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FloptaStr8 said
So when did we start thinking it is ok to push someone out into wall or off line and not concede position in practice? Why is practice so different than race night? I don't get the philosophy of practicing one way and then racing "officially" another. It is legal to be slower than the guy/gal behind you, and it is up to him/her to pass without contact. Check out OLR 05: A, C 06: A
Schmiggz said
Yeah, i'm getting fed up with practice rooms too. What happened today at Tokio was embarrassing for snail.
Tangled_Up said
I need the practice and like running with the fast guys to see how I can improve my line ... but when reverse order kicks in and I'm up front I always feel like I've been mugged by turn 2. Some guys are too aggressive and it rubs off on a lot of us who are just to trying to keep up. I'll continue to run in the practice rooms but don't really enjoy it. Race night is a different story ... Great fun in D8.
Lessen said
Honestly, I'm not a huge fan of the Thursday night practices either. I find them far less beneficial than any random casual practice room I jump into throughout the week.
USERID_77a23 said
...and it makes no sense. Multi division practices are run all week, then Thursday comes and it feels like there's actually $10grand for the winner and some will kill to get it



(1) It's good to know I'm not alone (2) now that we know there is a real concern, let us focus on a solution and not the problem (i.e. not poison the thread).

What can we as a community do to solve this issue?
  • IRs? - would this overburden the current stewards? Organize "practice stewards"?
  • Have post race discussions? - possible adrenaline interference
  • Have 4 lobbies? - D1/2--D3/4--D5/6--D7/D8; or 8 lobbies, 1 per division?
  • Solutions.....?
 
STEAMER62
I think it's not fair to discuss this topic without @Wolfsatz who is the coordinator of the Thursday's practice rooms
Click to expand...
I think it absolutely is. He will catch up via this thread. It's public. And besides that, he's in only one room out of two, three if the yellow room is up.
 
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I think IRs would be a bit much actually. It is practice after all.

I am in favor of 4 rooms as suggested. My best practices come from racing with Mid division.

I'm NOT in favor of reverse grid heats in practice rooms. Too much spread IMO.
 
I'm of the same mind of several regarding the Thursday "Practice" rooms. I haven't been in one since the fall of 2012. What's required here is a shift in thinking. The faster drivers should be the coaches and teachers, the slower folks the players and students. You can learn almost as much from coaching and teaching as you can from being coached and taught. Instead of it being a race, the Practice rooms need to be thought of as classrooms and practice yards.

What Flopta puts forth for solutions are good ideas. Filing IRs and putting more load on the official steward corps would not be my first choice however. If a few of the the folks that want to practice and be stewards can figure out a way to manage that aspect of the practice rooms, be my guest. Post race discussions? Absolutely. More lobbies? Only if the practice population can sustain it.

It really won't matter much what "solutions" are employed for practice unless the attitude changes as pointed out in the first paragraph. I do like to see the discussion focusing on ways to improve what several folks see as problems. I would like to remind everyone to avoid pointing fingers. So far that hasn't happened and that is an encouraging sign.
 
I'm kind of thinking if we ran 4 rooms it would:
(1) be conducive to "racing!" for those that just want to race/practice
(2) promote familiarity within a division
(3) bring in drivers who have "given up" on practice night
(4) lessen the extreme gap in skill levels/lap times, thus resulting in less aggressive feelings from the front of reverse grid starts. Drivers can focus on driving rather than worry about getting run over.

I think overall, drivers would feel less stressed.
 
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GGGMotorsport
15880632079_1a812e1f5d_c.jpg



Special thanks to @brntguy for the video!

Based on the success of the Wed Night Race Car Series, we are happy to announce the creation of the newest SNAIL Sanctioned Event
​

The SNAIL [Touring Car] Series (TCS) will compete on Tuesdays @ 9:00pm eastern and will feature the following.
​
Will use Wed Night [Race Car] Series as the base for this series with the following changes
  • Tuesday Nights @ 9:00pm Eastern
  • Touring Cars Only
  • Three 25 min races using a slightly modified BTCC format
    • Race 1 - Grid set based on 6 min qualifying session
    • Race 2 - Grid set based on results from race 1 (winner gets pole position)
    • Race 3 - Grid set based on inverted grid based on results from race 2
  • 5 min break between races
  • Fuel/Tire Ware set depending on Touring Car used
  • Tire Restrictions - Must use RH and RS
    • Must change Tire Compounds during race (no minimum laps)
    • Must make at least 1 pit stop requirement
    • Must start a least 1 race on both compounds (Example: Race 1-RH, Race 2-RS, Race 3-RS)
  • Will use the same schedule as the Wed RCS, however there will be no all star race (4 weeks with 1 week off between seasons)
  • Highest finisher in points each night that is not in the top 10 on Wed Night will get a locked in spot for Wed Night race and will not need to go through KOQ on Wed Night
    • Must be an active driver in the RCS
  • Season Champion gets to select 1 of the 4 tracks to be used in the next season (based on track list provided).
The following will RCS features will not carry over to the SNAIL [Touring Car] Series (TCS)
  • No season ending All Star Race
  • No Team Championship
We feel the above format for the SNAIL [Touring Car] Series will offer different challenges/rewards yet still have some of the similarities of the Wed RCS.

We are currently taking signups for the first season scheduled to start on 1/6/14. If your interested please head over to the official topic to sign up or ask any questions you may have.

Finally, I would like to thank @brntguy @Zii1993 @Wardenclyffe (Co-Directors) in helping with putting this together. We are confident that this will be a great series that will complement the SNAIL weekly line up and the RCS.

Thanks
James (Grim)
Click to expand...


Just a reminder that we still have a couple spots left for Season 1 of the Touring Car Series that will start this Tuesday (1/6/15) so if your interested, please be sure to sign up while spots remain open. If you have any questions , please let me know. Here is the link to to the official topic.

Thanks
 
Here's my suggestion for practice night. Make it an actual practice night, not a mock run through of Sunday. Free run the entire night. If anyone wants to practice racing in a group they can discuss in chat and coordinate on track. If one driver messes up the others would slow so they are a pack again. Just to practice pack racing.

I never understood why Thursday was a run through of Sunday when it's called practice. It should just be that, free practice. And if nobody likes that then if anything make the grid order by results of previous race, not reverse grid. Wherever you finish you start there and each race you try to work your way higher and higher.

Edit: Basically Thursday practice should only be in the style of the Yellow Room in preparation for the real Sunday night main event.
 
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While I appreciate the discussion (Thursday Practices), it is a very good format for "new Joiners" to run the Combinations prior to their first Sunday night race event.

Perhaps there could be a Practice Room set up specifically for that purpose. "SNAIL 101 etc.
New Comers + a few "Old Hands" to offer suggestions, corrections, and point out specific practices that SNAIL does not accept as good race craft. Better to learn on an informal setting - than to get hit with a lot of IRs on the first night.
Of course, getting folks to volunteer to help might present a difficulty.

We never know when the next Nick McMillan may show up. Certainly don't want to discourage Him/Her and have them leave due to lack of information or SNAIL training.

PS - Way to go Oregon & Ohio State.
 
It seems mock races are the accepted standard although you're not along in your thinking @DesertPenguin09

I often just try to enter track just behind somebody I know is close pace to myself. Sometimes I don't even try to pass, just stay there and pressure. It's more training than racing. Pretty much what the "yellow room" is supposed to be about.

@TEX36 I like it.
 
GTP_Vertigo
Now you see why I quit practicing on official practice nights?
Click to expand...
Schmiggz
Yeah, i'm getting fed up with practice rooms too. What happened today at Tokio was embarrassing for snail.
Click to expand...

I jump in from time-to-time but only to watch. Very rarely do I get on the track anymore. Grew tired of the "really" and the "did you just do that" comments. For me, it came down to knowing who I can and who I won't practice with. I'm not going to sit here and bash people, they have they're goals and I have mine, they aren't always going to be the same on an individual basis, but at the league level, they should always be the same.

By the way Vertigo, gonna give the GTR TT a run with my newly discovered speed following your little tip last night. Thanks....
 
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And there was a damn D2 guy in our Red Room. He claimed to be there as support to boost our confidence but all he did was blast his way to the front. Let us lower divisions have our racing with ourselves so we know what to expect come Sunday. You stay in your room and we'll stay in ours.
 
vsfit
I jump in from time-to-time but only to watch. Very rarely do I get on the track anymore. Grew tired of the "really" and the "did you just do that" comments. For me, it came down to knowing who I can and who I won't practice with. I'm not going to sit here and bash people, they have they're goals and I have mine, they aren't always going to be the same on an individual basis, but at the league level, they should always be the same.
Click to expand...


Hence my suggestion, vsfit.
 
Ok, let's talk about solutions.
The problem is identified and this is what the vast majority of snailers are saying:
- Upper division racers not respecting slower traffic.
- Some racers push the limits of decency way beyond OLR limits knowing that IR's won't be filed in a practice room and others still can distinguish practice from racing.

Sometimes, against the will of many, there is a need to implement more severe and strict rulings in order the cut off a problem from foundation so considering the fact that the actual model for Thursday night practice sessions is well planned with two separate rooms for faster and slower traffic, entering the "wrong room" shouldn't be allowed under any circunstances being the responsibility of the room's host to kindly invite people to leave. If a D7 wants to practice with a D2 will have to do it somewhere else, not in the blue or red room.
Besides the host, there should also be a room director in the practice session, someone with the will to help keeping the session as clean as possible. Someone with the given power to point out anyone who's not respecting the others in the track.
 
DesertPenguin09
And there was a damn D2 guy in our Red Room. He claimed to be there as support to boost our confidence but all he did was blast his way to the front. Let us lower divisions have our racing with ourselves so we know what to expect come Sunday. You stay in your room and we'll stay in ours.
Click to expand...
Budz, it's not nice referring a fellow snail in those terms.
 
Lessen
Whoa whoa whoa now... I think the Blue room was full last night so Red room got some overflow

Let's keep things civil PLEASE.
Click to expand...
Okay, my bad. I didn't know that was the case.

Schmiggz
Budz, it's not nice referring a fellow snail in those terms.
Click to expand...

What are you referring to? "Us lower divisions"? I was thinking of a shot worded way to refer to D4-D8 without writing it as "D4-D8"
 
Schmiggz
Ok, let's talk about solutions.
The problem is identified and this is what the vast majority of snailers are saying:
- Upper division racers not respecting slower traffic.
- Some racers push the limits of decency way beyond OLR limits knowing that IR's won't be filed in a practice room and others still can distinguish practice from racing.

Sometimes, against the will of many, there is a need to implement more severe and strict rulings in order the cut off a problem from foundation so considering the fact that the actual model for Thursday night practice sessions is well planned with two separate rooms for faster and slower traffic, entering the "wrong room" shouldn't be allowed under any circunstances being the responsibility of the room's host to kindly invite people to leave. If a D7 wants to practice with a D2 will have to do it somewhere else, not in the blue or red room.
Besides the host, there should also be a room director in the practice session, someone with the will to help keeping the session as clean as possible. Someone with the given power to point out anyone who's not respecting the others in the track.
Click to expand...
Whomever that may be (house keeper), now must concentrate on others and whether or not drivers are following the OLR. This takes away their concentration on racing and place it on "keeping house". This is unfair to him/her.
If rooms are divided more closely, then there is less demand for a "house keeper". D3 and D1 are simply too far apart just as a lower D3/upper D4 is too far from a D8.
 
Everyone should refer back to this: @Dragonwhisky posted

I'm of the same mind of several regarding the Thursday "Practice" rooms. I haven't been in one since the fall of 2012. What's required here is a shift in thinking. The faster drivers should be the coaches and teachers, the slower folks the players and students. You can learn almost as much from coaching and teaching as you can from being coached and taught. Instead of it being a race, the Practice rooms need to be thought of as classrooms and practice yards.

What Flopta puts forth for solutions are good ideas. Filing IRs and putting more load on the official steward corps would not be my first choice however. If a few of the the folks that want to practice and be stewards can figure out a way to manage that aspect of the practice rooms, be my guest. Post race discussions? Absolutely. More lobbies? Only if the practice population can sustain it.

It really won't matter much what "solutions" are employed for practice unless the attitude changes as pointed out in the first paragraph. I do like to see the discussion focusing on ways to improve what several folks see as problems. I would like to remind everyone to avoid pointing fingers. So far that hasn't happened and that is an encouraging sign.





Double Post...sorry.
 
Suggestion: Drivers practice in the following rooms to eliminate the Ultra Fast having to deal with us Ultra Slow members.
Room I - D1-2
Room II - D3-4
Room III - D5-6
Room IV - D7-8
Drivers are close in abilities - and Divisions 2, 4, 6 and 8 are practicing against drivers from the division they will hopefully be promoted into at some point.

Hmmmm:
1) That doesn't help D3 into 2, D5 into 4, D7 into 6.
2) Turnout for practice is always a concern
 
DesertPenguin09
And there was a damn D2 guy in our Red Room. He claimed to be there as support to boost our confidence but all he did was blast his way to the front. Let us lower divisions have our racing with ourselves so we know what to expect come Sunday. You stay in your room and we'll stay in ours.
Click to expand...
Schmiggz
Ok, let's talk about solutions.
The problem is identified and this is what the vast majority of snailers are saying:
- Upper division racers not respecting slower traffic.
- Some racers push the limits of decency way beyond OLR limits knowing that IR's won't be filed in a practice room and others still can distinguish practice from racing.

Sometimes, against the will of many, there is a need to implement more severe and strict rulings in order the cut off a problem from foundation so considering the fact that the actual model for Thursday night practice sessions is well planned with two separate rooms for faster and slower traffic, entering the "wrong room" shouldn't be allowed under any circunstances being the responsibility of the room's host to kindly invite people to leave. If a D7 wants to practice with a D2 will have to do it somewhere else, not in the blue or red room.
Besides the host, there should also be a room director in the practice session, someone with the will to help keeping the session as clean as possible. Someone with the given power to point out anyone who's not respecting the others in the track.
Click to expand...


There is more than one reason for racers of different divisions being in "wrong rooms". That is not really the issue. If those fast racers are in the slower room they need to be aware of that and drop the " win at all costs" mentality and give space to the less confident driver
 
TEX36
Suggestion: Drivers practice in the following rooms to eliminate the Ultra Fast having to deal with us Ultra Slow members.
Room I - D1-2
Room II - D3-4
Room III - D5-6
Room IV - D7-8
Drivers are close in abilities - and Divisions 2, 4, 6 and 8 are practicing against drivers from the division they will hopefully be promoted into at some point.

Hmmmm:
1) That doesn't help D3 into 2, D5 into 4, D7 into 6.
2) Turnout for practice is always a concern
Click to expand...

Not a bad idea TeX,
I think Most would rather race a full grid(cleanly). Our regular practice numbers are not large enough to support more than 3 rooms. Even that is a stretch at times. Because of the break the turnout was larger than normal last night



Edit : :banghead::banghead: Im "that guy" ..damn double poster
 
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