The US War in Afghanistan

[Touring Mars]

Anyone who buys this notion of a 'reformed Taliban' are deluded.

Some protestors removed a Taliban flag in Jalalabad and tried to replace it with the flag of Afghanistan - they were shot.

 

[HenrySwanson]

Anyone who buys this notion of a 'reformed Taliban' are deluded.

Some protestors removed a Taliban flag in Jalalabad and tried to replace it with the flag of Afghanistan - they were shot.

Yep.

Women especially are going to suffer. Again.

 

[PeterJB]

Anyone who buys this notion of a 'reformed Taliban' are deluded.

Some protestors removed a Taliban flag in Jalalabad and tried to replace it with the flag of Afghanistan - they were shot.

I dunno, just shooting them is pretty tame by the Taliban's usual standards. /s

 

[DK]

If Amrullah Saleh (the self-declared "Acting President" since Ghani's departure) manages to beat the Taliban, he's going to be a Mubarak-style military dictator isn't he?

 

[Keef]

We've got so many intertwined threads that I can't tell which one to put this in but this one is hot so it's going here.

Somehow I just learned yesterday that China has a coupe outposts (not sure I'd call them bases) immediately north of Afghanistan's Wakhan Corridor, in Tajikistan, along the Aksu river. Their goal is to stop militants moving into China because this area has a 50-mile mountainous border with China. They've also got roads built all the friggin way up to Wakhjir Pass which crosses the Afghan-Chinese border, and several small outposts in the area of the Afghan and Pakistani borders. Trust issues much? China, I can assure you that the Taliban is not interested in crossing over into your Uyghur territory to see what you're doing with Muslims.

But wouldn't it be funny if Trump left us with a parting gift and that's exactly what the Taliban intend to do?

 

[Groundfish]

 

[UKMikey]

I'm neither endorsing or rejecting this guy's views yet but would like to hear some counterpoints as I'm not informed about the situation on the ground out there.

 

[Liquid]

We've got so many intertwined threads that I can't tell which one to put this in but this one is hot so it's going here.

Somehow I just learned yesterday that China has a coupe outposts (not sure I'd call them bases) immediately north of Afghanistan's Wakhan Corridor, in Tajikistan, along the Aksu river. Their goal is to stop militants moving into China because this area has a 50-mile mountainous border with China. They've also got roads built all the friggin way up to Wakhjir Pass which crosses the Afghan-Chinese border, and several small outposts in the area of the Afghan and Pakistani borders. Trust issues much? China, I can assure you that the Taliban is not interested in crossing over into your Uyghur territory to see what you're doing with Muslims.

But wouldn't it be funny if Trump left us with a parting gift and that's exactly what the Taliban intend to do?

Russia is already doing business with the Taliban government like it's business as usual.

So for those who say that Afghanistan should be Russia or China's problem for a change, you'll get your wish.

 

[HenrySwanson]

Taliban scholars will decide whether girls are allowed to go to school or not.

Mujahid vowed that the Islamic Emirate, the Taliban’s name for their nascent administration, would “respect the rights of women” before adding the caveat “within the framework of Islamic law”.

He said that women would be allowed to work “with different areas like health and education” but he would not be drawn on whether they would be allowed in public life or leadership positions.

 

[PeterJB]

Taliban scholars will decide whether girls are allowed to go to school or not.

Mujahid vowed that the Islamic Emirate, the Taliban’s name for their nascent administration, would “respect the rights of women” before adding the caveat “within the framework of Islamic law”.

He said that women would be allowed to work “with different areas like health and education” but he would not be drawn on whether they would be allowed in public life or leadership positions.

Somehow I get the feeling they won't.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

Mike Pompeo's take on the situation.

 

[McLaren]

Former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo joins to discuss Biden's terrible approach to the Taliban threat in Afghanistan.

Former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo meeting with Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar, now the Taliban's de facto political leader

 

[ryzno]

That didn't take long, wondering when the bloods and crips are gonna start killing each other.

 

[Keef]

Mike Pompeo's take on the situation.

"Joe Biden announced in April that we would be withdrawing all our Troops and then he just sort of precipitously did it."

I didn't even make it 30 seconds into the video without Shapiro telling a half-truth at best. The Trump administration is that one that announced our withdraw - the Doha Agreement was signed on Feb 29, 2020. Here is the text of the agreement from the Department of State's website. As @McLaren posted, Mike Pompeo was the envoy who negotiated this deal in person on behalf of Trump's administration. The Biden administration had remained committed to executing the deal, and negotiations between the Taliban and Afghan government continued through early 2021.

"We withdrew all close air support..."

Well now that's just false, and I know that because I watched this press conference the other day where a US general said specifically that close air support is still available. The briefing and questions begin just after 49:00.



Okay, now that we've made it through the first 30 seconds of Shapiro's video...

Okay 50 seconds has come around and Pompeo says, "We had a plan...it doesn't appear that this administration had a plan at all." I've already addressed this - it's a blatant lie because the Biden administration did indeed have the plan which was developed by the Trump administration.

You should definitely reconsider where you get your information if it only took some guy in a chair a few minutes to prove multiple points wrong before he even got in a minute into the video.

 

[ryzno]

You should definitely reconsider where you get your information if it only took some guy in a chair a few minutes to prove multiple points wrong before he even got in a minute into the video.

Trump wanted, civilians, embassy, supplies and troops in that order.
"Ya know that thing" guy missed a few steps. Wonder why they're letting people leave so "peacefully"? We just left everything, weapons, Blackhawks...
We just supplied them man.
Wake up.

 

[Danoff]

Trump wanted, civilians, embassy, supplies and troops in that order.
"Ya know that thing" guy missed a few steps. Wonder why they're letting people leave so "peacefully"? We just left everything, weapons, Blackhawks...
We just supplied them man.
Wake up.

I wonder why Biden told our military to leave Blackhawk helicopters. That seems like a strange order. When BIden announced in April that we'd be out by September 11, I wonder why he included in that April announcement "please leave the helicopters". [/s]

 

[ryzno]

I wonder why Biden told our military to leave Blackhawk helicopters. That seems like a strange order... when BIden announced in April that we'd be out by September 11, I wonder why he included in that April announcement "please leave the helicopters". [/s]

We literally left with no announcement of actual dares and you know damn good and well we couldn't get 20yrs of equipment out in a night without being noticed.
We left everyone and everything, why you think the the UK and other countries are gonna bring charges against us to the UN?

 

[Famine]

We literally left with no announcement of actual dares ... we couldn't get 20yrs of equipment out in a night without being noticed.

How about 54 nights?

July 8th:

‘Overdue’: Biden sets Aug. 31 for US exit from Afghanistan

President Joe Biden says the U.S. military operation in Afghanistan will end on Aug. 31. He delivered an impassioned argument for exiting the nearly 20-year war without sacrificing more American lives even as he bluntly acknowledged there will be no “mission accomplished” moment to celebrate.

apnews.com

 

[ryzno]

‘Overdue’: Biden sets Aug. 31 for US exit from Afghanistan

President Joe Biden says the U.S. military operation in Afghanistan will end on Aug. 31. He delivered an impassioned argument for exiting the nearly 20-year war without sacrificing more American lives even as he bluntly acknowledged there will be no “mission accomplished” moment to celebrate.

apnews.com

You know what I meant man...
Quote the rest of my post.
Also correct quote and correct Danoff, his post disagrees with yours.

Regardless we left everything including our citizens. And yours.

 

[Famine]

You know what I meant man...

Yeah, you meant to post hyperbolic horse **** as usual.

Quote the rest of my post.

Oh the sheer irony of you saying that to anyone when you disregard 90%+ of any given post.

Also correct quote and correct Danoff, his post disagrees with yours.

No, it doesn't.

@Danoff said Biden announced in April that the US would leave before September 11... and he did.

Remarks by President Biden on the Way Forward in Afghanistan | The White House

Treaty Room 2:29 P.M. EDTTHE PRESIDENT: Good afternoon. I'm speaking to you today from the Roosevelt -- the Treaty Room in the White

www.whitehouse.gov

Then he said in July it would be August 31 - which is of course before September 11:

‘Overdue’: Biden sets Aug. 31 for US exit from Afghanistan

President Joe Biden says the U.S. military operation in Afghanistan will end on Aug. 31. He delivered an impassioned argument for exiting the nearly 20-year war without sacrificing more American lives even as he bluntly acknowledged there will be no “mission accomplished” moment to celebrate.

apnews.com

Both things are true. What's also true is that the Trump administration committed to a full withdrawal by May 1 2021, and I assume if you think 54 nights is "one night" you'd think that minus 122 nights is even shorter notice.

As for the comment about Trump wanting to get civilians out... sheesh. Doesn't look like he was all that keen on them.

Former Pence aide says Trump and Stephen Miller fought against Afghan refugee visas

Olivia Troye slammed previous administration’s failure to help allies who were ‘lifelines’ in Afghanistan

www.independent.co.uk

It's certainly a cluster****, and Biden bears some responsibility for it, but...

 

[McLaren]

There were reports back in May that the US was destroying all its equipment and taking back what it could.

All those weapons and helicopters you're worried about, you can probably take up your issue with the now-gone Afghanistan military who decided to ditch it instead of using it.

Officials are being secretive about what stays and what goes. Most of what is being shipped home is sensitive equipment never intended to stay behind, say U.S. Defense and Western officials who spoke on condition of anonymity in order to speak freely about departing troops.

Other equipment including helicopters, military vehicles, weapons and ammunition will be handed over to Afghanistan’s National Defense and Security Forces. Some bases will be given to them as well. One of those most recently handed over was the New Antonik base in Helmand province, where Taliban are said to control roughly 80% of the rural area.

U.S. trashes unwanted gear in Afghanistan, sells as scrap

The Americans are dismantling their portion of nearby Bagram Air Base, and anything that they are not taking home or giving to the Afghan military, they destroy as completely as possible.

www.politico.com

The Afghan Armed Forces (AAF)—which has long failed to live up to the hopes and promises of its American backers—appears unable to stem the tide or retain the billions of dollars in U.S.-made weapons given to help their ongoing fight.

Afghan National Army (ANA) defeats undermine the government, bolster the Taliban's reputation, and hand the group new equipment and weapons.

Taliban's Lightning Afghan Advance Could Win Billions in U.S. Weapons

The Afghan Armed Forces are teetering on the brink, despite their supposed military edge thanks to billions of dollars worth of American-made weapons.

www.newsweek.com

Edit* Also to add on to @Famine 's post about the civilian aid; you've got Marjorie Greene and the rest of Trump's loyal followers upset with Biden about leaving behind people and yet (I believe @TexRex shared this beforehand)....

Some of the Republican House members who this week excoriated President Joe Biden's strategy to pull U.S. troops out of Afghanistan and evacuate Afghan civilians voted last month against legislation to speed up the visa application process for Afghan citizens.

The House overwhelmingly passed a bill to make it easier for Afghans who assisted the American military to relocate to the U.S. The Averting Loss of Life and Injury by Expediting SIVs Act (ALLIES) Act was approved by a 407-16 vote on July 22. The 16 "no" votes were all from Republicans.

These Republican House members voted against the bill:

• Rep. Andy Biggs of Arizona
• Rep. Lauren Boebert of Colorado
• Rep. Mo Brooks of Alabama
• Rep. Scott DesJarlais of Tennessee
• Rep. Jeff Duncan of South Carolina
• Rep. Bob Good of Virginia
• Rep. Paul Gosar of Arizona
• Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia
• Rep. Kevin Hern of Oklahoma
• Rep. Jody Hice of Georgia
• Rep. Thomas Massie of Kentucky
• Rep. Barry Moore of Alabama
• Rep. Scott Perry of Pennsylvania
• Rep. Bill Posey of Florida
• Rep. Matt Rosendale of Montana
• Rep. Chip Roy of Texas

These 16 Republicans voted against speeding up visas for Afghans fleeing the Taliban

Some Republicans now criticizing Biden voted to block legislation that would have expedited visas to help Afghanistan civilians fleeing the Taliban.

www.usatoday.com

 

[ryzno]

Not gonna waste my time reading your post.
Trump had a plan, Biden and everyone else wants to blame him cause that thing guy didn't even follow it...

Civilians, embassy, supplies, troops?

Did you miss where we just had to send back troops the other day cause **** hit the fan?

Wonder why... Oh yeah, we pulled out our troops first.

 

[Famine]

Not gonna waste my time reading your post.

As entirely predicted within that post.

Trump had a plan

To withdraw all troops on May 1. That was over three months ago. Biden actually delayed it giving more notice. This is how time works.

 

[ryzno]

All those weapons and helicopters you're worried about, you can probably take up your issue with the now-gone Afghanistan military who decided to ditch it instead of using

My point exactly. We shouldn't have left it. They never wanted to be trained to defend their country.

As entirely predicted within that post.

To withdraw all troops on May 1. That was over three months ago. Biden actually delayed it giving more notice. This is how time works.

That's not following the schedule... Again, how you gonna blame Trump?
Read my original post.

Thanks for the merge. Something about timing... Sorry.

 

[McLaren]

My point exactly. We shouldn't have left it. They never wanted to be trained to defend their country.

You realize then that you have to blame Bush, Obama, & Trump in addition to your blame on Biden for being misled for 20 years into trying to train them to defend their country.

Or you place the blame back on the Afghanistan military for receiving billions in equipment & training, and then still running away.

 

[ryzno]

You realize then that you have to blame Bush, Obama, & Trump in addition to your blame on Biden for being misled for 20 years into trying to train them to defend their country.

Or you place the blame back on the Afghanistan military for receiving billions in equipment & training, and then still running away.

I do recall saying we should've never been there...

 

[Famine]

That's not following the schedule...

No, it's giving more notice. The opposite thing to what you said in your original post:

We literally left with no announcement of actual dares and you know damn good and well we couldn't get 20yrs of equipment out in a night without being noticed.

Trump committed to May 1 2021. Biden delayed that to "before September 11" (in April), then the specific date (which you say doesn't exist) of August 31 (in July). You surely comprehend that August 31 2021 (Biden's stated date) is in fact almost four months after May 1 2021 (Trump's stated date).

If not, then somehow according to your knowledge of time giving nearly two months' notice is "a night" and delaying something for four months is less notice than doing it on the original date.

And Trump railing against giving Afghan civilians visas and his usual cabal of morons in the house voting against it is somehow "Trump wanted to get civilians out".


Everything you said is demonstrably false, and you cannot be bothered reading anything that shows how false it is. Give it a month and you'll be saying the exact same nonsense again.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Civilians, embassy, supplies, troops?

I thought it was person, woman, man, camera, TV?

All I see is that he commented on that recently about how he would've done it, and potentially includes bombing the bases between the supplies and troops steps.

 

[ryzno]

Trump committed to May 1 2021. Biden delayed that to "before September 11" (in April), then the specific date (which you say doesn't exist) of August 31 (in July).

How's that Trums fault?

Trump wanted to get civilians out

American... You expected EVERYONE?

Ask everyone here, it's his fault. How you gonna blame someone else when they aren't in charge 5 months later? RoadDog?

That's like blaming me when I gotta remove a door frame and structure to remove a water heater that was 4" too big cause they built the closet around it.
You get it done while complaining about the previous idiots, but you get it done in time.

Y'all are hysterical.

 

[McLaren]

American...

That's not what he said recently. Has he flipped his stance or did you mishear him?

Can anyone even imagine taking out our Military before evacuating civilians and others who have been good to our Country and who should be allowed to seek refuge?

Ask everyone here, it's his fault. How you gonna blame someone else when they aren't in charge 5 months later? RoadDog?

B/c it's Trump's administration's negotiated deal & Biden just carried it out?

Trump is literally in Alabama right now telling everyone how he told the Taliban during his negotiation if they double-crossed the US, they would pay. Same man who a couple days, called the Taliban great negotiators. He wants to take credit for meeting with the Taliban and putting this deal in place, yet won't accept that it didn't play out the way he wanted is not how things work.