#StopNerfingCars

[Lomic]

I don't have the exact figures to hand, but if you mimic the settings for, for example, the Japanese 450 FR event at Tsukuba (pays 10,000cr), you will win something like 45,000 on Hard Difficulty for the exact same race parameters. I can't remember which car I was driving at the time but the opponent was set to Random.

Ok so that is around 850k/hour, not so bad (but I won't spend hours running around Tsukuba though).

Do you have other examples that I might enjoy more ?

 

[benjoi84]

Do you have other examples that I might enjoy more ?

I tell you what, assembling an exhaustive list comparing payouts across World Circuits Vs Custom/Quick Races is something I would love to do, if I had the time!

 

[ZevZoq]

Ok so that is around 850k/hour, not so bad

...but not so good either.

 

[S-car-Go]

The tyre dynamics in 1.49 have changed how cars handle so it's right that PP change sorry your Mustang is down 80hp OP but you obviously had found an exploit.

The journey is about picking the right path and packing the right kit.

 

[Lomic]

I tell you what, assembling an exhaustive list comparing payouts across World Circuits Vs Custom/Quick Races is something I would love to do, if I had the time!

I get that, but I am curious for some examples, not the full list and comparison to everything that exists. You seem familiar to those "perfectly good money to be earned in custom races" so I thought that you'd be able to give a few examples from the top of your head.

But that is not important and is more about curiosity on my part, don't worry if you don't have other examples right now.

 

[benjoi84]

@Lomic suffice to say, it's worth investigating.

Generally my experience says that about 50% of the World Circuit events will bring comparable credits rewards when configured as Custom Races, but there are outliers like the one I mentioned which just wipe the floor with them.

 

[sonnyboychris]

I appreciate that PD is evolving the game.

I'd love it if they had a series of tech videos where they really break down the changes to the physics model, just for us to nerd out on.

 

[eran0004]

It says in the patch notes, performance points for all featured cars have been adjusted.

It says that they have been updated. That doesn’t mean there have been any changes to how they are calculated, most likely it just means that the PP score for each car is changing because the physics changes means that they perform differently is the simulated performance test.

Lap times with some of my cars were slightly slower due to lowering hp/raising weight to get back under the PP level, just my 10 cents. 👍

Which is to be expected when you reduce power and increase the weight.

 

[Keef]

I assume you're young because you're placing way too much importance in your life on a video game. The whole point of the game is to have fun tuning cars and trying new things. If it ever feels like work, or if it feels like your hard work has been ruined, then honestly you need to stop playing and go do something else with your life. Go enjoy the outdoors or whatever, I don't know. It's just a game.

Like others have said, things change and you need to adapt. If anybody should be complaining its us old guys - we grew up in an era when the game was the way it was, it came baked into the cartridge or on the disc and you got what you got. If it was broken, that was part of the game. Nowadays, games and continually improve, and yet people still constantly complain when more content is added or bugs are adjusted.

I could be upset but I don't care. I've got plenty of other things to occupy myself with and you need to find more things for yourself.

 

[LSFDRX]

Hey guys,

I don't know what to say about the most recent update, really. I mean, the new cars, the return of the Eiger Nordwand is cool and all, but this update comes with a HUGE downside.
A lot of my cars that I built for specific things like WTC 600 or WTC 700 got completely ruined because Polyphony can't keep their hands off of the PP of cars.

Here are three examples:

1. The Ford Mustang Gr. 3 Road Car. I turned it into an absolute beast for not only WTC 700, but because the engine I swapped in was a turbo engine, the car was eligible for the Race of Turbo Sports Cars, and I absolutely loved it. Now with the new update, I had to strip 83 horsepower from the car to get it back to the 700 PP limit, which severely hurts acceleration and top speed.
2. The Mach Forty. Before I found the even better Corolla, I used this beast of a car for WTC 600, with good handling despite weighing 1.6 tons, an incredible top speed and good enough tire wear. I really liked it, and it saddens me to see a brilliant car get ruined so badly.
3. The nerf that hurt me the most was the Toyota Corolla MORIZO. I absolutely loved that car for WTC 600, the handling was impressive, the top speed was insane and the fuel efficiency was good enough with the 2JZ. It was the best, and by far the fastest car I ever used in the WTC 600 race in Tokyo, and Polyphony totally ruined my beloved Corolla... 😭😭😭

Polyphony really need to stop nerfing cars for the players just to make races like that tough WTC 600 race in Tokyo a lot harder. Every time an update comes out, Polyphony always changes the PP of cars to make them much worse, and that is, to put it as friendly as possible, PEAK GARBAGE GAME DESIGN. I mean, sure, maybe the Corolla I built was overpowered in the Tokyo race, but I absolutely loved it. I was so happy to have finally found a car that I can use to blow the AI out of the water, and Polyphony blatantly ruined it. Can we please please please go back to the previous game version? 😢

I would also like to know if you also had powerful 600 or 700 PP cars that were really good and then got completely ruined, and what cars are really great post-patch? And tell me in the poll if Polyphony should stop nerfing cars with every update.

Thank you,
Rushing Wind

Honestly, it sounds like you were using way OP cars for those races anyways. And there are many ways to take PP out of a car, tires being one if the major ones.

Take this as a challenge to re-adjust these cars for these events, or find cars that work better than your old ones.

If you're running any RH/RM/RS tires on those cars I would start by taking them down to sports tires. Any slick tire would basically be cheat mode anyways.

 

[Meythia]

No, because the PP score is a one-dimensional representation of your car’s performance, so it depends on what methods you use to get back to the old PP score. If your PP score went up because the handling improved, and you reduce the PP by reducing power or increasing the ballast, you will not have the same performance again.

That is a pretty one sided way of looking at the results and I cant formulate my opnion to agree here.
Looking specifically at event + car combo, when the car is all setup for power and performing its fastest this way and suddenly sees an increase for magically having better handling, then the only way in this case is reducing power and blatantly speaking it just shows PP != PP as everyone already knew.
PP relies on track, because some tracks require handling or power, of course no car with 1000PP will win on SSRX when it only boosts up its traction. That is no secret.
And that is not an edge case to take into consideration.
But as this change of PP should affect all cars, the total balance shouldnt have changed all too much.

 

[eran0004]

Looking specifically at event + car combo, when the car is all setup for power and performing its fastest this way and suddenly sees an increase for magically having better handling, then the only way in this case is reducing power and blatantly speaking it just shows PP != PP as everyone already knew.

There’s no magic involved, the physics were changed. As a result, the car did better in the simulated performance test that is used to determine its PP score.

PP relies on track, because some tracks require handling or power, of course no car with 1000PP will win on SSRX when it only boosts up its traction. That is no secret.
And that is not an edge case to take into consideration.

Performance depends on the track, but the PP score is the same.

But as this change of PP should affect all cars, the total balance shouldnt have changed all too much.

If the cars generally perform better (in the PP test mind you - not necessarily by player lap times) with the new physics, then the total balance should have gone up.

 

[sswishbone]

If Polyphony did something to fix the economy and not force people to grind so pointlessly, this would not even be an issue. OP specifically talks about races with biggest payouts, remove the need to continuously race these events, and people might enjoy relearning a game.

This is why GT7 is a failure of a game. It could easily solve this, instead it focuses on things which aren't necessary.

 

[RushingWind1]

Honestly, it sounds like you were using way OP cars for those races anyways. And there are many ways to take PP out of a car, tires being one if the major ones.

Take this as a challenge to re-adjust these cars for these events, or find cars that work better than your old ones.

If you're running any RH/RM/RS tires on those cars I would start by taking them down to sports tires. Any slick tire would basically be cheat mode anyways.

My 600 PP cars always run Hard Sport tires, while my 700 PP cars are adjusted to the limit with Soft Racing slicks.

Let's just say, before the update, I lapped Tokyo in less than 2:08 with the Corolla in said 600 PP race, which is the fastest lap time I have ever done in that race. Now I'm not getting anywhere near that. But the AI can still pull out 2:08 laps out of their sleeve. I guess they're not affected by the physics changes, which is absolutely unfair. At the very least, Polyphony could slow the big three in that race - Gallo, Kokubun and Suswillo - down to make it look like they adapted to the new physics, but no, Polyphony wants to make us players suffer more than we already have. I'm pretty sure if we tried to replicate their cars, we get 650 PP builds or so, especially since Gallo and Kokubun run Soft Sport tires.

If Polyphony did something to fix the economy and not force people to grind so pointlessly, this would not even be an issue. OP specifically talks about races with biggest payouts, remove the need to continuously race these events, and people might enjoy relearning a game.

This is why GT7 is a failure of a game. It could easily solve this, instead it focuses on things which aren't necessary.

I feel your words. I hope for the next update, Polyphony increases the payout for custom events, especially for timed races.

 

[gkgamer]

I have a couple hundred cars set for WTC600 Tokyo and WTC700 Le Mans.
I used many "cheese" tunes to maximize straight line speed on both of these tracks while using ridiculously long gears to keep fuel consumption under control.
I'd say that with v1.49, the cheesiest tunes have been hit the hardest, some with a gain over 20PP.
Bummer for my grinding garage but overall a good thing as it seems to have brought the whole field of eligible cars closer to each other.
Sub-26' Tokyo 12 laps has become significantly harder to achieve imo.

 

[Lebowski]

Look at this in real world situation, you but a new set of tyres for your real car and you notice the handling is different from what you were used to, do you complain or do you adapt and learn to drive with the new handling ?

What a stupid comparison. When you buy new tyres IRL it doesn't increase your weight and reduce your power does it, regardless of a change in handling? The whole point of this thread is that the new handling has penalised weight and power.

 

[eran0004]

What a stupid comparison. When you buy new tyres IRL it doesn't increase your weight and reduce your power does it, regardless of a change in handling?

This update hasn’t increased your weight and reduced your power either.

The whole point of this thread is that the new handling has penalised weight and power.

That point is wrong. The new update has improved the handling of the cars, which has bumped up the performance point score. That’s a problem for cars that has been tuned to sit close to the PP limit for certain events, as they now exceed the regulations. There’s no penalty to weight and power as far as I’m aware.

 

[hyperspeed980]

Honestly mate, if you need super OP tunes that curbstomp the competition then the Escudo and swapped kei cars are still there. For some reason PD just can't figure out the PP calculations for those things.

 

[tankuroded]

Sentiments like this makes me believe that people only care for their car's PP solely for money grinding. idk if people still do PP-limited races in open lobbies like in the PS3 era, but when multiplayer is mostly dominated by race cars running on BoP...

 

[Meythia]

PP calculations for those things.

For no car, basically.

 

[Tommy_D]

A lot of my cars that I built for specific things like WTC 600 or WTC 700 got completely ruined because Polyphony can't keep their hands off of the PP of cars.

I haven't done a ton of testing yet on my 600pp cars, but I did check a few of them out at Tokyo the other night. Some cars had no changes to their PP and performed slightly better (albeit their suspensions need some minor tweaks) and others increased just slightly (3-5pp). I detailed out my findings in the Tokyo 600 thread, but to summarize I found removing a performance part vs removing power in the ECU made a greater change to the PP levels without really having any downsides. The cars are faster now than they were before the physics change.

The WTC 600 in Tokyo done without exploits is genuinely one of the hardest races in single player in gt7 - share your setups, tips, and cars

Had t tyre wear multiplier has reduced from 25x?

www.gtplanet.net