The Future of Toyota Body-on-frame vehicles.

  • Thread starter Snaeper
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Honestly they made some big changes that I feel are either a step back or unnecessary or reduce the appeal of the Sequoia in general.

They got rid of the rear roll-down window which is an excellent feature. Perfect for summer vibes, perfect for an open-air experience, perfect for dogs in the back to hang their heads out the back, and perfect for a sudden rain storm. It's one of the best features on my first-gen Sequoia and the second-gen kept it as it should've.

They also switched to a live rear axle which is odd in my opinion. The second-gen had IRS and did fine with it, even off-road. It wasn't the best but it could've been engineered to be better in that situation. Instead, and presumably because this TRD Pro will be marketed as a Land cruiser replacement, they actually reverted back to a live axle. That means that the load floor is no longer flat. It's got this weird shelf system to fix the problem...but when you're lugging camping gear or trying to sleep in the back of the truck, that little shelf isn't tough enough to do this trick. This is now an annoying glitch that people are going to have to modify around which shouldn't be a problem to begin with. I actually prefer my first-gen's removeable (and heavy) third row, and high but flat load floor. I carry people in that third row like twice a year, there's no reason for it to be there otherwise, and there's no reason the load floor can't simply be flat like mine and the second-gen.

Honestly I'd rather have a second-gen than this. A lift and disconnecting the sway bars fixes the articulation problems. It would be nice to have a locker but that can be added. The new TRD Pro still needs lifted, armored, modified here and there, and in bigger ways - the bumper covers can't simply be removed and replaced by steel, they have to be cut. You have to destroy your parts just to put aftermarket ones on, telling me these trucks weren't actually designed with modification in mind. I don't like that and I think Toyota missed the point on that one.

These new trucks are definitely as big as I'd ever want an off-roading rig to be. I think I'll be downsizing in the future if I decide to get a new vehicle. The sixth-gen 4Runner will probably be just right, assuming they don't mess it up.
 
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It looks too large for most trails here. My 5th gen 4Runner is pretty much the perfect size for this.
 
Some more photos of the new Sequoia:

2023-Toyota-Sequoia-3-1024x555.jpg




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Personally, this was a car that I thought for sure would be axed, given the current Sequoia's very poor sales, and not having been meaningfully updated since 2009. So, props to Toyota for keeping the Sequoia around.

The styling is a home run, honestly. Yes, it's busy looking, but somehow it works. The new Tundra's styling seems to work even better on a full-size SUV. I predict it's going to be a much stronger seller than the previous generation.
 
GranTurNismo
Some more photos of the new Sequoia:

2023-Toyota-Sequoia-3-1024x555.jpg




View attachment 1108434

View attachment 1108435





View attachment 1108433

Personally, this was a car that I thought for sure would be axed, given the current Sequoia's very poor sales, and not having been meaningfully updated since 2009. So, props to Toyota for keeping the Sequoia around.

The styling is a home run, honestly. Yes, it's busy looking, but somehow it works. The new Tundra's styling seems to work even better on a full-size SUV. I predict it's going to be a much stronger seller than the previous generation.
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I think it's going to sell fine, especially with the TRD Pro edition. But I'm still pissed about the rear window.
 
Wow, this search function needs a serious overhaul @Jordan. It's easier to just flip pages if I can't quick search and sort by date.

Anyways, terrible news:



That, my friends, is not a full-size roll-down rear window. I have no idea why Toyota would do this but I have to assume it boils down to cost-saving. The roll-down rear window has been a hallmark of Toyota SUVs and pickup trucks since the 90s and is actually a big selling point, especially for people with dogs. They've gotten rid of it on the Sequoia and now they've gotten rid of it on the Tacoma. Very uncool. I can only assume they'll get rid of it on the 4Runner also which leaves that SUV as a hard sell when so many other off-road options exist these days, the Bronco being the primary competitor to the 4Runner.

I don't know what Toyota's plan here is but they're shooting themselves in the foot. While these truck and SUV markets are heating up, Toyota is removing unique features. I don't get it.
 
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Keef
Wow, this search function needs a serious overhaul @Jordan. It's easier to just flip pages if I can't quick search and sort by date.

Anyways, terrible news:



That, my friends, is not a full-size roll-down rear window. I have no idea why Toyota would do this but I have to assume it boils down to cost-saving. The roll-down rear window has been a hallmark of Toyota SUVs and pickup trucks since the 90s and is actually a big selling point, especially for people with dogs. They've gotten rid of it on the Sequoia and now they've gotten rid of it on the Tacoma. Very uncool. I can only assume they'll get rid of it on the 4Runner also which leaves that SUV as a hard sell when so many other off-road options exist these days, the Bronco being the primary competitor to the 4Runner.

I don't know what Toyota's plan here is but they're shooting themselves in the foot. While these truck and SUV markets are heating up, Toyota is removing unique features. I don't get it.
Click to expand...

Keef
Wow, this search function needs a serious overhaul @Jordan. It's easier to just flip pages if I can't quick search and sort by date.

Anyways, terrible news:



That, my friends, is not a full-size roll-down rear window. I have no idea why Toyota would do this but I have to assume it boils down to cost-saving. The roll-down rear window has been a hallmark of Toyota SUVs and pickup trucks since the 90s and is actually a big selling point, especially for people with dogs. They've gotten rid of it on the Sequoia and now they've gotten rid of it on the Tacoma. Very uncool. I can only assume they'll get rid of it on the 4Runner also which leaves that SUV as a hard sell when so many other off-road options exist these days, the Bronco being the primary competitor to the 4Runner.

I don't know what Toyota's plan here is but they're shooting themselves in the foot. While these truck and SUV markets are heating up, Toyota is removing unique features. I don't get it.
Click to expand...

Perhaps this is just hindsight bias talking, but this is literally exactly how I’d expect the new Tacoma to look. Just a shrunken Tundra.
 
Keef
That, my friends, is not a full-size roll-down rear window. I have no idea why Toyota would do this but I have to assume it boils down to cost-saving.
Click to expand...
I’ve never seen a Tacoma with this feature. Are you sure it’s ever been available?
 
c172fccc
I’ve never seen a Tacoma with this feature. Are you sure it’s ever been available?
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It hasn't, not on the Tacoma at least. The Tundra had (has?) that option though. There are aftermarket kits that allow you to do it, but they're expensive and don't work well.

The 4Runner does too and I doubt Toyota will drop that feature unless it's for safety or crash test reasons. It's really popular with 4Runner buyers and it's really convenient too, especially when you have a bunch of stuff in the cargo area and you don't want it to fall out. I roll mine down all the time, especially when I need to take the weekly garage to the dump.
 
c172fccc
I’ve never seen a Tacoma with this feature. Are you sure it’s ever been available?
Click to expand...

Joey D
It hasn't, not on the Tacoma at least. The Tundra had (has?) that option though. There are aftermarket kits that allow you to do it, but they're expensive and don't work well.

The 4Runner does too and I doubt Toyota will drop that feature unless it's for safety or crash test reasons. It's really popular with 4Runner buyers and it's really convenient too, especially when you have a bunch of stuff in the cargo area and you don't want it to fall out. I roll mine down all the time, especially when I need to take the weekly garage to the dump.
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You're both right, I was mistaken. But I maintain that the Tacoma is the oddball out of Toyota's lineup in several respects. It never had the roll-down rear window, it has a weird automatic center diff lock when in 4wd...it's weird. Still not a good reason to not expand this feature.

But the 4Runner, Sequoia, and Tundra have all had the window since the 90s and their first generations respectively. The new Tundra still has it but the Sequoia does not which is very annoying. I can only assume the 4Runner won't either which will be extremely disappointing.

I'm wondering if they did it for emissions reasons on the SUV. When driving with that rear window rolled down, the aerodyanmics of the vehicle sucks all the exhaust fumes back inside the cabin.
 
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Not a body on frame vehicle, but I figured it's not worth making its own separate thread. Toyota has released a new full-size SUV for the US market, the Grand Highlander, slotting between the regular Highlander and Sequoia in terms of length. Featuring three rows of seating, 15 more cubic inches of interior volume than the Highlander, and a total of 13 cupholders.

Screen Shot 2023-02-10 at 2.42.39 PM.png


Screen Shot 2023-02-10 at 2.43.19 PM.png


Screen Shot 2023-02-10 at 2.43.02 PM.png


www.carscoops.com

New 2024 Toyota Grand Highlander Has 13 Cupholders, 7 USB Ports, And Up To 362 HP | Carscoops

It also has enough room behind the third-row seats to fit seven carry-on suitcases
www.carscoops.com www.carscoops.com
 
GranTurNismo
Not a body on frame vehicle, but I figured it's not worth making its own separate thread. Toyota has released a new full-size SUV for the US market, the Grand Highlander, slotting between the regular Highlander and Sequoia in terms of length. Featuring three rows of seating, 15 more cubic inches of interior volume than the Highlander, and a total of 13 cupholders.

View attachment 1229798

View attachment 1229799

View attachment 1229800

www.carscoops.com

New 2024 Toyota Grand Highlander Has 13 Cupholders, 7 USB Ports, And Up To 362 HP | Carscoops

It also has enough room behind the third-row seats to fit seven carry-on suitcases
www.carscoops.com www.carscoops.com
Click to expand...
@Keef is about to get triggered.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
@Keef is about to get triggered.
Click to expand...
Apparently 4Runners don't sell in this market and they're never going to reveal the new one. I mean, the thousands of them I see per day is clear evidence that 4Runners are irrelevant and bigass highlanders are definitely what people want.
 
Keef
Apparently 4Runners don't sell in this market and they're never going to reveal the new one. I mean, the thousands of them I see per day is clear evidence that 4Runners are irrelevant and bigass highlanders are definitely what people want.
Click to expand...
The last new 4Runner I seen at a dealership was mine, and that was 3 years ago. It didn't even make it to the lot, I had dibs before it even arrived.

This looks pretty good for a Highlander though, the ultimate mom mobile.
 
That Grand Highlander is way better looking than many SUVs these days. A bit generic but I prefer that to overdetailed and uncohesive designs from 2016-2021 period. SUVs look better in last few years tbh
 
That is a terrible photoshop job lol

I hope it's still made in Japan. I absolutely love my 5th gen, it's damn near the perfect suv. I can definitely see myself getting another one in the distant future.
 
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Ya the folks at MotoTrend just used an AI image generator and put in "4Runner crossed with FJ Cruiser" and went with it.

It seems bold they're suggesting the V6TT would make its way into the 4Runner. It already fills up the engine bay of the Sequoia so I'm not entirely sure how they'd package it, with all the hybrid stuff, in the front of a 4Runner. I think the T24A is the more realistic choice since it's supposed to be the replacement for the 1GR-FE. I'm not sure how well that will go over though with 4Runner enthusiasts. I feel like they almost have to offer a V6 option, which I would assume would be the 2GR-FKS 3.5L out of the Tacoma.

Personally, I don't care what's under the hood as long as it's reliable and mated to a transmission that isn't a CVT.

Also, I still maintain that if the rear window doesn't roll down, I won't even consider buying one.
 
A hybrid 4 cylinder I think would be a good choice for something like a 4runner, at least optionally. The powertrain in my CR-V feels like a 3.5ish liter V6 off the line (though its acceleration above 40mph is considerably less V6 feeling) which is the characteristic I think you want in an SUV. My biggest gripe with the 4Runner is the abysmal fuel economy of the current model. 17mpg combined in 2023?? That's worse (significantly) than a 6.2 liter V8 Tahoe. I appreciate that the 4Runner has genuine capability that most crossovers cannot match, but the powertrain is clearly outdated. That being said, I believe all of Toyota's hybrid tech revolves around CVT gearboxes, which are not great for off roading.

The article mentions a turbo 4 and a hybrid V6. How fast do you need your offroady SUV to be? I can understand having a more powerful variant, but for the base model just shove in the Rav4 prime powertrain or come up with something like Honda's no-gearbox parallel hybrid setup if durability is a concern.
 
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I doubt they put that V6 in there. It's way too overkill for the size of the truck unless it's severely detuned. Maybe they've developed a new 4-cylinder.

Eunos_Cosmo
A hybrid 4 cylinder I think would be a good choice for something like a 4runner, at least optionally. The powertrain in my CR-V feels like a 3.5ish liter V6 off the line (though its acceleration above 40mph is considerably less V6 feeling) which is the characteristic I think you want in an SUV. My biggest gripe with the 4Runner is the abysmal fuel economy of the current model. 17mpg combined in 2023?? That's worse (significantly) than a 6.2 liter V8 Tahoe. I appreciate that the 4Runner has genuine capability that most crossovers cannot match, but the powertrain is clearly outdated. That being said, I believe all of Toyota's hybrid tech revolves around CVT gearboxes, which are not great for off roading.

The article mentions a turbo 4 and a hybrid V6. How fast do you need your offroady SUV to be? I can understand having a more powerful variant, but for the base model just shove in the Rav4 prime powertrain or come up with something like Honda's no-gearbox parallel hybrid setup if durability is a concern.
Click to expand...
Not sure what you mean by "feels like a V6" because the proper throttle response for a 4Runner or other off-road truck is a very lazy and linear throttle tip-in. It needs to have lots of torque available but also be very linear and give exactly what you ask for. My Sequoia's V8 is excellent for throttle response, especially off-road. Very lazy, lots of travel. But if you move the pedal the engine moves too. Toyota's V6 is like that minus the torque lol.
 
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Am I missing something or does that teaser not confirm that it's electrified? Yes, there is a hybrid version of the 3.5TT but that badge just says "i-FORCE MAX", which I'm guessing is just the regular 3.5TT sans the hybrid system. If that's the case, it would probably work OK in the truck, but that's over 100 more horsepower than the current truck. The Tacoma is underpowered, but it's not 100hp underpowered. It would be nearly 80 more hp than the Colorado and more than 100 more than the Ranger. I don't know what the Frontier has, but for the three people that care about that truck it probably doesn't matter.

I mean, if Toyota wants to pull a Chrysler and shove a big ass engine in a vehicle where it doesn't make sense, I'm here for it.

***Nevermind, I'm dumb. The "MAX" is the hybrid system.
 
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I would bet on the 2.4L turbo with a hybrid system like the Tundra/Sequoia with the electric motor between the engine and a 10 speed auto.
 
MedigoFlame
More teaser photos for a Trailhunter trim.
2024-toyota-tacoma-trailhunter-teaser.webp

2024-toyota-tacoma-trailhunter-teaser.webp
Click to expand...
Interesting, interesting.

I see that they've got chassis-mounted presumably dual rear tow hooks which is helpful, although most off-roaders simply slap a hook into the trailer hitch. I imagine having the hooks separate from the bumper was the only legal way they could do it for crash reg purposes. Aftermarket metal bumpers have the hooks mounted onto the bumper which is then mounted to the frame rail so it's all one piece and strong as hell.

Also ARB makes really quality products and I see they've integrated the proximinity sensors into the bumper, implying there's a button or mode to turn them off like the Wrangler and Bronco.

The truck looks to have a very short front overhang, shorter than the current truck, judging by that fender flare. Or they could simply be massive flares. I hope they're massive flares - the Chevy ZR2 comes standard with 33 inch tires like the current TRD Pro and also has hardcore steel-bumpered and winched packages like this. I assume there will be an ARB front with winch optional.

The market has moved far beyond a traditional TRD Pro which is weird because even five years ago that was the ultimate thing anybody offered besides Jeep. Now, a TRD Pro isn't any more impressive than a Z71 or FX4. They've had to invent and market a whole new trim level or package - I imagine it will be a package addition to the TRD Pro, like how Desert Boss is for the ZR2.

Very excited to see the full details because the Toyota is the only thing that could prevent me from buying the Chevy in the next couple years.
 
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The new Taco is an attractive option, I’ll definitely be inquiring about one of these when I go to the dealer next week. I’m expecting at least 70k cdn for the Pro version.
 

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