Aircraft being attacked by lasers

[OG_Wretch]

ASAT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-satellite_weapon



Of course, but when something completly unnecessary becomes a threat for thousands of people, because tons of idiots abuse it, it should be made illegal. Sure, everyone has stuff you don't "need" but you cannot "shoot down" airplanes and helicopters with most of it.

Seriously, who needs a green laser which is powerful enough to light-up an airplane cockpit? I would say only people who want to light-up an airplane cockpit.

EDIT: Only talking about pointers by the way, show laser systems for concerts etc. are something different.

You can't have my laser quick sighting system off my rifle or pistol either.

 

[G.T.Ace]

For what do you need a laser sighting on your guns? Preparing for some urban warfare in your neighbourhood?

 

[Famine]

Of course, but when something completly unnecessary becomes a threat for thousands of people, because tons of idiots abuse it, it should be made illegal.

3,000 people die on British roads every year. We going to make an argument for cars being banned because tons of idiots abuse them and kill thousands of people?

Seriously, who needs a green laser which is powerful enough to light-up an airplane cockpit? I would say only people who want to light-up an airplane cockpit.

Seriously, who needs a computer which is powerful enough to access child porn? I would say only people who want to access child porn.

That way lies madness.

 

[G.T.Ace]

Come on, now you're exaggerating a bit.
You can do tons of things with both a computer and a car, from just using it for practical reasons to actually save lifes, what can you do with a "high-power" laser pointer except for blinding people and pointing at a wall?

 

[OG_Wretch]

For what do you need a laser sighting on your guns? Preparing for some urban warfare in your neighbourhood?

It allows me to hit the enemy with more accuracy quickly (providing it's sighted in properly) and less of a chance hitting a friendly or loved one.

Put the dot on the bad guy and bang! No more bad guy.

Nothing so mundane as killing my neighbors which would be foolish to even attempt
since every one of them is as armed as I am if not even to a greater level.

If I wanted to kill others I'd do so with poison since it's so much more effective.
Probably Phosgene gas since it's easy to make and about as deadly as it gets.

But there is no way that will happen because I'm a happy well adjusted person
living life and watching for angry young people on drugs looking for free stuff to fund their habit.

No issues with dope smokers but the meth heads I could shoot all day just to put them out of every one's misery...
...mostly their own.

 

[Famine]

Come on, now you're exaggerating a bit.
You can do tons of things with both a computer and a car, from just using it for practical reasons to actually save lifes, what can you do with a "high-power" laser pointer except for blinding people and pointing at a wall?

You don't need to justify legal uses for an item...

Just because you don't need it, just because it can be perverted for crime, just because your life doesn't require one doesn't mean an item should be banned.

 

[G.T.Ace]

You don't need to justify legal uses for an item...

Just because you don't need it, just because it can be perverted for crime, just because your life doesn't require one doesn't mean an item should be banned.

So how do you choose if an item should banned or not?
Should everyone have the opportunity to buy and own explosives, drugs and other really dangerous stuff, because as long as you don't "abuse" it, nothing happens?

An item, which is bought from thousands of people just for causing harm (again, for what do you need a "high-power" laser pointer when you are not wanting to do silly things with it?) shouldn't be legal.

 

[Famine]

So how do you choose if an item should banned or not?

In an ideal world? You don't.

Should everyone have the opportunity to buy and own explosives, drugs and other really dangerous stuff, because as long as you don't "abuse" it, nothing happens?

Yep.

The crime should be the crime you commit by abusing the item, not having the item.

An item, which is bought from thousands of people just for causing harm (again, for what do you need a "high-power" laser pointer when you are not wanting to do silly things with it?) shouldn't be legal.

I have a laser pointer. I didn't buy it just for causing harm. I might buy a higher powered one. I wouldn't buy that just for causing harm.

You've decided that the only reason to have a laser pointer is to hurt people. You haven't demonstrated any evidence of this, but you're happy to claim that there's no use for one other than that. Your mind's already made up.

 

[OG_Wretch]

So how do you choose if an item should banned or not?
Should everyone have the opportunity to buy and own explosives, drugs and other really dangerous stuff, because as long as you don't "abuse" it, nothing happens?

An item, which is bought from thousands of people just for causing harm (again, for what do you need a "high-power" laser pointer when you are not wanting to do silly things with it?) shouldn't be legal.

One law, do nothing that will directly cause physical harm to another...
...without their consent.

If the person only has the mentality of a child then allowing them "matches" would be in violation on the one law.

Be responsible and secure your "matches" from children lest they burn down your neighborhood and leave you with the bill.

 

[G.T.Ace]

In an ideal world? You don't.

There's no ideal world, be realistic please.

Yep.

The crime should be the crime you commit by abusing the item, not having the item.

Huh? No gun restrictions, no prescriptions for medicine, no drivers license? Yey and all hell breaks loose!

I have a laser pointer. I didn't buy it just for causing harm. I might buy a higher powered one. I wouldn't buy that just for causing harm.

You've decided that the only reason to have a laser pointer is to hurt people. You haven't demonstrated any evidence of this, but you're happy to claim that there's no use for one other than that. Your mind's already made up.

If it isn't like that, tell me ONE(!) good reason to own a high-power laser pointer, just one and don't say "because I want it", that's not a reason. I already mentioned weaker pointers, which would be enough to play with your dog or to do presentations, I already asked you two times, for what do you need a high-power laser pointer except for doing silly things? For pointing a dot on a wall, for your dog, for presentations? Again, get a weaker one. For lightshows? Unpractical, get a show laser.

 

[Boffin]

You've decided that the only reason to have a laser pointer is to hurt people. You haven't demonstrated any evidence of this, but you're happy to claim that there's no use for one other than that. Your mind's already made up.

Well apart from doing a presentation, I havent seen much use for them.
Coming out of yr12 Design & tech when we fussed over major design projects and design briefs, I can't really see what the design brief for one of these things would be.

As said before, a powerful computer is used for many things, and generally any computer with enough power to run teh interwebz is enough to get you done for child porn if you are that way inclined. Computers are used for games, for documents, for calculations, and they also run the internet, a small portion of that is child porn. The majority of people who buy computers don'd intend to look at child porn on them, it really isnt their primary use.

Same as a car - its primary use is to move from point A to point B using minimum effort to the opperator and its occupants. It also has the ability to keep you dry in the rain, used as a object of recreation etc etc. With millions of these deadly machines running at relatively high speeds just feet from eachother every day, its a wonder that only 3000 British people are killed by them every year. Crashing is not their main purpose, and nor do people intend to crash them.

And we come to Lasers. You can point them at things - cool. They can be useful for presentations, yes, but why do you need a higher powered one? I cant really find much reason apart from the fact that more power means more destruction to the thing they are pointed at really. What DO people buy them for if it isnt to kick some presentational ass? Why DO people buy them?

 

[Famine]

I own lots of things that are utterly pointless. I was unaware there'd later be a test on what's necessary to require continued ownership.

There's no ideal world, be realistic please.

I am.

That some people choose to abuse things is no reason to ban everyone from having them. I appreciate that, culturally, you're conditioned to believe that it's the thing that is the problem and not the abuser, but it isn't.

Huh? No gun restrictions, no prescriptions for medicine, no drivers license? Yey and all hell breaks loose!

Now you're being silly.

If it isn't like that, tell me ONE(!) good reason to own a high-power laser pointer, just one and don't say "because I want it", that's not a reason.

Sure and there's not ONE (!) good reason to own a high-power car either. Since there's allegedly a proven causal link between higher speeds and death (and higher power means higher speed), let's ban them all to stop the few abusing them, right?

I already asked you two times, for what do you need a high-power laser pointer except for doing silly things?

And I already told you that there is no need to justify everything based on "need", or your house would be a lot smaller and emptier.

 

[OG_Wretch]

I guess my using them for quick/accurate target acquisition is going to be ignored then.

It also helps older folks hit the intruder with rounds from a small lightweight pistol,
who attempts a home invasion, instead of just scaring them half to death whistling rounds past.

 

[Famine]

I guess my using them for quick/accurate target acquisition is going to be ignored then.

Probably, since you're already dealing with cultures where guns are banned to stop crimes with guns happening...

 

[OG_Wretch]

Probably, since you're already dealing with cultures where guns are banned to stop crimes with guns happening...

And that is where the rub comes in.

Just because their culture has no supposed or legal use they want to ban a thing.

There is no security but what each individual makes for themselves and even that isn't Murphy proof.

Punish the wrong doer and move on to the next one; case by case...
...that is what will happen in any case whether they use an illegal item or not.

 

[blaaah]

I want to etch my name on the Moon.

 

[mirial]

Most kids get up to mischeif, but know when to draw the line. If the offender has the sense to know to place a beam directly in the flight path, then he is just a bad egg.

If caught, the offence should be dealt with by a hefty jail sentence plus sterilisation.

 

[blaaah]

Most kids get up to mischeif, but know when to draw the line. If the offender has the sense to know to place a beam directly in the flight path, then he is just a bad egg.

If caught, the offence should be dealt with by a hefty jail sentence plus sterilisation.

You are joking yes? Or is that another debate about what punishments for people should include?

No issues with dope smokers but the meth heads I could shoot all day just to put them out of every one's misery...
...mostly their own.

But would you? If for some reason your law was changed to make it legal to shoot 'meth heads' would you then just shoot them?

 

[mirial]

I thought my comment would provoke some reaction, but you can't mend a faulty circuit board can you? This is another topic, but unfortunately we are living in an era where we have over corrected with too much freedom.

Events like this are always going to happen when there is too much free reign, and the gap betwen the haves and the have nots is large.

I'm not posting anymore on this.

 

[G.T.Ace]

I own lots of things that are utterly pointless. I was unaware there'd later be a test on what's necessary to require continued ownership.

I do own pointless things myself, can I use them to let a airplane crash? Eh, no.

I am.

That some people choose to abuse things is no reason to ban everyone from having them. I appreciate that, culturally, you're conditioned to believe that it's the thing that is the problem and not the abuser, but it isn't.

You forget that the human being is mostly completely dumb, that's why there are laws, to prevent people getting things they could abuse.

Now you're being silly.

You were the one saying: "The crime should be the crime you commit by abusing the item, not having the item." Not me. If this counts for laser pointers which could cause a plane crash, it has to count for everything, especially guns.

Sure and there's not ONE (!) good reason to own a high-power car either. Since there's allegedly a proven causal link between higher speeds and death (and higher power means higher speed), let's ban them all to stop the few abusing them, right?

People don't buy sportscars to abuse them in the first place, people buy them to travel fast, or to go on a closed track and have fun with them. Laser pointers are bought from tons of people just for causing harm in the first place and they are cheap. If sportscars would cost only 10 bucks and wouldn't need a drivers license they should be illegal too, yes.

By the way I'm a supporter of the idea that you need to do some certain special license to be able to buy a sportscar. So not everyone can drive a 500 hp Ferrari and kill someone because of the lack of experience.

And I already told you that there is no need to justify everything based on "need", or your house would be a lot smaller and emptier.

And I already told you that not every "useless" item is as dangerous as a high-power laser pointer and that there are weaker alternatives which can be used for the things you, kinda, mentioned.

 

[OG_Wretch]

But would you? If for some reason your law was changed to make it legal to shoot 'meth heads' would you then just shoot them?

It already is the law if the "meth Head" is misbehaving badly enough but yes,
yes I would shoot them as I would any sick suffering wounded dying animal.

Only if they come to me though since hunting them doesn't sound like much sport.

They have been and will continue to be shot if their actions are deemed threatening enough...
...same as non-drug using criminals.

 

[G.T.Ace]

It already is the law if the "meth Head" is misbehaving badly enough but yes,
yes I would shoot them as I would any sick suffering wounded dying animal.

And you want to be taken serious?

 

[Famine]

I do own pointless things myself, can I use them to let a airplane crash? Eh, no.

Can you cause injury to others with them? If so, they should be banned by your own arguments - they have no use, you have no need for them, you can live without them and their misuse can cause injury to others.

You forget that the human being is mostly completely dumb, that's why there are laws, to prevent people getting things they could abuse.

The human being is mostly completely average.

You were the one saying: "The crime should be the crime you commit by abusing the item, not having the item." Not me. If this counts for laser pointers which could cause a plane crash, it has to count for everything, especially guns.

Yes. Causing a plane crash is the crime, not owning a laser pointer which could make a plane crash. I have no idea what your point could possibly be here.

People don't buy sportscars to abuse them in the first place, people buy them to travel fast, or to go on a closed track and have fun with them. Laser pointers are bought from tons of people just for causing harm in the first place and they are cheap.

You keep stating this, but you've not offered any actual evidence for it.

If sportscars would cost only 10 bucks and wouldn't need a drivers license they should be illegal too, yes.

Why?

Just so you know, you don't need a driving licence to buy a car.

And I already told you that not every "useless" item is as dangerous as a high-power laser pointer and that there are weaker alternatives which can be used for the things you, kinda, mentioned.

There's nothing innately dangerous about a laser pointer, high-powered or not. Or a car. Or a gun. I've no idea what your point here could possibly be either.

 

[OG_Wretch]

And you want to be taken serious?

It is a common held opinion among people living around me.
We are into self preservation and if that means throwing 5 already dying people from an overloaded liferaft,
sobeit.

Of course we've had the benefit of watching them kill themselves and completely ruin even their own children's lives.

They are mostly just takers who will not change until they are completely out of options and life.
That would be fine alone but, they take from honest hard working people who wish to live in peace
and be free from having to suffer the crimes committed so the "meth heads" can get a fix.

If they wish to do the drug, fine but, they need to be responsible for themselves instead of feeding on everyone else.

Legalize it and give them a place to go be high but keep it and everything involved with it in that place.

Otherwise, their is no good arguement for saving those that are already committing suicide.
They want to die so let them.

 

[blaaah]

It is a common held opinion among people living around me.
We are into self preservation and if that means throwing 5 already dying people from an overloaded liferaft,
sobeit.

Of course we've had the benefit of watching them kill themselves and completely ruin even their own children's lives.

They are mostly just takers who will not change until they are completely out of options and life.
That would be fine alone but, they take from honest hard working people who wish to live in peace
and be free from having to suffer the crimes committed so the "meth heads" can get a fix.

If they wish to do the drug, fine but, they need to be responsible for themselves instead of feeding on everyone else.

Legalize it and give them a place to go be high but keep it and everything involved with it in that place.

Otherwise, their is no good arguement for saving those that are already committing suicide.
They want to die so let them.

I don't think you have considered the implications of mental illness.
Most people who commit suicide and 'want to die' are of broken minds, are you saying those who have vulnerable and traumatised minds from drugs or whatever reason are able to say they really want to die and it would be the right thing for them? To say a 'meth head' wants to die and be taken seriously that 'meth head' would need to be given a full psychiatric assessment, be free from mind altering drugs and have no mental illness which significantly alters the individuals reasoning, then if clear a panel of experts and judges could decide if the wish to die was a genuine decision from a coherent mind that was requesting it. Then it should be legal for a suicide.

 

[OG_Wretch]

Blaaah, you don't get it.

All the "meth heads" need to do to keep from committing suicide earlier than planned or unplanned is stay the hell away from me and mine...
...same as any non-drug addled criminal with obvious ill intent.

I don't go looking for free stuff at their labs, or anywhere for that matter, so I expect the same consideration from them.

 

[BigYoSpeck]

The human being is mostly completely average.

The thing about your average person is half of them are below average intelligence.

Can't remember who said that, might have been George Carilin.

 

[RC45]

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[Northstar]

...several hundred feet away from your property using ground penetrating radar,

Used to tell thickness of ground, snow, ice etc....Not very useful for spying.

acute listening devices

Never heard of it and google search found nothing as well, at least relating to helicopters listening to people.

and heat sensing equipment

Which doesn't give much info and is costly to run along with a helicopter.

You need a warrant and/or probable cause if you want to "search" my property.

You're 100% right, so it's best not to give them any by blinding the pilot.

 

[RC45]

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