demo physics discussion
- Thread starter BLACK86
- 550 comments
- 48,839 views
- 209
- Italy
- Snake206
In my opinion the new physics is really good.
I love how it feel the weight of the car and how it react in the various situations.
I was watching this video and it seems to me to view the same raction of the car in the game when I push too hard in the corner:
From another view:
I love how it feel the weight of the car and how it react in the various situations.
I was watching this video and it seems to me to view the same raction of the car in the game when I push too hard in the corner:
From another view:
If you're using wheel, the TC is automatically turned off in the "demo" for the normal 370Z.
As to the garbage- it's according to Prologue's in-game manual (under driving option I believe). There are two recommended tires in order to get a realistic experience with each of the cars (eg. F430= N3-S1, BMW 135= N2-N3), the higher (stickier) tires to simulate freshly fitted ones and so forth.
- 2,980
- Greensboro/NC/U
- jarod336/GTP_torque
- Paperorplastic/ manherollen
With a wheel.
Its close and nearly at the same level of GTR2/LFS
End of discussion.
PD have out done them selves.
You truly cannot experience and take into accounting the hard work and dedication put into these new physics driving on a PAD imo. i know this, i have tried it on the 6axis just for fun, Took me 1 lap to run back to my DFGT.
The Difference is just bluntly night and day.
Just like insidesimracing said, "This games is only truly unleashed on a wheel"
At first in GT5p on Spec III it blurred the line to the "PC" sim racer physics world, Now GT5D Has Crossed that line, and i have seen a couple "Hardcore" pc sim racing fanatics accept it with open arms.
Whether it's a thrustmaster f430 wheel or a Logitech DFGT/G25/G27, Fanatec 911GT3 or club sport, Pure excettera.
This game Truly blows my mind, that it's come this far in the physics department.
Bravo PD you guys have pulled off a wonder, IGN was right.
I have played Forza 3 with a Fanatec Pure, it is really wonderful, But in my honest opinion PD hit the nail right on the head this time around, These physics Transcend that "console" racing feel. More of that then forza 3 managed to, and i was pretty astonished and shocked with that to begin with.
Its close and nearly at the same level of GTR2/LFS
End of discussion.
PD have out done them selves.
You truly cannot experience and take into accounting the hard work and dedication put into these new physics driving on a PAD imo. i know this, i have tried it on the 6axis just for fun, Took me 1 lap to run back to my DFGT.
The Difference is just bluntly night and day.
Just like insidesimracing said, "This games is only truly unleashed on a wheel"
At first in GT5p on Spec III it blurred the line to the "PC" sim racer physics world, Now GT5D Has Crossed that line, and i have seen a couple "Hardcore" pc sim racing fanatics accept it with open arms.
Whether it's a thrustmaster f430 wheel or a Logitech DFGT/G25/G27, Fanatec 911GT3 or club sport, Pure excettera.
This game Truly blows my mind, that it's come this far in the physics department.
Bravo PD you guys have pulled off a wonder, IGN was right.
I have played Forza 3 with a Fanatec Pure, it is really wonderful, But in my honest opinion PD hit the nail right on the head this time around, These physics Transcend that "console" racing feel. More of that then forza 3 managed to, and i was pretty astonished and shocked with that to begin with.
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- 7,637
- Exorcet
- OE Exorcet
EDIT at bottom
And I specifically said N3's, meaning stock Z.
myke, thanks. I'm going to have to try my DFP with the demo now, but PD deciding controller users need TC is still a bit insulting. As for PD's tire list, that was the garbage I spoke of. If it were true, road cars would skidpad 1.25 g on average, which is insane.
EDIT
Astonishing. The physics blew my mind when I used the wheel. I felt like I was really driving a car, and this is with an undersized unrestrained DFP bouncing in my lap as I sit on a bed without back support. My time went from 1:52.528 (controller) to 1:52.001 (wheel). I struggled to reach 1:52.5 with the controller, but the wheel let me get there fairly easily. If I had a stand, I could squeeze out another half second for sure.
But the point is, PD has hit the mark with the new physics. GT5 is going to be the high point of the series, I'm calling it now.
And I specifically said N3's, meaning stock Z.
myke, thanks. I'm going to have to try my DFP with the demo now, but PD deciding controller users need TC is still a bit insulting. As for PD's tire list, that was the garbage I spoke of. If it were true, road cars would skidpad 1.25 g on average, which is insane.
EDIT
Astonishing. The physics blew my mind when I used the wheel. I felt like I was really driving a car, and this is with an undersized unrestrained DFP bouncing in my lap as I sit on a bed without back support. My time went from 1:52.528 (controller) to 1:52.001 (wheel). I struggled to reach 1:52.5 with the controller, but the wheel let me get there fairly easily. If I had a stand, I could squeeze out another half second for sure.
But the point is, PD has hit the mark with the new physics. GT5 is going to be the high point of the series, I'm calling it now.
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- 539
- Melbourne, Australia
- Bekimche
I've just played the demo for about 4 hours, just testing oversteer physics and trying to drift (G25 & Stock 350z). I've managed to put a few drifts together...hardly, if you can even call em drifts. Some were nice but some were just "slides". It was in no way realistic though. I might make a video of it to show everyone how absurd the oversteer physics are. I found alot of things very odd...if before the corner your wheels are spinning and your approaching the corner, if you turn in with the wheelspin, you can sort of guide it through and pull off a decent drift, but If you try a power over move, or a feint drift or a braking drift or anything else...you can sometimes pull em off, but they're little and hopeless, otherwise and almost always you just spin. For the life of me I cannot understand why it's spinning when it shouldn't. Other times I have noticed that with the slightest feather of a touch on throttle through a corner trying to guide it through, it would spin...then other time it would be fine, until you start counter steering and it suddenly finds grip! *facepalm*
I hope it is just the 370z but I highly doubt that. They really need to fix the tire physics. LFS should be the benchmark for tire physics. And please I don't want to hear anything like "it's only cause you suck" or "it's not designed for drifting" or anything like that, because even those who think the physics are 100% perfect I bet they know deep inside that they're not and infact they are definitely not. It seems people just want to agree with one another but the physics ARE flawed and if everyone's saying it's perfect it's not going to get fixed which would be a shame.
Having all those 1000 cars, waiting so long for GT5, to only slightly enjoy it compared to how excited I would be if the physics were fixed in the full game, I don't think I'll ever get off it. I hope these aren't the final physics, I would be shattered beyond belief. I'm actually quite nervous about it, I want it to be fixed but I have a feeling it won't and will be stuck with these flawed physics in the full game
I hope it is just the 370z but I highly doubt that. They really need to fix the tire physics. LFS should be the benchmark for tire physics. And please I don't want to hear anything like "it's only cause you suck" or "it's not designed for drifting" or anything like that, because even those who think the physics are 100% perfect I bet they know deep inside that they're not and infact they are definitely not. It seems people just want to agree with one another but the physics ARE flawed and if everyone's saying it's perfect it's not going to get fixed which would be a shame.
Having all those 1000 cars, waiting so long for GT5, to only slightly enjoy it compared to how excited I would be if the physics were fixed in the full game, I don't think I'll ever get off it. I hope these aren't the final physics, I would be shattered beyond belief. I'm actually quite nervous about it, I want it to be fixed but I have a feeling it won't and will be stuck with these flawed physics in the full game
- 7,637
- Exorcet
- OE Exorcet
Interesting Bekimche, I can't really comment on or test your thoughts, as driving with an unrestrained wheel really makes slides and drifting tough to pull off.
I haven't driven LFS, but I've heard of its reputation. Would you say that better feedback would help GT5? I have to say that it was sometimes difficult getting a feel for how much grip I had, though I don't know if this is because I how I had my wheel set up, or if it's because of my less than average amount of wheel experience/use, or a flaw in the game's physics.
Also, I'm not ready to call GT5 physics perfect, I hope my last post didn't sound like that. They are great, at least considering all I know and my experience with cars, but I'm not enough of a real driver to claim that GT5 is perfection or not.
I haven't driven LFS, but I've heard of its reputation. Would you say that better feedback would help GT5? I have to say that it was sometimes difficult getting a feel for how much grip I had, though I don't know if this is because I how I had my wheel set up, or if it's because of my less than average amount of wheel experience/use, or a flaw in the game's physics.
Also, I'm not ready to call GT5 physics perfect, I hope my last post didn't sound like that. They are great, at least considering all I know and my experience with cars, but I'm not enough of a real driver to claim that GT5 is perfection or not.
- 18
- KayEnnOhBee
As a devoted LFS player the physics are very close but he's right on the oversteer part. It's nigh on impossible to hold a decent drift. In LFS you can chuck the car in, feather the throttle and use some (but not heaps) of steering input and that will get you an awesome drift but in this its just far too difficult. Its like the rear end is on an elastic band or something.
I've just played the demo for about 4 hours, just testing oversteer physics and trying to drift (G25 & Stock 350z). I've managed to put a few drifts together...hardly, if you can even call em drifts. Some were nice but some were just "slides". It was in no way realistic though. I might make a video of it to show everyone how absurd the oversteer physics are. I found alot of things very odd...if before the corner your wheels are spinning and your approaching the corner, if you turn in with the wheelspin, you can sort of guide it through and pull off a decent drift, but If you try a power over move, or a feint drift or a braking drift or anything else...you can sometimes pull em off, but they're little and hopeless, otherwise and almost always you just spin. For the life of me I cannot understand why it's spinning when it shouldn't. Other times I have noticed that with the slightest feather of a touch on throttle through a corner trying to guide it through, it would spin...then other time it would be fine, until you start counter steering and it suddenly finds grip! *facepalm*
I hope it is just the 370z but I highly doubt that. They really need to fix the tire physics. LFS should be the benchmark for tire physics. And please I don't want to hear anything like "it's only cause you suck" or "it's not designed for drifting" or anything like that, because even those who think the physics are 100% perfect I bet they know deep inside that they're not and infact they are definitely not. It seems people just want to agree with one another but the physics ARE flawed and if everyone's saying it's perfect it's not going to get fixed which would be a shame.
Having all those 1000 cars, waiting so long for GT5, to only slightly enjoy it compared to how excited I would be if the physics were fixed in the full game, I don't think I'll ever get off it. I hope these aren't the final physics, I would be shattered beyond belief. I'm actually quite nervous about it, I want it to be fixed but I have a feeling it won't and will be stuck with these flawed physics in the full game
You are right in therms of drifting. Car like Viper SRT10 just spin if you reach point and nothin will help you.
Someone posted vid with crash of 370z and i'm amazed that this happened just like in demo ! I mean You are trying to get apex right and you add throttle to to 3/4 then you don't feel car slippin to counter but it does so you just don't counter it and then you have it a spin without any sign without any help because youve past point...
This is exacly what happen in demo and this is exacly what happened to this guy on vid. He didn't feel car slippin so he didn't counter itright and then bam...
370Z have whole new suspension so probably this is why it handles very diffrent from 350z. But don't get me wrong i like to drift around corners but some cars are ****** do drift like SRT10. I can drift all day in NSX, 350z, Sub wrx 09' but every time i try srt10 i'm angry because it spin out like hell and point of drift/spin out is just after lossing grip.
I feel the same with 370z, when you cornering it naturally oversteer when you off throttle (like some mid engine cars). Back tyres are much wider than front and all tires are grippy. So when you oversteer on those grippy tyres without throttle you don't need to add throttle to slide around corner much but when you add more than 1/2 throttle rear tyres are like ice and you spin out.
So to drift this car you don't need to smash 3/4 of throttle every time. You add just a little like 1/4 constantly or shots of 3/4 throttle continued with minimal throttle touch to continue spinning tyres.
I'm not perfect but this car CAN drift with right approach.
Also consider people that G25 or other wheels don't counter fast like real cars wheels.
This guy is my fav drifter in gt5p he have moddfied G25 (Some crazy fast FFB, probably replaced g25 wheel mechanism)
This is how quick proper wheel must be. And with this fast countersterrin FFB you can drift easly even in **** drifter like 370z
or srt10. 
Also i don't blame 370z for no drift ability. It's more of a race car than drift car. It's faster around a track than 350z by a mile...
- 1,101
- GTP_EA11R
I'm glad I'm not the only one terrified of the demo. The low-speed driving was delightful on the stock car, it felt exactly like my car in real life. The way the tail wags under braking, the vivid weight transfer, the undignified stop after a slide... It's all perfect.
But the oversteer happens so bloody fast that I literally just broke my Driving Force Pro, and about once every three laps I now have to yank the steering wheel back into place. I don't want to say 'it's too hard,' for fear of being labelled as a talentless fool, but it seems many others are having this problem with oversteer. Why couldn't PD give us a car we're familiar with, so we could make direct comparisons?
Naturally, the wheel was in bad shape, but still. It's cool how cheap DFGTs are!
EDIT: wow, that was incolherent. Time to go to bed...
But the oversteer happens so bloody fast that I literally just broke my Driving Force Pro, and about once every three laps I now have to yank the steering wheel back into place. I don't want to say 'it's too hard,' for fear of being labelled as a talentless fool, but it seems many others are having this problem with oversteer. Why couldn't PD give us a car we're familiar with, so we could make direct comparisons?
Naturally, the wheel was in bad shape, but still. It's cool how cheap DFGTs are!
EDIT: wow, that was incolherent. Time to go to bed...
- 539
- Melbourne, Australia
- Bekimche
Perkel, I don't think he has modified the G25. My G25 spins the same way, I've even spun it twice as fast as that when I sometimes "throw" the wheel to link corners. I've even got a MOMO Race wheel on my G25 and it's slightly heavier, but spins just as fast, and it makes it much easier to drive and drift due to the larger wheel diameter.
Anyways, for those who say the 370z is different etc, well I'm sorry, but it is a FR sports car, and it does handle like you would expect a FR sports car should. Unless Nissan have somehow secretly managed to develop a system where the car is stable and unable to go sideways and lose stability without traction or stability control, then I don't think it has any trouble drifting. There are many videos on youtube, but I really like this one just to show that it's not the car, its the physics. The car is fine. Please watch from 3:45 in...
As you can see, the car is fine and handles like it's expected to. Morrison also says it's much easier to control than the 350.
Excorcet I strongly suggest you play LFS just to give you an idea (and that it's also a kick ass game). You asked if the problem lies in the feedback or flaws in the physics. I'd say it's the physics, the feedback actually feels alot better than prologue, you can feel alot more in the wheel now, but that really doesn't matter because in prologue, I could still feel the car breaking loose, I still felt everything, so it's definitely the physics.
KayEnnOhBee I'm glad you agree with me. And this..."In LFS you can chuck the car in, feather the throttle and use some (but not heaps) of steering input and that will get you an awesome drift but in this its just far too difficult." is spot on. It really is that simple to do, and that's how simple it is in real life too. You don't need to be Schumacher with lightning fast reflexes or Yasuyuki Kazama or Keiichi Tsuchiya to drift. The car talks to you, it pretty much corrects itself, anyone with decent enough driving skills can do it, I don't know why they have made it so stupidly hard and unrealistic.
Anyways, for those who say the 370z is different etc, well I'm sorry, but it is a FR sports car, and it does handle like you would expect a FR sports car should. Unless Nissan have somehow secretly managed to develop a system where the car is stable and unable to go sideways and lose stability without traction or stability control, then I don't think it has any trouble drifting. There are many videos on youtube, but I really like this one just to show that it's not the car, its the physics. The car is fine. Please watch from 3:45 in...
As you can see, the car is fine and handles like it's expected to. Morrison also says it's much easier to control than the 350.
Excorcet I strongly suggest you play LFS just to give you an idea (and that it's also a kick ass game). You asked if the problem lies in the feedback or flaws in the physics. I'd say it's the physics, the feedback actually feels alot better than prologue, you can feel alot more in the wheel now, but that really doesn't matter because in prologue, I could still feel the car breaking loose, I still felt everything, so it's definitely the physics.
KayEnnOhBee I'm glad you agree with me. And this..."In LFS you can chuck the car in, feather the throttle and use some (but not heaps) of steering input and that will get you an awesome drift but in this its just far too difficult." is spot on. It really is that simple to do, and that's how simple it is in real life too. You don't need to be Schumacher with lightning fast reflexes or Yasuyuki Kazama or Keiichi Tsuchiya to drift. The car talks to you, it pretty much corrects itself, anyone with decent enough driving skills can do it, I don't know why they have made it so stupidly hard and unrealistic.
Because you will be drivin 370z tuned in real life when you win the competition... 💡 ?
Probably they will do some real gt5 demo later...
BTW i feel nissan will be very succesfull if this car will be in gt4. It's more like build from scratch totaly new 370z than 350z iteration. Car is grippy and fast with some suspention tweaking probably it will handle terrific IRL and in GT5.
- 4,878
- CoolColJ, GTP_CoolColJ
It looks like the up to about 80% of full throttle can only be used coming out of a turn or through a turn, any higher and instant spin.
the guys up the top of leader board are just better at finding that threshold and staying there. It all seems rather canned.
I did some tests and there is no engine braking at all!
If you go up to 5th gear and then drop to first, the rev limiter will scream, but the car still coasts along.....
Maybe the clutch is automaticly depressed, but it doesn't help shorten braking distances
the guys up the top of leader board are just better at finding that threshold and staying there. It all seems rather canned.
I did some tests and there is no engine braking at all!
If you go up to 5th gear and then drop to first, the rev limiter will scream, but the car still coasts along.....
Maybe the clutch is automaticly depressed, but it doesn't help shorten braking distances
@ Bekimche
your video don't prove anything, He tested drifting on wet track (why he used wet track anyway ???). I play mainly rFactor and FFB for me in prologue is still lacking (but is very good).
My point is that lots of sources confirm than it handle quite diffrent than 350z. I respect your opinion about RWD cars but no RWD car=!RWD car. Try SRT10 and then try 599 fiorano. Two totaly diffrent cars.
Also even in this video he didn't pull decent angle for me to judge drifting in 350z vs 370z.
Morrison tels it handle like 350z and it is more stable other say that it is diffrent than 350z with more grip but more twitchy nature..
I think we both can hold on our opinions about physic till demo with more cars will hit PSN. Because discusion based on opinions of others and videos showing same car that handles diffrently don't get us anywere
your video don't prove anything, He tested drifting on wet track (why he used wet track anyway ???). I play mainly rFactor and FFB for me in prologue is still lacking (but is very good).
My point is that lots of sources confirm than it handle quite diffrent than 350z. I respect your opinion about RWD cars but no RWD car=!RWD car. Try SRT10 and then try 599 fiorano. Two totaly diffrent cars.
Also even in this video he didn't pull decent angle for me to judge drifting in 350z vs 370z.
Morrison tels it handle like 350z and it is more stable other say that it is diffrent than 350z with more grip but more twitchy nature..
I think we both can hold on our opinions about physic till demo with more cars will hit PSN. Because discusion based on opinions of others and videos showing same car that handles diffrently don't get us anywere
- 4,878
- CoolColJ, GTP_CoolColJ
well I also coast along at 60km/hr in first gear, and release everything, there is no drastic engine braking. That would also cause big weight transfer, but I don't see it
do the same in NetKar Pro and see the difference, you will spin out if you drop from 3rd to first at speed
do the same in NetKar Pro and see the difference, you will spin out if you drop from 3rd to first at speed
If you change from 3 to 1 in full speed (if you change at all) probably engine will fly off the car IRL but demo don't have demage so you can change gear and it looks weird and feel weird.
And when engine breaking is fast and derastic ? It just slow down to a certain speed at keep this speed...
And when engine breaking is fast and derastic ? It just slow down to a certain speed at keep this speed...
- 539
- Melbourne, Australia
- Bekimche
Perkel, it doesn't matter if its wet or not, that was simply to state that the car does infact go sideways quite beautifully. There are other vids out there too. It was to prove that the car is fine because people were saying the 370z is built with so and so suspension and set up this or that way to prevent this and that. It does drift. And yes he's not going to drift it like Keiichi Tsuchiya, but he doesn't need to. I understand that different cars handle differently like you said with the viper and Ferrari but I am not trying to compare the car to the 350z or any others, just simply was trying to prove that the car in real life is capable of drifting.
But you are right, we will have to wait for another demo or the full game to see how other cars differ. At the moment, in my opinion the physics are very flawed.
LOL I personally don't like Australia's version, but some episodes are ok
But you are right, we will have to wait for another demo or the full game to see how other cars differ. At the moment, in my opinion the physics are very flawed.
LOL I personally don't like Australia's version, but some episodes are ok
- 846
- GTP_juniordee3
- Oddbug
Wait...are you saying the car in the game can't drift? Because I think it's a natural drifter
. The car is very stable, and if I want it to go sideways I just feint, step on the throttle and sideways it goes. I can control the car like a want, and drift "almost" as good as I could in GT5
. I think they nailed the drifting physics for once, unlike GT5 where it was too easy. The biggest change in physics I noticed are the weight transfer and the tire physics, but not in a negative way.
- 539
- Melbourne, Australia
- Bekimche
Yes it's possible to drift, I have pulled off many drifts so far, but it is in no way realistic, the tire physics still need to be worked on. Read my post in the previous page, I try to explain that the physics are flawed, but it's near impossible to explain. The best way would be to have GT5p GT5 demo and LFS side by side and three people playing comparing the three. Could you show us a video of you drifting almost as good as in GT5p?
- 2,822
- Espoo
- GTP_Raitzi
Main differense in sliding physics is that in LFS and Forza you can catch a slide by "letting wheel do the work" and catching it on the right moment. In GT5 wheel does not automaticly turn to counter the slide same matter, or i can not tell what is right moment to let loose the wheel as i do not quite feel when slide is starting. IRL I have only drifted on snow and gravel and not high speed on tarmac, but i can say that lfs and forza drifting wheels more close to what i have experieced. I currently am totally bad in playing GT5 as i have played those ohter games that feel very different.
Note that my FFB setting might way off because i have had only 40min with game (i will continue after holidays)
(fanatec turbo s wheel btw)
edit2: GT5 370z feels a bit like diff has 100% or something(this what i would adjust first on the car)
Note that my FFB setting might way off because i have had only 40min with game (i will continue after holidays)
(fanatec turbo s wheel btw)
edit2: GT5 370z feels a bit like diff has 100% or something(this what i would adjust first on the car)
- 38
- Irving/Texas/U.
The new physics are defintely not pad friendly or even controller friendly. I think the wheel turns way to fast for us controller users. It should be alot more smoother and slower. PD should give us an option to adjust sensitivity and threshold for pad users. I'm not super serious about this game and don't want to be forced to buy a wheel so I won't be frustrated with the game. I'm sure its great witha wheel as you can make small adjustments but for controller users its to twitchy. I barely touch the pad and BOOM! instant full lock.
- 539
- Melbourne, Australia
- Bekimche
That first porsche vid looks extremely fun. The guy's crazy for driving that beast in the wet on a track like the ring. Fantastic video, goes to show just how oversteer is in a real car, don't need to have lightning fast reflexes, the car talks to you, he was guiding it perfectly with throttle to power the car through the corners and in the wet too! very impressive considering the wet track and its a porsche, reputation to bite you in the ass. absolutely lovely to watch. Ahh the joys of drifting...
- 10,270
- Bonn
- GTAce
I disagree with the red parts and agree with the green one.
- 5,603
- England, Warwickshire
- GTP_Sigma
I am stunned about the bad press of the physics, its a huge leap forward, anyone who thinks you should be able to full throttle out of a tight corner in a powerful RWD car on road tyres, clearly hasn't tried it on a track day.
There is an easy way to control the torque as to get a controllable throttle, shift up a gear to reduce torque, its much easier to balance the throttle then. Exciting the hirpins in 2nd is never going to end well with about 70% and above, exiting 3rd means you can accelerate away full throttle without loosing much time at all.
The low speed physics are massively improved, the understeer is far more progressive and predictable, as for general oversteer i fail to see whats wrong with it. The stock car on N3's feels brilliant, it really does.
There is an easy way to control the torque as to get a controllable throttle, shift up a gear to reduce torque, its much easier to balance the throttle then. Exciting the hirpins in 2nd is never going to end well with about 70% and above, exiting 3rd means you can accelerate away full throttle without loosing much time at all.
The low speed physics are massively improved, the understeer is far more progressive and predictable, as for general oversteer i fail to see whats wrong with it. The stock car on N3's feels brilliant, it really does.
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