Well I'm sure this post will stir up some controversy. But I think it is necessary for those of us that are reviewing replays.
First of all, class act posting your replay goixoye. 👍 I respect anyone that strives to prove to all that they have done what they say.
But having said that, you won't like the following.
Rotbarsch1979 pm'd me this morning to ask me to double check what he was seeing, and what goixoye had referred to in his post about the possible contact with the GT 20sec. into the race.
My first time looking at it, I went yup. No doubt there is slight contact, just by the little jiggle the ford does, and also when viewed behind, goix's Nissan jiggles too.
So then I started photomoding it from every possible angle from the Nissan point of view, and also the Ford point of view. The thing is, no matter what angle, what stop point, etc. I couldn't show the cars as being even close to contact! I ran this sequence for a good 45 minutes, because it was so similar to what I saw in DRIVEN's race. In that case I couldn't show contact either, (which DRIVEN went back and confirmed) so we let his result stand. I didn't want to be in the position of saying a race is dirty without proof, but here I have reviewed two races with similar incidents, that if it were my race I would have kicked for having contact without hesitation just by looking at the replay. Not even photomoding mind you, just looking at the replay. In fact I did just that very thing with a couple races for this event.
So after all these events, and having the desire to learn a little more, I decided to do a little experiment. I loaded up the Seoul race and started to do some intentional banging of AI. The most telling was going down the straight just before T2 when I intentionally rode into the side of the the GT almost the whole straight to the point where the GT was crabbing into me to counteract my push. I then saved the replay and then photomoded it. And here's the sequence.
In this photo we see the cars from the front at a distance obviously into each other right?
This next image is from the same camera and angle, just zoomed in. As you can see, there is an obvious gap between the cars. Let me assure you that I was hard into the GT at this point.
Now here are the cars in the same position, but as viewed from the rear.
First, viewed from a distance. (notice the GT crabbed into the Nissan)
And now again the same camera and angle as previous, but zoomed in.
Once again, the gap is clear to see.
As a reviewer, it would be obvious when viewing the replay to say that there is major contact all the way down the straight between these cars. But there is no proof, because the replay won't show it! Believe me, even with major contact, photomode is crap for proof of contact. The game won't show it. Unbelievable!
So now the question becomes how do we prove that contact has occurred?
One way that Gregor mentioned in his review of Bigrew's race was a speed drop of the car that is doing the contact. It was a good observation on his part, and one that I missed in reviewing DRIVEN's race. I went back and looked at that race again this morning, and there was a 4MPH drop under full throttle of the GT.
But in goixoye's case, the GT is under braking and zero throttle, so there is no way to establish a speed change.
The other way could be sound. Sometimes you can hear the contact if it's heavy enough. But again in goixoye's case the contact is very slight, and no sound that I can detect transfers.
Other than that, I'm starting to think that proof of contact will have to be at the discretion of the reviewer. I am also wondering if this statement should define contact for review purposes.
AI contact is assumed if a reasonable person can say that a suspicious interaction has occurred between vehicles with no other outside influences.
Acceptable evidence of AI contact may include:
1. An observed,unexplained, sudden change of intended trajectory of either or both vehicle when they are in close proximity.
2. A sudden speed gain or loss of at least 1.5MPH by either vehicle that cannot be explained by acceleration or braking.
3. The sound of a collision is noticed at the point AI contact is suspected.
So what do you guys think? I would sure like someone else, or several people to verify my observation that contact cannot be proven in photomode. I have not tested this in Arcade mode yet, but intend to soon.
As far as the replays for this race go, I believe that all three drivers DRIVEN USA, goixoye, and Bigrew honestly thought that there was not contact, because they did what we all do which is to photomode, etc. saw no contact, and submitted what they believed to be clean races. But as it says in each weeks race introduction, If you have any doubt that it's anything other than 100% clean, don't submit it!
The two races I reviewed for DRIVEN USA and goixoye are in my opinion, dirty. DRIVEN because of the 4MPH speed drop of the GT at point of suspected contact under full throttle, and goixoye because of the suspicious reactions of the 2 vehicles in close proximity with no outside influences.
I think that we will all have to think differently about AI contact in the future when we are reviewing our races for submission. Because of this race, hopefully we can all become more knowledgeable when we have other AI races. 👍
Steve
Explain please
