America - The Official Thread

[merseyxshore]

Those Socialists and communists did indeed demonstrate their hate and ignorance.

Hundreds gather in Glasgow, Liverpool and Brixton to 'celebrate' death

www.google.com

It’s no surprise to me that Communists and Socialists disliked her.
She, unlike them, actual possessed morals and work ethic.
Even after her passing the idiot in the article was talking the gap between rich and poor when literally in a different clip I showed her OWNING the guy who tried that on her.
She called that farce argument out for what it was-what socialism is.
Lol you would prefer to make the poor poorer so long as the rich were less rich!
Idiocy!
Today the subversive mentality has shifted.
You have godless people.
In times past people were controlled by for example in Catholicism by guilt and fear of wrath of God.
But, as I already explained, they eliminate religion as a subversion tactic and a lot of modern folks do not believe in God.
So, for people like that they add back fear and guilt about climate and use that to control you.
The modern belief system you have been fed is revisionist history along with climate guilt racism guilt, lol it functions psychologically exactly like Catholicism lol.
The worst part though is how immoral and hateful it is. As the article above shows those were extremists, as the normal woman stated at the end.

free your mind and remember everything free comes from someone who works

Can you really count pretty much 95% of entire city regions' populations as extremists and communists off the back of one article? I live here mate, I'm literally telling you how it is. Or is this just the classic American right wing "anything I don't like or understand is clearly communism"? Thatcher was hated by working class people, especially in the north of England.

I'd also love to see which parts of history you view as being "revisionist". Is it those US states trying to ban discussions about abhorrent historical racism?

 

[UKMikey]

Somehow I doubt trying to appeal to the better nature of Mr "Screw the Afghans... let's talk about the moral issues" is going to achieve much on this thread.

 

[Danoff]

So, for people like that they add back fear and guilt about climate and use that to control you.

Being concerned about something doesn't mean you're being controlled. It means you're concerned about an issue.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Didn't you see that coming?

Putting the SS into Sea Bass.

This reference may not be obvious..

 

[Groundfish]

I live here mate, I'm literally telling you how it is

I live here, tell people how it is also.
Facts are facts-just because a bunch of unemployed communists extremist decide to dance on a great leaders grave it’s not going to change the facts.
Saying “I’m telling you how it is” isn’t much of an argument.
It’s never worked for me here either.

Socialism is the philosophy of the lazy.
Just wait around for others to work and provide for you!

 

[Danoff]

Socialism is the philosophy of the lazy.
Just wait around for others to work and provide for you!

That is not the philosophy of socialism. You should probably try to understand what you're talking about.

Edit:

If I had to capture probably the biggest negative philosophy of socialism (which is what you seem to be trying and failing at), it's that people, when left to their own devices, will not help each other enough - at least with property and money. They can be relied on to be charitable through force. It's a cynical view of human nature that says that charity has to be forced.

 

[UKMikey]

Putting the SS into Sea Bass.

This reference may not be obvious..

I give up. Is a sea bass a kind of ground fish?

 

[MatskiMonk]

I give up. Is a sea bass a kind of ground fish?

 

[UKMikey]

OMG, he identifies with checks wiki a sociopathic truck driver butt rapist?

 

[Liquid]

From where this conversation started to where it's gone over the last few pages, there has been some world-class deflection; the Federation and USS Enterprise wish they had deflector dishes that good.

 

[Rossell2]

I live here, tell people how it is also.
Facts are facts-just because a bunch of unemployed communists extremist decide to dance on a great leaders grave it’s not going to change the facts.
Saying “I’m telling you how it is” isn’t much of an argument.
It’s never worked for me here either.

Socialism is the philosophy of the lazy.
Just wait around for others to work and provide for you!

There was some employed capitalists dancing on her grave too to be honest.

 

[Keef]

Just wait around for others to work and provide for you!

You mean like police, firefighters, and the military? I pay socialist taxes so the government can provide these services to me so I don't have to do it myself.

 

[Groundfish]

over the last few pages, there has been some world-class deflection; the Federation and USS Enterprise wish they had deflector dishes that good

Yeah when @danoof literally provided Stalin’s exact words as written in the 1936 constitution there then claims the whole “pan-socialism shape shift goalpost shift” where for him his definition of socialism is all the good necessary things and conveniently ignores the historical genocide and starvation it shows a truly masterful deflection skills, perhaps he uses pure dilithium crystals or something I dunno but it’s masterful deception.
A true chameleon.


EDIT THANKS KEEF for fulfilling my prophecy from post 30922.

This is what I mean, it’s not like this isn’t the same tired Marxist playbook.
It’s nothing new this socialism fad and all the same historical tricks are being played on those who are being subverted and brainwashed by it.

 

[UKMikey]

 

[Danoff]

Yeah when @danoof literally provided Stalin’s exact words as written in the 1936 constitution there then claims the whole “pan-socialism shape shift goalpost shift” where for him his definition of socialism is all the good necessary things and conveniently ignores the historical genocide and starvation it shows a truly masterful deflection skills, perhaps he uses pure dilithium crystals or something I dunno but it’s masterful deception.

Stalin is just about the only person who can even conceivably be attributed with having pulled this off, but he did it from a deeply communist starting point. You want to make this into some kind of "tactic" to achieve communism but... it has been shown in many governments throughout the world to be terrible at achieving communism. If it's a tactic, it's failing miserably. So maybe let go of that paranoia. Give me an example of a market-based socialist system that went communist without using the USSR. I'll wait.

This is what I mean, it’s not like this isn’t the same tired Marxist playbook.
It’s nothing new this socialism fad and all the same historical tricks are being played on those who are being subverted and brainwashed by it.

It's not new, it's not a fad, it's not a trick, there's no playbook, and it doesn't require brainwashing. Wrong in about every possible way.

 

[Keef]

EDIT THANKS KEEF for fulfilling my prophecy from post 30922.

This is what I mean, it’s not like this isn’t the same tired Marxist playbook.
It’s nothing new this socialism fad and all the same historical tricks are being played on those who are being subverted and brainwashed by it.

I don't really understand what you're referring to here. What does Marxism have to do with tax-funded government-provided services? These concepts have existed for thousands of years and I don't think they're part of some societal cycle that you're alluding to. Concepts like tax-funded police and militaries have existed from the inception of most societies, including American society. Arguably, police and military organization is the genesis of society, as societies and economies cannot effectively grow unless they are organized, rules are enforced, and they're defended from threats. America would not exist if it weren't for the organization of a publicly-funded military. This does not follow the Marxist idea of some cyclical economic evolution, or like the fall of capitalism into socialism.

 

[merseyxshore]

Socialism is the philosophy of the lazy.
Just wait around for others to work and provide for you!

Wait, are you one of these "nobody wants to work anymore" types?? 😂 😂 😂

 

[UKMikey]

Starfleet is strictly amateur hour. "I'm not deflecting, you're deflecting" is taking it to Palpatine levels of deflection.

 

[Dennisch]

All I see is this when reading the posts.

 

[Groundfish]

Wait, are you one of these "nobody wants to work anymore" types?? 😂 😂 😂

Uuuh, no.
One thing that Marx had right though is how value is created.
How say one dollar is created. You take something perform labor (work) on it it adds value then you can barter or sell it or whatever.
That’s a very sound true concept imo.
The difference between the USA and say a socialist setup is that under socialism you will work or be put in the gulag.
Your reward for your labor will be determined by the State, and looking at history sometimes gets so bad when planners do poorly people literally starve or go to the store and find empty shelves.
None of this occurs to the lazy people who want things for free as they sit there today thinking about it. They are the perfect targets of subversive ideology.
They are told see you have nothing now, but under Socialism housing would be a human right-food would be free!
It sounds great to them and of course the real history is completely ignored or heavily downplayed. “The playbook “

Contrast this with the USA (pre too big to fail lol)
Where you are free to work hard and the sky is the limit as far as what is possible by your own free will.
The only limit is you.
Wages production your own conditions are your choice.
I will say though people lacking work ethic will not flourish with freedom, but under socialism their refusal to work would put them in the gulag.
So to me looking at historical evidence socialism is slavery.

You can try to poke fun at people with a strong work ethic in a free society but the jokes on you.

America was founded by people willing to die for freedom. It was that important.
The prosperity that was generated by freedom unfortunately has led to a resurgence of the tired Marxist playbook as its foisted on a younger society so spoiled and entitled and ignorant of history they actively advocate an ideology that inevitably leads to enslavement genocide and starvation.
Everything thing free comes from work.
Marx was right about the creation of wealth it comes only from work.

I think here in this famous movie speech Jessup actually does make a strong point in his reasoning.
I think it relates here because truth is any way you look at it if you want anything you will have to work for it. At least with freedom your options are unlimited.
Your rewards are determined by your own effectiveness your own choices.
You’re not stuck in a one room flat barely living with rations providdd by the govt and no hope except not to be put in the gulag
Maybe some younger folks with few responsibilities “can’t handle the truth”

CAUTION FOUL LANGUAGE IN VIDEO

Amplifying FEE’s Seminars for Even Greater Impact - FEE

As FEE strives to make ideas of liberty a credible and familiar part of campus culture, we aim to reach greater numbers of young people without a large additional investment of resources.

www.google.com

Firsthand Accounts of Life Under Socialism Reach Students in U.S. and Abroad

Less than one year since its launch, TFAS’s “Venezuela: My Story … Your Future” project has exposed the truth about socialism to more than 2,000 college students worldwide.

tfas.org

 

[Danoff]

The difference between the USA and say a socialist setup is that under socialism you will work or be put in the gulag.

*communism

Comeon man, put in a little effort to understand these terms.

Your reward for your labor will be determined by the State, and looking at history sometimes gets so bad when planners do poorly people literally starve or go to the store and find empty shelves.

*communism.

They are told see you have nothing now, but under Socialism housing would be a human right-food would be free!

*communism

Where you are free to work hard and the sky is the limit as far as what is possible by your own free will.

With a socialist safety net. Because socialism.

Wages production your own conditions are your choice.

Within socialist rules.

So to me looking at historical evidence socialism is slavery.

*communism

 

[Imari]

I suggest studying history before espousing socialism.

I suggest studying history before espousing authoritarianism.

Socialism is the philosophy of the lazy.

Socialism is the philosophy of those who have empathy for others. Psychopaths simply don't understand why people would care about other humans when it comes at no direct benefit to themselves, and therefore label it as lazy.

...but under Socialism housing would be a human right-food would be free!

You're right, that's totally unacceptable. We can't be having poor people living in houses and eating food! They'll start getting ideas above their station.

I think here in this famous movie speech Jessup actually does make a strong point in his reasoning.

I think you rather missed the point of his reasoning. It's like when white supremacists think American History X is awesome. You think that the "weak" should starve rather than be assisted by those more capable or able.



If you won't defend those weaker than you you're not a patriot or a hero. You're selfish and a bully.

For every person who might take unfairly from social welfare, there are ten who need it despite their best efforts. People who work hard but from the nature of the statistics of large numbers happened to fall on hard times. It's not the fault of a child that they were born to poor parents. It's not the fault of the worker that a company downsizes during a pandemic and that even with the best will in the world finding another job is not something that happens instantly. There's any number of people who want to contribute to society and can, but at certain times find themselves unable to support themselves adequately. It's to the benefit of society long term to help those people through rather than let them starve or force them into situations where they have to commit crimes in order to survive. But it takes a certain amount of compassion and the ability to look at the greater picture, rather than just your own personal values.

That's Jessup's flaw - he thinks that anyone who isn't serving the front lines is subhuman and worthy of death, that's the gist of his "I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself..." rant. The reality is that not all people are capable of serving on the front lines, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be helped when they need it or that they can't contribute meaningfully in other ways given appropriate support.

 

[Exorcet]

Socialism is the philosophy of those who have empathy for others. Psychopaths simply don't understand why people would care about other humans when it comes at no direct benefit to themselves, and therefore label it as lazy.

And ironically that empathy for others and resulting cooperation benefits everyone, even the selfish. Millions of people cooperating are going to perform much better than isolated individuals that don't share information.

For every person who might take unfairly from social welfare, there are ten who need it despite their best efforts. People who work hard but from the nature of the statistics of large numbers happened to fall on hard times. It's not the fault of a child that they were born to poor parents. It's not the fault of the worker that a company downsizes during a pandemic and that even with the best will in the world finding another job is not something that happens instantly. There's any number of people who want to contribute to society and can, but at certain times find themselves unable to support themselves adequately. It's to the benefit of society long term to help those people through rather than let them starve or force them into situations where they have to commit crimes in order to survive. But it takes a certain amount of compassion and the ability to look at the greater picture, rather than just your own personal values.

Exactly.

 

[Groundfish]

That's Jessup's flaw - he thinks that anyone who isn't serving the front lines is subhuman and worthy of death

No. Santiago’s poor performance was endangering his fellow soldiers.
It’s the Spock needs of the many outweigh the few or the one.



Jessup explains military defense is a necessity and points out the irony of Cruises character prosecuting (forget name) who is safe partially BECAUSE of Jessup protecting him. Imo.

as far as @Danoff socialism has determined the value of your stance that everything good done by agreement is socialism and everything bad done by agreement is communism.
The value is…

one quarter portion.

Star Wars The Force Awakens (2015) clip with quote one quarter portion. Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or backward to get to the perfect clip.

getyarn.io

 

[Danoff]

as far as @Danoff socialism has determined the value of your stance that everything good done by agreement is socialism and everything bad done by agreement is communism.

Socialism (and communism) are not agreement. They're force. And it's not a matter of everything "good" or "bad" being one or the other. These terms simply have meaning. I don't recall ever personally saying that socialism was good or communism was bad, or vice versa, in our conversation. I'm simply telling you what it "is". So you're wrong on basically all counts again.

I even went out of my way to hand you what I thought was the most negative aspect of socialism as a philosophy (since you were trying and failing to find it).

If I had to capture probably the biggest negative philosophy of socialism (which is what you seem to be trying and failing at), it's that people, when left to their own devices, will not help each other enough - at least with property and money. They can be relied on to be charitable through force. It's a cynical view of human nature that says that charity has to be forced.

How is this me linking "good" with socialism?

 

[ryzno]

I give up. Is a sea bass a kind of ground fish?

It's an actual fish.

There are also different kinds of bass.

 

[McLaren]

For anyone else: fee.org is considered center-right as it is regarded as right-leaning on economic views, and left-leaning on social views.

As for TFAS, well, shocker; conservative outlet tries to push the age-old, "listen to this 1 person define his life under conveniently-picked Venezula to make your decision on socialism around the world".

When we consider the manifold contributions of the Fund for American Studies, The American Spectator, and the Media Research Center over the years and reflect that they are but a part of the conservative movement, we can rest assured that the movement is alive and well and resolute in its goal to preserve ordered liberty in America, both for this generation and generations to come.

3 Proofs That the Conservative Movement Is Alive and Well

The Media Research Center, the Fund for American Studies, and The American Spectator are pillars of the conservative movement. And they're thriving.

www.dailysignal.com

Edit* First sourced article isn't any different. Cites Venezula and then Jordan Peterson.... Also does what Danoff has been trying to clarify by purposefully mixing socialism, communism, and maoism as the same thing.

 

[Groundfish]

As for TFAS, well, shocker; conservative outlet tries to push the age-old, "listen to this 1 person define his life under conveniently-picked Venezula to make your decision on socialism around the world".

What are you trying to say? Bernie Sanders didn’t heap praise on Venezuela?
Or that Scandinavian countries have not moved away from those socialist ideas he holds?
Perhaps you’re saying inexperienced younger voters weren’t duped by his age old played out Marxist junk ideas?

Lol maybe you’re trying to say Socialism collapsing Venezuela’s economy hasn’t created a massive refugee and humanitarian crisis?
See below

Opinion | Bernie Sanders and Venezuela

The Vermont socialist tries to pretend he didn’t encourage a brutal regime.

www.google.com

https://disasterphilanthropy.org/disaster/venezuelan-refugee-crisis/

Venezuela crisis: How the political situation escalated

A closer look at what is behind the country's spiralling political and economic crisis.

www.google.com

 

[McLaren]

What are you trying to say?

Your sources are biased, and pry on Venezula to define socialism everywhere.

Much in the way 2A folks always target Chicago to define gun laws everywhere.

 

[Danoff]

Edit* First sourced article isn't any different. Cites Venezula and then Jordan Peterson.... Also does what Danoff has been trying to clarify by purposefully mixing socialism, communism, and maoism as the same thing.

Thanks for the heads up. I skipped clicking on it. Yea it takes for granted that communism is the ultimate goal of socialism, and the ultimate end - in complete defiance of essentially all evidence (except possibly the USSR) and an understanding of how socialism is actually implemented and what the goals are of socialist countries.

I still can't believe that articles like this don't understand that the US is socialist.

What are you trying to say? Bernie Sanders didn’t heap praise on Venezuela?

Woooooow. He refused to call Maduro a dictator and signed a letter of support for NOT Maduro almost 20 years ago. That's heaped praise! [/s] Not that Sanders is somehow the god of socialism.

Or that Scandinavian countries have not moved away from those socialist ideas he holds?

Lots of flavors of socialism. This is actually your own admission of a counter-argument to your premise. This is an example of socialism NOT leading to communism.

Lol maybe you’re trying to say Socialism collapsing Venezuela’s economy hasn’t created a massive refugee and humanitarian crisis?
See below

Opinion | Bernie Sanders and Venezuela

The Vermont socialist tries to pretend he didn’t encourage a brutal regime.

www.google.com

https://disasterphilanthropy.org/disaster/venezuelan-refugee-crisis/

Venezuela crisis: How the political situation escalated

A closer look at what is behind the country's spiralling political and economic crisis.

www.google.com

All of the top 10 GDP nations are socialist. Venezuela is not going to cut it as a claim that socialism is ruinous.