demo physics discussion

  • Thread starter BLACK86
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Physics annoys during race and trees during replay, mate.

I live in a world in which I made three slides in a row with my venerable E46 330d touring today on the first try. Then tried something like that in the game and failed to make even one good after hours.

Do me a favor masters and make a youtube replay of three good looking slides in a row with stock 370Z in this damn "nondemo".
 
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RedBaron
Even graphics are worse. The actual HDR lightning showed its weakness and looks especially horrible with this Indianopolis track. There are almost no 3D objects on this track, tribunes are from 2D constructions, there are maybe seven trees on the track and all of them are crossed cardboards with pixels instead of leaves, OMG!
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The complaint about the trees is the only part of this post I agree with. My first time around they stuck out in my mind as rather.. m'eh. They're not disgusting, they just really ought to be better. As for the rest of the track I disagree. The tower and grandstands look really good, the Bombardier logo surprised me. The track looks really nice, I think. Overall I'd give it an 8/10 at least.

As for the control, I'll be frank. I suck, I'm using a 6 axis, and I slid that car through a couple of turns already. I'm not saying I can drift around the track like a pro but I am saying that there is either something wrong with some sort of setting you are using or you are greatly exaggerating.
 
No46_TheDoctor
What reality are you living in?

Because in the one I am currently in this demo feels, looks and is, AMAZING.
To be honest, I didn't even notice there were any trees around the track, I was too busy concentrating on getting a decent lap time!

Maybe thats the problem alot of people who aren't happy with the physics are having? Spending too much time looking at trees and ****?

How anyone can say this is worse than prologue is beyond me, well no, it isn't actually, let me guess, the complaints are coming from the people who are bottom of the leaderboards?

This traction control thingy must be just for the controllers?
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lol My lap times suck, but I love this demo. Anyone thinking this is a stepdown from Prologue is on something. The new Physics engine is amazing!! Now, I just need to play this with a wheel! lol
 
My only gripe is that it's still easier to post fast times with a pad than a wheel, and I have a G25 which I spent hours working away with and reached 234th in UK.
Then I do 2... yes 2 laps with Dualshock 3 and jump straight to 180th...
it should be easier with a wheel as cars are driven and made with wheels not sticks...
Will definitely use wheel in full game but if I'm ranking higher using a pad then that's how it's gotta be... urgh I feel dirty saying that :/
 
What exacly annoy people ?

After playin few hours:

-Car feel great and weight balance is now even more crucial than in gt5p
-Drifting is much more harder for people learned from GT5P (for eg me) as post above weight balance is crutial.
- you have to be very quick with hands to do decent drift.
- Now we are talking about driving on edge. Much more like rFactor, LFS
- tire noise is diffrent for each tarmac (try yellow)
- now you are realy feeling each bump even in stock car (more realistic)
- you can now use parking handbrake


in my opinion big + for physic over gt5p

also it may be that this car is not just drift friendly like 350 z people...
 
RedBaron
I am not any fanatic fan of drifting, but this physics is really bad in whole oversteer department. Not bad, ugly and impossible. You should be able to do the same things like in real life. But you aren't.
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I can drift easily with the tuned 370. I have no idea where you are getting this. Just put it in 3rd gear for most corners. Sometimes its the driver not the game
💡
 
Watching the leaderboards in Gran Turismo.com,has the new physics change GTP_ herargy 'cos many wellknown name isnt where you expect them to be?Is this because off the ABS1 training in Prologue?Might be.
 
IMHO, the physics are better than ever. N3 tyres teach importance of smooth inputs instead of jerking the wheel and smashing the throttle or brakes.. and R1 tyres refine this aspect even further. Race driving is about accuracy, finesse and timing, keeping the traction at maximum when you need it. drifting is more like overshooting your traction zone and trying to regain control. part of the problem with stock 370Z is, that like any other modern sportscar, it's set up as understeering pig from factory because.. it's safe for ham-fisted college kid who got it from his dad and is influenced by his hoon friends and some unfortunate movies such as FnF. Go in to corner too hot and you get understeer.. Smash the throttle and you'll spin. Correct me if I'm wrong when I claim that this follows the principles of car-related physics pretty damn well.. and I like it just as it is.
 
Im playing with a DualShock 3 and have good control about how the cars react (3'29.535 or so is my overall time so far). I had only one 360 and i did it on purpose after i threw the (stock) Z in the grass.

The only thing that annoys me is the TCS, but also only in the last chicane.

By the way, have you guys noticed the lost in grip when you drive on the black/yellow painted surface after that one right corner? It feels and even sounds awesome how the rear wheels start to spin.
 
A massive + from me on the physics!

Make no mistake if you drive like you do in any other console racer you will struggle massively. This is very similar to GTR2/GTL.

By the way it is hard for me to string together consistent laps, I'll have a cracker and than trying to repeat it I'll overcook it and spin out, you difinetly can not be hamfisted with this!
If you are using the controller you are almost wasting your time, the physics is unbelievable with the wheel:)

I only hope PD dont take on too much of the negativety that SOME people have 👎 and try and dumb it down, if people find it hard they can use standard physics when the full GT5 is here.
 
No46_TheDoctor
This traction control thingy must be just for the controllers?
Click to expand...


aha you may be right because i tried it with a controller and you cant even donut.

yes physics are harder than prologue which is good, have to be so careful and gentle with the throttle around 2nd gear bends, its a great feeling when you get it right.
 
I can drift the stocker quite easily, that is hold and recover too (using the wheel you have no TCS). I havent attempted drifting the tuned version as I imagine it will be snappy with it's stiff suspension, R1's (very grippy) and without a big powerhouse engine.

The Physics? I think they're great, I love how you really need to easy of the brake on turn in as it causes understeer now, in GT5P leaving ABS on allowed you to just go into full trail braking all the time. Maybe the demo is in a light ABS setting I don't know but I like it, feels more realistic.
The bumps and dips effect your car more now, its kind of a shame Indy has such low curbs as it would be fun to bounce cars off them.
Oh and not when you collide with a solid wall the car crashes more realistic (without damage of course), in GT5P if you were to clip the wall in the first corner you just stop dead, in the demo time trial your car gets flicked arond violently. There is many more improvements that I wont bother listing but overall it's great.

I love going a little wide into the yellow painted lines and having my left rear tyre start to slip underpower as I exit the corner, thats cool.


Just remember to help avoid confusion all controller users (sixaxis/DS3) the stock 370Z has TCS by default while for the wheel it is off.
 
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BroncosXR8
A massive + from me on the physics!

Make no mistake if you drive like you do in any other console racer you will struggle massively. This is very similar to GTR2/GTL.

By the way it is hard for me to string together consistent laps, I'll have a cracker and than trying to repeat it I'll overcook it and spin out, you difinetly can not be hamfisted with this!
If you are using the controller you are almost wasting your time, the physics is unbelievable with the wheel:)

I only hope PD dont take on too much of the negativety that SOME people have 👎 and try and dumb it down, if people find it hard they can use standard physics when the full GT5 is here.
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Yep. I'm using a controller and having a lot harder time feeling as in control as before. I don't see this as a bad thing, though, as the car just seems to react in a more natural way. I've never noticed the weight transfer to the degree I do with this! I think what we may be seeing is a professional physics aimed at wheel users and a standard physics which is more accomodating for controller users. This is just a guess but I can see a lot of people with controllers having even more difficulty than I am (having been playing with a controller since GT1 I can get by).
 
Drifting with a wheel is now almost impossible with the stock 370z. They have made it ridiculously hard, which in real life it's very easy to control oversteer. Heck even my mates high powered v8 ute which had hardly any weight in the back would flow sideways so well and could hold the slide with one hand...

there's definitely improvements in the physics and i love the feedback you get through the wheel etc etc...but they got oversteer wrong. GT5p had very bad oversteer physics at low speed, but they were great at mid to high speeds (not 100% but still great).
 
G.T.Ace
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3678433&postcount=40
Thought im the only one noticing it.
I found this effect extremely impressive, also how the car gains grip, after touching the unpainted asphalt again.
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Yeah and the different squeal sound, similar to GT PSP. I have mentioned it before in another thread, its a lot of fun, I have lines up the stocker at the start of the yellow stretch, got it snaking in third gear. :D

When I first discovered it after checking if I will be penalised my car stepped out so hard and spun around in wheelspin, I just cracked up laughing.

Oh and I meant rear left tyre in my post :ouch:


Bekimche
Drifting with a wheel is now almost impossible with the stock 370z. They have made it ridiculously hard, which in real life it's very easy to control oversteer. Heck even my mates high powered v8 ute which had hardly any weight in the back would flow sideways so well and could hold the slide with one hand...
Click to expand...


As I mentioned in my post above I'm not having any issue drifting in the the stocker.
 
You should have seen the grin on my face after i hit the painted part and the car moved a bit sideways with that *eekeekeek*. 8)
Even with the controller it feels so natural, i really cant understand the complainers, it feels like a mix from GTR Evo. and GT5:P.
 
Leonidae
IMHO, the physics are better than ever. N3 tyres teach importance of smooth inputs instead of jerking the wheel and smashing the throttle or brakes.. and R1 tyres refine this aspect even further. Race driving is about accuracy, finesse and timing, keeping the traction at maximum when you need it. drifting is more like overshooting your traction zone and trying to regain control. part of the problem with stock 370Z is, that like any other modern sportscar, it's set up as understeering pig from factory because.. it's safe for ham-fisted college kid who got it from his dad and is influenced by his hoon friends and some unfortunate movies such as FnF. Go in to corner too hot and you get understeer.. Smash the throttle and you'll spin. Correct me if I'm wrong when I claim that this follows the principles of car-related physics pretty damn well.. and I like it just as it is.
Click to expand...

👍 well said....just seems like alot of people who (so called) drift IrL on the street at usually low speeds for less than 15 meters, think that the physics suck because they cannot hold a drift at usually triple the speeds ingame for 100 meters!
 
I am genuinely surprised that some people think the physics have actually got worse, the 370z on N3's feels a superior drive to anything in GT5P (which is a decent drive to be fair) its the low speed understeer where the greatest leap has been made, but understeer on the limit is far more progressive and accurate than in GT5P.

The tuned feels a completely different car with slick tyres, and it should, the gap was apparent in GT5P but is even more noticeable now. Add to that the little details which aid immersion and the general driving experience is notably improved.

I like it, and I can't wait to try more cars with the new physics when GT5 arrives.
 
Let's keep prospective on what exactly GT5:TT is to guys... this is a demo released for the sole purpose of facilitating GT Academy... NOTHING else.

I wouldn't expect this to be the final render of the track, or the sounds to be complete. This is a purposeful and functional tool for GT Academy (and marketing gig for PD and Sony) not a full on demo.

The other point I would make is that in an interview, PD specifically said that the physics engine will allow scaling for all levels of users. If I was to make a bet, I would bet that we have full tilt physics, and that some of the symptoms users are noticing will be able to be adjusted in the full game.
 
Jay
As I mentioned in my post above I'm not having any issue drifting in the the stocker.
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Hmm...I've managed to do a few decent little ones but compared to the drifts I can do with the stock 350z on gt5p, it doesn't even compare. In gt5p I could drift almost the entire track, but in the demo I can only manage small low-medium speed ones.

I think that's the flaw here...

GT5p = horrible low speed oversteer physics, great mid to high speed
GT5tt = much improved low speed oversteer but worse mid to high speed

Everything else in the physics department feels great, the understeer feels better, the braking etc etc...its just the oversteer that's bugging me. Its quite easy to catch the back end, but to actually drift/powerslide/link corners...no chance

Could you provide maybe a video of you drifting the stocker? Is it anything like GT5p with linking corners powering through the corners or? Cause I doubt it is possible with the new physics. (not being a smartass by the way just genuinely want to see if it is possible)
 
Well, ever thought that you shouldnt be able to drift on an entire track without being really skilled and having the car set-up for that? I would say thats quite realistic.
 
Personally i dislike the physics in this TT as it doesnt feel real imo. With traction control on full i can still spin the wheels freely and do a burnout with ease. As for cornering it just spins. My real life car is a high powered import with more power than these cars in game and i can slide it with ease. In this i cant even drive normally without it spinning. Once the back lets go on this thing it is near impossible to pull back. Having R1 on both front and back you would thing it wouldn't drive like you were on ice. Especially with traction control on full. Even turning it right off is exactly the same so its either a glitch or someone screwed up big time. I don't think something like this should be used for choosing a real life driver because its definitely NOT realistic at all. Sorry PD but you have really made a mistake in this TT. Hopefully the full game they fix the oversteer issues because this TT ruins my GT spirit. NOT FUN TO PLAY AT ALL!!!!!!
 
no no you're not getting me. A stock car like the 370z can drift quite easily without being set up. I'm not talking about competition style driting here, only a few corners of the track are even hard to put together. It really isn't realistic, I can see how many will feel that it is, but the oversteer I'm afraid isn't quite there yet. I'm just simply pointing out the cons in the physics, I agree there are many pros and they have done a stellar job, but you can't expect everything to be perfect. Here I am just simply pointing out a flaw in the physics that is all.

Play LFS to get more of an idea of what I mean. Play with a stock XRG (very underpowered) you can't exactly drift a whole track (obviously), although you CAN drift it just like you could if a car in real life with similar specs would be able to, not outstanding, but doable. You really need to push it, similar to an AE86, push it to the limit and it can drift quite well.
 
stickman1987
My real life car is a high powered import with more power than these cars in game and i can slide it with ease.
Click to expand...

But it's not an 370Z, is it?

Bekimche
Play LFS to get more of an idea of what I mean.
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Well, now there's a thing.

I'm always more than happy to read well voiced criticism like you both did. Because that keeps me from falling for fanboi-ism.

But, I can't really see how you can compare any random car to what is portrayed in the game. Heck, not even all BMWs in RL drive a like, and while you can have much "fun" in an M3, it's a completely different story in an 530 or 116. They are nothing like each other, yet the still share the basic BMW-ness.

And I really don't understand the "Game A does it that way, so Game B should do it the same".

No. Each and every developer have their own approach and each game feels differently. Which is a good thing, because it gives us choice. Even the choice to say: "I don't like it because it doesn't feel right to me." ;)
 
the demo is alot better the GT5p, i love the tune car and the non tune car both are really fun to drive, even with a Ds3 its still fun.
 
OK, I just spent 5 minutes with the demo and now I really do not know what people are complaining about. The stock 370Z feels amazing. For the first time ever, I can actually feel the tires gripping into the road. You can feel it right when they lose it and then quickly regain traction, it's amazing. That was one of my biggest gripes with GT, because to me it always felt like you were sliding, there was really no feedback in that sense for me at least. Now you can feel right when the tires snap back into grip, it's brilliant. And this whole issue of oversteering!! I was playing with a dual shock since I didn't have time to setup my G25, and it didn't get away from me once! This is what I have been waiting for, the full version cannot come fast enough now!! Sadly I have to wait until tomorrow to really give it a go with the G.
 

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