A little disheartened at the under 500 car roster

[Samus]

I don't either for the PS3 era to merge every regional difference. But I'd like for some variations to get to know more about that car (like base version and hardcore version), but not too overboard (I'd think if the performance is identical like the native market, implement that in different way like let the player choose LHD or RHD of a car. or if different names like Miata or Eunos, put them in Badge option).

But I'd disapprove as well if people call every car with the same name as duplicates, which can be seen as acceptable view even if it's wrong. Like is your solution really overboard to disallow the game to add a separate racecar version of such after the road car one like R8 LMS to R8 or Supra GT500 to a Supra RZ?

I'd like for you to read @wasenhorn's explanation.

That's his opinion, mine remains the same. I don't buy for a second that PD cared about a few random people who would be annoyed they couldn't buy a Mazda MX-5 SR-Limited (NA, J) '97 like they own rather than the completely identical Mazda Eunos Roadster SR-Limited (NA) '97.

 

[Imari]

It's because they're econo boxes which are not many people want to drive in game.

What was the first Gran Turismo game you played? Gran Turismo became popular precisely because it included everyday cars at a time when all racing games had were race cars and supercars.

For most people, an "econobox" is all they can afford in real life. We don't all have six figures to drop on an R35. Driving your own car in game is fun. Modifying it with parts that you can't afford in real life is fun. Building competitive race cars out of cars that are routinely driven to the supermarket by your grandmother is fun. There are reasons why things like the 24 hours of Lemons and ChumpCar are popular - and they're still fun in game.

 

[Silver Arrows]

The issue with GT games going up to Sport (and, lets be real, once the game got to a certain point, they started doing it again) is that many of the different variants of vehicles were, as Samus said, only added in because Polyphony wanted to pad out the car count. Nothing more, nothing less. 95% of the JDM vehicles that had 50 variants or whatever going up to GT6 were only there because Polyphony believed that a bigger car count mattered more for back of box advertising. They didn't, especially when, in accordance with the current thread topic, they weren't modeled with any sort of differences between them, and once GT5 and 6 came into the equation, said vehicles were almost always Standard fare garbage that had no business being apart of the car list to begin with.

My opinion is that when it comes to adding in stock or 'normal' versions of cars, it should be generations first, and then figure out which versions have the most merit for that type of game. And treat racing vehicles of cars as the separate entities they are. There's a vast difference between say, a Clio Cup car and your bog standard Renault Sport Clio, but there is little functional difference between adding in various forms of the R35 GT-R when one could be very much fine with the standard, recent GT-R and potentially the Nismo variant.

 

[Aloha62_2]

It's the make-up of the cars that concern me at the moment, rather than the total, although with so many still being unknown there's still the chance that the final roster will be more to my tastes.

I loved GT1/2 as it let me replicate the tin-top racing I loved, tuning up some boggo saloon car into a touring car wanna-be. A lot of cars were ones you could look out of the window and see, or may even own. I could buy my dads laguna and turn it into a BTCC racer, and pit it against my uncles prelude.

Things like Vision GT cars? Fantasy running shoe look alikes that give me 0 interest.

 

[br1x]

The issue with GT games going up to Sport (and, lets be real, once the game got to a certain point, they started doing it again) is that many of the different variants of vehicles were, as Samus said, only added in because Polyphony wanted to pad out the car count. Nothing more, nothing less. 95% of the JDM vehicles that had 50 variants or whatever going up to GT6 were only there because Polyphony believed that a bigger car count mattered more for back of box advertising. They didn't, especially when, in accordance with the current thread topic, they weren't modeled with any sort of differences between them, and once GT5 and 6 came into the equation, said vehicles were almost always Standard fare garbage that had no business being apart of the car list to begin with.

My opinion is that when it comes to adding in stock or 'normal' versions of cars, it should be generations first, and then figure out which versions have the most merit for that type of game. And treat racing vehicles of cars as the separate entities they are. There's a vast difference between say, a Clio Cup car and your bog standard Renault Sport Clio, but there is little functional difference between adding in various forms of the R35 GT-R when one could be very much fine with the standard, recent GT-R and potentially the Nismo variant.

I am not so sure about that tbh, you talk from a different perspective than a large part of the casual audience out there who just thinks "oh cool, I played that back on PS1" and sees "over 1000 cars" and just buys it.

Most people who play Gran Turismo are not die-hard GT or even racing game fans, pure numbers often are enough draw for them.

 

[Silver Arrows]

I am not so sure about that tbh, you talk from a different perspective than a large part of the casual audience out there who just thinks "oh cool, I played that back on PS1" and sees "over 1000 cars" and just buys it.

Most people who play Gran Turismo are not die-hard GT or even racing game fans, pure numbers often are enough draw for them.

No, it isn't. Especially when the games eventually start to chase numbers above all else. One need only look at Forza 7, after doing the same things that GT's 5 and 6 did for that to be the case. By adding in vehicles and chasing car counts by way of cars that were tangentially related to a pure motorsports title (and frankly, should have stayed in Horizon) that was clearly only done because they wanted bulletin point material, it actively helped make the game much more scattershot and frankly, undefined as much as any other aspect.

More people are willing to accept a car list that is tighter and smaller, and fits the type of game that it is, then a large car list that doesn't please anyone and who's only purpose it to fulfill marketing requirements.

 

[Famine]

I don't buy for a second that PD cared about a few random people who would be annoyed they couldn't buy a Mazda MX-5 SR-Limited (NA, J) '97 like they own rather than the completely identical Mazda Eunos Roadster SR-Limited (NA) '97.

Even if they did, those people don't exist, because the Mazda MX-5 SR-Limited doesn't exist. That was only ever a Eunos Roadster (and not a Mazda, but we kinda have to let that one slide) SR-Limited, produced for the Japanese market in a run of 700 cars only.

The nearest equivalent in Europe was the Mazda MX-5 Berkeley, also produced in 1997-1998 but as a run of 400, and with most of the same kit (including Sparkle Green Metallic paint and polished wheels), but some big differences. SR had a Torsen LSD and 14-inch seven-spoke wheels, Berkeley had no LSD and 15-inch five-spoke wheels, plus a boot rack.

As for the Mazda Miata in North America, there was no equivalent model, so the Miata SR-Limited didn't exist twice as hard as the MX-5 SR-Limited didn't.

 

[dacc10]

What was the first Gran Turismo game you played? Gran Turismo became popular precisely because it included everyday cars at a time when all racing games had were race cars and supercars.

For most people, an "econobox" is all they can afford in real life. We don't all have six figures to drop on an R35. Driving your own car in game is fun. Modifying it with parts that you can't afford in real life is fun. Building competitive race cars out of cars that are routinely driven to the supermarket by your grandmother is fun. There are reasons why things like the 24 hours of Lemons and ChumpCar are popular - and they're still fun in game.

The problem with everyday cars, is that there are way too many in real life, and on the other, they aren't really "special" or "unique". If back in the day it was possible to model a ton of cars very quickly, which allowed for outside the box options to be added, nowadays it takes so long, that they have to make the best choices possible.

Said that, now that almost every brand has some sort of sportier version of their everyday cars, it's a no brainer that those cars should be added, as they fit both the sports car and everyday car criteria.


Either way, PD always had a problem with their decision making. From the duplicates in the past, to their refusal to allow outsourcing of the car modeling process. Let's not forget that they didn't do outsourcing because (atleast partly) they claimed that their models were better and future proof (and they wanted to keep the process "in-house"), which it ended up not being the case, as everything got remodeled for GTS.

Since everything (or almost everything) needed to be updated from the PS3-era to PS4, all those cars modeled for GT6 ended up specifically, ended up being scrapped and not used for GTS. Since those cars were used only in one game, they ended up being wasted somehow. If they were modeled with PS4 (and PS5) in mind, like the GTS cars were, right now the car count would easily surpass 500. Anyway, GT6 had enough premium cars to get rid of the standards completely, instead of PD not only keeping them, but wasting valuable resources into updating some models into "semi-premium" level.

 

[o000o]

That's his opinion, mine remains the same. I don't buy for a second that PD cared about a few random people who would be annoyed they couldn't buy a Mazda MX-5 SR-Limited (NA, J) '97 like they own rather than the completely identical Mazda Eunos Roadster SR-Limited (NA) '97.

Just that opinions of others can be taken into account to learn something new or such, like his other explanations like 86 vs BRZ.

But your example here is what I disagree as well to put both car names in the game as separate cars. I'd want if able for players to choose car name (badge).

The issue with GT games going up to Sport (and, lets be real, once the game got to a certain point, they started doing it again) is that many of the different variants of vehicles were, as Samus said, only added in because Polyphony wanted to pad out the car count. Nothing more, nothing less. 95% of the JDM vehicles that had 50 variants or whatever going up to GT6 were only there because Polyphony believed that a bigger car count mattered more for back of box advertising. They didn't, especially when, in accordance with the current thread topic, they weren't modeled with any sort of differences between them, and once GT5 and 6 came into the equation, said vehicles were almost always Standard fare garbage that had no business being apart of the car list to begin with.

My opinion is that when it comes to adding in stock or 'normal' versions of cars, it should be generations first, and then figure out which versions have the most merit for that type of game. And treat racing vehicles of cars as the separate entities they are. There's a vast difference between say, a Clio Cup car and your bog standard Renault Sport Clio, but there is little functional difference between adding in various forms of the R35 GT-R when one could be very much fine with the standard, recent GT-R and potentially the Nismo variant.

Well as you said, the duplicates are Standard fare garbage, which'd mean PD worked on certain JDM only, like the Premium Skylines in GT5-GT6 are the same as the ones provided in GTS.

Otherwise, for your Clio example, there are people who do treat racing versions as duplicates only due to having the same name (IMO wrong, but it can happen). GT-R does have generation in the beginning one, Black Edition one, and current Premium one, the performance are different, unlike 276hp JDMs. Just hoping that this isn't a bias to non-Japanese ones where Clio Cup gets free pass, while GT-R GT500 is seen as duplicate to standard GT-R.

 

[Famine]

But your example here is what I disagree as well to put both car names in the game as separate cars. I'd want if able for players to choose car name (badge).

One of them isn't a real car though...

 

[dacc10]

And even if it was, would it even be worth it just for a badge? We don't even have the ability to pick different factory wheels when we buy a new car in the game, only a preset, and body kits are usually in limited number.

 

[o000o]

One of them isn't a real car though...

Yeah, not speaking strictly for SR-Limited.

And even if it was, would it even be worth it just for a badge? We don't even have the ability to pick different factory wheels when we buy a new car in the game, only a preset, and body kits are usually in limited number.

I don't know where tf you got the assumption that I'd only want pick badge while I'd dismiss other options. If there are different factory wheels, then I'd like if the game allows the player to pick different factory wheels too for the cars (I mean it shouldn't be difficult to just provide menu in dealership). I'm thinking of choosing badge or such like choosing car's colors.

 

[05XR8]

Yeah, not speaking strictly for SR-Limited.

I don't know where tf you got the assumption that I'd only want pick badge while I'd dismiss other options. If there are different factory wheels, then I'd like if the game allows the player to pick different factory wheels too for the cars (I mean it shouldn't be difficult to just provide menu in dealership). I'm thinking of choosing badge or such like choosing car's colors.

I guess. There’s a licence plate icon in the GT Auto/LE. Wouldnt have to be a raised 3D badge.

 

[Samus]

But your example here is what I disagree as well to put both car names in the game as separate cars. I'd want if able for players to choose car name (badge).

Exactly, where appropriate it really wouldn't have been hard to make that an option but they preferred to list them all as individual cars to boost the overall numbers.

86 and BRZ is different because that is two manufacturers, even if it is the same car. I don't have any real problem including both of those.

 

[dacc10]

I don't know where tf you got the assumption that I'd only want pick badge while I'd dismiss other options. If there are different factory wheels, then I'd like if the game allows the player to pick different factory wheels too for the cars (I mean it shouldn't be difficult to just provide menu in dealership). I'm thinking of choosing badge or such like choosing car's colors.

You want a different badge for the differently named regional variants of certain cars, plus right/left hand drive options, plus wheels, anything else? What is so important about the first two things, other than "feeling like driving the same exact car, with a different name and the wheel on the other side"?

I still don't think people realise that any visual difference the car has, including badges or steering wheel placement, or wheels, or bodykits, or whatever, they all require to be modeled. So why should PD waste resources on modeling such superfluous stuff. Just imagine PD modeling 10 or more extra cockpits just so some cars can have both right and left hand drive versions, instead of using those resources to update the interiors of Premium cars from GT5/6 so they can finally make a comeback to GT7.

 

[RichiPuppy]

One of them isn't a real car though...

I think you knew exactly the point he was trying to make so what exactly did your comment add to the conversation?

 

[ImaRobot]

I think you knew exactly the point he was trying to make so what exactly did your comment add to the conversation?

To me, the point is pretty moot when talking about modeling specific cars and trims, because each model has it's own individuality and likes, when one of the cars being compared literally doesn't exist. Especially considering the talk is about padding the car list with unnecessary things.

What exactly are you adding to the conversation?

 

[Famine]

I think you knew exactly the point he was trying to make so what exactly did your comment add to the conversation?

That one of the cars being discussed regarding vehicle duplication doesn't exist in the first place - and was therefore unnecessarily duplicated - so has no purpose being in the game anyway, and is itself solid evidence of unnecessary duplication.

Pursuant to your own question, what does your rather unnecessarily hostile post add to the conversation?

 

[o000o]

You want a different badge for the differently named regional variants of certain cars, plus right/left hand drive options, plus wheels, anything else? What is so important about the first two things, other than "feeling like driving the same exact car, with a different name and the wheel on the other side"?

I still don't think people realise that any visual difference the car has, including badges or steering wheel placement, or wheels, or bodykits, or whatever, they all require to be modeled. So why should PD waste resources on modeling such superfluous stuff. Just imagine PD modeling 10 or more extra cockpits just so some cars can have both right and left hand drive versions, instead of using those resources to update the interiors of Premium cars from GT5/6 so they can finally make a comeback to GT7.

I don't know why you're all riled up about those that aren't in game and way exaggerate (well some do genuinely require work) the problem, but of course forgetting those which are already in game, like for example ofc, color selection, or wheels that you mention there.

Seriously wtf would be really wrong to include original wheel menu selection in Brand Central when they did that in GT Auto, and that they'd provide more wheel choices for modification and adding original wheels on the dealership is just doing similar thing? And like badges would probably take less than whole car color? Only changing specific small part in a car instead of majority of it.

Make GT only provide 1 car color, the most iconic one then so they don't have to waste providing only visual flick and have "more time/resources" to model entirely different car?

 

[dacc10]

I don't know why you're all riled up about those that aren't in game and way exaggerate (well some do genuinely require work) the problem, but of course forgetting those which are already in game, like for example ofc, color selection, or wheels that you mention there.

Seriously wtf would be really wrong to include original wheel menu selection in Brand Central when they did that in GT Auto, and that they'd provide more wheel choices for modification and adding original wheels on the dealership is just doing similar thing? And like badges would probably take less than whole car color? Only changing specific small part in a car instead of majority of it.

Make GT only provide 1 car color, the most iconic one then so they don't have to waste providing only visual flick and have "more time/resources" to model entirely different car?

You do realize that color is not a 3D object, right? The process is completely different of modeling a car, or body part, or whatever. That's why we have a color palette, which alone has literally tousands of shades possible. Did they individually model each tone in the color palette? Plus all the car paints from factory, plus all those special paints (chrome, matte, etc)? Of course not.

Compare that to wheels, which are actual 3D objects, so they go through the same modeling process as a car. In your head, you're thinking "modeling one extra set of wheels, won't consume that many resources", and you're right, it won't, the problem comes when they start adding one extra set of wheel (from the dealership) to many more cars. Let's just say 50 cars get one extra set of wheels, now that would take almost as many resources, as modeling let's say 5 individual cars, or possibly 10 body kits, or updating interiors from GT6 Premium cars. There's a reason why most other games don't do that, and there's no reson for PD to be different, even though some cars have better wheel options that what we end up with in games.

The same applies to the rest of what you want: badges are irrelevant, from a gaming perspective, it makes no difference if the car is called Miata or MX-5, having a mention of the other version in the car description should be enough. As for left or right hand drive, I mean, stating the obvious again, they don't benefit the game in any way, so it's just a pointless way to spend resources (which, once again, could be used to update car interiors from GT6 premiums).

 

[05XR8]

Just that opinions of others can be taken into account to learn something new or such, like his other explanations like 86 vs BRZ.

But your example here is what I disagree as well to put both car names in the game as separate cars. I'd want if able for players to choose car name (badge).

Well as you said, the duplicates are Standard fare garbage, which'd mean PD worked on certain JDM only, like the Premium Skylines in GT5-GT6 are the same as the ones provided in GTS.

Otherwise, for your Clio example, there are people who do treat racing versions as duplicates only due to having the same name (IMO wrong, but it can happen). GT-R does have generation in the beginning one, Black Edition one, and current Premium one, the performance are different, unlike 276hp JDMs. Just hoping that this isn't a bias to non-Japanese ones where Clio Cup gets free pass, while GT-R GT500 is seen as duplicate to standard GT-R.

This would be along the lines of offering various trim levels. Probably something PD would do for the GR Yaris.

 

[o000o]

You do realize that color is not a 3D object, right? The process is completely different of modeling a car, or body part, or whatever. That's why we have a color palette, which alone has literally tousands of shades possible. Did they individually model each tone in the color palette? Plus all the car paints from factory, plus all those special paints (chrome, matte, etc)? Of course not.

Compare that to wheels, which are actual 3D objects, so they go through the same modeling process as a car. In your head, you're thinking "modeling one extra set of wheels, won't consume that many resources", and you're right, it won't, the problem comes when they start adding one extra set of wheel (from the dealership) to many more cars. Let's just say 50 cars get one extra set of wheels, now that would take almost as many resources, as modeling let's say 5 individual cars, or possibly 10 body kits, or updating interiors from GT6 Premium cars. There's a reason why most other games don't do that, and there's no reson for PD to be different, even though some cars have better wheel options that what we end up with in games.

The same applies to the rest of what you want: badges are irrelevant, from a gaming perspective, it makes no difference if the car is called Miata or MX-5, having a mention of the other version in the car description should be enough. As for left or right hand drive, I mean, stating the obvious again, they don't benefit the game in any way, so it's just a pointless way to spend resources (which, once again, could be used to update car interiors from GT6 premiums).

Now I don't know what is the right way to talk about car wishes, everything is wrong due to "not thinking about resources", like wanting specific car would mean denying others wanting different car to be added so that can mean they're wrong too for just talking about what car they want to have.

For colors, gotta still make sure that the lighting and various shades of it are implemented correctly in various sides of the cars?

And for wheels, it's more of actually just being subjective that you just like the branded wheels better while you cover that up by inventing reasons why you aren't wrong and others are wrong? I'd want either default paint or wheels to be available to be selected on cars in GT Auto, for the latter it'd be simply adding one more menu in Brand Central just like the paint ones.

 

[RedRockValley]

"Econoboxes" aren't coming back, if you guys mean stuff like a base model Dodge Neon or a Corsa B. They were new and much more common around the era of GT2. PD didn't add them because they were like grandma's old beater car, they were added because manufacturers wanted to make an impression on players with their new line-ups. It's why there were so many new manufacturers in GT2, lots of these brands were salivating at the idea of a "virtual showroom" after they saw the success of GT1. It was new and very forward-thinking.

The modern equivalent of this would be adding something like a VW Up or a Hyundai Kona. Not that I would necessarily be against that mind you, but it gives you insight into how these cars weren't seen the way we see them now.

I think a good way to satiate these tastes would be to add things like a Neon SRT4, Saxo VTS or a Clio 182 Trophy, to give a few examples. Beefed up versions of their econobox counterparts with racing history, they certainly wouldn't feel unusual amongst the other machines in GT7.

As for the econoboxes... They just aren't going to come back, and if they do, it's probably only going to be a few and something from Japan.

 

[GBalao888]

"Econoboxes" aren't coming back, if you guys mean stuff like a base model Dodge Neon or a Corsa B. They were new and much more common around the era of GT2. PD didn't add them because they were like grandma's old beater car, they were added because manufacturers wanted to make an impression on players with their new line-ups. It's why there were so many new manufacturers in GT2, lots of these brands were salivating at the idea of a "virtual showroom" after they saw the success of GT1. It was new and very forward-thinking.

The modern equivalent of this would be adding something like a VW Up or a Hyundai Kona. Not that I would necessarily be against that mind you, but it gives you insight into how these cars weren't seen the way we see them now.

I think a good way to satiate these tastes would be to add things like a Neon SRT4, Saxo VTS or a Clio 182 Trophy, to give a few examples. Beefed up versions of their econobox counterparts with racing history, they certainly wouldn't feel unusual amongst the other machines in GT7.

As for the econoboxes... They just aren't going to come back, and if they do, it's probably only going to be a few and something from Japan.

Judging by the looks of things in GT Sport and even the current car list we have now, I think the theme of which consists more of "dream vehicles" (being the must-have sports, super and hypercars), historically important cars, modern racing machines and some of the best of the Japanese automotive industry. They really shifted their focus on that, although we still have a bit of some everyday vehicles like the Honda Fit, Mazda Demio, and so on.

Nowadays, from that "virtual showroom" that you mentioned, PD are aiming to transform that into an "automotive encyclopedia", or even as far as a "virtual car museum".

 

[dacc10]

Now I don't know what is the right way to talk about car wishes, everything is wrong due to "not thinking about resources", like wanting specific car would mean denying others wanting different car to be added so that can mean they're wrong too for just talking about what car they want to have.

For colors, gotta still make sure that the lighting and various shades of it are implemented correctly in various sides of the cars?

And for wheels, it's more of actually just being subjective that you just like the branded wheels better while you cover that up by inventing reasons why you aren't wrong and others are wrong? I'd want either default paint or wheels to be available to be selected on cars in GT Auto, for the latter it'd be simply adding one more menu in Brand Central just like the paint ones.

When it comes to colors, they don't check individually each color from every angle possible on every lighting scenario. That would be impossible to do. If we assume there are 1000 unique colors in game (to paint a car), then they needed to check every single one of those for each car (let's say 400), we get 400k variants. Add that to the different times of day, with different sorts of lighting, from different angles, we reach the multi-milion mark of possible combinations, and this is just for paints alone, once you throw in liveries, the possible combinations multiply by a lot. So, they do probably check if the colors are right under different lighting conditions, but it's not on individual cars, it's the paint alone, and that has nothing to do with 3D modeling.

The easiest way to explain is this: GTS has player made decals, PD does not model those decals in 3D, nor the players who created them, it's a 2D design, that can be placed on a car, the car serves as a canvas. Paints are the same.

Also, pretty sure PD doesn't wander around trying to model every car in each individual possible color that they get in game.

As wheels go, the process is completely different. Those are 3D objects, which are modeled by the same process as cars themselves. It's not magic, and it's not just adding a tab on the dealership. If the wheel model is not in the game, it will have to be modeled, taking away resources from something else.

Your last paragraph was quite confusing. I like branded wheels better than what? My clear preference is to use the resources available, to model more cars (or update premium cars from GT6), as those wheel won't add as much as an actual car to the game. You want more factory wheels as an option to choose from the Dealership, and I explained why that's not practical, as modeling more wheels consumes resources (which is key for a game that right now lags behind it's main competitor).

If we were talking about PD allowing us to use factory wheels, on other cars from the same brand, it's completely different, and that would be great.

 

[RedRockValley]

Judging by the looks of things in GT Sport and even the current car list we have now, I think the theme of which consists more of "dream vehicles" (being the must-have sports, super and hypercars), historically important cars, modern racing machines and some of the best of the Japanese automotive industry. They really shifted their focus on that, although we still have a bit of some everyday vehicles like the Honda Fit, Mazda Demio, and so on.

Nowadays, from that "virtual showroom" that you mentioned, PD are aiming to transform that into an "automotive encyclopedia", or even as far as a "virtual car museum".

I think this is the better approach, now that making cars for games is a much more laborious task. Dream cars with some normal cars sprinkled in here and there is fine for me, pretty sure Forza does the same nowadays.

 

[o000o]

I think this is the better approach, now that making cars for games is a much more laborious task. Dream cars with some normal cars sprinkled in here and there is fine for me, pretty sure Forza does the same nowadays.

Forza had really big car lineup with similar quality as in FM7 and FH4 (after last update), and iirc they have more normal cars than anything GT has...

 

[NICKname]

What was the first Gran Turismo game you played? Gran Turismo became popular precisely because it included everyday cars at a time when all racing games had were race cars and supercars.

That was 24 years ago. Gaming has changed massively since then. GT Sport has sold over ten million units despite barely including everyday cars, let alone a reason to use everyday cars.

GT7 doesn't need an emphasis on everyday cars to be popular, it needs changes that (casual) fans will actually care about: better cars, better racing, better customization, better online multiplayer and a better career mode. Customization and online multiplayer weren't even a concern for players a quarter century ago. If PD wouldn't make these changes GT7 would end up bombing like GT6 did.

And besides that, modeling cars takes so much time and effort nowadays that it would be just a waste to model cars that nobody will ever seriously use in career mode or online multiplayer.