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- Sum1s2pid
That's from 1990, no turbos.
That wasn't the MP4/4 lap? Hmm.... I had better fix that.
ninjaedit >.>
I'm old. I was dead at the time? Get off my lawn! /shakesfist
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2014 Rolex Australian Grand Prix
- Thread starter Cap'n Jack
- 1,519 comments
- 51,458 views
That wasn't the MP4/4 lap? Hmm.... I had better fix that.
ninjaedit >.>
I'm old. I was dead at the time? Get off my lawn! /shakesfist
- 2,526
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- Hammerhead Garage
He has voiced his dislike for months now, all with no effect.
Which would mean developing an entirely new engine - you can't just bolt the ERS units onto the old V8s and expect it all to work. There is no way the manufacturers would agree to spending tens of millions of dollars developing them, having just spent tens of millions of dollars creating the turbocharged V6s.
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
The FIA are happy with the fuel sensor (BBC) which leads me to infer that the fuel 'offset' advice they gave to IRBR was correct. IRBR still dispute this, of course.
IRBR have until Thursday lunchtime (Paris time presumably, so all afternoon) to formally lodge an appeal. Afaik they have implied that they will, I hope that if they do the matter is resolved quickly and cleanly. Certainly the fact that the sensor seems to be okay is a positive sign (as far as a correct judgement goes) but there may still be an issue with how the live data is transmitted to the team or technical delegation.
Gill Sensors
IRBR have until Thursday lunchtime (Paris time presumably, so all afternoon) to formally lodge an appeal. Afaik they have implied that they will, I hope that if they do the matter is resolved quickly and cleanly. Certainly the fact that the sensor seems to be okay is a positive sign (as far as a correct judgement goes) but there may still be an issue with how the live data is transmitted to the team or technical delegation.
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
Yes but RBR aren't stupid and like all teams are plotting all the time to get more when they don't have enough, I'm a Merc fan but I'll be one of the first to agree that last year MGP knew they were exploiting a loop hole that could get them in trouble using their current car (even if indirectly approved). This is the same for RBR, they saw an opportunity and if things went wrong they knew they could say "well you didn't have your act together so how are you sure we're wrong?"
It's not that hard to see and when you read the ten point finding it becomes even more clear that RBR took a couple steps they shouldn't; not listening to the FIAs warning and ensuring they'd have no DQ and then putting in their own system that wasn't even approved by the FIA.
Yes, but now that he's in danger of losing big bucks, I reckon things are gonna change...
Surely there's something they could do with the exhaust systems?
- 23,800
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- 804
- GTP_ZippyCat
- 33,155
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- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
To make a sound louder you need more energy, this formula is all about minimising energy use over distance so to modify the output would be to modify the performance. Teams just aren't going to go for that.
From a technical point of view I wonder if the FOM tv people were simply unprepared for the volume. There should be no reason why they can't deafen TV viewers with the sound of a presenter leafing through a clipboard, let alone a sports car passing at 200mph. I suspect they'll use different mics and angles next time, the whole balance is different now. The best part of that is that we should hear even more of the tyres
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I don't think they were unprepared. At least here in Brazil the sound of the broadcast was well balanced and didn't sound low. The tyre-screeching was awesome to hear!From a technical point of view I wonder if the FOM tv people were simply unprepared for the volume. There should be no reason why they can't deafen TV viewers with the sound of a presenter leafing through a clipboard, let alone a sports car passing at 200mph. I suspect they'll use different mics and angles next time, the whole balance is different now. The best part of that is that we should hear even more of the tyres
yeah, F1 world is crowded by business hypocrites and politicians in the shadow
but its all about money at the end, the F1 as pinnacle of racing sports that i used to follow with passion, is over.
big teams have been advantaged due to their status and their financial power, especially when you know who are behind them
Mclaren have some middle east investments
Ferrari owned by FIAT
Mercedes AMG by Mercedes
RB
smaller teams simply attempt to catch sponsors in order to miss budget
bigger team paid talented drivers
smaller teams are paid by paid drivers
...
no surprise at all
Marussia and Caterham will never make points not because they sucks no because they miss a lack of budget
Noise sound is another issue, but for these business workers, at near future, there exists a risk to damage F1 notoriety
its all about image
as Bernie said, F1 means being sexy, faster, glamorous etc...
removing usual screaming sounds from older engine motor such as V10
what a crime of majesty
less notorious, less sponsors, less money for whole F1 paddock
but its all about money at the end, the F1 as pinnacle of racing sports that i used to follow with passion, is over.
big teams have been advantaged due to their status and their financial power, especially when you know who are behind them
Mclaren have some middle east investments
Ferrari owned by FIAT
Mercedes AMG by Mercedes
RB
smaller teams simply attempt to catch sponsors in order to miss budget
bigger team paid talented drivers
smaller teams are paid by paid drivers
...
no surprise at all
Marussia and Caterham will never make points not because they sucks no because they miss a lack of budget
Noise sound is another issue, but for these business workers, at near future, there exists a risk to damage F1 notoriety
its all about image
as Bernie said, F1 means being sexy, faster, glamorous etc...
removing usual screaming sounds from older engine motor such as V10
what a crime of majesty
less notorious, less sponsors, less money for whole F1 paddock
- 846
- London Town
- SiiverArrow
It's no coincidence that the 4 rich teams you listed are backed by different manufacturers from next year. The only way you can make it more competitive is by encouraging more engine suppliers back into the sport and V10s would do the opposite...The only reason Renault is still in the sport (and why Honda is returning) is because of the new power units. Without them there would only be 2 teams at the top (Ferrari and Mercedes) and the rest would have to pay for engines and have to rely on pay drivers to make up the deficit. The gap between them and the 2 at the top would increase until it turns into Moto GP where you're guaranteed that only 4 people can only ever win anything.
- 804
- GTP_ZippyCat
To make a sound louder you need more energy, this formula is all about minimising energy use over distance so to modify the output would be to modify the performance. Teams just aren't going to go for that.
From a technical point of view I wonder if the FOM tv people were simply unprepared for the volume. There should be no reason why they can't deafen TV viewers with the sound of a presenter leafing through a clipboard, let alone a sports car passing at 200mph. I suspect they'll use different mics and angles next time, the whole balance is different now. The best part of that is that we should hear even more of the tyres
Been a lot of speculation on other forums that Bernie simply told them to bury the engine sounds in the mix. Joe Saward hasn't gone so far as to endorse that but he's called one of his readers "an innocent" for thinking Bernie wouldn't do such a thing.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
The sound balance definitely improved between the Friday and Saturday. On Friday, it was a mess; it was coarse and very, very harsh. I'm guessing they were just running whatever settings they were using last year. But on Saturday, it was much cleaner and clearer, to the point where I could hear the turbos and the wheelspin. There is probably more scope for improvement, but there is a simple solution: pick up your remote control, and press "V+" until the sound is at your heart's delight.From a technical point of view I wonder if the FOM tv people were simply unprepared for the volume. There should be no reason why they can't deafen TV viewers with the sound of a presenter leafing through a clipboard, let alone a sports car passing at 200mph. I suspect they'll use different mics and angles next time, the whole balance is different now. The best part of that is that we should hear even more of the tyres
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
I was thinking of the sound's relative "breadth", everything just felt narrow somehow. The peaky tyre noises came through but I wonder if we could actually have heard even more. Just increasing the channel volume doesn't help if the commentators are talking, which they almost continuously are
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- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
IRBR confirm they will formally appeal against the DSQ. I don't know how long it'll take the case to be heard but it's a shame that we'll almost certainly start the next race without knowing the result of the first.
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Actually, they have done more than that - they formally lodged the appeal. They only had 96 hours to do it.
Personally, I suspect Red Bull left it as late as possible to guarantee that the Malaysian Grand Prix would be run without a definite outcome. That way, they make the FIA look ridiculous. They obviously want the rule regarding fuel sensors to be changed.
Personally, I suspect Red Bull left it as late as possible to guarantee that the Malaysian Grand Prix would be run without a definite outcome. That way, they make the FIA look ridiculous. They obviously want the rule regarding fuel sensors to be changed.
certainly about 1 month
concerning Ferrari, Dominicalli admits Raikkonen having some issues with setups and car behavior overall
according some source, he lacks as usual of team spirit cooperation.
firstly he has been grouchy as usual toward his new engineer
listen radio conversation, Kimi just reprimanded him like daddy to son
he also ignored whole Ferrari employees when he went in garage
absolutely no tact with women, he pushed a Ferrari press agent?
concerning Ferrari, Dominicalli admits Raikkonen having some issues with setups and car behavior overall
according some source, he lacks as usual of team spirit cooperation.
firstly he has been grouchy as usual toward his new engineer
listen radio conversation, Kimi just reprimanded him like daddy to son
he also ignored whole Ferrari employees when he went in garage
absolutely no tact with women, he pushed a Ferrari press agent?
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- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
I agree with the timing. And bless your pedantry, they have indeed formally lodged their intention to appeal.
To split the hair the appeal itself will be presented and judged in front of the FIA (and WSMC?)
if they been so far, they would target indeed fuel sensors rules to be adapted at their convenience
they desire to prove they were right with fuel sensors and FIA's ones were inaccurate
the ultimate decision from tribunal will certainly come after Malaysian GP, 3 weeks / 1 month or so
guess they want it for SPAIN GP where they will attempt to bring major evolution and expect Renault improve their engine motor.
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- GTP_ZippyCat
Agreed on their ultimate intent, but the only way Malaysia would be left "without a definite outcome" would be if RBR deliberately violated the rule again.
- 422
- Eastern MA
- Odin_Wednesday
I think what was meant was, the Malaysian GP would be run without the appeal having a definite outcome (not the Malaysian GP itself lacking a definite outcome).
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
Not so, the outcome of Malaysia (if the appeal hadn't been heard) would be that the WDC and constructors tables would both be indefinite, only the race result itself would (presumably) be definite.
- 804
- GTP_ZippyCat
PM's wording is unclear, but I took him to mean the race outcome, not the standings. It'd possible, of course, the folks at Red Bull are so jacked up on their own product and/or BS that they might think it reasonable to defy the FIA a second time on the same issue. It's also possible the Renault/RB10 combo is such crap that without cheating on fuel flow it can't get to the front, giving them every incentive to defy the FIA again. After all, if it's not a contending car otherwise, what have they to lose?
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
I don't think they care that much for either the race results or the standings because they know there are still eighteen races to go and one good result can swing the lead of the championship back to them.
No, I think they are trying to get rid of a rule that they don't like because it is inconvenient to them. If they get control over monitoring the fuel flow, then they get control over how the data is presented, and that gives them a lot of scope to observe the letter, but ignore the spirit of the rules.
No, I think they are trying to get rid of a rule that they don't like because it is inconvenient to them. If they get control over monitoring the fuel flow, then they get control over how the data is presented, and that gives them a lot of scope to observe the letter, but ignore the spirit of the rules.
- 20,681
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
IRBR are making hay in the press for sure, whatever happens now there'll be a good portion of the public who think they were terribly hard done to if they lose the case. It's all part of the F1 grandstanding of course, not that it helps.
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
Yeah and that only last .008 seconds sadly since it's IRBR and not say FI or Williams that are true fan favorites.
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It's exactly what they did last year with the tyres.
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- m8h3r
Hopefully FIA will just hit them over the head with a ruler and say that they make the rules and it's RBR's job to follow them and will be rightfully disqualified if they go against them again.
