damage was obviously never a priority to his team all those years. That interview just comes across as Kaz's acknowledgement that damage simulation would get the attention it needed from then on.

Same goes for the sounds: they obviously weren't a priority before, he was aware they were really lacking, and now they've been improved a considerable amount (imo).

Just remaining optimistic in the sea of all the things to be pessimistic about in GTS.

I like your style mate. My optimism however, has been long gone when it comes to GT, PD, and Yamauchi. IMO they have destroyed what was once the king of the console racers. Its a shame, but its just the way things are.

 

[Imari]

Same goes for the sounds: they obviously weren't a priority before, he was aware they were really lacking, and now they've been improved a considerable amount (imo).

Was he aware? As far as I know he only started admitting that they weren't great after the entire community started mocking him over the "too accurate" comment.

 

[Samus]

Just because the game is still unreleased and the article presents one of the various things PD is working on doesn't mean it was all they were working on!

No, it doesn't mean they were only working on that, but it seemingly shows where their priorities lie. We've seen the results of their hard work on graphics, the game looks great. So there is a direct correlation, they say they've worked on it for three years as well as other graphical areas, the results are great. We don't know how much effort or time they've put into things like AI and damage but so far we've seen little to no results. If they have spent as much time on those as they have the graphics we're not seeing the results in the same way. Not yet, anyway.

It's therefore quite reasonable for people to wonder if they have been spending as much time on those aspects as they have graphics, and where their priorities lie. One we see results, the others we don't.

I also have to laugh to myself that PD are bragging about being one of the first to start working with HDR whilst neglecting to mention those who started after them already have games out, PDs is nowhere in sight.

According to this, Kaz actually does care about damage. Chill, they're probably still working on it, bringing it to acceptable standards to show to the public.

Who knows, maybe the A.I. are still a work in progress too.

I admire your optimism but people have been saying the same before the release of most GT games. Until we see the results, like we do with graphics, it remains just talk.

 

[matherto]

HDR is available on the standard PS4.
Also, technology is moving forward. HDR will become the norm within this decade with many big brands already competing with this tech. The game industry would be dumb to not utilize HDR in the very near future.

Apparently I have to re-iterate this again:



Just because the game is still unreleased and the article presents one of the various things PD is working on doesn't mean it was all they were working on!

It always seems like anti-GT whining posts get liked the most on an article about GT on a site dedicated to GT.

We whine about GT because we have the highest expectations being the biggest fans of the series.

Go to any sports team forum and when they win people still find all the negatives and very few positives and when they lose the server usually crashes. The biggest fans are absolutely the hardest on their heroes.

We whine because we absolutely know what PD are like through years and years of empirical evidence through playing every game and noticing all the things they've failed to change and the ways in which they work which gives you the context for why they've failed to change them.

By now we know PD fixate themselves on little things like 3D, HDR (albeit I agree with you that it'll be the standard adopted and I'm glad to know the standard PS4 can do it, means I can hold off on the Pro for a little while longer) and never address the core issues of the game.

GT5 and GT6 didn't feel radically different to GT4. Most of the cars were carried over from GT3 and GT4 with very little improvement and the sound capturing has stayed the same throughout. Why is it every other car racing franchise out there can sound realistic but GT still sounds exactly like GT has always sounded? At this point it's way too far beyond a joke to expect them to have realistic sounds at all. Subsequent games will forever sound like 'GT', it's almost a trademark now.

HDR won't be the only thing they've been working on, for that we know for sure but we also know that unless they started afresh with a whole new crew then none of the longstanding problems we find with the games will ever be changed.

 

[lancia delta hf]

According to this, Kaz actually does care about damage. Chill, they're probably still working on it, bringing it to acceptable standards to show to the public.

Who knows, maybe the A.I. are still a work in progress too.

Since we have no idea how far off GTS is (it could be December 2017 for all we know), we can't assume its completion.

Am i the only wo remembers when GT6 was a placeholder for GT6 and it turned out GT6 placeholder was in fact the GT6 we got? Mislead or a blatant lie?

Blind faith in PDI today is faith misplaced.

 

[Samus]

Am i the only wo remembers when GT6 was a placeholder for GT6 and it turned out GT6 placeholder was in fact the GT6 we got? Mislead or a blatant lie?

Blind faith in PDI today is faith misplaced.

I mean, there is one lie/failed promise in that quote already.

 

[JTB10000]

I mean, there is one lie/failed promise in that quote already.

And which is that?

 

[Samus]

And which is that?

Finally, when asked about the alleged arrival of Gran Turismo 7 in 2017, as initially feared by some sources, it came a blunt denial: “People will never wait so much.”

It was pre-reveal, so he obviously wasn't going to correct the person asking the question on the name, but he was obviously still referring to GT Sport when he said that.

 

[CarBastard]

Am i the only wo remembers when GT6 was a placeholder for GT6 and it turned out GT6 placeholder was in fact the GT6 we got? Mislead or a blatant lie?

Blind faith in PDI today is faith misplaced.

That's what irks me the most. How can people turn this into a matter of faith? The unreasonable expectations and arguments from people here willing to defend Kaz and PoDi at all costs are not only absurd but, just like you said, misplaced.

It's a product. Either the one behind it makes a good product, which he hasn't been doing as of lately (see: GT5 and GT6), or you take your money elsewhere. Do feelings have something to do? Of course, I love Gran Turismo and have many fond memories of it but I won't stand for Kaz treating me like a dumb moneysack. Mind you, I've never seen criticism more constructive than the one you see here in GTP and still Kaz chooses to push his master genius mimesis artist vision down our throats instead of addresing the concerns we, the paying customers, have.

 

[lancia delta hf]

That's what irks me the most. How can people turn this into a matter of faith? The unreasonable expectations and arguments from people here willing to defend Kaz and PoDi at all costs are not only absurd but, just like you said, misplaced.

It's a product. Either the one behind it makes a good product, which he hasn't been doing as of lately (see: GT5 and GT6), or you take your money elsewhere. Do feelings have something to do? Of course, I love Gran Turismo and have many fond memories of it but I won't stand for Kaz treating me like a dumb moneysack. Mind you, I've never seen criticism more constructive than the one you see here in GTP and still Kaz chooses to push his master genius mimesis artist vision down our throats instead of addresing the concerns we, the paying customers, have.

Yep, the GT series has an emotional attachment with me. I have so many memories attached to it relating to periods of my life, but man GT5 was a kick in the nuts the first day i played it. Despite my emotional attachment to the series i have switched off my emotions and see it for what i think it is. Lost in its own mess, It's a bus being driven in the wrong lane by its driver (Kaz).

I dont think GT is ever coming back to its former glory unless Kaz wakes up or steps aside. The next GT should have not blown fans away but the competition and it hasn't even attempted to. RIP GT

 

[Griffith500]

Just like how the PS3 premium car models were suppose to be future proof?

By the time the tech that can take advantage of everything Kaz's team is adding makes it mainstream there will be newer, better tech and Kaz will again gleefully throw away all that his team has worked on to build a graphics engine that people wont be able to fully appreciate for years and the cycle will continue.

The only thing this news says to me is that Kaz is extremely wasteful with the resources he has available.

He is Ken Kutaragi, too ambitious for his own good. And apparently nobody is doing anything to rein him in.

No. Purely in terms of colour depth, a 16-bit floating-point physically-based renderer will be fine for a long time yet.

Did you miss the part where all HDR-output games are using this very same approach, out of necessity?

Stop overreacting based on a limited and flawed understanding of the technology.

 

[Spagetti69]

So the HDR feature is finished ?

 

[Griffith500]

So the HDR feature is finished ?

We've been seeing it in action already, so, aside from a bit of tweaking, I think we're good.

Again, we've had HDR renderers for a decade, but HDR output is what is new.

 

[SlimCharles]

View attachment 612949
The cars in GTS don't sound like vacuum cleaners any more, the joke is dead.

There has been improvement. But not so big that the joke is dead. If there is a racing game in the new generation that sound like vacuum cleaners, it would be close between GT Sport and SLRE...

 

[AKps3]

“In order to make the game compatible with HDR, we had to start by developing a camera that can actually capture the world within HDR format,” he said. “As a result, we ended up developing a camera that has 100 times the dynamic range over a standard digital camera today.”
http://fraghero.com/can-you-tell-th...his-popular-car-game-unbelievably-believable/

 

[Tired Tyres]

“In order to make the game compatible with HDR, we had to start by developing a camera that can actually capture the world within HDR format,” he said. “As a result, we ended up developing a camera that has 100 times the dynamic range over a standard digital camera today.”
http://fraghero.com/can-you-tell-th...his-popular-car-game-unbelievably-believable/

That stinks of the cars are too much for PS3. We're future proofing. All this 100 times whatever for 4K? 4K... an interim step to 8K. Okay.

 

[eran0004]

There has been improvement. But not so big that the joke is dead. If there is a racing game in the new generation that sound like vacuum cleaners, it would be close between GT Sport and SLRE...

I guess real life is doing it wrong as well.

 

[karelpipa]

I hear wind noise. Lastly heard in GT4 IIRC.

 

[Samus]

I guess real life is doing it wrong as well.

Hardly relevant with an awful microphone barely picking up any sound. Get a decent one and it's rather different:

 

[eran0004]

Hardly relevant with an awful microphone barely picking up any sound. Get a decent one and it's rather different:

That's a difference in driving style rather than a mic issue. One is a top speed run at a constant high rpm while the other is a gentle cruise around a track at a varying rpm, often building up from very low engine speeds. Let the car in your video get up to 350 km/h and it too would sound like a vacuum cleaner. Compare the start of my video with your video and you'll find that they sound more or less the same.

I hear wind noise. Lastly heard in GT4 IIRC.

Pretty sure I heard a lot of wind noise in GT5. There is also wind noise in GT6, but it is mostly toned down (aero brakes excepted).

 

[Samus]

If you think that is a high quality microphone and representative of what you would actually hear in there I'm not sure what else to say. Even the one I posted isn't that good, but it picks up more than the one in your video which is really only getting the wind noise. It doesn't even pick up the voices actually in the cockpit very well.

 

[eran0004]

If you think that the wind noise at 80 km/h is equivalent to the wind noise at 350 km/h I'm not sure what else to say

 

[McLaren]

Driving styles is why both videos sound different? Really? Couldn't possibly be the quality of both videos?

Still doesn't explain that @Samus's video is a more accurate representation of what the cars in GT spend most of their time (racing a track), and yet are sounding like they're doing top speed runs in the process (since that video is attempting to justify the "vacuum cleaner" sound).

 

[eran0004]

Driving styles is why both videos sound different? Really? Couldn't possibly be the quality of both videos?

Yes really. Cruising around a track at partial throttle and low rpm sounds nothing like going full throttle at high rpm. That is not a matter of microphone quality. Check the start of the video and you'll hear that the microphone is picking up the engine sound just fine.

Still doesn't explain that @Samus's video is a more accurate representation of what the cars in GT spend most of their time (racing a track)

That Enzo is not racing around the track. It's cruising at low RPM and partial throttle, which is understandable since the track is soaking wet.

and yet are sounding like they're doing top speed runs in the process (since that video is attempting to justify the "vacuum cleaner" sound).

The infamous vacuum cleaner comparison videos show the cars running at a constant high rpm. That's what you get from the top speed run, not from the slow cruise around the track.

 

[McLaren]

Yes really. Cruising around a track at partial throttle and low rpm sounds nothing like going full throttle at high rpm. That is not a matter of microphone quality. Check the start of the video and you'll hear that the microphone is picking up the engine sound just fine.

Picking up any sound isn't the concern; it's the quality of the sound. Your video is nearly a decade old & as YouTube is showing, the quality is very low compared to modern videos.

That Enzo is not racing around the track. It's cruising at low RPM and partial throttle, which is understandable since the track is soaking wet.

Which is still producing a sound GT cars have an issue accurately representing.

The infamous vacuum cleaner comparison videos show the cars running at a constant high rpm. That's what you get from the top speed run, not from the slow cruise around the track.

This Enzo is being thrashed through a circuit in higher RPMs, the same thing that happens in GT games. So, why is the game sounding closer to your video than mine above?

That's the point you're missing. It shouldn't. Cars in GT are not constantly full throttle to 360kph+ in the highest gear possible for an extended amount of time like your video, and yet, still sound as if they are at times. Your evidence of "real life doing it wrong" is almost contradicting at proving GT's authenticity because it's showcasing some of the issues. The game should sound like that in that scenario, not every time the car is in the high RPMs that they tend to.

 

[eran0004]

Picking up any sound isn't the concern; it's the quality of the sound. Your video is nearly a decade old & as YouTube is showing, the quality is very low compared to modern videos.

It's not a quality issue, because the quality doesn't explain why the sound of wind is more pronounced than the engine sound at top speed.

Here is a newer video of a 458 doing a top speed run. Same thing, the constant high rpm in combination with the wind noise produces a vacuum cleaner type of sound:

Which is still producing a sound GT cars have an issue accurately representing.

Of course they do, I totally agree. The question is though: Do they sound like vacuum cleaners while real cars doesn't?

This Enzo is being thrashed through a circuit in higher RPMs, the same thing that happens in GT games. So, why is the game sounding closer to your video than mine above?

That is still not a constant high rpm. And no, racing the Enzo in Gran Turismo doesn't sound like that, but it also doesn't sound like a vacuum cleaner:



Only under very specific circumstances, such as a top speed run, it does:

That's the point you're missing. It shouldn't. Cars in GT are not constantly full throttle to 360kph+ in the highest gear possible for an extended amount of time like your video, and yet, still sound as if they are at times. Your evidence of "real life doing it wrong" is almost contradicting at proving GT's authenticity because it's showcasing some of the issues. The game should sound like that in that scenario, not every time the car is in the high RPMs that they tend to.

They only sound like vacuum cleaners when they are at a constant high rpm, which is why that is the situation shown in comparison videos:

[/QUOTE]