Will we ever see legendary and iconic EU cars?

[ClydeYellow]

The reason why lots of cars aren't premium is time.

Actually, no. It would've been time if Kazunori Yamauchi was an hobbyist making this game out of the goodness of his heart alone in his basement, and that surely doesn't seem to be the case. The reason why lots of cars aren't premium (other logistic factors notwithstanding) is the lack of man-hours. And to increase your man-hour budget you can either stretch development times, or hire more people.

We definitely need more apologists like you on this forum.

REMEMBER THE ELEVENTY BILLION.

No, but seriously, do you feel the need to throw the word "apologist" at someone who simply doesn't believe PD is the SS? Jesus Christ on a pogo stick, that's dense even for my standards.

And speaking of the matter at hand, I wouldn't say that Japan or the US are "well catered". Don't get me wrong, I agree with the OP in saying that we need more European cars; I even got my own mental list of EU cars that should be featured as Premiums in Gran Turismo: it may be because I'm a huge car nerd.
But I am not only bonkers for EU cars: if it has spinzy winzies and goes "wroom" (but "swish" is an acceptable sound, too) it's the coolest thing ever for me. And we're also missing lots of Japanese and American oldies - and many that are featured are Standards that haven't seen any upgrade since GT4 or, in some cases, GT3.

Also, OP speaks of Volkswagens like they're the coolest thing since sliced bread and if you don't see why they're so important to the world of cars you're retarded - I honestly couldn't care less for Polos and Golfs for the 80s, and would rather have a premium Honda S500 or a City Turbo or an Abarth 750 Zagato but hey, that's what I like.

 

[TRLWNC7396]

Actually, no. It would've been time if Kazunori Yamauchi was an hobbyist making this game out of the goodness of his heart alone in his basement, and that surely doesn't seem to be the case. The reason why lots of cars aren't premium (other logistic factors notwithstanding) is the lack of man-hours. And to increase your man-hour budget you can either stretch development times, or hire more people.

I liked the second half, but this part gave me a "WWhhhaaaaa.... ???" moment. Man hours IS time. What was your point? Okay, hiring, yes, but remember this: TRAINING someone to understand and be SUCCESSFUL programming for the (incredibly annoyingly hard to program) PS3 is going to take quite a bit of time. (Okay, man-hours. )

 

[ClydeYellow]

Man hours IS time.

No, it's the amount of work PER unit of time (in this case, 1 hour). Given that a job requires n man-hours and that a workforce of w workers is available, the (theoretical) time to completion will be h=n/w; I assume that most people wouldn't be happy if GT7 came out on the PS6 (I, for one, wouldn't), therefore if we increase n (by adding other tasks like, say, modelling other cars) we must also increase w by hiring other people (in this case, not coders, but rather 3d artists who can model those cars - it's not really that hard to find people who are already trained for that; I think PD uses Autodesk products, which are quite popular in the industry, but I may be way off).

 

[Nurburgthing.]

@ClydeYellow - It's true, I am a huge retro VW fanboi but, I love many many other old school cars too be they American, Japanese or otherwise.

For example, why are the old skylines standard? Why are so many old muscle cars standard? It's utterly ridiculous.

Being a European I am more biased towards our cars and circuits. I do love cars and tracks from all over though.

 

[Ameer67]

Well spotted. What is your point? The Ferrari was probably harder to pin down than the Audi, that was my point.

My point was that just because they can get a Ferrari doesn't mean they can for sure get the Audi.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I liked the second half, but this part gave me a "WWhhhaaaaa.... ???" moment. Man hours IS time. What was your point? Okay, hiring, yes, but remember this: TRAINING someone to understand and be SUCCESSFUL programming for the (incredibly annoyingly hard to program) PS3 is going to take quite a bit of time. (Okay, man-hours. )

Hours is time if you are working alone. You have so many hours in a given calender period and that is it. When you have a team it is different, you can always hire more people and virtually create more time by essentially buying more hours of production in that same calender period.

The whole PS3 argument is moot at this point. It has been around a long time, there is simply no excuse at this point not to have a handle on things, if indeed that were the issue. I can understand that line of reasoning in 2006, not 2014. More likely it is pointless at this point to continue to put serious effort into the PS3 and most of the company is focused on the PS4 and GT7. IMO they dramatically overreached with GT6 and all effort at this point to finish the game is wasted. Call it a day, focus on creating more content that is usable on PS3 and PS4, leave the new features for GT7, apologize to fans, offer a discount on GT7 and move on.

 

[TRLWNC7396]

While I agree with the posts after mine, I must bring up a word of reminder. On the PS board, I regularly communicate with a retired main frame programmer. His unique perspective of the difficulties introducing someone into a process (the PS3 at the moment) has given me a different perspective from the "throw bodies at it" concept.

Yes, when the PS3 came out, PD should have multiplied their workforce by a factor of 10. Yes, they are screwed (by themselves) for being SO ambitious with 6. No, they CAN'T train anyone fast enough to understand the system they have built to be worthwhile. And, no, they can't train someone to program for the PS3 fast (or cheap) enough to be worth hiring that many people.

So, @Johnnypenso, while you are right on the new system end of it, we have to remember that GT is a specific program and training new people to use it will still take time and effort.

They ARE hiring. Not sure for what (besides sound), but they are.

I don't feel that giving up on 6 will really gain us much (some, yes, but not much) in the way of 7 coming out MONTHS earlier at this point in time.

We shall see.

 

[Johnnypenso]

While I agree with the posts after mine, I must bring up a word of reminder. On the PS board, I regularly communicate with a retired main frame programmer. His unique perspective of the difficulties introducing someone into a process (the PS3 at the moment) has given me a different perspective from the "throw bodies at it" concept.

Yes, when the PS3 came out, PD should have multiplied their workforce by a factor of 10. Yes, they are screwed (by themselves) for being SO ambitious with 6. No, they CAN'T train anyone fast enough to understand the system they have built to be worthwhile. And, no, they can't train someone to program for the PS3 fast (or cheap) enough to be worth hiring that many people.

So, @Johnnypenso, while you are right on the new system end of it, we have to remember that GT is a specific program and training new people to use it will still take time and effort.

They ARE hiring. Not sure for what (besides sound), but they are.

I don't feel that giving up on 6 will really gain us much (some, yes, but not much) in the way of 7 coming out MONTHS earlier at this point in time.

We shall see.

Agreed with most of this but the last part. I didn't say give up I said focus on content. Obviously if a feature is 90% complete it makes sense to put some time into it and finish it for GT6. I get the feeling however, given its nearly a year since release and nearly 18 months since the features were announced that they are struggling to fit it into the PS3 without being buggy as heck. Witness the rash of bugs since Zahara. The longer it goes without the features, the bigger the fall is going to be if they never get released or they are released but they are half-assed and/or buggy as all get out.

PD would gain huge cred (and some backlash of course) if they just said, "We screwed up and overreached on the PS3, sorry. Instead. We'll release 30 cars intended for GT7 into GT6 in the next 6 months free of charge and here's a $10-15 PSN card....". etc.

 

[Highlandor]

It has been around a long time, there is simply no excuse at this point not to have a handle on things, if indeed that were the issue. I can understand that line of reasoning in 2006, not 2014. More likely it is pointless at this point to continue to put serious effort into the PS3 and most of the company is focused on the PS4 and GT7. IMO they dramatically overreached with GT6 and all effort at this point to finish the game is wasted. Call it a day, focus on creating more content that is usable on PS3 and PS4, leave the new features for GT7, apologize to fans, offer a discount on GT7 and move on.

Never more true'r word(s) spoken.... 👍

Re thread topic: I think 'hope' for some iconic cars is long gone. As discussed / mentioned many times on GTP, E30 M3 was voted most wanted car (not in the game) for GT5, they're not exactly difficult to find (to be modelled), and how many times did PD even recognise the need for this - zilch...

We have a rally spec Escort cossie, but no road car, which, IMO is even worse than omitting the E30 M3. Just how difficult would it be to amend the rally car into a standar road going car. The lack of cossie's is crazy (and I'm a huge aircooled VW guy, not a blue oval fanboi)..

Then look at the game as a whole - PD are going to do what PD wants, if some of that corresponds with people's suggestions it's more likely coincidence...

It's a real shame, as historics and classics are very popular amongst other websites' organised racing. In fact, it was probably our most popular and missed 'regular' nights...

 

[TRLWNC7396]

Okay, give up IS a bit harsh. I agree. 90% or so, they should be finished. But, yes, you are right. Finish what is there, and move on.

 

[eran0004]

Actually, no. It would've been time if Kazunori Yamauchi was an hobbyist making this game out of the goodness of his heart alone in his basement, and that surely doesn't seem to be the case. The reason why lots of cars aren't premium (other logistic factors notwithstanding) is the lack of man-hours. And to increase your man-hour budget you can either stretch development times, or hire more people.

Given that you find as many qualified 3D-artists as you would need. A lot of companies have a hard time finding qualified workforce when they need to expand, and it's often something that holds them back.

And if you can't expand your workforce, then man-hours is exactly like time.