What Are Your Most Compelling Gran Turismo David vs Goliath Victories?

[michael_s_k]

I am curious regarding other players' most compelling Gran Turismo David vs Goliath moments. Which are the lowest-HP vehicle you've used to take 1st Place in challenging GT 2 events against significantly more powerful rides?

A highlight for me, and the challenge that initiated (w/inspiration and guidance from the GT master TeaKanji) my gaining a working understanding of vehicle systems, tuning, and best-practice driving techniques:

Using the Suzuki Cappuccino, successfully completing the GT40 challenge during the Rome Circuit race of the Historic 80's Car cup (when the game deploys a special Ford GT40 that not only has HP over the event limit but also adjusts its performance capabilities on an ad hoc basis to help it crush all who oppose its reign).

TeaKanji's defeat of dual GT40's during this race is impressive to say the least.

I also snatched the checkered flag from the GT40 on Rome Circuit using the Cooper Mini 1275S Mk1 requiring a special focus on learning how to tune and drive the FF Cooper Mini 1275S FF effectively. It was among other things a workshop for learning how to win using cars with serious oversteer deficits.

I have enjoyed lots of other mismatches, most recently using a 258 HP BP Kraft Apex Trueno GT to defeat the GT-One 99' (and the GT40, Oreca Viper, etc) in the Red Rock Raceway GT All-stars event. An interesting exploration of maintaining a high average speed, effective cornering and barely beating a far superior vehicle you have no reasonable expectation of defeating.

Point being, I have had some "exciting rides" using vehicles from lower classes to successfully challenge the mighty and am interested in hearing from other GT enthusiasts regarding their most amazing David vs Goliath races.

 

[TeaKanji]

Sorry I'm late to this thread; thanks for the shout-out. I was trying to come up with interesting ideas for 'David vs. Goliath' races, and so I experimented with cars that were able to beat the HKS 180SX Drag Car in the Turbo race at Test Course. Turns out a 296hp '93 Miata is capable of beating two of them...

 

[michael_s_k]

Nice!

 

[michael_s_k]

The more I consider your 93' Miata achievement vs the twin HKS 180SX's (on the Test Course during the Turbo event, no less), the more compelling your success becomes, inspiring me to try it out for myself and in doing so (hopefully) learning how you achieved this spectacular victory. I was reminded of using the low-hp BP Apex Trueno GT to win @ Red Rock Raceway(GT All-Stars event) vs a '99 GT-One and GT40 et al as it can be done but requires very specific driving technique, but your yields of feat here far surpass my own humble achievements and serve as super-cool inspiration. Just the idea itself: using a low-HP '93 Miata of all vehicles to best an HKS 180SX or two presents such an interesting challenge, how can any GT enthusiast resist giving it a try? You're kind of like a GT hero, challenging the Goliaths and coming out on top and in so doing providing edifying and entertaining replays so potent as to inspire every driver to improve his or her game. That's badass. Excellent again, TeaKanji.

 

[TeaKanji]

You're kind of like a GT hero, challenging the Goliaths and coming out on top and in so doing providing edifying and entertaining replays so potent as to inspire every driver to improve his or her game.

That's kind of you to say, and I'm glad to hear that these challenges have inspired you and potentially others to improve. It's one of the main reasons why I do what I do, to motivate and upskill others.

The Test Course challenge isn't too difficult really, the 180SX's have a very poor turn radius so you can catch up pretty easily on the corners. The Miata has fantastic acceleration, which allows it to hit 320km/h and reach the rest of the pack despite having a slow launch. If you follow a tune similar to the one I show at the start of the video, it should only take one or two attempts. It's more a challenge of tuning knowledge rather than driving skill.

I did have a go at beating GT All Stars at Red Rock Valley by the way, a racing-modified 305hp Silvia Q's 2000c was barely able to win against the GT-One and GT40. Yep, it does require careful driving and tuning indeed. Tuning breakdown is in the video description if you want to learn more.

 

[TeaKanji]

Figured I'd give an update on things that happened since I last posted here. I've completed a bunch more GT2 challenges, including beating race 3 of Convertible Car World with a 128hp Honda Beat, race 3 of Historic Car Cup with a 125hp Lotus Elan, race 1 of Tuned NA Car Cup with a 126hp Renault Clio, among other things. I've compiled them all into a playlist here for anyone who's interested: Playlist link

One "David vs. Goliath" race I did want to bring attention to, though, is NTSC 1.0 Trial Mountain 30 Laps. Due to a bug with endurance line-ups, the 679hp Vector M12 LM race car can appear, despite the event power limit being 295hp. It's often been touted as being near-impossible unless you use a ridiculously strong car like the Dodge Concept Car, but a few people recently have been able to prove that it's not too difficult with the right setup. Here's my run, using a racing-modified 276hp Impreza '94 WRX Sedan:



Also, special mention to Stass__ for managing to beat the Vector with a 250hp Spoon Civic Type R:



Would be cool to see more runs that manage to beat the Vector using unorthodox car choices. Granted, the Spoon Civic is extremely lightweight, but it proves that racing modifications/downforce may not be needed if you're using an FF or 4WD with a proper setup. The key thing seems to be setting the front height low and the rear height high so the car gets an acceleration boost, especially during the uphill sections. Soft springs and dampers also help a lot with the first section, as it allows you to blaze through the curbs without losing stability.

As for race 2 of Historic Car Cup against the GT40 at Rome, GTTRDS managed to prove that some cars that are even less powerful than the Cappuccino can beat it...

​

 

[BuNkELiT317]

I’m working on using a Stagea Autech (race modified, 627 HP) to take down the World Championship, but am struggling mightily with Trial Mountain, Rome, and Midfield. I’ve got Laguna Seca and Apricot Hill (without darting the final chicane!) in the bag.

I’d love to post a video of a Championship win, even if it’s not 5 first place races. Any thoughts on how to tune this beast?

I’m typically losing to the R390, the GT-One, the GT-40, and Atlantique race cars.

Stagea Pros:

-Off the line launch is unrivaled by any car in the grid
-Dominant in broad, sweeping corners
-Heavy; high stability in traffic when opponents race dirty

Stagea Cons (given my current tune?):

-Sluggish in lower gears
-Top speed is ~165
-Pushy in sharp corners (understeer in, oversteer out)

Anyone have any thoughts on suspension, gearing, LSD? I’ve only used the Auto Setting for gearing. Downforce is maxed, but even at the cost of top speed, I feel it’s necessary.

 

[TeaKanji]

I’m working on using a Stagea Autech (race modified, 627 HP) to take down the World Championship, but am struggling mightily with Trial Mountain, Rome, and Midfield. I’ve got Laguna Seca and Apricot Hill (without darting the final chicane!) in the bag.

I’d love to post a video of a Championship win, even if it’s not 5 first place races. Any thoughts on how to tune this beast?

I’m typically losing to the R390, the GT-One, the GT-40, and Atlantique race cars.

Stagea Pros:

-Off the line launch is unrivaled by any car in the grid
-Dominant in broad, sweeping corners
-Heavy; high stability in traffic when opponents race dirty

Stagea Cons (given my current tune?):

-Sluggish in lower gears
-Top speed is ~165
-Pushy in sharp corners (understeer in, oversteer out)

Anyone have any thoughts on suspension, gearing, LSD? I’ve only used the Auto Setting for gearing. Downforce is maxed, but even at the cost of top speed, I feel it’s necessary.

Try this and see how you get on:

springs: 3.2 / 4.5 ride height: 96 / 145 dampers (B + R): 2 / 5 camber: 2.2 / 1.0 toe: -0.20 / 0.20 stabilisers: 2 / 3 brake balance: 16 / 14 gears: final gear to 5.500, then auto setup to 6, then final gear to 3.900, then set individual gears to 2.485, 1.900, 1.475, 1.151, 0.900 downforce, 0.42 / 0.70 LSD: 1, 1, 1 / 1, 1, 1

Should do the trick as a general-purpose setup. The soft springs will allow you to cut through the curbs at Trial Mountain and Rome without the car flinging off-track. Lap 1 can be a bit messy against the key opponents you mentioned, but you can usually take the lead in lap 2 or 3 with clean driving.

 

[BuNkELiT317]

Gotta admit, pretty dog gone cool to get as detailed a response as you have provided in such a short time! Thanks, TeaKanji! I’ve been using your tuning guidance from your ultimate GT2 guide for some time now.

Out of determination, VERY aggressive driving, and only a pair of Atlantiques as the main opponents to beat, I was able to take down the Championship by a small margin earlier today.

I’m excited to utilize the tune you posted; if I’m able to take first in all races without absolutely bruising the pack to make it happen, I’ll put up a video.

Thank you to michael_s_k for originating and again to TeaKanji for the dedication to letting us nostalgia addicts in on your secrets!

One question, however. What happens when you say to set the final gear, then auto set, then set the final gear again?

 

[TeaKanji]

Gotta admit, pretty dog gone cool to get as detailed a response as you have provided in such a short time! Thanks, TeaKanji! I’ve been using your tuning guidance from your ultimate GT2 guide for some time now.

Out of determination, VERY aggressive driving, and only a pair of Atlantiques as the main opponents to beat, I was able to take down the Championship by a small margin earlier today.

I’m excited to utilize the tune you posted; if I’m able to take first in all races without absolutely bruising the pack to make it happen, I’ll put up a video.

Thank you to michael_s_k for originating and again to TeaKanji for the dedication to letting us nostalgia addicts in on your secrets!

One question, however. What happens when you say to set the final gear, then auto set, then set the final gear again?

Hehe, happy to help, hope the guide has been somewhat helpful. There's a few things I simplified or glossed over in the tuning section that I definitely plan to dive deeper into when I make a follow-up 'advanced' tuning guide. Congrats on winning the championship.

About the gears, basically, the auto setup slider changes the gear ratio ranges whenever you move it. Lower auto setup values will give closer gears, while higher ones will make the gears wider. For the smallest RPM drop between shifts, you want to set it to 1. However, as the Stagea is a 4WD and needs a fast 1st gear for a powerful launch, setting it to 1 will hinder the car's top speed. Setting it to 6 gave the best balance of close gears and top speed from my testing. The gear arrangement (1st gear all the way left, 4th gear all the way right, then all other gears spaced out in between) is mainly to bring the gears as close as the ranges will allow.

The final gear is set to 5.500 before using auto setup, as the game uses whatever the final gear is currently set to while determining the ratio ranges. Setting it to its highest setting, then lowering it again after using auto setup, gives you the most freedom, as you can fine-tune the final gear so the car has both a fast launch and enough top speed.

I hope that all makes sense, I understand it's a bit abstract and the game doesn't do a good job of showing you what's going on. The same trick works in GT3 and GT4, and I explain it in my guides for those if you want some more visual examples.

 

[michael_s_k]

TeaKanji - Thanks for posting again on this thread. As always, your posts are both entertaining and edifying as well as inspirational, providing new challenges for myself and anyone else lucky enough to follow your GT adventures. Wow you really covered a lot of ground here and I am excited to give these challenges a try myself. You're a GT hero and mentor and it's your accomplishments, starting with the Cappuccino win over dual GT40s, which inspired me to take the time to really learn about tuning and wow, what a significant positive difference a little knowledge makes. Your kind sharing of specific tunings was especially helpful and jump-started me down the road toward gaining a useful comprehension of tuning. And honestly, I'm still learning. Point being, I have to give you credit for being both an inspiration and teacher. So, thanks again TeaKanji.

Figured I'd give an update on things that happened since I last posted here. I've completed a bunch more GT2 challenges, including beating race 3 of Convertible Car World with a 128hp Honda Beat, race 3 of Historic Car Cup with a 125hp Lotus Elan, race 1 of Tuned NA Car Cup with a 126hp Renault Clio, among other things. I've compiled them all into a playlist here for anyone who's interested: Playlist link

One "David vs. Goliath" race I did want to bring attention to, though, is NTSC 1.0 Trial Mountain 30 Laps. Due to a bug with endurance line-ups, the 679hp Vector M12 LM race car can appear, despite the event power limit being 295hp. It's often been touted as being near-impossible unless you use a ridiculously strong car like the Dodge Concept Car, but a few people recently have been able to prove that it's not too difficult with the right setup. Here's my run, using a racing-modified 276hp Impreza '94 WRX Sedan:



Also, special mention to Stass__ for managing to beat the Vector with a 250hp Spoon Civic Type R:



Would be cool to see more runs that manage to beat the Vector using unorthodox car choices. Granted, the Spoon Civic is extremely lightweight, but it proves that racing modifications/downforce may not be needed if you're using an FF or 4WD with a proper setup. The key thing seems to be setting the front height low and the rear height high so the car gets an acceleration boost, especially during the uphill sections. Soft springs and dampers also help a lot with the first section, as it allows you to blaze through the curbs without losing stability.

As for race 2 of Historic Car Cup against the GT40 at Rome, GTTRDS managed to prove that some cars that are even less powerful than the Cappuccino can beat it...

​

Hehe, happy to help, hope the guide has been somewhat helpful. There's a few things I simplified or glossed over in the tuning section that I definitely plan to dive deeper into when I make a follow-up 'advanced' tuning guide. Congrats on winning the championship.

About the gears, basically, the auto setup slider changes the gear ratio ranges whenever you move it. Lower auto setup values will give closer gears, while higher ones will make the gears wider. For the smallest RPM drop between shifts, you want to set it to 1. However, as the Stagea is a 4WD and needs a fast 1st gear for a powerful launch, setting it to 1 will hinder the car's top speed. Setting it to 6 gave the best balance of close gears and top speed from my testing. The gear arrangement (1st gear all the way left, 4th gear all the way right, then all other gears spaced out in between) is mainly to bring the gears as close as the ranges will allow.

The final gear is set to 5.500 before using auto setup, as the game uses whatever the final gear is currently set to while determining the ratio ranges. Setting it to its highest setting, then lowering it again after using auto setup, gives you the most freedom, as you can fine-tune the final gear so the car has both a fast launch and enough top speed.

I hope that all makes sense, I understand it's a bit abstract and the game doesn't do a good job of showing you what's going on. The same trick works in GT3 and GT4, and I explain it in my guides for those if you want some more visual examples.

It totally makes sense and I have used your gear-setting technique on an ad hoc basis many times. Your further clarification here is much appreciated. Thanks!

 

[michael_s_k]

TeaKanji - Two items:

I neglected to offer my thanks for your inclusion of tuning for the '94 Impreza WRX sedan. A big Subaru Impreza fan primarily thanks to owning two Imprezas in real-life including a '94 wagon, my first Subaru and first AWD car and I'll never forget that first experience with it, a test-drive down a windy country road w/a couple of straigaways where I quickly discovered the wonders of the Impreza's excellent acceleration and superior traction and general handling. I was like "Wow, I had no idea this sedate-looking little wagon was capable of such a high level of performance" and fell immediately in love with Imprezas for life. In any case, I have the 94 sedan in my GT 2 garage for reasons of nostalgia and to see how much performance can be brought out in this oldie-but-goodie and look forward to trying out your suggested tuning.

I misread part one of your suggested "gear-trick" process, believing it to be 5.0 instead of 5.5 (or was it 5.050?) and had been using 5.0 as the initial final drive setting prior to setting it at 3.4 for months with very noticeable positive performance effects for most vehicles which seemed likely candidates for changing final drive settings and now look forward to seeing how setting final drive to 5.5 before switching to 3.4 effects performance.

As always, thank you!

 

[TeaKanji]

Figured I'd mention this here: I've organized a GT2 challenge run competition over on YouTube. For anyone observing this thread who wants to join in on the fun, now's your chance:



To enter, you just need to record and upload a public video on YouTube of beating any of the five Gran Turismo All Stars races using a car with 370hp or less. All forms of upgrades and tuning are allowed and encouraged. The more underpowered the car is, and the more spectacular the race is, the better. I've made a Discord server for the competition, where you can find the full list of rules (please read before doing attempts): https://discord.gg/VGjT6wX5rG

One submission per person will be accepted in the Discord server's #submissions channel until June 4th (roughly 2 1/2 weeks from now). The entries will then be judged with the help of fellow GT content creator Yellowbird. Two winners will be picked, who will each receive €50 worth of Steam games of their choice. Best of luck to all who take part!

 

[Kingofweasles]

Figured I'd mention this here: I've organized a GT2 challenge run competition over on YouTube. For anyone observing this thread who wants to join in on the fun, now's your chance:



To enter, you just need to record and upload a public video on YouTube of beating any of the five Gran Turismo All Stars races using a car with 370hp or less. All forms of upgrades and tuning are allowed and encouraged. The more underpowered the car is, and the more spectacular the race is, the better. I've made a Discord server for the competition, where you can find the full list of rules (please read before doing attempts): https://discord.gg/VGjT6wX5rG

One submission per person will be accepted in the Discord server's #submissions channel until June 4th (roughly 2 1/2 weeks from now). The entries will then be judged with the help of fellow GT content creator Yellowbird. Two winners will be picked, who will each receive €50 worth of Steam games of their choice. Best of luck to all who take part!

Can I use the GT2 Plus and 60fps gameplay mods? Because I'm interested in playing this game again and I think I can win with something fun...

 

[TeaKanji]

Can I use the GT2 Plus and 60fps gameplay mods? Because I'm interested in playing this game again and I think I can win with something fun...

Only the Light version of GT2+ is allowed (mainly for simplicity's sake as the latest Complete version changes power units on PAL/NTSC-U among other things, and Light lets people use NSX racing modifications on NTSC-U), and all of Silent's game-enhancing codes (60 FPS, improved draw distance etc.) are allowed.

 

[Kingofweasles]

Only the Light version of GT2+ is allowed (mainly for simplicity's sake as the latest Complete version changes power units on PAL/NTSC-U among other things, and Light lets people use NSX racing modifications on NTSC-U), and all of Silent's game-enhancing codes (60 FPS, improved draw distance etc.) are allowed.

Got it.

 

[michael_s_k]

Figured I'd mention this here: I've organized a GT2 challenge run competition over on YouTube. For anyone observing this thread who wants to join in on the fun, now's your chance:



To enter, you just need to record and upload a public video on YouTube of beating any of the five Gran Turismo All Stars races using a car with 370hp or less. All forms of upgrades and tuning are allowed and encouraged. The more underpowered the car is, and the more spectacular the race is, the better. I've made a Discord server for the competition, where you can find the full list of rules (please read before doing attempts): https://discord.gg/VGjT6wX5rG

One submission per person will be accepted in the Discord server's #submissions channel until June 4th (roughly 2 1/2 weeks from now). The entries will then be judged with the help of fellow GT content creator Yellowbird. Two winners will be picked, who will each receive €50 worth of Steam games of their choice. Best of luck to all who take part!

This is an extremely cool, fun and interesting challenge competition idea and I commend TeaKanji for facilitating the entire affair. Way to go TeaKanji and, correct me if I'm wrong, Yellowbird!