Glickenhaus Says Its Cars Won't Appear in Gran Turismo Unless Sony Pays "a Fair Royalty"

[GTPNewsWire]

This is the discussion thread for a recent post on GTPlanet:

Glickenhaus Says Its Cars Won't Appear in Gran Turismo Unless Sony Pays "a Fair Royalty"

This article was published by Andrew Evans (@Famine) on September 3rd, 2020 in the Gran Turismo Sport category.

 

[Jump_Ace]

Jerome

 

[AudiMan2011]

So Glickenhaus is just doing what he normally does; acting like an entitled, spoilt you-know-what.

 

[Coiler]

Does PD pay anyone nowdays to use their cars?

 

[Nielsen]

Lotus recently said they hope to reappear in Gran Turismo soon. Combined with this news I’m starting to get the impression that PD are tough negotiators. Spa semminly also took a while to secure for GT Sport.

It’s ultimately good when racing game developers don’t let the licensors push them around, because these games are like interactive advertizements. I hope some manufacturers actually recognize this and pay developers to showcase their assets.

 

[redhed17]

I couldn't have picked one of their cars out of a line up, so I doubt I would miss them not being in a GT game. I haven't so far.

Mmm, if only there was a way to get your cars seen by millions of people to increase your profile and brand awareness. 💡

 

[SZRT Ice]

I'm of the mindset that brands should pay game devs to put their cars in games. Many will never have seen or heard of these unicorns, outside of seeing them in a video game. It's marketing/exposure/networking for their brands.

But yeah... Sure... Let's get real... Money makes the world go round. But I don't see a need to burn professional bridges by openly throwing a monetary tantrum on a social media platform. Not surprised the deal hasn't been made if this is how they also do business.

Example of better messaging would be:

"We would love to have our vehicles featured in the next GT game! Hopefully this can come to fruition if and when a licensing deal can be agreed on by both parties!"

Same messaging, less damaging delivery. Not so difficult. Instead, their messaging comes off as sour, butt hurt and bitter.

 

[Haitauer]

And they call Asphalt and CSR "sim racing"..

Thats steep even on gran turismo fan standarts.

 

[Populuxe]

Considering this ruling from earlier this year, this seems like a bad take by Glickenhaus. The ruling is that Activision has the right to include Humvees in it's Call of Duty games without licensing them from AM General.

District court Judge George Daniels wrote that Activision’s games passed the “Rogers test,” referring to a 1980s ruling on the use of trademarked names in artistic works. “It was metaphysically possible for [Activision] to have produced video games without the presence of Humvees,” Daniels says. But they increase Call of Duty’s feeling of realism and serve a purpose beyond simply trading on the Humvee brand. “If realism is an artistic goal, then the presence in modern warfare games of vehicles employed by actual militaries undoubtedly furthers that goal.”

Moreover, Call of Duty beats the “Polaroid factors” standards that determine whether a trademark’s use will confuse consumers. “Put simply, [AM General’s] purpose in using its mark is to sell vehicles to militaries, while [Activision’s] purpose is to create realistically simulating modern warfare video games for purchase by consumers.”

Now let's apply that to Gran Turismo (or any racing game developer).

“If realism is an artistic goal, then the presence in modern [automobile racing] games of vehicles employed by actual [race teams] undoubtedly furthers that goal.”

“Put simply, [Glickenhaus’s] purpose in using its mark is to sell vehicles to [consumers], while [Polyphony Digital’s] purpose is to create realistically simulating [automobile racing] video games for purchase by consumers.”

It will be interesting when some racing game dev finally says "You know what, Jim? You're being just a little too extra. Let's put this court ruling to the test."

 

[deviln3]

I have a lot of love for Subaru WRX STI from the days of GT1 and GT2, and I end up buying these cars in the current game, even if I don't plan on using them.

Brands have a lot of opportunity to get future customers via games, and I agree manufacturers should be compensated for their intellectual property, but the long term benefit likely outweighs the small near term profits they are fighting over.

 

[John Moore]

Should PD just make a Fictional hypercar that resembles the shape and color scheme of that particular racecar and squash the spoiled brats

 

[Atwork]

The thinking is like that of Bernie Ecclestone and totally missing part of what a car is. Kids turn in to adults, kids play with toys. You can get a child brand loyal, not saying that is a good thing but it is mind boggling to me how some brand would rather miss out of millions of dollars of free advertising. I get not wanting people to make a buck of your work, but in part Lamborghini is what it is today, because it was on posters in kids rooms.

Spa seems to not have a flat rate and wanted to charge GT an arm and a leg.

 

[O604]

What a guy. Starts SCG because Ferrari complained about him using the emblem, so he takes it off with a screwdriver and replaces it with a hand drawn one. Then accuses others of ripping off Ferrari.

https://www.autoweek.com/car-life/a...aus-on-cars-racing-and-the-quest-for-le-mans/

https://www.carscoops.com/2019/07/j...s-out-de-tomaso-for-copying-the-ferrari-p4-5/

 

[redhed17]

But I don't see a need to burn professional bridges by openly throwing a monetary tantrum on a social media platform. Not surprised the deal hasn't been made if this is how they also do business.

Kick up a fuss and moan, and you get more attention. They are saying we value our name more than PD do, implying that they think of themselves, their cars and their brand as valuable, when like I implied earlier, most people would not know about their cars.

Example of better messaging would be:
"We would love to have our vehicles featured in the next GT game! Hopefully this can come to fruition if and when a licensing deal can be agreed on by both parties!"

Their statement comes over as they have been approached, but value themselves/want more money. This statement could come over as 'please have us in your game'.

Same messaging, less damaging delivery. Not so difficult. Instead, their messaging comes off as sour, butt hurt and bitter.

Which statement was more likely to get attention like this article do you think! Would there be an article with a statement like you suggest.

 

[AlbertaGamer]

Should PD just make a Fictional hypercar that resembles the shape and color scheme of that particular racecar and squash the spoiled brats

As long as spoiled brats don't sue PD for looking like theirs, just my 2 cents. I might be wrong, or not.

 

[ynot]

Guess we won't be driving those cars in GT7. And who cares?

 

[RACECAR]

Alright Jim, have fun with your illusionary idea that you are anywhere near the worth of Ferrari (A manufacturer that ironically seems far more willing).

It is hilarious that according to him, the same people that "Don't care about GT" are the same people that play CSR Racing. Out of the loop much?

 

[McLaren]

Mmm, if only there was a way to get your cars seen by millions of people to increase your profile and brand awareness. 💡

Jim's profile awareness if already quite large; his wealth is from the film industry. His breakthrough into the automotive world came through with a partnership of Ferrari, although Jim was already well known in the exotic community for his collection prior; a P3/4, 412, & MK IV. GT40 are big names on the concours circuit.

He's not going to lose sleep if GT doesn't feature his cars b/c none of GT's playerbase is, in any realistic form, going to be part of Jim's directed market. The people Jim want to buy his cars have already been well aware of him.

 

[Phaceless_Ph]

Translation = he tried to hold them up for money and it didn't work.

 

[lancia delta hf]

I think some people are missing the issue.

Lotus recently said they hope to reappear in Gran Turismo soon. Combined with this news I’m starting to get the impression that PD are tough negotiators. Spa semminly also took a while to secure for GT Sport.

It’s ultimately good when racing game developers don’t let the licensors push them around, because these games are like interactive advertizements. I hope some manufacturers actually recognize this and pay developers to showcase their assets.

They're not pushing devs around. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but it appears the issue isn't that they feel they should be paid the same as Ferrari, that would be arrogant, the issue seems to be that they want PD to pay them them at least the same that other devs have paid them.

Should PD just make a Fictional hypercar that resembles the shape and color scheme of that particular racecar and squash the spoiled brats

Spoiled brats for wanting to get paid what they feel is fair? I must admit I do like the guy but he also irks me too.

Guess we won't be driving those cars in GT7. And who cares?

The two cars that are in AC are great cars to drive.

 

[hardvibes]

This guy likes his own replies.
Says it all.

 

[RACECAR]

That is just next level.

 

[Famine]

As I mentioned on Twitter, SCG makes 15-20 cars a year and can sell every one of them, and more, from its motorsport activity alone. It's starting to make some new models that might boost that number, but it won't ever make more than 324 cars a year because that'd lose it the NHTSA classification as a niche car manufacturer, and attract some financial penalties.

As such, it doesn't need Gran Turismo for publicity, and can hold out for whatever it considers fair royalty.

But... similar niche brands like Ruf have openly stated that they see people who were Gran Turismo kids growing up, hitting their 40s, and buying a Ruf because it was dear to them when they were kids. SCG might not need the publicity now and its current customers may not give a stuff about Gran Turismo, but if it has the brand awareness now it has the customers in 15-20 years for whatever it's making then.

Considering this ruling from earlier this year, this seems like a bad take by Glickenhaus. The ruling is that Activision has the right to include Humvees in it's Call of Duty games without licensing them from AM General.

Now let's apply that to Gran Turismo (or any racing game developer).

It will be interesting when some racing game dev finally says "You know what, Jim? You're being just a little too extra. Let's put this court ruling to the test."

We also covered that at the time - and for that reason. However, something I noted at the time might apply: the game features cars that look like the real cars, but they're never specifically named in the games. I think there's a moment in MW2 where you're told by another character to "get in the Hummvee", but that's it as far as I recall.

Having a car that both looks like the real car and is specifically named as the car within a section with the manufacturer's name might be a different legal challenge.

 

[sundaydriving]

What are PD asking?

 

[Tetraturbo]

Not something unusual considering it's PD, sounds like they're horrible to deal with licenses. Zenvo tried to get in touch with PD one time and said they didn't even get a return so I don't think these brands are gonna appear on GT7 any soon.

 

[Tornado]

I think people are dramatically overestimating how important it is for a car of this level to appear in a GT game. Wide reaching free advertising for your cool car matters quite a bit less for million dollar exotics than it does for economy cars hopped up with rally car parts.

Considering this ruling from earlier this year, this seems like a bad take by Glickenhaus. The ruling is that Activision has the right to include Humvees in it's Call of Duty games without licensing them from AM General.



Now let's apply that to Gran Turismo (or any racing game developer).



It will be interesting when some racing game dev finally says "You know what, Jim? You're being just a little too extra. Let's put this court ruling to the test."

It would take an exceptionally brave developer to do that, especially if they want to sell their game outside of the American market.

 

[JTB10000]

I don't like his attitude ‐ makes me care even less than I already did about his cars - but since this isn't new for PD/Sony, I'm inclined to assume that they are the more unreasonable ones in this situation.

 

[Cocomoto]

Well, royaltes, are they paid by how many games are selled? Because if is that the case, a GT game would sell a lot more than AC, for example where they have their car featured. And it's a good car to drive in the game.
But yeah, they didn't soudn very professional there..

 

[Nowax]

This guy likes his own replies.
Says it all.

LMAOO that's... ughhh...

 

[RACECAR]

Did some digging and interesting to note that SCG has only appeared in:

Asphalt 8 & 9
Assetto Corsa
CSR Racing
Racing Rivals

Kinda tells you how little they care about sim racing when the only title remotely close to it is Assetto Corsa and everything else is a Mobile game
Not exactly the biggest deal if they ever appear or not in GT game personally for me, but this attitude is just stunning. Part of me shouldn't be surprised this is coming from a guy who's main fortune is from Hollywood (Insert all the jokes you want here), but it just wows me to get this from a guy his age. Not in anyway close to what I would call mature.