A pseudo-scientific test: Comparing the Le Mans cars on Sarthe II

[gumpy]

Just a quick question, the Playstation Pescarolo C60 '04 was tested on pace setting '3' - is setting '4' too much or do the tires give out too much that you have to resort to setting '3' when you have less grip ?

The writeup includes "I also checked to see how many cars Bob could drive error-free on the "4" (Fast) speed setting. As it turned out, only two cars had that advantage: The Audi R8 and the Bentley Speed 8 (which occasionally got slightly off the pavement, but not often). Why Bob could handle these cars at the faster setting, and not others, is a mystery. It may say more about the cars than the B-Spec driver, I would think. (Oddly, the '03 Pescarolo was faster on "3" than it was on "4". I have no idea why.)"

 

[[empty space]]

if b-spec is going faster on 3 than 4 then its because hes making it through the corner, but, hes taking it too fast and not getting an optimium drive onto the long straights. or, just plain running wide. sears point is another track where you just need to stay online to be "fast".

 

[-= XplosiV =-]

Thanx for highlighting that guy's, i evan read that before i posted, i just must have forgotten - DOH

 

[sejtur]

Great test, Zardoz. 👍

I think if you don't install turbo stage 4, you can just use pace 5 for almost every car.

 

[Zardoz]

...if you don't install turbo stage 4, you can just use pace 5 for almost every car...

Checked it on three cars, as I recall. Didn't seem to make a difference. There are six places on the track where Bob goes off on higher speed settings (Mulsanne Corner, Indianapolis, Arnage, Maison Blanche, Esses, Tertre Rouge), and the engine power didn't affect it.

800 HP or 1100 HP, he motored off the road on those places just the same.

 

[soptom]

Have you or are you planning to test them on another course, namely one without a straight large enough to even out a poor handling car if it has a big enough speed advantage? I can appreciate it took you an awfully long time to do this though so perhaps someone else with most/all of the above cars can try it( I haven't got enough of them to bother). Also, are the default settings close to optimum for every car? I haven't looked into it but if a car has good default settings, would this give it an advantage over a car with bad default settings? How about adjusting the settings on each car to your own optimum and keeping them on the same "speed" strategy before testing. Good write up, I'm not questioning your reasoning, just trying to even it up even more so that a definitive result can be agreed upon, what do you think?

 

[sejtur]

Checked it on three cars, as I recall. Didn't seem to make a difference. There are six places on the track where Bob goes off on higher speed settings (Mulsanne Corner, Indianapolis, Arnage, Maison Blanche, Esses, Tertre Rouge), and the engine power didn't affect it.

800 HP or 1100 HP, he motored off the road on those places just the same.

I know you got the NTSC version so I'll check it out also.
My C cars only spin when they got red rear tires (well I've had a few races expierience and maybe they did went off the track sometimes I didn't notice) but those races were not on Sarthe.

 

[Zardoz]

...but if a car has good default settings, would this give it an advantage over a car with bad default settings? How about adjusting the settings on each car to your own optimum...

I talked about that in the write up. Proper chassis setups for each car could very well change the results. It could possibly move some cars up the list, and it could re-arrange the order of the top cars.

I tested them on Sarthe II because it seems like a lot of players want to run that race just to get the great prize car: The Bentley Speed 8. Certainly running the test on other tracks could yield different results.

While I had a lot of fun doing it, once is enough. I think I'm out of the car-testing business, especially since the other group I was going to look at, the JGTC cars, has already been tested for us:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=62799&highlight=JGTC

http://boards.ign.com/Gran_Turismo/b5208/85969693/?2


.

 

[The-BNA]

That's great I loved every bit of it

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

This not count for everyone,


For me, the Toyota 88C-V is by far the best, in second the Sauber C9 and in third the Audi R8 followed by the BMW V12 LMR.



But, good info, thanks 👍

 

[VyPeR]

Awesome effort on the comparison, Zardoz. Thanks for sharing. I too enjoy the LMP cars, but usually tend to stick with the GT and the GTS types. I just think it sucks that the Vertigo and the GT40 absolutely have to be tuned in order to even be competitive with the other uber GT class/LM "dream" cars (especially on certain tracks).

Oh well. I needed to learn how to tune eventually. I guess my button-mashing past is catching up to me. That's probably where B-Spec Bob comes in, being able to drive the finesse cars until I can catch up in skill and ability. At least I can drive the dang cars at full throttle down a straight and overtake properly! Ha! Take that Bob!

Yea I know what you mean with the Vertigo, I spent countless times tuning it up to make it "competitive". This car is tough to use, but looks like a beauty, and sounds ultra cool.

 

[VeilsideR33sub]

For some reason the Toyota 88C-V makes LeSarthe I seem unrealistically easy ; it bombs the straight , takes the dunlop or whatever at the end without braking problems and then eats up the back esses.
I much prefer the Audi ; it is crisper it terms of handling and in Zardoz's testing it comes out as the only flawless AI handler . It is a little more work , both on the straight and taking the long curves but it's direct feel keeps you awake .
In general , I Lap in a tighter coil with the R8 and this is what raises the usefullness of the machine over the Toyota which spams all it comes into contact with . . .

 

[barryf1fan]

I may be a little late to this but I just wanted to say thanks for the info. I will definitely benefit from it. I hope you had fun doing it because that seemed like work.

Feel almost guilty being able to "just" read through it and get all the stats without the work. Your a great person for sharing this.

 

[whatupdet]

This is a little off topic but I'm wondering if you race a race in B-Spec mode after you've done it in A-spec will you still receive B-spec points/stats? Or how about if you repeat a race over and over again?
Lastly if you use the Race speed X3 option do you still receive points? I wonder because I've been repeatedly doing the El Capitan in B-spec to get an easy 1M in credits but my stats haven't changed. Maybe it's because I'm using a severally overclassed car for the race, I don't know?

 

[zondahelmet]

what about the Zonda LM race car and the Nissan GTR Concept LM

 

[Moxy]

Just what I needed! Cheers, I think this will help all 'N00BZ' like me in the future a great deal 👍

 

[T4 GTR]

Well, I'm a skyline R34 owner (60 Grand! 60 GRAND) and I'm actually quite surprised on how realistic it handles to the real thing on GT4. So I don't see why any other car should handle any different.

After all GT4 Is a realistic game, graphics, sounds, feel.

Cheers

T4 GTR

 

[BMWteamPTG]

great post. i learned a ****load of info here. as i started, in my head, i pre-guessed the results and was surprised by my guessing and your results. i was close. thanks for your hard work, and hopefully more of these psuedo-scientific tests

 

[tigre_hobbes]

I have to say, you're spot on with these two points. Why is the 88C-V (or the Minolta as everyone seems to call it) among the best LM cars in GT4? I couldn't understand it either. And I agree, the Sauber was indeed hyped up and still is. I think it's just because it's hard to acquire.

Anyway, great write up, will come in useful. Great to see so many LM fans on GTP.

You're right. PD tranform the 88C-V in a bomb and the 905 in bull****

 

[F310B]

Nice experiment, I take my hat off to you. The only complaint I would have is that those ridiculous turbo upgrades were used. I would never use them, because I want to drive the cars like they would have raced at Le Mans, not like they would have raced with rocket boosters attached to the back.

I also repeatedly find that the Sauber C9 is the fastest car in both B-spec and A-spec, apart from the F1 car, both over a single lap and over longer runs. It's way ahead of the Audi R8 and Bentley and other modern LMPs. R92CP would be second over a single lap, and 787B would be second over longer runs. The 88-CV is probably third in both categories.

Why is the 88-CV so fast? I think it's because the developers took 50kg off the weight to make it faster. Probably just nationalistic bias on the part of PD - make the Japanese cars seem better.

 

[VyPeR]

My all time faves on the LM 24 hr endurance, or just normal racing on LM, are the:
Bentley Speed 8
Nissan R92CP
Pescarolo Judd
Audi R8

For some reason the Toyota 88C-V makes LeSarthe I seem unrealistically easy ; it bombs the straight , takes the dunlop or whatever at the end without braking problems and then eats up the back esses.
I much prefer the Audi ; it is crisper it terms of handling and in Zardoz's testing it comes out as the only flawless AI handler . It is a little more work , both on the straight and taking the long curves but it's direct feel keeps you awake .
In general , I Lap in a tighter coil with the R8 and this is what raises the usefullness of the machine over the Toyota which spams all it comes into contact with . . .

The Toyota 88C V, though very fast, has (in my opinion) weak brake response

 

[Ebon]

The Toyota 88C V, though very fast, has (in my opinion) weak brake response

usually to compromise that I up the brake controller to 24/22 and raise the front ever so slightly, along with lowering the front spring rate. while these adjustments might not make this car the fastest thing ever, I find that that it's much more pleasent to lose speed than do 228 into a steel barrier while the rest of the field passes you laughing

 

[fdRX7]

empresseve work but i have a question could u please tell me what is the old "tranny trick"?
i found it sorry about that

 

[DeSwyft]

Are there any other Lemans cars you haven't covered, or is that all of it?

What about Pagani Zonda LM Race car or Toyota 7 Race Car?

 

[Rzeractor]

Ahh, go the Pescarolo.

 

[Famine]

Are there any other Lemans cars you haven't covered, or is that all of it?

What about Pagani Zonda LM Race car or Toyota 7 Race Car?

The Zonda LM sort-of doesn't exist, and the Toyota 7 is a CanAm car.

All of the cars in the test have really run at Le Mans in Le 24 Heures Du Mans.

 

[Zaine2]

OMG WOW

This is really useful
I don't think i'll bother buying another car now i have the minolta, theres not that much difference. Also i'd prefer to buy the audi rather than that French car. It's because i think french cars are unreliable in real life and have seen bad problems with them. Also that car is not that good in rela life!

And german enginering is the dog b***cks

Just one question though cause i'm new u see. I don't undertsand ur terminology on R2/R3 tires and those tire terms.

Does this mean have hard tires on the back and medium on the front.
Sorry it's probally a really newbie question.

Great Work! Should diffinetley be a sticky!👍

 

[PeterJB]

I must admit, I bought GT4 mostly for the Le Mans "prototype" race cars. Sure, I love racing any class of car in GT4 as long as the AI field can put up a real fight, but for me, the exotic endurance racers hold a special fascination.

That interest led me to conduct a bit of B-Spec testing to see which is the fastest of the lot of the mighty Group C, GT-1, and LMP cars. I B-Specced it so I could speed up the process, while also eliminating the variations in lap times that my erratic driving would create. I trust B-Spec Bob's consistency far more than mine.

.

If this was intended for Le Mans cars why did you use the Gillet Vertigo and the Chaparral 2D? Because to my knowledge neither of them ever competed in the Le Mans 24 Hours. Amazingly the Minolta never did either!

 

[daan]

A Vertigo attempted to pre-qualify in 1997 and a Chaparral 2D took part in 1966.

 

[evantri]

Hi all,

Sorry for the noob question, but how to obtain the playstation pescarolo cars?

It seems I can't find it anywhere..

Thanks for the info