- 4,805
So lets say you have about 35,000 to spend on a car which would you get and why? For me i am not sure yet but these are two great cars.
Acura TL or Mazda RX-8?
- Thread starter pimp racer
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Super-Supra
(Banned)
- 4,111
I'd go with the 2004 Acura TL.
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The TL is a sedan, and it's more than $35K. It's an old man car (:
The RX-8 has all kinds of uniqueness going for it. It's also very sporty. The backseat is less than a backseat, but you can use it for an 'inside trunk'. You can also aquire the car for less than $35k
But lastly I would go for an S2000. BUE-YEA!
The RX-8 has all kinds of uniqueness going for it. It's also very sporty. The backseat is less than a backseat, but you can use it for an 'inside trunk'. You can also aquire the car for less than $35k
But lastly I would go for an S2000. BUE-YEA!
- 3,780
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- The359
I'd say go with the RX-8. Forget the numbers, the RX-8 is a sportscar and the TL is just a sedan that you'll see a lot of average people driving. If you really want some sportiness, then it's RX-8 you should go with.
The TL is really rather ugly in my opinion. If they did away with the big ACURA letters on the front bumper it'd be a considerable improvement. The RX-8 also has a sportier interior then the TL I think.
The TL is really rather ugly in my opinion. If they did away with the big ACURA letters on the front bumper it'd be a considerable improvement. The RX-8 also has a sportier interior then the TL I think.
- 5,622
- eMadman
umm...in this case, tl even though it's a honda. Mazdas are in general VERY overpriced (well, up here they are) and you don't get as much bang for the buck. Why exactly ARE you comparing 2 vehicles from 2 different classes now? One is pretty much a sports coupe despite the 4 doors, there is no rear space. The other is a sedan...
btw, isn't the TL a fwd?
btw, isn't the TL a fwd?
- 4,805
Well one reason i would probably go with the RX-8 is because you are likely not going to see a lot of these compared to the Honda S2000 and Acura TL. ( But i still see the rx-8 like everyday lucky me)
No. Your misconception is that the TL is a sedan and the RX-8 is a sports car. It has to do with design and advertising. Let's not forget the numbers and focus on that the TL has more power, more spec, more interior room, better acceleration, and equal handling. Even a fully-optioned RX-8 can't touch a TL on spec, and then the RX-8 loses price, the only category it can take over the TL.
They've both got four doors and backseats. If you want a non-luxurious full-on sport sedan, you get a WRX for $3000 less than an RX-8. A luxurious sport sedan like an Altima, Mazda 6, or Accord is about $4000 less. A sports car like the 350Z is $500 less. They're all less expensive, better-optioned, faster, quicker, and more powerful. The TL comparison is a weak one, but that doesn't mean the RX-8 is better.
But keep in mind, we've been given $35k to spend on either of these cars, so price shouldn't be a factor at all.
Five dollars says either AWD or FWD. I think Honda's too afraid to abandon the 3.5...
- 12,993
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I'll take a 1986 Plymouth Reliant and $34,500 in cash, please.
- 12,993
- USA! USA!
So, you'd buy an RX-8 just because someone labeled it a sportscar? A sportscar that doesn't perform as well as a family sedan, even?
That's sad.
///M-Spec
Staff Emeritus
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I suppose the TL is a sports car the same way using Botox is just like being young again.
It has to do with weight and distribution of said, suspension calibration and where the drive wheels are located. I guess maybe the TL brochures don't mention that, so let's not forget those facts.
Better acceleration and equal handling? Is this data from 'The RX-8 driven by a monkey vs. TL driven by pre-accident Zenardi Magazine'? Try 'TL almost as good as RX-8' and you'll get a little closer to the truth.
Yes Virginia, its a dumb comparison. I think someone is confused about that kind of car they want. But people who would choose the RX-8 would never cross-shop a TL unless they don't know much about cars and go by price alone.
Your animosity towards the 8 is borderline pathologic. This feels curiously like the other RX-8 thread we had, where you declared the car has no meaning or purpose. I suppose the signifigance of light weight, low center of gravity, proper drive wheels and near perfect weight distribution still escapes you, but perhaps I'm just too prone to mass-market advertising.
M
And sports car enthusiasts with some sense will buy one of its competitors. I'm seconding what Klos said.
No. Styling and marketing. You can't scapegoat 'suspension settings' and 'drive wheel location' when the difference between the 'sedan' TL and the 'sports car' RX-8 is so spectacularly small.
Equal acceleration. Is what I meant.
There's no objective measure of handling, but calling the RX-8 better isn't giving the TL a fair shake - once again, styling and marketing. I've driven both cars (both manuals and the 4A RX-8) and handling is extremely similar. Despite the RX-8's looks.
Because it isn't better than any of its direct competitors! I still think it has no purpose except to give different people something different, make them pay more for it, and make them get less out of it.
'Proper drive wheels' is a pretty easy fallback when you know there are no other rear-drive sedans in its price range. Of course, every competitor with four doors and without 'proper drive wheels' exceeds or meets the RX-8 in every category. And the main coupe competitor, the Nissan 350Z, is far better than the RX-8 could ever dream to be.
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- The359
Wow, I guess all those RX-8 buyers must be idiots then...oh, wait, this is only your opinion and not fact
Those RX-8 buyers certainly must have found it worth buying over it's competitors.
If it were up to you, everyone would be driving only the same 5 or 6 cars. How utterly boring.
And a comparible RWD sedan? Easy, Chrysler 300 Touring or 300 Limited.
///M-Spec
Staff Emeritus
- 4,928
First let's make one thing clear: I'm not going to try and make a case that the RX-8 is somehow "better" than the TL. They are clearly geared towards different types of buyers. What's right for you may not be right for me. Simple fact.
Second, there clearly is a case to be made for the RX-8 and lots of people don't have any trouble making it. They are for people who want all the qualities of a real sports car, but need occasional seating for 4.
Of course, your first response is to say "well there are plenty of four doors that offer more room than the RX-8 and are just as quick". This is true if your car comparison is done by holding up two brochures. I don't know about you, but I don't drive a bunch of stats. I'm interested in the driving experience.
The RX-8 is simply a better, more focused driver's car than the sedan alternatives in the price range but retains a good combination of their best features. It weighs several hundred pounds less than the sedan competitors (not to mention the 350Z), has better weight distribution, lower CG, racier power delivery and matches them for ride/handling compromise. All these things make it more fun to drive and that's the bottom line.
Yes, it can't keep up with the hardcore STi or Evo. They are faster, more focused, more rewarding and still have more room. But ask 10 car enthusiasts if they'd like to drive 5 hours on the Interstate in either and I bet only one or two of them would say yes. I've driven an Evo and I don't know how owners can live with the ride on a daily basis. I guess they don't have any broken pavement near them because I sure can't.
Every car is a series of compromises. Slinky looks is often gotten by a cramped interior. Good handling is often gained by a hard ride. Refinement is often gained by weight and cost. The 8 makes sense to a lot of people because it makes the right series of compromises for a a certain segment of enthusiasts.
Don't take this the wrong way, but if you can't tell the difference between a torque-steer happy, 270 hp 3500 lb. FWD sedan and a 230ish hp 3000 lb torsen-equiped RWD coupe, you didn't drive the cars very hard. There are serious limitations with FWD when you get into that hp range. They may feel the same at 7/10ths or even 8/10ths, but when the hammer drops there is no comparision.
And there are objective measures of handling. Its called an autocross. And I'll happily take on a TL in a RX-8 at one. The Acura will lose.
Proper drive wheels is absolutely, positively not a 'fall back' when you talk about sports cars. FWD is a serious demerit in a car with 250+ horsepower. No one in his right mind will say torque steer is prefereable to throttle steer.
EDIT: Besides, the G35 6MT coupe is a perfectly good alternative to the RX-8.
As for the Z; it is a damn fine car. Not exactly light years beyond the 8, but it does do certain things better. But it is not an option for people who need those back seats from time to time.
M
The Vanishing Boy
Premium
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- GTP_VanishingBoy
- Vanishing Boy
Personally I prefer the Subaru Forester 2.5XT, way cheaper and has better performance (with cargo hauling) than the both of them. Since I'm a 'practicality first' type of guy, I'll pick the TL w/ A-apec package anytime. Im not going to buy a car that can go 13 mpg for the sake of fun and performance, if thats the case I'd rather get either the Evo 7.5/WRX STi or the S2000 with better gas milage.
But what are the qualities of a sports car? You say RWD and suspension settings, forsaking speed, handling, and acceleration, where the Impreza and Lancer are real competition.
You seem to be interested in harshness.
Have you driven the RX-8, Impreza, and Lancer?
I think it makes the wrong series of compromises, and your argument seems to rest on the fairly subjective category of driving experience - not even handling. I'd rather take the potholes than give up 60bhp, two drive wheels, a seat, some spec, and (though miniscule) my sense of style.
I live in New York. I don't drive at the car's capacity, ever. So the RX-8 is better in hard driving. I couldn't care less. Usually, people who claim to drive hard accelerate quickly at stoplights and peel out of parking lots.
And if you ever knock high-powered front-wheel drive vehicles again, I'll have Cadillac come to your door and beat you down.
You think an autocross is an objective measure of handling? What are you, off your mind? It's still drivers, drivers **** up. Often. It wouldn't even matter if it were drivers put forth by each company, or the greatest drivers in the world.
Nah - they'll go with the Impreza. Or the Lancer. (or the IS300, or the G35, or the 3-series, or the A4, or the Altima, or the Accord, or the CTS, or the Galant, or the C-class though hopefully not)
They really ought to go for a Mustang, but people don't tend to like those.
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- WRBWRXMAX
- Max Archer
The RX-8 has one VERY important advantage. As with the RX-7 series, the small size of the rotary engine allows it to be placed behind the front axle for an effective MR layout, and, coupled with its light weight, gives the car 50:50 weight distribution. Therefore, the car has a more stable acceleration characteristic, and can maintain a higher corner enterance and exit speed.
The Acura has an FF layout, with a higher, more forward, center of gravity. Therefore, under accelleration, as weight shifts rearward, the car loses traction and therefore accellerates less effectively. The traction loss also degrades turning and braking porformance, necessitating earlier braking and a lower entrance speed. The same issues also cause understeer in the corner. Therefore, the car can not accelerate through the corner to the same degree that the RX-8 can.
In other words, the FR layout is vastly superior to the FF. FF is an inferior layout meant for small economy cars, not $35,000 cars that are supposed to be sporty.
Still, I'd prefer a G35 coupe, an STi, or a LanEvo to either of them.
The Acura has an FF layout, with a higher, more forward, center of gravity. Therefore, under accelleration, as weight shifts rearward, the car loses traction and therefore accellerates less effectively. The traction loss also degrades turning and braking porformance, necessitating earlier braking and a lower entrance speed. The same issues also cause understeer in the corner. Therefore, the car can not accelerate through the corner to the same degree that the RX-8 can.
In other words, the FR layout is vastly superior to the FF. FF is an inferior layout meant for small economy cars, not $35,000 cars that are supposed to be sporty.
Still, I'd prefer a G35 coupe, an STi, or a LanEvo to either of them.
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- WRBWRXMAX
- Max Archer
I believe you have just made a serious breach of the Acceptable Use Policy.
It doesn't matter wether you "really meant it" or not. It was still a threat to inflict physical harm on another member.
If I said that I was going to come to your house while you were sleeping and shoot you in the back of the head with a military-grade M16 assault rifle, it wouldn't matter whether I was serious or not.
And while getting Cadillac representitaves to beat someone up is implausible, it would not be particurlarly more difficult than obtaning the aforementioned illegal weapon and transpotring it across state or national borders. And in both cases, locating the "victim" would be extremely difficult.
So just because the nature of the threat is relatively implausible does not mean it can be disregarded. And the way "if you ever knock high-powered front-wheel drive vehicles again" was delivered gave it a very intimidating and serious tone.
There is a high likelihood that a member of less seniority would be banned for making such a threat.
