All appreciation for Marcos Ambrose will stop. Right NOW.

[SandStorm]

So you think Marcos Ambrose is doing okay this season? Hmm? Think he's going to kik @$$? Just remember who made it possible. Just remember the Holden teams who consented to sign the Project Blueprint form. Admittedly they wanted some more competition, but they could have refused to sign the Blueprint documents, and the Ford drivers - Ambrose included - would still be running around mid-pack.

And you wonder why the Holdens are having such a lousy year? Well they are limited to using the same parts as Ford - for example, the double-wishbone - and they did have to decrease their engine's output and operating efficiency (admittedly they should be running Holden engines, not that Chevy crap).

I've always wondered if Ford fans are embarrassed that AVESCO had to step in and give the Fords a little push in the right direction while bringing the Holdens back. I asked a fan and he said "No, that's the way it should be". Admittedly he was dumb, so it wasn't very conclusive, but you get the idea.

Just think about WHY the Fords are finally having some luck, Ford fans. Yeah. Now weep.

 

[miniMADness]

Originally posted by SandStorm Just think about WHY the Fords are finally having some luck, Ford fans. Yeah. Now weep.

Amen

 

[vat_man]

Oh please - it's called a parity formula.

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by vat_man
Oh please - it's called a parity formula.

"Oh please" yourself, Mister high-and-mighty I'm-a-moderator.

The point I'm trying to make is that Ford fans reckon they're so high-and-mighty now that Ford are finally winning. I'm just serving to remind them why the Fords are winning - because AVESCO took pity on the poor souls and guided them step-by-step back into a winning position.

Next time Ford fans think they're so good, just have a good long think about how they'd still be mid-pack if AVESCO hadn't stepped in.

 

[vat_man]

Originally posted by SandStorm
"Oh please" yourself, Mister high-and-mighty I'm-a-moderator.

The point I'm trying to make is that Ford fans reckon they're so high-and-mighty now that Ford are finally winning. I'm just serving to remind them why the Fords are winning - because AVESCO took pity on the poor souls and guided them step-by-step back into a winning position.

Next time Ford fans think they're so good, just have a good long think about how they'd still be mid-pack if AVESCO hadn't stepped in.

Ahem - I made no mention of my moderatorship in my comment, and never use it as a weapon in general discussion. I would thank you to extend me the same courtesy.

Let's perhaps take a step back, and think why HRT/K-Mart/Brock have suddenly started to show form.

Mmmmm...I know! They've started testing again, after the mess in the wake of the TWR collapse has finally been cleaned up. There's your reason Ambrose dominated early on.

So - boot's on the other foot for a while, and you don't much care for it. Deal with it. It's a two make formula - if one of the makes gets crapped off with getting thumped every fortnight, then the formula's screwed, isn't it?

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by vat_man
Ahem - I made no mention of my moderatorship in my comment, and never use it as a weapon in general discussion. I would thank you to extend me the same courtesy.

I didn't say you used your moderatorship as a weapon, now did I? Did I say that? Show me. Please. I'll wait.

Let's perhaps take a step back, and think why HRT/K-Mart/Brock have suddenly started to show form.

Mmmmm...I know! They've started testing again, after the mess in the wake of the TWR collapse has finally been cleaned up. There's your reason Ambrose dominated early on.

So - boot's on the other foot for a while, and you don't much care for it. Deal with it. It's a two make formula - if one of the makes gets crapped off with getting thumped every fortnight, then the formula's screwed, isn't it?

Mate, I don't give a right rat's ARSE about why these teams are starting to show form. I barrack for HRT, no one else. Sure, I can show appreciation if another team wins, but I'm an HRT man only.

And I can tell you why Ambrose has been so dominant this year. Bad luck on HRT's part. Sure, the TWR collapse came into it, but bad luck was mostly why HRT has not shown form this year. Example - Phillip Island; tyres.

Ball's in your court now.

 

[vat_man]

Originally posted by SandStorm
I didn't say you used your moderatorship as a weapon, now did I? Did I say that? Show me. Please. I'll wait.

I didn't - but you did elect to use it as a weapon, which was my entire point - explain to me how my moderatorship is relevant in your response.

"Oh please" yourself, Mister high-and-mighty I'm-a-moderator.

You pushed the button on this.

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by vat_man
I didn't - but you did elect to use it as a weapon, which was my entire point - explain to me how my moderatorship is relevant in your response.

You pushed the button on this.

Me thinks moderatorship may have gone to your head, my friend. The message you give me when you say something like "Oh please, it's a parity formula" says to me something like "I'm a high-and-mighty moderator. I can say what I please how I want to say it and no one can tell me otherwise."

Not that I mean you do it deliberately, that's just the way it seems to me.

 

[vat_man]

Originally posted by SandStorm
Me thinks moderatorship may have gone to your head, my friend. The message you give me when you say something like "Oh please, it's a parity formula" says to me something like "I'm a high-and-mighty moderator. I can say what I please how I want to say it and no one can tell me otherwise."

Not that I mean you do it deliberately, that's just the way it seems to me.

Well, you're reading it completely wrong - the response seemed completely appropriate given the tone and content of your first post in this thread.

My moderatorship only comes into play when the AUP's been breached - during regular posting it's irrelevant. Nice qualifier in the last sentence, by the way.

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by vat_man
Well, you're reading it completely wrong - the response seemed completely appropriate given the tone and content of your first post in this thread.

My moderatorship only comes into play when the AUP's been breached - during regular posting it's irrelevant.

Again - I myself thought it was a bit too agressive, if you catch my drift.

Nice qualifier in the last sentence, by the way.

Cheers. 👍

Oh well - all's well that ends well.

 

[millencolin]

sandstorm you are nothing but a sore looser.

thats all that needs to be said. get over it.
every team that starts winning must start loosing at some point when other teams rise a.k.a- australian rugby league team

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by millencolin
sandstorm you are nothing but a sore looser.

thats all that needs to be said. get over it.
every team that starts winning must start loosing at some point when other teams rise a.k.a- australian rugby league team

Well that's put me in my place!

All I'm saying is to remember why Ambrose is winning - thank AVESCO for taking pity and helping Ford out.

 

[Glut]

So let me get this straight - you're annoyed because AVESCO runs a parity class that actually has parity? So drivers who previously had to rely on dominance of a particular team ended up looking like losers?

I think that you'd also be shocked to know that the holden on the racetrack shares no parts with the holden on the road - not even the engine!

So - in summing up, Ambrose is shown to be a much better driver and we should appreciate him more because now he's in the same car as Skaife - it's obvious who's the better driver.

Perhaps the thread should be labelled - Actually Skaife turns out to be not so good after all

 

[HRT_Maloo]

Originally posted by millencolin

every team that starts winning must start loosing at some point when other teams rise a.k.a- australian rugby league team

And the Wallabies rugby team

Any way, the Holdens have always used the Chev engines, and who gives a **** if Ford are winning at the moment. Like someone has already mentioned, they are nothing like the road cars (okay, they may have the same doors as the road going versions), and sadly, most fans cannot get this into their ****ing heads.

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by Glut
So let me get this straight - you're annoyed because AVESCO runs a parity class that actually has parity? So drivers who previously had to rely on dominance of a particular team ended up looking like losers?

I'm all for evening up the series even though I'm an HRT fan - makes the sport more exciting to watch, doesn't it? My only complaint is that people think Ambrose is so good, so great, but they never stop to think that AVESCO brought the Holdens down a few pegs while helping the Fords in another. Admittedly I think Holdens should use their own 5.0-litre instead of relying on Chev to bail them out of a hole, but that's another story.

I think that you'd also be shocked to know that the holden on the racetrack shares no parts with the holden on the road - not even the engine!

Um - duh. The only parts you'll find on a road car that are the same as the race car is the doors.

So - in summing up, Ambrose is shown to be a much better driver and we should appreciate him more because now he's in the same car as Skaife - it's obvious who's the better driver.

Perhaps the thread should be labelled - Actually Skaife turns out to be not so good after all

You wonder why Ford are winning? Well here is one example: Holdens are running their own (well, Chev's ) decreased efficiency inlet/outlet and extractors. It was on the V8 Supercars one time; AVESCO made Holden decrease the bore of their heads, thus decreasing efficiency, thus decreasing power output.

I think you'd be shocked to know that the Fords are actually running more HP than Holden this year - the Fords are sitting happy at 635hp, while the Holdens are on 600hp.

And never forget the torrid luck that Skaife is having - tyres at Phillip Island is just one example, Rodney Forbes at Barbagallo is another. Those two incidents alone cost Skaife a likely mighty points haul. If Skaife had finished where he should have for those two races (1st and 4th respectively, if memory serves) then he would now be in the lead of the championship. Also Bathurst, with the door - if it wasn't flapping he would have come at least 2nd, if not 1st.

Perhaps the thread should be called "Ambrose blazes while Skaife's shocking luck continues".

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by HRT_Maloo
And the Wallabies rugby team

Oh ha ha - the "Waballies", as I've christened them, are going to kick NZ's arse in the finals.

"Waballies" = Wobblies, owing to poor Bledisloe and Tri-Nations form mid-year. Oh, also in the World Cup lead-up games, where they got walloped by England.

 

[Glut]

Originally posted by SandStorm
but they never stop to think that AVESCO brought the Holdens down a few pegs while helping the Fords in another. Admittedly I think Holdens should use their own 5.0-litre instead of relying on Chev to bail them out of a hole, but that's another story.

Holden would never want that - they might then let ford run their technically superior v8...

You wonder why Ford are winning? Well here is one example: Holdens are running their own (well, Chev's ) decreased efficiency inlet/outlet and extractors. It was on the V8 Supercars one time; AVESCO made Holden decrease the bore of their heads, thus decreasing efficiency, thus decreasing power output.

So now Ford & Holden both run the same bore and they both have the same inlet restrictions, as of the 2003 spec holden engine. I think that you should check your source.

I think you'd be shocked to know that the Fords are actually running more HP than Holden this year - the Fords are sitting happy at 635hp, while the Holdens are on 600hp.
[/b]

I suspect that you get this straight from the v8 supercar website. Let me put this into context to show how silly it is.
The SBR team claims 635 HP, on the minimum 1350 kg weight and claim top speed of 298 kph and a 4 second 0-100.
the HRT team claims around 600 HP, on the minimum 1350 kg weight and claim top speed of 298 kph and a 4 second 0-100.
I somewhat suspect that around 600HP = 635 HP.

And never forget the torrid luck that Skaife is having - tyres at Phillip Island is just one example,

that wasn't luck, that was a bad descision, which he took because a brave tyre choice was the only was he'd get back in it.

Rodney Forbes at Barbagallo is another. Those two incidents alone cost Skaife a likely mighty points haul. If Skaife had finished where he should have for those two races (1st and 4th respectively, if memory serves) then he would now be in the lead of the championship.

My calculating gives him an extra 68 points (generously) from those 2 races, including taking points from others.
This leaves 1557 points against Murphy and ambrose, both who have more than 1600.

Also Bathurst, with the door - if it wasn't flapping he would have come at least 2nd, if not 1st.

for the reasons discussed in previous threads, I think that's garbage.

Perhaps the thread should be called "Ambrose blazes while Skaife's shocking luck continues".

Skaife doesn't have shocking luck, just shocking drives...

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by Glut

My calculating gives him an extra 68 points (generously) from those 2 races, including taking points from others.
This leaves 1557 points against Murphy and ambrose, both who have more than 1600.

Check your calculating, mate - Phillip Island Skaife was out of the points entirely - or at least as out of the points as you can get with the adjusted points system. A first place would have given him around 120 - 160 extra points; he finished lower than 15th there, if memory serves - and it might not, so don't hesitate to correct me, please. Admittedly it was the ****head Jeff Grech's fault, the rain was only very light.

Barbagallo would have given Skaife something like 170 points if he'd stayed where he was (4th) but as Rodney Forbes (according to the dick head Jeff Grech, and I don't share his opinion) can't even spin properly, he clobbered Skaife and again took him way down the points table.

And don't forget Queensland (at least I think it was) where Skaife blew up in a cloud of smoke whilst in a strong position and yet again got dropped right out of the points.

I generously estimate that had he finished strongly in all those races, he would have collected (again, generously) around 350 points all-up from 3 races.

for the reasons discussed in previous threads, I think that's garbage.

It was only garbage, really because his door did in fact swing open. If it had stayed closed he would have finished around 2nd. More points again.

Skaife doesn't have shocking luck, just shocking drives...

Nah, bad luck... For reasons discussed...

Oh, and for the longest ever series of quotes these forums have ever seen, you win the grand prize, 16 squillion Antarctican pesos and all the rotten fish you can hold!

 

[XPLOSV]

Sandstorm, I didnt read all the posts mainly because I couldnt be bothered but millencolins comments on you being a "sore looser" maybe heading in the right direction.

Firstly, the double-wishbone setup on the Ford (and now the Holden) is actually superior to what holden was running before. I dont really want to get into this argument but its pretty clear who the best driver in the season is, and its not you beloved Skaife. And what are you talking about engine power reduction...Dude, now your just making the facts up....

Again, I'm not having a go at ya or anything (Hey, your Australian) but you do realize that the way you go on about Holden and Skaife is, well, rather disturbing

My friendly advise to you is to get over it. If you cant handle the opposition winning for once in 6 years then maybe you should give up interest in the sport for your own health and well being

 

[Mike Rotch]

Originally posted by XPLOSV
Sandstorm, I didnt read all the posts mainly because I couldnt be bothered but millencolins comments on you being a "sore looser" maybe heading in the right direction.

Firstly, the double-wishbone setup on the Ford (and now the Holden) is actually superior to what holden was running before. I dont really want to get into this argument but its pretty clear who the best driver in the season is, and its not you beloved Skaife. And what are you talking about engine power reduction...Dude, now your just making the facts up....

Again, I'm not having a go at ya or anything (Hey, your Australian) but you do realize that the way you go on about Holden and Skaife is, well, rather disturbing

My friendly advise to you is to get over it. If you cant handle the opposition winning for once in 6 years then maybe you should give up interest in the sport for your own health and well being

, that'll get the old boy stirred up

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by Mike Rotch
, that'll get the old boy stirred up

Not at all Mike, I can take as good as I give.

EXPLOSV - I'm just complaining about how AVESCO can't let the course of nature go without interfering. I mean, the Fords always deserve a good arse flogging, but nooo, AVESCO had to step in and help Ford out. We can only hope that Holden get the finger of fate (or at least AVESCO) lowered upon them next year.

As for Skaife (aka the beloved ) it's not the end of the world if he doesn't win, I'm just sick of everyone saying how great Ambrose is when he's not so superb at all. See, Ford were producing their own cars, Holden theirs, and AVESCO steps in and says "No, your car is too good." And you wonder why I'm not impressed.

 

[Bollocks#999]

lets face it, the AU was a pile of crap and the BA is significantly better

With the last sentance mate, The FIA tried that with Ferrari (so to speak) and it didnt work, so maybe Skaife aint so hot in an inferior car...
























That'll rev him up some

 

[Mike Rotch]

Originally posted by Bollocks#999


That'll rev him up some

:giggle:

Although true about Ferrari and rule changes not working

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by Bollocks#999
lets face it, the AU was a pile of crap and the BA is significantly better

With the last sentance mate, The FIA tried that with Ferrari (so to speak) and it didnt work, so maybe Skaife aint so hot in an inferior car...
























That'll rev him up some

Well there you go then - maybe Schumacher is just a better driver than Skaife. Or maybe the limitations on Ferarri weren't as severe as those on the Holdens. Either way, there's still 3 rounds of the SCS to go, Skaife can still make it up.

 

[Bollocks#999]

True he could, but Im hoping he dont

 

[SandStorm]

Originally posted by Bollocks#999
True he could, but Im hoping he dont

*Hope* *Hope* *Cross fingers*

I don't care what happens to me, I just want to get to 10,000 posts. Then Duke can do what he wants with me. He can take my account and rip it up and throw it into the fire to burn to nothing but a fond memory if he wants.

 

[HRT_Maloo]

**** it, lets just go back to the old days when makers would make cars specifically for this racing -"big tank" Charger, XU2 Torana (I read in AMC that it was actually going to be called XU1 II) and phase IV GTHOs)

But, production cars are relatively boring compared to the supercars (sooooo slow)

And you say about Holden relying on Chev for their engines- Ford do the same- FoMoCo USA

 

[slidesquad#1]

Originally posted by HRT_Maloo
And you say about Holden relying on Chev for their engines- Ford do the same- FoMoCo USA

So, Ford aren't allowed to use Ford engines? It may be from the USA, but it's still Ford though, isn't it? Same for the Chev's, as far as I can make out, Holden should be allowed to use any bloody engine from GM they want, as long as it's legal.

Holden have been off a bit this season, and sandstorm, you'll just have to bear it mate, you've had it your way for the last how many years?

 

[millencolin]

Originally posted by slidesquad#1


Holden have been off a bit this season, and sandstorm, you'll just have to bear it mate, you've had it your way for the last how many years?

I couldnt agree more

 

[HRT_Maloo]

Originally posted by slidesquad#1
So, Ford aren't allowed to use Ford engines? It may be from the USA, but it's still Ford though, isn't it? Same for the Chev's, as far as I can make out, Holden should be allowed to use any bloody engine from GM they want, as long as it's legal.

Yeah, that is what pisses me off. "Holden are crap cos they rely on Chev" and that sort of bull****. I dont see the Falcon having its own engine from Aussie (V8, that is), but been Ford all over the world, the ****wits that dont know **** cant accept that, or get it through their thick heads.