Eh, the fact that there are 6 teams in England vying for 4 Champions League spots means that it's very unlikely Southampton or West Ham will be more attractive than Borussia Dortmund or Valencia. The current big six are very attractive to players in Europe for sure but beyond them, the other 14 will be paying for young hopefuls, average players, or in West ham's case, terribly old players that were good 5-10 years ago.
Thats now though, Champions league money is tiny compared to the Premier league already(and the english teams make way more then the other nations clubs as well in the CL), Money will win the long game if you can earn 5 times more playing football in England compared to Germany and Spain it's going to go towards money most times, a football career isn't long in the scheme of things and once they retire they are unlikely to make anywhere near that kind of money again, so it's always in the back of the mind of the players.
Emery confirmed as Arsenal boss. I'm not entirely sure what to think about him specifically but an actual manager is better than taking a punt on Arteta in my opinion.
Tactically astute, with Sevilla showed he can craft results out of a team of good, but not exceptional players, and has some experience managing huge egos.
Arteta is promising but far too inexperienced at this stage, same with Vieira or Henry.
Eh, the fact that there are 6 teams in England vying for 4 Champions League spots means that it's very unlikely Southampton or West Ham will be more attractive than Borussia Dortmund or Valencia.
Six and Leicester. You can't really rule out a club getting a Champions League spot off the back of one ridiculous season any more. And there'll be two teams who played in the Champions League playing in the Championship this year - only because Blackburn, who won the league title 20 years ago, got promoted back to it.
The current big six are very attractive to players in Europe for sure but beyond them, the other 14 will be paying for young hopefuls, average players, or in West ham's case, terribly old players that were good 5-10 years ago.
West Ham got Lanzini (25) and Payet (31), although Payet's subsequent tantrum at West Ham not being big enough is kind of indicative.
But I think it's worse than that. The Premier League money is self-destructive. Teams have to spend a fortune to survive - and even if they do spend a fortune they might not. Swansea spent £70m on players this year and went down. £20m of that went on a forward from West Ham who's scored an average of 8 goals a year across his entire career, and who Swansea already sold for £20m to West Ham a bit over a year before. Meanwhile they sold a player to Everton for £45m. An Icelandic player. Everton spent as much money in 2017 on an Icelandic midfielder as Real Madrid spent on Zinedine Zidane in 2001 - or Barcelona spent on Neymar in 2013.
As they have to spend to survive, they don't play their kids - they want proven international players. If they're even developing their kids, they get farmed out to lower league sides on loan; Chelsea's Tammy Abraham almost made the England squad on the strength of 30 games for Swansea (and that off the back of 40 games from Bristol City). Meanwhile our clubs are hurling money at foreign clubs for their younger players, who are getting game time (and then we're giving them more game time), which the clubs then feed back into developing their younger players.
Sure, our kids are winning international trophies at U17-U23 level, but it doesn't translate to the full England team. The U20 World Cup winning team has 200 Premier League appearances between them (9.5 each) including substitute appearances, and half of those are Lewis Cook and Dominic Calvert-Lewin (Bournemouth and Everton). Then you get exceptions like Marcus Rashford and, since him, Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Trent Alexander-Arnold. "We" pile all the pressure onto them as the next Rooney/Owen/Beckham/Gazza, they don't succeed and "we" rip them apart.
And it's not just kids - Premier League leading clubs don't even play their English players. There's 418 possible starting positions in the league each season. The number of English starts for the champions over the last few years looks like this:
2018 - Manchester City - 112 (26.8%)
2017 - Chelsea - 42 (10.0%)
2016 - Leicester City - 136 (32.5%)
2015 - Chelsea - 73 (17.5%)
2014 - Manchester City - 79 (18.9%)
2013 - Manchester United - 182 (43.5%)
2012 - Manchester City - 150 (35.9%)
Anyone want to guess the proportion of German players starting for Bayern Munich's various titles?
2018 - Bayern Munich - 194 (51.8%)
2017 - Bayern Munich - 138 (36.9%)
2016 - Bayern Munich - 173 (46.3%)
2015 - Bayern Munich - 157 (41.9%)
The net result of that is regular World/European Cup semi-finals for the nations we buy players from and group stage/first knockout round for us. So basically we need my 40% rule again.
The U20 World Cup winning team has 200 Premier League appearances between them (9.5 each) including substitute appearances, and half of those are Lewis Cook and Dominic Calvert-Lewin (Bournemouth and Everton). Then you get exceptions like Marcus Rashford and, since him, Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Trent Alexander-Arnold.
So, what you are saying is that you need more players with double barreled names? It's a double whammy (pun intended) too as the club gets more money when they sell a shirt with the player's name(s) on it.
I think Serie A has a good rule now that went into effect a couple years ago as far as roster restrictions. Although it does not specify nationalities, it does lead to more Italian nationals on the rosters. Each team's 25 man roster must include four "homegrown" players and four "club-trained" players.
- A "homegrown" player is defined as someone who spent three years between the ages of 15 and 21 at any Italian club's youth system, 1st team squad or out on loan.
- A "club-trained" player is defined as someone who spent three years between the ages of 15 and 21 at the current club's youth system, 1st team squad or out on loan.
Six and Leicester. You can't really rule out a club getting a Champions League spot off the back of one ridiculous season any more. And there'll be two teams who played in the Champions League playing in the Championship this year - only because Blackburn, who won the league title 20 years ago, got promoted back to it.
West Ham got Lanzini (25) and Payet (31), although Payet's subsequent tantrum at West Ham not being big enough is kind of indicative.
But I think it's worse than that. The Premier League money is self-destructive. Teams have to spend a fortune to survive - and even if they do spend a fortune they might not. Swansea spent £70m on players this year and went down. £20m of that went on a forward from West Ham who's scored an average of 8 goals a year across his entire career, and who Swansea already sold for £20m to West Ham a bit over a year before. Meanwhile they sold a player to Everton for £45m. An Icelandic player. Everton spent as much money in 2017 on an Icelandic midfielder as Real Madrid spent on Zinedine Zidane in 2001 - or Barcelona spent on Neymar in 2013.
As they have to spend to survive, they don't play their kids - they want proven international players. If they're even developing their kids, they get farmed out to lower league sides on loan; Chelsea's Tammy Abraham almost made the England squad on the strength of 30 games for Swansea (and that off the back of 40 games from Bristol City). Meanwhile our clubs are hurling money at foreign clubs for their younger players, who are getting game time (and then we're giving them more game time), which the clubs then feed back into developing their younger players.
Sure, our kids are winning international trophies at U17-U23 level, but it doesn't translate to the full England team. The U20 World Cup winning team has 200 Premier League appearances between them (9.5 each) including substitute appearances, and half of those are Lewis Cook and Dominic Calvert-Lewin (Bournemouth and Everton). Then you get exceptions like Marcus Rashford and, since him, Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Trent Alexander-Arnold. "We" pile all the pressure onto them as the next Rooney/Owen/Beckham/Gazza, they don't succeed and "we" rip them apart.
And it's not just kids - Premier League leading clubs don't even play their English players. There's 418 possible starting positions in the league each season. The number of English starts for the champions over the last few years looks like this:
2018 - Manchester City - 112 (26.8%)
2017 - Chelsea - 42 (10.0%)
2016 - Leicester City - 136 (32.5%)
2015 - Chelsea - 73 (17.5%)
2014 - Manchester City - 79 (18.9%)
2013 - Manchester United - 182 (43.5%)
2012 - Manchester City - 150 (35.9%)
Anyone want to guess the proportion of German players starting for Bayern Munich's various titles?
2018 - Bayern Munich - 194 (51.8%)
2017 - Bayern Munich - 138 (36.9%)
2016 - Bayern Munich - 173 (46.3%)
2015 - Bayern Munich - 157 (41.9%)
The net result of that is regular World/European Cup semi-finals for the nations we buy players from and group stage/first knockout round for us. So basically we need my 40% rule again.
Outside the top six is the more likely option where our young players will come from for england. City don't really use theirs, as do Utd. Liverpool only really have Arnold. Chelsea is just a loan farm, with not many English players. Tottenham is the best bet for young English talent with the the likes of Walker Peters and Onomah et al.
With Everton (some of) our young English players have had plenty of game time. Here shows the number of appearances for young (English) players.
Dom Calvert Lewin 31 games
Tom Davies 28 games
Jonjoe Kenny 19 games
Benni Baningime 8 games
Adamola Lookman 7 games (loaned out to Leipzig)
Special mention to Kieran Dowell who went on loan to Forest who made 38 appearances. Dowell, DCL, Kenny and Lookman were U20 W/C winners.
Indeed, or even lower - Middlesbrough and Charlton both have a couple of kids in the U17-U20 setups. And we've got George Hirst, at least for now, as his dad argues with whoever he was arguing with.
But money talks. With the cash on the table, the top clubs don't have the first-team time for players. They earn £1.9m for each position up the table and £1.1m for each TV game after the 10th game, so they need results and exposure right now. They'll just spend £40m buying a 22-year old who's had a couple of decent seasons in the Bundesliga, La Liga, Ligue 1 or Serie A (or someone who did well at the World Cup/Euro Championship) - anyone with an exciting name to get on TV.
Then the next season the German, French, Spanish and Italian teams, who have thrust the huge transfer incomes at their own youth setups, have new 22-year olds who've had a couple of decent seasons. Or done well at an international tournament (not you, Italy), and it carries on.
I always find it fascinating that we accept the hugely multicultural nature of the Premier League (and Championship), but are absolutely amazed when an English player goes abroad. We all got interested in Japanese football when Lineker - who'd played for Barcelona - went to Nagoya Grampus Eight. Italian football only became a thing on British TV when Gazza went to Lazio. MLS only got into our news when Beckham went to LA Galaxy. Right now we've got Lookman at Liepzig and Sancho at Borussia Dortmund, while Manchester City alone have three full internationals for other nations aged 23 or under.
Emery is growing on me. His presser was impressive today and really ballsy to speak in English. He has his work cut out for him, but with him Sanelhi and Mislintat -- things are looking positive. Excited for a new season finally. Need a decent transfer market mind.
Big Congratulations to Fulham who will be playing Premier League Football next season, they beat Aston Villa 0-1 in a good and hotly contested PL final, The only goal was a very nice finish by Tom Cairney with a lovely assist by Ryan Sessegnon.
Fulham had Dennis Odoi sent off for a reckless challenge on Jack Grealish, who they targeted throughout the match with several fouls on him, it was all Fulham in the first half with Villa pressing at the start of the second, Villa didn't really do much with the extra man, Fulham deserve to go up IMO. 👍
I would rather Shrewsbury womn promotion toaday. More of a lesser team being promoted to The Champiomship. Kind of like Burton Albion and Perterborough in recent times.
With the season over, commiserations to Sunderland and Chesterfield who have now suffered back-to-back last-place relegation finishes.
Just some final housekeeping to do before this thread is done:
16th May - David Moyes (West Ham United, contract expiration) Premier League
18th May - Carlos Carvahal (Swansea City, contract expiration) Premier League
18th May - Paul Lambert (Stoke City, sacked) Premier League
22nd May - Gary Rowett (Derby County, leaves for Stoke City) Championship
A log of all managerial departures from the top 92 because sackings are all too quick to happen these days.
Arsenal - Arsene Wenger
Bouremouth - Eddie Howe
Brighton & Hove Albion - Chris Hughton
Burnley - Sean Dyche
Chelsea - Antonio Conte
Crystal Palace - Frank de Boer
Everton - Ronald Koeman
Huddersfield Town - David Wagner
Leicester City - Craig Shakespeare
Liverpool - Jürgen Klopp
Manchester City - Josep Guardiola
Manchester United - Jose Mourinho
Newcastle United - Rafael Benitez
Southampton - ]Mauricio Pellegrino
Stoke City - Mark Hughes
Swansea City - Paul Clement
Tottenham Hotspur - Mauricio Pochettino
Watford - Marco Silva
West Bromwich Albion - Tony Pulis
West Ham United - Slaven Billic
Aston Villa - Steve Bruce
Barnsley - Paul Heckingbottom
Birmingham City - Harry Redknapp
Bolton Wanderers - Phil Parkinson
Brentford - Dean Smith
Bristol City - Lee Johnson
Burton Albion - Nigel Clough
Cardiff City - Neil Warnock
Derby County - Gary Rowett
Fulham - Slaviša Jokanović
Hull City - Leonid Slutsky
Ipswich Town - Mick McCarthy
Leeds United - Thomas Christiansen
Middlesbrough - Garry Monk
Millwall - Neil Harris
Norwich City - Daniel Farke
Nottingham Forest - Mark Warbuton
Preston North End - Alex Neill
Queen's Park Rangers - Ian Holloway
Reading - Jaap Stam
Sheffield Wednesday - Carlos Carvahal
Sheffield United - Chris Wilder
Sunderland - Simon Grayson
Wolverhampton Wanderers - Nuno Santo
Blackburn Rovers - Tony Mowbray
Blackpool - Gary Bowyer
Bradford City - Stuart McCall
Bristol Rovers - Darrell Clarke
Bury - Lee Clark
Charlton Athletic - Karl Robinson
Doncaster Rovers - Darren Ferguson
Fleetwood Town - Uwe Rösler
Gillingham - Ady Pennock
Milton Keynes Dons - Robbie Neilson
Northampton Town - Justin Edinburgh
Oldham Athletic - John Sheridan
Oxford United - Josep Clotet
Peterborough United - Grant McCann
Portsmouth - Kenny Jackett
Plymouth Argyle - Derek Adams
Rochdale - Keith Hill
Rotherham United - Paul Warne
Scunthorpe United - Graham Alexander
Shrewsbury Town - Paul Hurst
Southend United - Phil Brown
Walsall - Jon Whitney
Wigan Athletic - Paul Cook
Wimbledon - Neil Ardley
Accrington Stanley - John Coleman
Barnet - Rossi Eames
Cambridge United - Shaun Derry
Carlisle United - Keith Curle
Cheltenham Town - Gary Johnson
Chesterfield - Gary Caldwell
Colchester United - John McGreal
Coventry City - Mark Robins
Crawley Town - Harry Kewell
Crewe Alexandra - Dave Artell
Exeter City - Paul Tisdale
Forest Green Rovers - Mark Cooper
Grimsby Town - Russell Slade
Lincoln City - Danny Cowley
Luton Town - Nathan Jones
Mansfield Town - Steve Evans
Morcambe - Jim Bentley
Newport County - Mike Flynn
Notts County - Kevin Nolan
Port Vale - Michael Brown
Swindon Town - David Flitcroft
Stevenage - Darren Sarll
Wycombe Wanderers - Gareth Ainsworth
Yeovil Town - Darren Way
31st August - Justin Edinburgh (Northampton Town, sacked) League One
11th September - Frank de Boer (Crystal Palace, sacked) Premier League
16th September - Harry Redknapp (Birmingham City, sacked) Championship
16th September - Michael Brown (Port Vale, sacked) League Two
16th September - Gary Caldwell (Chesterfield, sacked) League Two
25th September - Ady Pennock (Gillingham, resigned) League One
25th September - John Sheridan (Oldham Athletic, sacked) League One
17th October - Craig Shakespeare (Leicester City, sacked) Premier League
23rd October - Ronald Koeman (Everton, sacked) Premier League
30th October - Lee Clark (Bury, sacked) League One
31st October - Simon Grayson (Sunderland, sacked) Championship
6th November - Slaven Billic (West Ham United, sacked) Premier League
13th November - Rossi Eames (Barnet, demoted) League Two
20th November - Tony Pulis (West Bromwich Albion, sacked) Premier League
3rd December - Leonid Slutsky (Hull City, resigned) Championship
20th December - Paul Clement (Swansea City, sacked) Premier League
23rd December - Garry Monk (Middlesbrough, sacked) Championship
24th December - Carlos Carvahal (Sheffield Wednesday, sacked) Championship
31st December - Mark Warburton (Nottingham Forest, sacked) Championship
6th January - Mark Hughes (Stoke City, sacked) Premier League
16th January - Chris Lucketti (Bury, sacked) League One
16th January - Mark McGhee (Barnet, demoted) League Two
17th January - Phil Brown (Southend United, sacked) League One
20th January - Robbie Neilson (Milton Keynes Dons, sacked) League One
21st January - Josep Clotet (Oxford United, sacked) League One
22nd January - Marco Silva (Watford, sacked) Premier League
4th February - Thomas Christiansen (Leeds United, sacked) Championship
5th February - Stuart McCall (Bradford City, sacked) League One
6th February - Paul Heckingbottom (Barnsley, leaves for Leeds United) Championship
9th February - Shaun Derry (Cambridge United, sacked) League Two
11th February - Russell Slade (Grimsby Town, sacked) League Two
17th February - Uwe Rösler (Fleetwood Town, sacked) League One
25th February - Grant McCann (Peterborough United, sacked) League One
27th February - Steve Evans (Mansfield Town, leaves for Peterborough United) League Two
1st March - David Flitcroft (Swindon Town, leaves for Mansfield Town) League Two
3rd March - Steve Cotterill (Birmingham City, sacked) Championship
12th March - Jon Whitney (Walsall, sacked) League One
12th March - Mauricio Pellegrino (Southampton, sacked) Premier League
18th March - Darren Sarll (Stevenage, sacked) League Two
19th March - Graham Westley (Barnet, sacked) League Two
21st March - Jaap Stam (Reading, sacked) Championship
22nd March - Karl Robinson (Charlton Athletic, leaves for Oxford United) League One
24th March - Graham Alexander (Scunthorpe United, sacked) League One
2nd April - Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink (Northampton Town, sacked) League One
10th April - Mick McCarthy (Ipswich Town, sacked) Championship
22nd April - Dan Micciche (Milton Keynes Dons, sacked) League One
23rd April - Jack Lester (Chesterfield, sacked) League Two
29th April - Chris Coleman (Sunderland, sacked) Championship
8th May - Keith Curle (Carlisle United, contract expiration) League Two
6th May - Jose Morais (Barnsley, sacked) Championship
8th May - Simon Grayson (Bradford City, contract expiration) League One
10th May - Martin Allen (Barnet, sacked) League Two
10th May - Ian Holloway (Queen's Park Rangers, resigned) Championship
16th May - Sam Allerdyce (Everton, sacked) Premier League
16th May - David Moyes (West Ham United, contract expiration) Premier League
18th May - Carlos Carvahal (Swansea City, contract expiration) Premier League
18th May - Paul Lambert (Stoke City, sacked) Premier League
22nd May - Gary Rowett (Derby County, leaves for Stoke City) Championship
