The problem is...

[Tacet_Blue]

Bit touchy on the spelling PhatFat No ones going to pick you up on a mistake like "coulden't" but "hitlar" was classic, and you must see the funny side of that.

The war between Germany and parts of Europe started with the invasion of Poland, but my point was would it have escalated to a WORLD WAR if it hadn't been for the genocide.

And here are some more religious wars and observations on religion and its connection with war.

Saddam Hussein's decision to invade Iran on September 9, 1980 was fueled directly out of fear that Iran's new revolutionary leadership would eventually fracture Iraq's delicate Sunni-Shia balance

Urban, personally promoted a Holy Crusade to reclaim the Holy Lands from the barbarian Turks. Thus, the First Crusade was launched in 1096 CE. They lasted some 250 years

From the Byzantine-Muslim War of 645 to today's conflicts in the Middle East, religion has played a powerful and critical role in many wars throughout history.

Religious Wars in Europe (1559-1715) including the French religious wars, the Schmalkaldic War, and the Thirty Years' War

Religious-based conflicts and wars in the contemporary world including Egypt, India, Indonesia, Kashmir, Latin America, Israel, North Africa, Northern Ireland, Sri Lanka, and Tibet

The role of war in the development and spread of major religions, such as Islam, Christianity, Sikhism, and various sects

 

[PhatFat]

I do see the Humor in the mistake but dont think it is a vaild point and I dont deny that many wars were caused by religon.
And if you look at WWII France England and other countries declared war on germany because he was invading countries and the US joined because of Pearl Harbor and Hitler declared war on the US. I could be wrong but i dont think any countries joined because of the Jews, and I am not even sure if the full extent of what Hitler was doing to them was known.

 

[Tacet_Blue]

And if you look at WWII France England and other countries declared war on germany because he was invading countries and the US joined because of Pearl Harbor and Hitler declared war on the US. I could be wrong but i dont think any countries joined because of the Jews, and I am not even sure if the full extent of what Hitler was doing to them was known.

You're probably right about that, but Hitler did announce his intentions to wipe out the Jewish race at the Nazi Reichstag on Jan 30 1939 so it was well known.

Also shockingly he started a program of euthanasia to wipe out the sick and disabled in his own country in a plan named "Aktion T 4".

But I guess the drive behind his meglomania was racism and not religion.

Edit: Roosevelt froze Japanese assests in US and suspended relations in July 41, also the US annouced an oil embargo against aggressor states in Aug 41...so technically they were involved prior to the Pearl Harbour attack

 

[Danoff]

And the Civil war started because Lincoln was elected president and he was anti-slavery.

It is criminal to deprive an innocent man of his freedom. It is the criminals that broke the US in two, not the one who would prevent their crimes.

 

[milefile]

The problem is...

 

[87chevy]

well, i don't believe the thousands of non slave owning Rebels were fighting for slavery, but i could be wrong. I do know that slavery was NOT a major issue until the Emancipation Proclimation. And Lincoln only passed that because he Needed something to cause people to get on his side. It was a last resort to get Northeners behind him.

 

[Anderton Prime]

The US Civil War was "about" a lot more than just the issue of slavery. While the most obvious difference between the North and the South was slave ownership, the problem was that simply making owning slaves illegal would have very likely brought the economy of the Southern States to its knees. That is why such a fervent war resulted. Not because those Americans who lived in the south supported slavery because they enjoyed owning slaves per se, but because such major Southern industries as tobacco and cotton were built upon slave labour and as such depended on it. That America ever had slaves (and let's not forget there were a LOT of Northern Americans who owned slaves as well) and was supposed to be a free nation was ironic, but slavery is over now and America is STILL grappling with racial issues, some of which are the direct result of slavery.

 

[ExigeEvan]

The reasons for Germany invading other countries was because: -
He believed Germans were an elite race (can't remember the exact name used). And that being so elite they needed more 'room' and a larger industry.
Also it was the only way for Hitler to be able to persue the Jews who were leaving Germany.

Also is it possible to say that the Japanese were religious in the way they attacked, and continued to fight with America?
The ceremonial drink/meal before the attack on Pearl Harbour.
Also their suicide attacks?

I know this could be seen as fanaticism, but wasn't their 'God' the emperor of Japan?

 

[Lou Ferrigno]

You pointing out my spelling erroes just proved you coulden't come up with anything worth saying.
And the Civil war started because Lincoln was elected president and he was anti-slavery.
The use of the F word before history book proves you're stupid.
Hitler went after the Jews because he needed something to blame the state of germany was in since WWI but this wasn't even a factor in the start of WWII, it was invasions of other countries.
And I dare you to show me how religon started any of these wars.


P.S. May the one of you who has not made a spelling error in any post on any forum throw the first stone.

You are probably the biggest fukking idiot I've ever met in my life. Go drink some cyanide and die. Save Darwin the time.

 

[emad]

You are probably the biggest fukking idiot I've ever met in my life. Go drink some cyanide and die. Save Darwin the time.

whoa there killer. Calm down - you just violated SEVERAL rules on the AUP that you agreed to when you registered to this forum.

 

[Duke]

In light of today's horrific attacks against innocent civillians in London, I think it appropriate that we recall this thread for discussion.

 

[smellysocks12]

Though I understand that these attacks are caused by terrorists / fundamentalists who claim to do it in the name of the Islam, the vast majority of muslims doesn't support these terrorist acts at all. The palestinian and chechen situation can't be compared to these terrorist attacks by Al Quaeda, that is a completely different problem. That isn't exactly a muslim thing, that's a people's thing. The Russians and Israeli are being dictators in those areas, committing many crimes as well. Especially the Russians are being brutal in Chechen neighborhoods. So the only way out for the poor people who don't have modern weaponry, unlike their enemies, is to resort to measures which we consider to be terrorist. This doesn't justify making civilian casualities at all, but it makes it understandable.

To a certain degree the resistance with attacks in Iraq is understandable as well, but then again, they are also terrorizing most of their own population as well, which is a simple attempt to get more power.

In these cases the West looks at those 'terrorists' as terrorists, but they are another man's freedom fighters.

People like Osama Bin Laden and Al Zarqawi are scum of the earth though, and I don't understand their motives at all, except for being driven by hatred. Their acts shouldn't make you generalize other terrorists / freedom fighters and put them all in the same boat.

 

[Duke]

"Freedom fighters" do not deliberately attack civillian targets because they're civillian. "Resistance movements" attack the invaders, not the native population.

 

[Swift]

Destroying a public place that had NOTHING to do with the decision to go into Iraq or any other middle eastern country is just weak. Why didn't they hit parliment or something? At least those people had a direct say in what was going to happen with the military in Iraq.

Honestly, I hate playing this game that they started by our(United Nations) rules. They don't have any rules. So we should just end this garbage before more people get killed because we're still trying to find Osama.

 

[ledhed]

Track down the members and leaders of these orginizations and their supporters . Kill them all . No more terrorist .
We need to do a better job of hunting these scum down .

 

[Tacet_Blue]

Part of me just wants to have an angry rant about how disgusted I am about these attacks on civilians, the cowardice involved in attacking these soft targets, the futility of it, the utter waste of life and the grievance and suffering it has caused to all those affected...but that is what the terrorist wants...to cause terror and destruction, to disrupt and demoralise.

It is a little worrying that the intelligence services slipped up and failed to see any of this coming as it was very well organised and couldn't have just been planned overnight.

People like Osama Bin Laden and Al Zarqawi are scum of the earth though, and I don't understand their motives at all, except for being driven by hatred. Their acts shouldn't make you generalize other terrorists / freedom fighters and put them all in the same boat.

You can only call yourself a freedom fighter when you are on native soil fighting an oppressor, if you cross borders to fight an occupying force you are a mercenary, if you cross borders to fight a sovereign nation, then you are an international terrorist, nothing more. (And IMO, deserve to die)

A website claims it was done in the name of Islam. We have a thriving community of Muslims in London and not one of them agrees! I'd like to know how the shards of glass can differentiate between Asian and British or the many other cultures and races we have in the UK.
Seems like an act of indiscriminate killing to me.

Acts like this only demonise the perpetrators and make it easier for people like Bush and Blair to order pre-emptive strikes in the name of the war on terror.

London will be fine, it has seen a lot worse, the only thing that has changed is that the people responsible now have a lot more enemies than they did yesterday.

 

[skicrush]

Destroying a public place that had NOTHING to do with the decision to go into Iraq or any other middle eastern country is just weak. Why didn't they hit parliment or something? At least those people had a direct say in what was going to happen with the military in Iraq.

Honestly, I hate playing this game that they started by our(United Nations) rules. They don't have any rules. So we should just end this garbage before more people get killed because we're still trying to find Osama.

Worse yet, the "resistence" in Iraq is now targeting the diplomats from their fellow arab countries. And what are they resisting? The emergence of freedom and democracy? No, they are resisting their loss of power, with leftover weapons from when they HAD power. Worse yet for them, the people are really starting to believe that WE WANT OUT as soon as we can responsibly leave, and that their continued fighting is the very thing that is keeping us there. It seems to be that this is what has triggered the change in tactics, to make them start attacking other arab diplomats. But it doesn't make sense--I really don't think it is going to accomplish anything. The "freedom fighters" seem more and more to actually just be fighting freedom.

 

[Hell Raiser]

As in any religion, there will be people who will take things too far. All these groups that fight in the name of Islam,has NOTHING to do with Islam. In Islam an army at war is forbidden from killing any woman ,child,elder,they are even FORBIDDEN from cutting down a tree.!!!!!!!!!!
Yes the Islam empire spread from China to the south of France,and a good part of it was won with war,but once in control,people of different faith were protected under the Islamic law.No one could take their homes ,money,women,or children.Yes some did have to pay taxes,but they were never forced to convert.
So please,before anyone else opens their mouths and talk out of their asses.Read up on history.Look for facts to support what you say,then talk.........
a lot of people in the past converted to Islam,because of what they saw missing in their own religion.
Don't judge Islam and the Muslims,by what a few ungodly people do in the name of Islam.

Like Ledhed said,track them down,and kill them.But in the process ,try to remember,that a lot of Muslims are falling victims,to a lot of new laws that are there
now to make them pay for something,they had no part of. so the next time you see a vailed woman or you run across a man that looks Arab,or as some MORONS would call them "towel heads"................STOP and THINK....................these are people just like you,that have families,that they care for and feelings,just like everyone else,so instead of insult,why don't you ask them their side of the story?? why don't you ask them how they feel about what is going on in the name of Islam??

 

[Duke]

Yes, precisely. It's largely 'disaffected' Sunnis who are keeping the so-called 'insurgency' going in Iraq. The Sunnis are attacking the fledgling Iraqi democracy and the Iraqi people because they've lost power. Remember, the Sunnis are the ones who almost completely boycotted the Iraqi national elections at the beginning of this year. So they're mad for being powerless... when they themselves chose not to vote.

There's just no rational dealing with these people. It's a damn good thing they don't stand for all of Islam.

 

[Tacet_Blue]

Don't judge Islam and the Muslims,by what a few ungodly people do in the name of Islam.

I agree, the vast majority of Muslims (if not all of them) are disgusted by these acts as much as anyone.

The terrorists are abusing the religion and the concept of Jihad for their own political gain. Muslims are fed up seeing their religion of peace being tarnished like this on a world stage.

One of the first statements from our Prime Minister today was to reassure the Muslim community and tell the general public that the UK government does not think Muslim equals terrorist. A terrorist is a murderer no matter what his or her religion, the two are not related.

In the name of God, the merciful, the compassionate, may peace be upon the cheerful one and undaunted fighter, Prophet Muhammad, God's peace be upon him.

Nation of Islam and Arab nation: Rejoice for it is time to take revenge against the British Zionist Crusader government in retaliation for the massacres Britain is committing in Iraq and Afghanistan. The heroic mujahideen have carried out a blessed raid in London. Britain is now burning with fear, terror and panic in its northern, southern, eastern, and western quarters.

We have repeatedly warned the British Government and people. We have fulfilled our promise and carried out our blessed military raid in Britain after our mujahideen exerted strenuous efforts over a long period of time to ensure the success of the raid.

We continue to warn the governments of Denmark and Italy and all the Crusader governments that they will be punished in the same way if they do not withdraw their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. He who warns is excused.

God says: "You who believe: If ye will aid (the cause of) Allah, He will aid you, and plant your feet firmly.

Islam is fundamentally a peaceful religion, no genuine Muslim will fall for the above rubbish.

 

[skicrush]

Yes, precisely. It's largely 'disaffected' Sunnis who are keeping the so-called 'insurgency' going in Iraq. The Sunnis are attacking the fledgling Iraqi democracy and the Iraqi people because they've lost power. Remember, the Sunnis are the ones who almost completely boycotted the Iraqi national elections at the beginning of this year. So they're mad for being powerless... when they themselves chose not to vote.

There's just no rational dealing with these people. It's a damn good thing they don't stand for all of Islam.

Moreover, the conflict in Iraq is NOT a religious one--it is social. Kurds, Shi'ite, Sunni--As far as the Iraq conflict is concerned, they are simply different social classes. The Sunnis had power, and now that power has been (or tried to be) fairly redistributed, they, who had all the power, were liberated of quite a bit so there was some to give to the other affected parties. And they're being sore losers about it. The only part religion plays in it is as an identifier of the different parties.

In fact, after Lebanon's elections and now that the palestinian peace process is grinding forward too, the only legitimate problems most arabs have should be with their own gov'ts, not ours. Interesting, isn't it, that the very problem that started the whole terrorism thing is now being peacefully sorted out, and the terrorism it spawned has now taken on a life (and a cause) of it's own. Bin Laden is nothing more than a megalomaniac psychopath. He has no cause other than his own delusions. Some have suggested they're jealous of us, and our wealth. Not true--look at the family he comes from. He is simply insane. Every bit the equal of Hitler in his delusions. And in as much need of being stopped, before he tries to take the title. There is NO reasoning with them. I, for one, am glad we made sure that whatever Iraq had or was planning on making is no longer available to them.

 

[a6m5]

I'm glad you guys are smart and cool about all this. 👍

and BLAAMO!!!! he hit the nail on the head. that's why i choose not to participate in ANY organized religion. Religion has been the cause for nearly every major war ever. You know, the movie Dogma should be taken WAY more seriously.

I don't think this is exatcly true. Any religious person, sane and with common sense would have said "no" to starting wars in name of their religion. Those wars were started by criminals, who used religion for their own cause, IMO.

 

[Duke]

We continue to warn the governments of Denmark and Italy and all the Crusader governments that they will be punished in the same way if they do not withdraw their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. He who warns is excused.

Unless, of course, it's the US doing the warning. We gave the Afghanistani Taliban fair warning - hand over Bin Laden or we're coming to get him. Hell, we gave Hussein almost 10 years of warning - comply with the terms of your surrender or the war is back on.

Somehow 'the Great Satan' doesn't get excused, even when we warn...

 

[skicrush]

From slate magazine: http://slate.msn.com/id/2122246/

"Bin Laden's whole game plan is to turn the people of the democratic world against their governments. He thinks democracies are weak because their people, who are more easily frightened than their governments, can bring those governments down. He doesn't understand that this flexibility—and this trust—are why democracies will live, while he will die. Many of us didn't vote for Bush's government or Blair's. But we're loyal to them, in part because we were given a voice in choosing them. And if we don't like our governments, we can vote them out. We can't vote out terrorists. We can only kill them."

 

[ledhed]

Its not like we do not know that we are at war with Islamic terrorist . They have been telling US they are at war for YEARS . We need to get it into our heads that WE are at war with them and act accordingly . Enough of the PC crap . Enough business as usual . Enough worring about who's with us . Enough waiting for France and the rest .
Get busy winning . Hunt them no matter where on EARTH they go . Then go in and KILL them. If you do not want us in your country ...then you go get them ..if not GET THE FRIK OUT OF THE WAY ..this is bull . Its not like we do not KNOW who to get ! WE KNOW WHERE TO FIND THEM . So WTF are we waiting for ? A few more bus loads ? Another frikin building ? Another diplomat or construction worker ? A few MORE beheadings ?

 

[smellysocks12]

"Freedom fighters" do not deliberately attack civillian targets because they're civillian. "Resistance movements" attack the invaders, not the native population.

That's your view, that's my view, but not everyone's view.

 

[Hell Raiser]

Ha. The religion of peace. Do female suicide bombers get dark haired virgins in heaven too?

That was just a moronic thing to say!!!!!!!

And everyone wonders why is there so much hate and misunderstanding in this world,it's because of comments like that.THINK BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR MOUTH!!!!!

 

[PS]

Add some more exclamation marks, it might make him understand faster.

 

[Hell Raiser]

Add some more exclamation marks, it might make him understand faster.

Point well taken

 

[blargonator]

3 of the main religions are fundamentally the same, judaism came before christianity which basically added the new testament and from christianity came islam ( im just generalizing, i don't want to get into specifics). most people think wow! those crazy other religions! good thing we are right <;- )
well, if you actually look into all the religions you will see they have things in common like the same prophets and the same stories, they all have a story of a great flood and etc.
hell, christanity and islam have a HUGE connection, Jesus Christ = Isa who is a important prophet. basically you guys have seemed to take care of the things i was thinking, every religion and place has a small amount of crazies, its stupid to generalize on that tiny population. its like saying 1 of every 10,000 christians has commited a crime ( that is not a real number, just an example i made up) so obviously all christians are criminals which we know is not true.