They could actually do this in GT5

[Zardoz]

Okay, one more for the list. This is the Maserati 8CTF, run without much success in European Grand Prix races in 1938. It is best known for winning the Indianapolis 500 back-to-back in 1939 and 1940, driven by Wilber Shaw:

 

[RedWolfRacer]

I'd like to applaud you for your knowledge of this era of racing, Zardoz. I agree that it was more or less the romantic era for racing as it was a fairly new sport as was the technology within it.

I agree that the Auto Union was a nice car to look at...except when you'd been racing at the 'ring for four hours hoping to get something decent enough to race with at the WGTC....

Still, it has the sleek lines of yester-year's cars. Though they might be laughable compared to the science of aerodynamics seen in today's cars, they were cutting-edge in their day! Hard to believe sometimes.

 

[Zardoz]

...I agree that it was more or less the romantic era for racing as it was a fairly new sport as was the technology within it...Though they might be laughable compared to the science of aerodynamics seen in today's cars, they were cutting-edge in their day! Hard to believe sometimes.

While we can't help but love those great old cars, the admiration we have for the guys who drove them is probably just as big a factor in the continuing interest race fans have for pre-war Grand Prix racing.

Consider what they were up against:

The cars were packing engines that put out between 430 and 646 HP (the supercharged straight-8 of the alcohol-burning 1937 Mercedes W125) and only weighed around 750 kilos (1650 pounds). They skittered along on those skinny, hard-rubber, lame-tread tires. Aerodynamic downforce was thirty years away from even being thought of. Suspensions were "basic", at best, with hydraulic shock absorbers and fully-independent layouts only just beginning to appear.

Without airfoil systems and wide tires to slow them down, they achieved very high straightaway speeds on the fast courses. The Mercs were timed at 193 MPH at Spa in 1937, and Auto Union claimed the 580 HP Type C could hit 205 if given enough room.

The drivers had no fire-retardant clothing at all, wore silly little cloth "helmets", and had no restraining harnesses, which was fine, of course, because none of the cars had so much as even a rudimentary roll bar. Their best chance for survival in a flip was to get ejected!

Safety barriers on the tracks were a farce. Piles of sandbags was their idea of high-tech energy-absorbing systems. Spectators got up close and personal, and many were killed when cars slammed into them. Look at this jammed-packed starting grid and the in-your-face seating of the crowd:

The tracks were lined with trees, ditches, and buildings. They'd pile up some hay bales and declare the course "safe":

They didn't even get hay bales most of the time. Make a mistake here and your initial contact is the stone wall of a building:

Sure, it takes nerve to climb into any race car, but what those guys had to face was pretty extreme, to say the least. That was a unique era of car racing, and you really have to admire what they did.

 

[Gabkicks]

there were many less crashes back then also. drivers nowadays crash alot more nowadays because i guess they feel safer.

 

[Tornado]

there were many less crashes back then also. drivers nowadays crash alot more nowadays because i guess they feel safer.

Yeah, but nearly every crash was fatal. That's why there were less crashes. You never pushed a car because you could very easily die in a wreck.

 

[Gabkicks]

thats what i was emplying, but thx for spelling it out for those who arent so quick

 

[Zardoz]

Just stumbled onto this Mercedes Motorsport site:

http://www3.mercedes-benz.com/motorsport/e/unterhaltung/videogallery.htm

The video gallery has races from 1908 to the 2004 DTM, with three (Avus 1937, Monaco 1937, and Tripoli 1938) from the era we're talking about.

The 1908 vid is hilarious. Lots of trouble in that turn!

 

[amar212]

One mine older post on this particular subject - my favourite racing-story of all times regarding pre-war era. Read if you like.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1217575&postcount=30

Zardoz, nict to know that someone loves and knows that era as much as me and my crew. BR 2 U.

 

[Zardoz]

One more shot. I just found it, and its so appalling I had to post it:

What a death trap. This is the Grand Prix of Tripoli, 1937. Blow a tire or spin out and you're into those big, tough palm trees. You'll probably slaughter a few spectators while you're at it.

Has racing safety come a long way, or what?

 

[McLaren]

While it'd be cool to see those cars, I would never drive them as I'm not a fan of them. I just really dislike the styling of cars past the 60's.

Plus, there'd be those morons who think, "They're a waste of space and no one likes them" because they don't know why they're really there.

 

[Gabkicks]

this thread has been a great history lesson

 

[Old Geezer]

Call me dumb, but I'd find it to be spitting on the gravestones to drift these.

NOT Dumb...you've obviously just never seen films of these monsters in action!!! 600HP transferred thru 4" wide tyres! Contrary to ever popular "FAN BOY" beliefs..."Drifting" is NOT the "Invention" of 21st Century Japanese drivers!

GREAT Thread Zardoz! 👍 I actually got to see the rear engined Auto Union above make a few laps at Laguna Seca circa 1981. I use the word VERY sparingly...BUT the only description was "AWESOME!!!" ...O.G.

 

[Small_Fryz]

Great thread 👍, learned a lot 👍

I would like to add the BRM V16, id love to hear that engine in the game .

Their is no doubt about it, these guys had great skills to drive these cars, all corners where taken with 4 wheel drifts. Very entertaining to watch.

 

[Zardoz]

Okay, these are the last shots of these old guys that I'll post. Thanks for bearing with me.

Maserati Type V8RI (1936):

Alfa Romeo 8C-35 (1935):

The next year they jammed a bigger V-12 into it and re-named it the 12C-36:

Mercedes W25E (1936):

In 1938 Alfa was so desperate to become competitive with the Germans they fielded three different Grand Prix cars, with 8-cylinder, 12-cylinder, and 16-cylinder engines. This is the V16-powered Type 316:

So here's the list of possible candidates for our fantasy GT5 pre-war Grand Prix car class:

Mercedes-Benz W25E (1936)
Mercedes-Benz W125 (1937)
Mercedes-Benz W154 (1938)
Mercedes-Benz W163 (1939)
Auto Union Type C (1936)
Auto Union Type D (1938)
Alfa-Romeo 8C-35 (1935)
Alfa-Romeo 12C-36 (1936)
Alfa-Romeo 12C-37(1937)
Alfa-Romeo 316 (1938)
Alfa-Romeo 158 (1939)
Maserati 8CM (1935)
Maserati V8RI (1936)
Maserati 8CTF (1938)

We could have some serious fun with these. Too bad there's next to no chance of it happening...

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Jih, good idea. Very shagadelic. All racing is good racing, a bit of classic is what we all want.

 

[Pupik]

It's not pre-war, but I'd rather have the Maserati 250F.

Polyphony could easily make a GT game just for a history of racing cars, but I'm not sure how much of a sucess it would be. I can't see that happening, although some sort fo game that allows you to compare different types of racing cars and from different eras. A great idea, but PD going to have to slowly feed us the idea just as they are doing it in GT4 (some 80's cars, 90's, and present-day). Still, we're almost there.

Now if only PD could trust us to race the cars when we see fit, not some silly Photo Mode or Test Course only! Come on, we've already established what's cheating and what's not...

 

[FooAtari]

Call me dumb, but I'd find it to be spitting on the gravestones to drift these.

You need to look up on your motorsport History Tyre technology was non-existance back then, drifiting was how these guys raced. Seeing the cars slide around and out of corners was common in F1 up until the 70's...

Drifiting is nothing new

 

[Milliethemutt]

After a few visits to Goodwood they would certainly get my vote and post war race cars too.

 

[Danny]

Looks like Pro Race Driver 2006 could do this better...