The next-gen MX-5 Miata thread

05XR8
Seems like that's moving upmarket as well. Baby RX-V in appearance?
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I'd be really surprised if they refresh the car that heavily. It's only been on the market for six years and already had one refresh!
 
Keef
I'd be really surprised if they refresh the car that heavily. It's only been on the market for six years and already had one refresh!
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Average lifespan for most cars is 6 years before full change.
 
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R1600Turbo
Average lifespan for most cars is 6 years before full change.
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The Miata's lifespan has been 8, 8, and 10 so far. Given how good the ND is I'd have expected at least 8 once again.
 
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That post is reading wide stance. More room for the new engine? Car will still have a long snout and that five point grill for sure. May as well look like the RX-V and Mazda Vision Coupe Concept.

Edit: If we're going to talk lifespan, 2029 will be it's 40th birthday. 2031 will be Mazda's 110th. Do they only do a refresh for the new engine in 2023? The 8 year span would reach 2031. 2 years past the Roadster's 40th.

Do Mazda then do a new model in 2025, for a short lifespan to 2029? I don't know.

Just guessing anyway. Would make sense to change the car to an NE, in 2023. Make a special Final NE edition for 2029 and maybe introduce a new car same year or 2031.
 
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05XR8
That post is reading wide stance. More room for the new engine? Car will still have a long snout and that five point grill for sure. May as well look like the RX-V and Mazda Vision Coupe Concept.

Edit: If we're going to talk lifespan, 2029 will be it's 40th birthday. 2031 will be Mazda's 110th. Do they only do a refresh for the new engine in 2023? The 8 year span would reach 2031. 2 years past the Roadster's 40th.

Do Mazda then do a new model in 2025, for a short lifespan to 2029? I don't know.

Just guessing anyway. Would make sense to change the car to an NE, in 2023. Make a special Final NE edition for 2029 and maybe introduce a new car same year or 2031.
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By that point in 2031 I’d expect it to be an ev. Could be an interesting changeover period. NE to NE-V
 
For sure. If Mazda do ever get the last rotary sports car completed and on the streets, could be an awesome time to witness how the brand moves on.
 
I'd guess that the wide stance would be related to platform sharing. The NC was a considerably bigger car than the NB because it shared it's platform with the RX-8, so it's not unprecedented - especially as the new platforms are RWD.

Somewhat related - I've noticed that my local Mazda dealership has actually begun completely renovating their buildings. My speculation is that it is timed to coincide with the new RWD platforms coming to market and they want to create a more upscale experience. I'm curious if other people have noticed their nearest Mazda dealerships undergoing renovation? (This particular dealer is in zip code that Mazda's push for premium kind of has to work, so it could be that only one's in areas like this would be renovated)
 
I drive past my local Mazda dealer(one I worked for) every day. The property they built on and moved to, houses Subaru(to the left), recently acquired Audi(to the right) and Kia(to the right of Audi). Audi and Kia facility is new. Not sure they‘d renovate, but I’ll keep a look out.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I'd guess that the wide stance would be related to platform sharing. The NC was a considerably bigger car than the NB because it shared it's platform with the RX-8, so it's not unprecedented - especially as the new platforms are RWD.

Somewhat related - I've noticed that my local Mazda dealership has actually begun completely renovating their buildings. My speculation is that it is timed to coincide with the new RWD platforms coming to market and they want to create a more upscale experience. I'm curious if other people have noticed their nearest Mazda dealerships undergoing renovation? (This particular dealer is in zip code that Mazda's push for premium kind of has to work, so it could be that only one's in areas like this would be renovated)
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When I bought my ND last year, the local Mazda dealer was building an entirely new dealership next to a Cadillac dealer, and down the street from a Porsche and Maserati/Alfa dealer. The new dealership was open by the first free servicing, and I was blown away by how snazzy it was. Very upscale looking dealer.

And I won't be surprised if the next gen MX-5 (NE? NF?) is derived from the RX-Vision or whatever they decide to call it. Especially if they don't plan on having anyone else to share development costs with like with the ND/Fiata twins.
 
Swagger897
By that point in 2031 I’d expect it to be an ev. Could be an interesting changeover period. NE to NE-V
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That would tie in with Mazda's Zoom Zoom 2030 Sustainability Roadmap

Also Mazda's MX-30 EV is currently sitting at:

Front track
1,565 mm

Rear track
1,565 mm

Wheelbase
2,655 mm

Current MX-5 is at:

Front track
1,495 mm

Rear track
1,505 mm

Wheelbase
2,310 mm

So a size increase to fit the EV platform would sound about spot on. Assuming of course it uses the same platform as the MX-30 and not something else. The MX-30 is pretty dull for EV performance and I'd guess Mazda would want something a little spicier and a slightly bigger battery than the 35.5kWh in the MX-30. PS isn't too far off at 145ps on the MX-30 vs the MX-5's 132ps.
 
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I struggle to see an EV MX-5. The MX-5 is an affordable, small, lightweight, fun, useable car that can do things like small grocery runs and weekend trips. An EV MX-5 would be either larger and heavier and/or have less interior/storage space (there isn't much now!) to fit an adequate battery or it would have seriously meager range. Any of those compromises wouldn't really suit the MX-5's ethos. I did a "lightweight" EV thought experiment a while back, and the results I came up with were not that compelling:

I was curious as to what a "lightweight" EV might look like. If we take Tesla's batteries as near state of the art in terms of energy density, we're in the neighborhood of 6.25kg / kwh (P100 battery is 625kg and has 100kwh). An MX-5 engine weighs around 300lbs / 135kg, dressed. If we limit our battery pack to that weight and assume an energy density of the Tesla, I'm arriving at around 22kwh capacity. I think the ICE ND transmission is probably lighter than an electric motor, but there is probably some efficiency in the driveline with the EV, so we'll call that a wash. Assuming .35CD and about 19 square feet (1.79m^2) (figures I found for the ND), the car would consume about 12kw/hr maintaining 60mph, meaning our 22kwh battery could last us about 1.75 hours and give us about 105 miles of range. This agnostic of how much power you could produce (and ignoring the efficiency of the motor)...but it's pretty easy to see why battery capacity is prioritized over weight in EVs....weight ultimately has very little effect on range. Even at 4,000lbs the same car would only consume 3 more KW to maintain 60mph.


This example tells me that a lightweight EV would need extreme aero to be viable beyond urban driving ranges with current battery tech Either that or very exotic construction to give more weight back to the batteries. Maybe Mazda can utilize it's rotary engine range extender to pump out that 12kw needed for sustained highway cruising in a lightweight package? I'd be onboard with that.


The other side of fun, to me, is engagement. Without shifting in any capacity, I think engagement is limited. I hope somebody figures out how to make the acceleration of EVs more involving somehow.
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Ultimately, to arrive at a similar weight and size of the current MX-5 (without using more expensive materials) with a BEV equivalent, you're likely limited to something like <25kwh battery and the naturally poor aerodynamics of the little roadster will mean a pretty limited range. The EV cars on sale today with the biggest range and power figures are also the heaviest. That isn't a coincidence. You need a big (and preferably long) shape for a BEV to make sense.

I don't see a proper MX-5 working as a BEV with today's tech. I'd rather see Mazda electrify the rest of their lineup and leave the MX-5 as an ICE sports car. I suspect this may end up being the kind of equilibrium in the future. A few old school sports car living on with ICE powerplants while the vast majority of cars becoming BEVs. I think the planet would be OK with that, especially as MX-5's account for, by my count, something like 0.04% of global car sales and passenger cars themselves only account for 6% of global C02 emissions, meaning MX-5s contribute to <0.01% of global greenhouse gas emissions. I think we can let them slide.
 
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Would Mazda say, use a hybrid from Toyota to keep weight down? I understand they just ditched the smaller MX-5 engine and I’m sure they’d prefer to use their own engine, but using a hybrid might up the efficiency without encroaching the 2L.
 
05XR8
Would Mazda say, use a hybrid from Toyota to keep weight down? I understand they just ditched the smaller MX-5 engine and I’m sure they’d prefer to use their own engine, but using a hybrid might up the efficiency without encroaching the 2L.
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I would really love to see another attempt at a sporty and economical hybrid with a manual 'box. Per @homeforsummer the CR-Z is pretty fun, but the numbers were not there so I think a lot of people wrote them off without even driving them. A parallel wankel hybrid would be great, as I've been saying literally for years. Make it happen Mazda!
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I struggle to see an EV MX-5. The MX-5 is an affordable, small, lightweight, fun, useable car that can do things like small grocery runs and weekend trips. An EV MX-5 would be either larger and heavier and/or have less interior/storage space (there isn't much now!) to fit an adequate battery or it would have seriously meager range. Any of those compromises wouldn't really suit the MX-5's ethos. I did a "lightweight" EV thought experiment a while back, and the results I came up with were not that compelling:



Ultimately, to arrive at a similar weight and size of the current MX-5 (without using more expensive materials) with a BEV equivalent, you're likely limited to something like <25kwh battery and the naturally poor aerodynamics of the little roadster will mean a pretty limited range. The EV cars on sale today with the biggest range and power figures are also the heaviest. That isn't a coincidence. You need a big (and preferably long) shape for a BEV to make sense.

I don't see a proper MX-5 working as a BEV with today's tech. I'd rather see Mazda electrify the rest of their lineup and leave the MX-5 as an ICE sports car. I suspect this may end up being the kind of equilibrium in the future. A few old school sports car living on with ICE powerplants while the vast majority of cars becoming BEVs. I think the planet would be OK with that, especially as MX-5's account for, by my count, something like 0.04% of global car sales and passenger cars themselves only account for 6% of global C02 emissions, meaning MX-5s contribute to <0.01% of global greenhouse gas emissions. I think we can let them slide.
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We're 10 years away from 2031 predictions anyways so there's plenty to change. The entire market will be completely different by then I suspect. 2011 was wildly different than it is now.
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I would really love to see another attempt at a sporty and economical hybrid with a manual 'box. Per @homeforsummer the CR-Z is pretty fun, but the numbers were not there so I think a lot of people wrote them off without even driving them. A parallel wankel hybrid would be great, as I've been saying literally for years. Make it happen Mazda!
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The CR-Z's biggest problem was weight. Not that 1100kg or so is outright heavy, but after the Insight (850kg) and compared to an ND MX-5 (~1000kg at its lightest), the CR-Z's a bit chunky. It's a shame people wrote it off though. Just one of the risks of the market's obsession with numbers. I've seen more than a little overlap between people who said the CR-Z was too slow and people who now complain modern cars are too fast...

A similar powertrain in an MX-5 would be great fun though - the CR-Z always had a really good low-end thanks to the motor assist. With motor assist at the bottom and ND2-style top end, even better.

I'd like to see the "NE" go down that route, but I'm not sure whether any manufacturer wants to invest in that now when full EV looks like being where future investment needs to go. Conceptually though it's perfect for the MX-5. You get to keep a naturally-aspirated engine and a manual gearbox, the hybrid stuff isn't actually that heavy (in the Insight at least I think 5kg for the motor and 20kg for the battery? Call it no more than 50kg for absolutely everything battery/motor-related), and you get a nice torque and mpg bump.

Plus the world's best start-stop system (nothing I've used fires an engine up as quickly and smoothly as Honda's IMA system).
 
Digging this Color. Zircon Sand
1690667768208.jpeg
 
The only problem with the Miata these days is how mature a company Mazda has become. The car is very nice, don't get me wrong, but it would be nice to get some yellows, greens, blues, purples available on the car. These can all be done in a mature way and it would add a lot of spice to the car, probably increase sales as people want limited edition colors.
 
Keef
The only problem with the Miata these days is how mature a company Mazda has become. The car is very nice, don't get me wrong, but it would be nice to get some yellows, greens, blues, purples available on the car. These can all be done in a mature way and it would add a lot of spice to the car, probably increase sales as people want limited edition colors.
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The lack of vibrant colors is the worst aspect of the ND Miata. That and the lack of roll control lol...
 
Eunos_Cosmo
I've been wishing for a BRG ND since that car was first unveiled.
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BRG or even a deep metallic green would be great but I absolutely love the purple and blue on old M-Editions. Montego Blue, Straight Blue, Merlot, and Marina Green are timeless and luxurious. I think the ND would look sick in a color like Merc's Solarbeam Yellow also. Make Miatas Great Again!

IMG_41653-medium.jpg
 
The lack of interesting colors (especially in the interior) was a pretty strong factor that ultimately made me decide to go in a different direction when I was looking a couple years ago for something new; and is probably going to do it again when I start looking again in a couple months.
 
Keef
BRG or even a deep metallic green would be great but I absolutely love the purple and blue on old M-Editions. Montego Blue, Straight Blue, Merlot, and Marina Green are timeless and luxurious. I think the ND would look sick in a color like Merc's Solarbeam Yellow also. Make Miatas Great Again!
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If we stick to Mazda's portfolio, Competition Yellow Mica was a gorgeous color, not unlike Lamborghini's Giallo Evros
 
I am strongly considering wrapping my RF in BRG at some point. Especially seeing as I have the somewhat rare tan interior. As much as I'd like a shade of yellow, I dunno how well that would contrast with my interior color.
 
Tornado
The lack of interesting colors (especially in the interior) was a pretty strong factor that ultimately made me decide to go in a different direction when I was looking a couple years ago for something new; and is probably going to do it again when I start looking again in a couple months.
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Trouble in the harem?
 

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