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[Famine]

is there a ferrari in GT4???

*slap*

Can You drive endurance races in the b-spec mode?

Yes you can. And this has what to do with the thread?

I've now got complete data for the first 5 Used Car rotations. I'll update sometime tomorrow, as I've got a lengthy day in the field and I'm installing my seat in my GT4 rig when I get home...

 

[RallyRacingFan]

you are mocking me... aren't you?

Who is mocking you? I read the posts, I don't see any mocking.

The only thing we need is a common unit of performance. Which could be "seconds it takes to go around Tsukuba for 1 lap." (lets call this "T") for example . To make it as linear as possible it should be done in b-spec mode with a constant b-spec driver points.

While number of seconds around a course would be an excellent measure that approach requires tons of experimental data. Also the equation you present to model T is linear which I seriously doubt is going to fit the data well since power required to overcome aerodynamic drag is proportional to velocity cubed. Still it gives me an idea.

T = time in seconds around Tsukuba
Q = quarter mile time
K = 0-1000m time

T = aQ + bK

If a and b were relatively stable across a few cars perhaps we could use this to model performance.

But what I was trying to get was a mathematical model which takes the specs and roughly predicts the performance of cars around a track based on physics. Scaff threw a spanner in the works with this:

However take a look at the following:
http://www.miata.net/sport/Physics/13-Transients.html

which I am going to ignore because it makes things way too complex. So we already have a formula which very roughly predicts performance of cars around a track (PWR) and I was wanting to figure out what terms to add in order to make it more accurate. Not perfectly accurate, just more accurate.

I like the idea of B-Spec mode. Gives us the opportunity to run experiments under controlled conditions. One thing I would like to see if whether GT4 models the Scaff transients during cornering which would cause heavy cars to corner slower than light cars. A simple experiment would be to send B-Spec out in two different weight cars on tracks with constant radius curves and see if the speeds around the curves were the same for each car or not.

 

[Scaff]

Scaff threw a spanner in the works with this: which I am going to ignore because it makes things way too complex.

Sorry about that.

 

[vipersan]

Famine: thank you for great work.

I just hope, that the file will be updated accordingly when the PAL version comes ( I assume it will have some other cars too).

 

[El_Torero]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bramvanuytven

"... is there a ferrari in GT4??? "

that was the mocking part... nothing to do with the thread...

Anyway, I agree with you in the complexity of the the equation and that it will probably not be linear. As I said, I was trying to put in as many variables as possible in order to explain as closely as possible a non measurable aspect like handling.

I guess then that other way of doing it would be with the participation of the gtplanet forum.

The variables would be the following:

P = Power

W = Weight

T =Torque? (although this will probably be dependent of variable "P" and therefore should be taken out)

and H = Handling

How do we measure "H"? Well, by doing a survey... If we consider most of the voters as "experts", if they could give a value between 1 to 5 (or more) for handling for lets say a "chunk" (sorry about my english, there are certain words which i don´t know the translation) of 50 cars. Then we should get a fairly intresting indicator.

ciao

 

[RallyRacingFan]

Discussing car physics in this thread is probably a little off-topic especially considering there is a whole thread called "Car physics" over in Automotive > Cars in General forum. My bad. I got a PM which mentioned that if I wanted to read up about car physics to help create a mathematical model I should check out the car physics thread. It occured to me that I should have posted there in the first place.

 

[Famine]

Okay, latest update...

We've got numbers for the first FIVE used car lists now - making 610 cars in total. I'll go over and check the "more expensive" dealer cars at some point soon, by the magic of maskrider's save game.

One bizarre moment - I noted the presence of a Suzuki Cappuccino '95 in the Used Car A list on the third rotation (Days 15-21) which had only 10.0km on the clock. The mileage (kilometreage?) was highlighted in orange, and the car had correspondingly higher power/torque figures than the regular 50,000km+ Cappuccino '95. I'll be making note of any future occurrences of this, and posting comments in the Excel file regarding it.

 

[Sambert]

Used cars with the orange highlighting appear on a regular basis. No doubt a ploy by PD to keep us playing until we get our hands on a mint condition oldie of our choice. Well, it has worked on me. Hmm, I wonder how long it will be before I acquire that alpine green Cerbera with ten clicks on the odo...

Incidentally, is there a Ferrari in GT4?

Edit: I have it!!! The brown F40 is mine. Thankyou for sharing your secret with us Famine. I trust that you will enjoy the mindless PMs coming your way.

 

[El_Torero]

Incidentally, is there a Ferrari in GT4?

JEJE

 

[Famine]

Update.

All dealer-purchaseable cars amended for accurate figures. A couple of prize cars added to the list and some more used car shenanigans.

 

[Sambert]

In regard to the used cars, I have discovered that the black LM cars return to the used car dealerships on day 1392. Hence, it appears that they are available every 696 game days.

 

[Famine]

Yep - it's a 7-day rotation, and a 700 day cycle.

The lists change, in a non-random fashion, every 7 game days. They start over again on day 701...

 

[Barbol]

One bizarre moment - I noted the presence of a Suzuki Cappuccino '95 in the Used Car A list on the third rotation (Days 15-21) which had only 10.0km on the clock. The mileage (kilometreage?) was highlighted in orange, and the car had correspondingly higher power/torque figures than the regular 50,000km+ Cappuccino '95. I'll be making note of any future occurrences of this, and posting comments in the Excel file regarding it.

I believe that is when the kilometrage clock have more than 1 full loop......I have seen it in others used cars

Great work Famine 👍

 

[Barbol]

Yep - it's a 7-day rotation, and a 700 day cycle.

The lists change, in a non-random fashion, every 7 game days. They start over again on day 701...

Please, can you add the number of rotation (or game day) when each used car appears

Only a suggest

 

[Famine]

Please, can you add the number of rotation (or game day) when each used car appears

Only a suggest

In the final version there will be 99 more worksheets nailed onto the back, covering each Used Car rotation.

 

[Famine]

Update!

We're now up to 665 cars (including a Lotus Carlton I'd totally failed to spot in the Master Car List).

I'm steadily plodding through my licences whilst doing all this - I'm now up to IA6, having golded all of the previous ones - and eventually I might get to play the game...

The Used Car Database is coming along nicely too. I'm up to the 10th rotation - which means I'm 10% of the way there... *dies* Expect a thread on that inside the next few days.

 

[Toxi]

Hi there,

first of all, thank you very much for the work you did on the excel file. It's a great help.

I'm having a little trouble with the Professional Hall and the N/A Sports cars. TBH, I don't know what that means. It is some kind of engine but I had a look at all the cars I own and none of them has a N/ A sports engine. Could you please tell me, which GT4 cars have a N/A sports engine and / or how I get them? Is this a build in thing or do I need to tune my car?


Help is appreciated!


Kind regards,

Carsten

 

[Famine]

"NA" means "Naturally Aspirated". This is any engine without forced induction as standard - this means no turbochargers or superchargers. Vehicle aspiration can be found in the vehicle's information sheet.

At a later date, when I've had a chance to modify all of the cars, more information will appear in the Drive column. I like to use the format "nxxx". The inital number signifies the number of gears available on the stock vehicle (1-7). The next two letters signify the engine/drive wheel placement (FF, FR, MR, 4W, RR) and the final letter signifies the tuning type (T for Turbo & Intercooler; t for Turbo without Intercooler; N for NA tuning alone; and n for no significant power upgrades). 6MRt would, for example, show a car with a 6-speed gearbox, mid-engine, rear-wheel drive with available turbo upgrades but not intercooler upgrades. When this information becomes available, only cars with a terminal "T" would be ineligible for the NA Sports challenge. For now you'll have to rely on innate car knowledge and/or in-game data sheets.

To help you, steer clear of anything Japanese with big power (Skylines, Supra, RX-7, GTO). A TVR would be a good bet.

 

[Toxi]

Hi,

thanks for the help. I have completed around 40% of the game but didn't do all the japanese races so far. I'll contiunue here now ...


Regards,

Carsten

 

[lll777]

Does anyone know if the audi A4 DTM is standard available, and if you can tune this car. if yes, how far can this audi be tuned
be tuned..

 

[Famine]

File updated with some accurate values for more prize cars (Tank Car, for example).

 

[yeti]

Hey Famine...

Was wondering when you were gonna release the Used Car info?

C.

 

[Famine]

NEVER! MWAHAHAHAAHAHAAAAA!

I'm not sure. I've got 20 weeks done, but I don't know whether to release that or wait until I've got all 99...

 

[yeti]

Feel free to release the first few weeks...

I'm interested in them as I've not got the game yet and wish to plan which car I want to purchase...

Gotta be careful you see... cos if I hit the licences hard then come out and get a car I may have missed the car that I want... I'm thinking 80 tests... average of 3 tries to pass each... means 240 days... therefore first 15 weeks or so will have passed!!

C.

 

[Famine]

If you stay IN the tests, you won't gain extra days. You could have 900 attempts at it, as long as it's in one go.

Mission Hall is one day per attempt though.


And if anyone fails ANY GT4 licence test for time, they need shooting.

 

[GT Freak!]

Good list, and usefull. Never knew that there is a slight difference in power between PS and HP. Usefull to have it in HP though!

If you stay IN the tests, you won't gain extra days. You could have 900 attempts at it, as long as it's in one go.

Mission Hall is one day per attempt though.


And if anyone fails ANY GT4 licence test for time, they need shooting.

Are they that easy? Hope not, i dont want to be stuck on the same license until im 81 but i want a bit of challenge in them so my driving improves!

 

[Famine]

To pass they're peasy. To gold it's... not so peasy.

That said... 80/0/0

 

[Jetboy.]

Kudos to you, the Golding, the list, everything. I feel like I'm still at school with all that physics bickery; therefore, I need a cup of coffee now.

So Famine, what were you rewards for getting all golds?

 

[meister_dan]

Bump up

 

[yeti]

If you stay IN the tests, you won't gain extra days. You could have 900 attempts at it, as long as it's in one go.

Mission Hall is one day per attempt though.


And if anyone fails ANY GT4 licence test for time, they need shooting.

Really?!

I thought that each test meant a day... that's good to know...

Cheers

C.